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Bernie Sanders!


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#821 Bogie56

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 03:50 PM

"Approximately two-thirds of American voters say the U.S. needs “radical change,” according to an April 5 Quinnipiac University poll.

When asked what they thought about the statement “the old way of doing things no longer works and we need radical change,” the survey found that 64 percent of voters agreed.

 

The responses were split up based on party and on voters’ candidate of choice. 71 percent of Republicans agreed that the U.S. needs radical change; so too did 58 percent of Democrats.

 

Supporters of every presidential candidate expressed desire for radical change, save for one. The only exception? Hillary Clinton."

 

http://www.salon.com...dium=socialflow

 

The old way of doing things certainly doesn't work.  The evidence is there for almost everyone to see.  Clinton of course would not wish for "radical" change, which does not need to be defined by violence by the way, as she is a guardian of the current world order.

These guardians paint change as 'dangerous' - ooh, so scary, so they can protect this world order for the top 1%.  It's actually much less than 1% in reality.


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#822 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 03:43 PM

 

Supporters of every presidential candidate expressed desire for radical change, save for one. The only exception? Hillary Clinton."

 

I actually believe that, and agree. I think the media (mainstream, talk radio, non-mainstream) and others whip people up into a frenzy, particularly in turning people against Washington. That has led to some dangerous situations. I think Hillary supporters recognize how dangerous that mode of communication is. It leads to situations such as Oklahoma City, that recent situation in Oregon, and things that may seem less toxic but in the long run lead to violence. 



#823 mr6666

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 03:34 PM

"Approximately two-thirds of American voters say the U.S. needs “radical change,” according to an April 5 Quinnipiac University poll.

When asked what they thought about the statement “the old way of doing things no longer works and we need radical change,” the survey found that 64 percent of voters agreed.

 

The responses were split up based on party and on voters’ candidate of choice. 71 percent of Republicans agreed that the U.S. needs radical change; so too did 58 percent of Democrats.

 

Supporters of every presidential candidate expressed desire for radical change, save for one. The only exception? Hillary Clinton."

 

http://www.salon.com...dium=socialflow


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"A small elephant is not a rabbit."


#824 darkblue

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 02:16 PM

The irony being people think a socialist is trustworthy and honest.

 

Christ is a socialist.


I may live badly but at least I don't have to work to do it.


#825 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 01:16 PM

I am loath to get in the middle of these testy exchanges, but I have to speak up. Swithin, you keep using the "unicorn" label to go after Sanders supporters, but I don't think you got the original intent of the usage of that word by darkblue. It wasn't that he was calling Bernie "holy/sacred" or "infallible" but that he was saying that Sanders was as "rare as a unicorn", for whatever reason, perhaps for his stance against big-money donors or his open espousal of socialists ideals, both of which are extremely rare in the modern American political sphere. Unicorns are known for being rare. They are not, as far as I know, usually ascribed infallibility or holiness, which seems to be the attribute you have bestowed on it.

 

Just my 2 cents. There are critical remarks to made about all of the candidates, but if you are disingenuous about it, it kind of sabotages your point of view in the eyes of others. 

 

Thanks for your POV, Larry. I'm sorry that people insist on bringing up these sensitive political threads, but if they must start these threads, I will certainly help populate them!  Darkblue chose that word carefully and went on in that thread (as I recall, I think it's gone now) to emphasize Bernie's uniqueness. He made him sound almost infallible -- he may even have used that word, although I don't remember exactly.

 

That word -- unicorn -- is actually the essence of my thesis. Trump's supporters think that Trump is a rare and unusual creature because of his stances; Bernie's supporters think the same of their candidate. (In some case, they actually seem to have similar stances, for example, as regards old-fashioned American protectionism and fear of the global market. And on their simplistic "a chicken in every pot" approach to the issues.)

 

Bernie's supporters persist (as Trump's supporters do) in positioning their candidate as"rare as a unicorn," meaning he's not a typical politician. My point is that Bernie is most definitely a typical politician. Each candidate may have his/her unique features, but they are all politicians, and Bernie and Trump are (for me) at the top of the list.

 

As far as sabotaging my point of view in the eyes of the others -- there is no arguing with Sanders or Trump supporters. That may be the real unicorn-like feature of those two candidates and their supporters -- an unprecedented inability to accept disagreement.



#826 NipkowDisc

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:59 AM

The above poll was on CNN this morning.  Take it as you will.  As for the NY Daily News article, CNN had two people from the Bernie campaign on this morning who made it quite clear that the people who wrote that article didn't understand the issues and Bernie's response which they completely stand by was correct and defensible.  I couldn't go into it as they did as I am not an economist.  You would just have to see their responses in that interview in which they repeated Bernie's answers.  And one even pointed out that his position was no different than Clinton's which the NYDN characterized as uninformed.  It is unfortunate that people take these stories at face value and run with them.

has the NY daily news held HRC to her pronouncement several debates ago that she would be forthcoming with those goldman-sachs transcripts??? :huh:


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#827 LawrenceA

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:44 AM

I am loath to get in the middle of these testy exchanges, but I have to speak up. Swithin, you keep using the "unicorn" label to go after Sanders supporters, but I don't think you got the original intent of the usage of that word by darkblue. It wasn't that he was calling Bernie "holy/sacred" or "infallible" but that he was saying that Sanders was as "rare as a unicorn", for whatever reason, perhaps for his stance against big-money donors or his open espousal of socialists ideals, both of which are extremely rare in the modern American political sphere. Unicorns are known for being rare. They are not, as far as I know, usually ascribed infallibility or holiness, which seems to be the attribute you have bestowed on it.

 

Just my 2 cents. There are critical remarks to made about all of the candidates, but if you are disingenuous about it, it kind of sabotages your point of view in the eyes of others. 


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#828 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:17 AM

I have said in the past that I do not agree with Bernie's past stance on gun laws but I guess that was not convenient to the unicorn narrative.  

My wife prefers Clinton.  We are not seeking a divorce.  

 

 

I certainly remember that you said that. I was speaking of Bernie supporters in general.  I think you (or was it someone else?) who asked one of our resident Trump worshippers if there was anything he didn't like about Trump. I think Trump is a unicorn to them. That seems to me to be another thing Bernie and Trump have in common -- the fact that their supporters can't see any flaws in their candidates.  But I'm not referring to you, Bogie, as I do recall your concerns about Bernie and guns.



#829 Bogie56

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:13 AM

I have said in the past that I do not agree with Bernie's past stance on gun laws but I guess that was not convenient to the unicorn narrative.  

My wife prefers Clinton.  We are not seeking a divorce.  


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#830 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:09 AM

The irony being people think a socialist is trustworthy and honest.

A socialist can certainly be trustworthy and honest.  But I don't think Bernie and many of his supporters are either of those things.



#831 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:07 AM

The above poll was on CNN this morning.  Take it as you will.  As for the NY Daily News article, CNN had two people from the Bernie campaign on this morning who made it quite clear that the people who wrote that article didn't understand the issues and Bernie's response which they completely stand by was correct and defensible.  I couldn't go into it as they did as I am not an economist.  You would just have to see their responses in that interview in which they repeated Bernie's answers.  And one even pointed out that his position was no different than Clinton's which the NYDN characterized as uninformed.  It is unfortunate that people take these stories at face value and run with them.

 

Bernie has run with the right-wing Republican attitudes about Hillary -- ready made for him. Bernie's votes against gun laws are well documented. It's unfortunate that Bernie supporters can take no criticism of their unicorn.

 

I listened to the audio of the Daily News interview -- it's very scary.  Just like Trump not knowing what he's talking about. But Bernie's people are good at sophistry, I'll give them that.



#832 MovieMadness

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 11:06 AM

One Wisconsin Poll - Honesty & Trustworthiness:

Sanders 83%

Clinton 16%

 

The irony being people think a socialist is trustworthy and honest.


Things are never so bad they can't be made worse.


#833 Bogie56

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 10:56 AM

One Wisconsin Poll - Honesty & Trustworthiness:

Sanders 83%

Clinton 16%

 

The above poll was on CNN this morning.  Take it as you will.  As for the NY Daily News article, CNN had two people from the Bernie campaign on this morning who made it quite clear that the people who wrote that article didn't understand the issues and Bernie's response which they completely stand by was correct and defensible.  I couldn't go into it as they did as I am not an economist.  You would just have to see their responses in that interview in which they repeated Bernie's answers.  And one even pointed out that his position was no different than Clinton's which the NYDN characterized as uninformed.  It is unfortunate that people take these stories at face value and run with them.


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#834 jamesjazzguitar

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 10:54 AM

One Wisconsin Poll - Honesty & Trustworthiness:

Sanders 83%

Clinton 16%

 

The bottom line here is that HRC is NOT a good politician.   With all the backing of the Dem establishment and the media she shouldn't be in such battle with a self described "socialist".      Dems should be worried that even with the GOP so fractured she will beat herself in November.


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#835 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 10:47 AM

One Wisconsin Poll - Honesty & Trustworthiness:

Sanders 83%

Clinton 16%

 

Actually, the exit polls showed much higher ratings for Clinton for honesty -- well over 50%.   And of course I think Mr. Cruz is honest and trustworthy. If he weren't, I wouldn't be so terrified of him!

 

Like most of the other candidates before him (a few of which have been posted in the Trump threads), Bernie made it to the cover of The New York Daily News today:

 

Bernie-New-York-Daily-News-.jpg

 

(I trust Hillary to fight the gun lobby.)



#836 Bogie56

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 10:16 AM

One Wisconsin Poll - Honesty & Trustworthiness:

Sanders 83%

Clinton 16%



#837 Swithin

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 07:23 AM

Sanders' disastrous meeting with the New York Daily News points up even more similarities between him and Donald Trump. Stump speeches, slogans, absolutely no understanding of policy.  Break up the banks, build the wall, free tuition -- all meaningless slogans with no understanding of how to do anything. Pretty scary. Two dangerous and very similar men: Trump and Sanders.

 

https://www.washingt...bernie-sanders/

 

(As one of the pundits wrote, if Hillary Clinton gave an interview like that, she'd be crucified. The media is too easy on Sanders, as they were on Trump, but perhaps that will now change.)



#838 NipkowDisc

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 11:51 PM

Sanders Wins Wisconsin!!

 

By double digits, yet! And that's, what? 8 in a row? 9? I'm losing track the way Bernie's just been burning it up.

 

Nate Silver seems to have blown a fuse or something. Didn't he give Hillary a 78.5% chance of winning Wisconsin? Hoo-boy, he's been getting a lot of States wrong this year.

 

And now 16 States for Bernie, 17 for the queen?

 

And at least 2 of hers were really virtual ties, if I remember correctly.

 

She owes everything to southern-state African-Americans. Everything.

 

It's absolutely bizarre when you think of how much suffering they have endured because of Clinton Democrats. Spike Lee is still shaking his head in disbelief about those deep-south primary results.

they're the only block dumb enough to vote for her.


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#839 NipkowDisc

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 11:46 PM

From what I read, she decided to have another private big-donor dinner in NYC instead.

bernie wasn't invited. :)


"okay, so we're moving right along, folks" -al pacino, dog day afternoon


#840 LawrenceA

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 11:25 PM

it doan matter. she'll come on and say she won anyway:lol:

 

From what I read, she decided to have another private big-donor dinner in NYC instead.






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