We're excited to present a great new set of boards to classic movie fans with tons of new features, stability, and performance.

If you’re new to the message boards, please “Register” to get started. If you want to learn more about the new boards, visit our FAQ.

Register

If you're a returning member, start by resetting your password to claim your old display name using your email address.

Re-Register

Thanks for your continued support of the TCM Message Boards.

X

Kyle Kersten was a true friend of TCM. One of the first and most active participants of the Message Boards, “Kyle in Hollywood” (aka, hlywdkjk) demonstrated a depth of knowledge and largesse of spirit that made him one of the most popular and respected voices in these forums. This thread is a living memorial to his life and love of movies, which remain with us still.

X

Jump to content


Photo

Future of Democratic Party?

What do Democrats need to do.

  • Please log in to reply
337 replies to this topic

#21 JakeHolman

JakeHolman

    Borders, Language, Culture & Heritage

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 15,398 posts
  • LocationTRUMP COUNTRY -- GOD'S COUNTRY -- PROUD DEPLORABLE

Posted 14 March 2017 - 01:38 PM

Texas redistricting case makes it official: Courts are rigging the game ... and it's entirely legal 

A gerrymandering case out of Texas serves to further prove the point that the judiciary is rigging the game against Republican candidates — and it’s all completely legal. Late Friday, a panel of federal judges threw out three of Texas’ congressional districts — because racism. This further highlights how the federal judiciary is using provisions of the Voting Rights Act to rig elections in favor of Democrat candidates.

 

CONSERVATIVE REVIEW >> https://www.conserva...-entirely-legal

 

jrD5m_s-200x150.gif


I don't think the intelligence reports are all that hot. Some days I get more out of the New York Times. JFK

 

The American people, North and South, went into the war as citizens of their respective states, they came out as subjects. What they thus lost they have never got back.  H.L. Mencken
 
Tis Well. President George Washington
 
Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy. Sir Winston Churchill 
 
Movies are written in sand: applauded today, forgotten tomorrow. D.W Griffith
 
I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on earth. Steve McQueen
 
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. George Orwell
 
Perfect freedom has no existence. The grown man knows the world he lives in, and for the present, the world is Rome. Ben Hur
 
Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. President Ronald Reagan
 
A man's got to know his limitations. Dirty Harry Callahan
 
A man's got to have a code, a creed to live by, no matter his job. The Immortal John Wayne


#22 Vautrin

Vautrin

    Quel siecle a mains!

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 7,776 posts
  • LocationNorth Carolina

Posted 13 March 2017 - 03:06 PM

They better hope it doesn't go all the way to the Supreme Court.


Curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid get.


#23 TheCid

TheCid

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,496 posts
  • LocationSouth Carolina

Posted 13 March 2017 - 10:39 AM

Darrell Issa receives heat in California.

Federal court rules that Texas districts were gerrymandered to hurt minorities.  Redrawing required.

Maybe there is hope for the Democrats in 2018.


  • mr6666 likes this

#24 JakeHolman

JakeHolman

    Borders, Language, Culture & Heritage

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 15,398 posts
  • LocationTRUMP COUNTRY -- GOD'S COUNTRY -- PROUD DEPLORABLE

Posted 10 March 2017 - 09:10 AM

5UgMNCwA_bigger.jpg

Breitbart NewsVerified account @BreitbartNews 14h14 hours ago

And she's proving her eligibility for a nursing home.

http://www.breitbart...or-impeachment/


I don't think the intelligence reports are all that hot. Some days I get more out of the New York Times. JFK

 

The American people, North and South, went into the war as citizens of their respective states, they came out as subjects. What they thus lost they have never got back.  H.L. Mencken
 
Tis Well. President George Washington
 
Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy. Sir Winston Churchill 
 
Movies are written in sand: applauded today, forgotten tomorrow. D.W Griffith
 
I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on earth. Steve McQueen
 
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. George Orwell
 
Perfect freedom has no existence. The grown man knows the world he lives in, and for the present, the world is Rome. Ben Hur
 
Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. President Ronald Reagan
 
A man's got to know his limitations. Dirty Harry Callahan
 
A man's got to have a code, a creed to live by, no matter his job. The Immortal John Wayne


#25 TheCid

TheCid

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,496 posts
  • LocationSouth Carolina

Posted 28 February 2017 - 05:56 PM

For the past 10 years, we've lived in IA, and participated in the evil caucuses in both 2008 and 2016.  As we live in one of the larger cities here, Bernie did very well in our district, receiving an equal number of delegates as HRC.  However, we are an anomaly, as the larger rural population skews much more conservative (hence the election of Joni Ernst to replace long time Dem. Senator Tom Harkin).  Considering the massive head start HRC had in money, name recognition and, of course, having the backing of super delegates before a single vote was cast, it's amazing how strong a showing Bernie made in the state as a whole.  But, the DNC couldn't allow the momentum to continue unchecked.

 

I didn't mean to insinuate that Warren would have beaten Trump (not saying that Bernie definitely would have either, as some people assert), only that if she had come forward then Bernie probably would not have run, but would have supported her candidacy instead. 

 

Of course, Trump lied.  He was just being a politician. 

This discussion will contine forever, but one point you made is how well Sanders did in your district, but not so well in the rural areas.  Actually I believe that having some liberals is a good thing as it keeps the party (or country) moving in a better direction.

But, the reality is whoever gets elected sets the destination for the country.  And that is the problem for the Democrats for the next several elections.  Getting elected and changing the direction of the country.

As for superdelegates, I'll bet there are still a lot of people in the Republican Party who wish they had had them so they could have stopped Trump and put a more intelligent/reasonable/competent Republican in the White House.

My fear, and that of many people, was that Sanders/Warren/Pelosi offend too many people who actually vote and that hurts Democrats.  

As the DNC is beginning to acknowledge, winning the presidency doesn't matter a whole lot if you lose the Senate, the House, the governorships and the state legislatures.

The DNC needs to acknowledge the desires of the progressive liberals, but they also need to acknowledge the reality of how politics in America actually works.  And where the money comes from.



#26 BelleLeGrand1

BelleLeGrand1

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 679 posts

Posted 28 February 2017 - 05:06 PM

Don't know what state you live in, but Bernie and Warren are perceived as being too far to the left for the vast majority of Americans.  They do not represent "traditional Democratic values," but rather extreme liberalism or socialism.  Bernie is a socialist and proud of it.

I still believe that if Warren had run, Trump would have won both the electoral college and popular votes.

The "DINO's in the current party leadership" are all considered to be progressive or liberal by every reputable source out there.  

More importantly, most recognize the value of cooperation with others and the necessity of working with the corporations.  See my response to james.

As for Trump, he lied and his supporters bought it.

 

 

 

For the past 10 years, we've lived in IA, and participated in the evil caucuses in both 2008 and 2016.  As we live in one of the larger cities here, Bernie did very well in our district, receiving an equal number of delegates as HRC.  However, we are an anomaly, as the larger rural population skews much more conservative (hence the election of Joni Ernst to replace long time Dem. Senator Tom Harkin).  Considering the massive head start HRC had in money, name recognition and, of course, having the backing of super delegates before a single vote was cast, it's amazing how strong a showing Bernie made in the state as a whole.  But, the DNC couldn't allow the momentum to continue unchecked.

 

I didn't mean to insinuate that Warren would have beaten Trump (not saying that Bernie definitely would have either, as some people assert), only that if she had come forward then Bernie probably would not have run, but would have supported her candidacy instead. 

 

Of course, Trump lied.  He was just being a politician. 



#27 TheCid

TheCid

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,496 posts
  • LocationSouth Carolina

Posted 28 February 2017 - 04:06 PM

He may not have a (D) after his name, but Bernie represents traditional Democratic values more than any DINOs in the current party leadership.  If someone like Elizabeth Warren (who turned out to be a big disappointment) had stepped up to the plate, he probably wouldn't have run at all.

 

A big part of the problem is that the Democrats have turned their backs on their base in favor of their big corporate donors.  Remember this quote from Chuck Schumer:  "For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.”  Yeah, that strategy worked out real well, didn't it?  With that kind of attitude, they shouldn't expect the working class to return to the fold anytime soon.

 

Trump certainly isn't of the working class, but he sure knew how to talk to them. 

Don't know what state you live in, but Bernie and Warren are perceived as being too far to the left for the vast majority of Americans.  They do not represent "traditional Democratic values," but rather extreme liberalism or socialism.  Bernie is a socialist and proud of it.

I still believe that if Warren had run, Trump would have won both the electoral college and popular votes.

The "DINO's in the current party leadership" are all considered to be progressive or liberal by every reputable source out there.  

More importantly, most recognize the value of cooperation with others and the necessity of working with the corporations.  See my response to james.

As for Trump, he lied and his supporters bought it.



#28 TheCid

TheCid

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,496 posts
  • LocationSouth Carolina

Posted 28 February 2017 - 04:01 PM

The DNC isn't going to push for laws that are perceived by their corporate sponsors as hurting their industries.

 

Of course since you are a moderate Dem you believe the ones primarily to blame are the progressives and progressives believe the opposite.    See post from Bella.

 

Regardless of who is to blame what is going down only helps the GOP retain power at all levels of government.  

 

 

What post from Bella?

The Democrats have not turned their backs on their base.  Their base turned their backs on the Dems and voted for Trump because he appealed to their worst instincts. 

The Democrats over the past 70 years and up until 2010 were the ones who enacted all the progressive/liberal legislation and regulations that Trump and the Republicans are now overturning.  They enacted all the legislation restricting corporations and protecting people, the environment, the land, etc.  That's pretty damn "progressive."

Seems to me that some people cannot accept that corporations and businesses are an essential part of America.  More importantly they are a key component of politics from the school board to the White House.

 

Regardless, the problem for the Dems is that they must unite and they must present candidates for whom a majority of people will vote.


  • Princess of Tap likes this

#29 darkblue

darkblue

    child of vision

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,227 posts

Posted 28 February 2017 - 06:40 AM

Trump certainly isn't of the working class, but he sure knew how to talk to them. 

 

Dems can't even be bothered to try anymore - unless it's Hillary doing her phony imitations.

 

Whole new gen seeing right through now. As the boomers die off, so will go the Party unless it changes back to what it's supposed to be.


  • BelleLeGrand1 likes this

I may live badly but at least I don't have to work to do it.


#30 BelleLeGrand1

BelleLeGrand1

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 679 posts

Posted 28 February 2017 - 02:54 AM

What promises they have no intention of keeping?

Regardless, it appears the "progressive/liberal" factions are the ones primarily to blame.  Their attitude is: If we can't have our platform and our guy, we won't participate.  Welcome to how Donald John Trump became President of the United States.

Also need to remember that Sanders is NOT a Democrat, I repeat NOT a Democrat.  He is an independent and only ran for the Democratic nomination because he did not have the courage to run as an independent as many others have.

 

He may not have a (D) after his name, but Bernie represents traditional Democratic values more than any DINOs in the current party leadership.  If someone like Elizabeth Warren (who turned out to be a big disappointment) had stepped up to the plate, he probably wouldn't have run at all.

 

A big part of the problem is that the Democrats have turned their backs on their base in favor of their big corporate donors.  Remember this quote from Chuck Schumer:  "For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.”  Yeah, that strategy worked out real well, didn't it?  With that kind of attitude, they shouldn't expect the working class to return to the fold anytime soon.

 

Trump certainly isn't of the working class, but he sure knew how to talk to them. 


  • darkblue likes this

#31 Vautrin

Vautrin

    Quel siecle a mains!

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 7,776 posts
  • LocationNorth Carolina

Posted 27 February 2017 - 11:21 PM

I wouldn't worry too much about the Democrats. Each party

goes through some rough patches electorally. One party

in a two party system can always depend on being the other

party when people are temporarily fed up with the party in

power.


Curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid get.


#32 darkblue

darkblue

    child of vision

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,227 posts

Posted 27 February 2017 - 09:12 PM

What promises they have no intention of keeping?

Regardless, it appears the "progressive/liberal" factions are the ones primarily to blame.  Their attitude is: If we can't have our platform and our guy, we won't participate.  Welcome to how Donald John Trump became President of the United States.

Also need to remember that Sanders is NOT a Democrat, I repeat NOT a Democrat.  He is an independent and only ran for the Democratic nomination because he did not have the courage to run as an independent as many others have.

 

You ain't see nothing yet.

 

If Bernie decides to take his politics elsewhere, you can say goodbye to the Democratic Party.

 

His new Party will become larger than the Establishment Party. Why they're not doing what he asks, considering that, is a sure sign that they have confidence in the Corporate MIC's ability to crush him if it needs to.


I may live badly but at least I don't have to work to do it.


#33 jamesjazzguitar

jamesjazzguitar

    There is nothing as bad as something not so bad

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 16,277 posts
  • LocationCalifornia

Posted 27 February 2017 - 05:48 PM

What promises they have no intention of keeping?

Regardless, it appears the "progressive/liberal" factions are the ones primarily to blame.  Their attitude is: If we can't have our platform and our guy, we won't participate.  Welcome to how Donald John Trump became President of the United States.

Also need to remember that Sanders is NOT a Democrat, I repeat NOT a Democrat.  He is an independent and only ran for the Democratic nomination because he did not have the courage to run as an independent as many others have.

 

The DNC isn't going to push for laws that are perceived by their corporate sponsors as hurting their industries.

 

Of course since you are a moderate Dem you believe the ones primarily to blame are the progressives and progressives believe the opposite.    See post from Bella.

 

Regardless of who is to blame what is going down only helps the GOP retain power at all levels of government.  

 

The fact that Sanders and by extension many of his supporters are NOT Dems only makes the GOP that much happier. 


  • BelleLeGrand1 likes this

#34 TheCid

TheCid

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,496 posts
  • LocationSouth Carolina

Posted 27 February 2017 - 05:06 PM

I agree.  Of course the DNC establishment wishes to bring these Bernie supporters into the fold so they get their vote by making promises they have no intention of keeping. 

 

The larger point I was making is that the Dem party might not be able to get enough progressives to toe-the-line of the DNC establishment to defeat GOP candidates in future elections.

What promises they have no intention of keeping?

Regardless, it appears the "progressive/liberal" factions are the ones primarily to blame.  Their attitude is: If we can't have our platform and our guy, we won't participate.  Welcome to how Donald John Trump became President of the United States.

Also need to remember that Sanders is NOT a Democrat, I repeat NOT a Democrat.  He is an independent and only ran for the Democratic nomination because he did not have the courage to run as an independent as many others have.



#35 Vautrin

Vautrin

    Quel siecle a mains!

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 7,776 posts
  • LocationNorth Carolina

Posted 27 February 2017 - 04:25 PM

It's that old political saw, the taller person usually wins.


Curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid get.


#36 Vautrin

Vautrin

    Quel siecle a mains!

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 7,776 posts
  • LocationNorth Carolina

Posted 27 February 2017 - 04:24 PM

eteled


Curse Sir Walter Raleigh, he was such a stupid get.


#37 HIGHWAY

HIGHWAY

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,098 posts

Posted 27 February 2017 - 03:46 PM


  • darkblue and BelleLeGrand1 like this

#38 jamesjazzguitar

jamesjazzguitar

    There is nothing as bad as something not so bad

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 16,277 posts
  • LocationCalifornia

Posted 27 February 2017 - 12:59 PM

Bernie doesn't want his donors (millions of little people) being lied to. That's a pretty good reason to not expose their names to the DNC - the DNC only wants to hound them.

 

I agree.  Of course the DNC establishment wishes to bring these Bernie supporters into the fold so they get their vote by making promises they have no intention of keeping. 

 

The larger point I was making is that the Dem party might not be able to get enough progressives to toe-the-line of the DNC establishment to defeat GOP candidates in future elections.



#39 TheCid

TheCid

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,496 posts
  • LocationSouth Carolina

Posted 27 February 2017 - 09:19 AM

 

DJT_Headshot_V2_bigger.jpg

Donald J. TrumpVerified account‏@realDonaldTrump 7h7 hours ago

The race for DNC Chairman was, of course, totally "rigged." Bernie's guy, like Bernie himself, never had a chance. Clinton demanded Perez!

 

 

Of course Trump is disappointed.  His candidate and that of the Republican Party (Ellison) lost.  That means the Sanders-Warren wing loses face since they came on so strong for Ellison before Perez was even in the race.

I am not disparaging Ellison and I think he has a lot to contribute to the Democratic Party, but he was the target the Republicans, their supporters, the corporations, the one-percenters, etc. wanted to be able to attack.

The next elections at all levels would have been about Ellison, his religion, his politics and his past instead of about the actual Dem candidates "from the school boards to the senate."



#40 darkblue

darkblue

    child of vision

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,227 posts

Posted 27 February 2017 - 12:31 AM

Sanders comments today about how the DNC elect their leaders is very telling.   Additionally he stated that he would not provide the DNC the list of his donors.   

 

Bernie doesn't want his donors (millions of little people) being lied to. That's a pretty good reason to not expose their names to the DNC - the DNC only wants to hound them.


I may live badly but at least I don't have to work to do it.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users