Sign in to follow this  
Princess of Tap

Mike Pence-- Who is He and What is his Agenda?

306 posts in this topic

Yes, from what I've heard Bette was pretty salty in real life...

I wouldn't be surprised. What a $%^&*$ dump. I curse all

the time too, though I can control it with strangers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I saw a short item in the paper a few weeks ago where a woman

in Indiana tried to use their religious freedom law to get out of

a child abuse charge. Spare the rod kind of thing. She was still

found guilty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

George Stephanopoulos refused to take **** from Mike Pence on Sunday.

 

The ABC host of This Week grilled Pence for repeatedly defending Donald Trump’s false claim that 3 million people voted illegally to help Hillary Clinton win the popular vote....

 

"It’s his right to make false statements?” a bewildered Stephanopoulos asked.

Pence responded by dodging the question and called Trump “refreshing” while praising his ability to brainwash people into hanging on his every word.

 

“I think one of the things that’s refreshing about our president-elect. I think he made such an incredible connection with people all across this country because he tells you what’s on his mind.”

 

Stephanopoulos refused to let Pence get away with not answering his question. “But why is it refreshing to make false statements?” he asked.

And then the interview got testy as Pence claimed that nobody knows if Trump’s statement is false or not, leading Stephanopoulos to hit Pence hard to conclude the interview....

 

http://addictinginfo.org/2016/12/04/watch-mike-pence-is-taken-to-the-woodshed-by-abc-host-for-defending-trumps-lies/

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

George Stephanopoulos refused to take **** from Mike Pence on Sunday.

 

The ABC host of This Week grilled Pence for repeatedly defending Donald Trump’s false claim that 3 million people voted illegally to help Hillary Clinton win the popular vote....

 

"It’s his right to make false statements?” a bewildered Stephanopoulos asked.

Pence responded by dodging the question and called Trump “refreshing” while praising his ability to brainwash people into hanging on his every word.

 

“I think one of the things that’s refreshing about our president-elect. I think he made such an incredible connection with people all across this country because he tells you what’s on his mind.”

 

Stephanopoulos refused to let Pence get away with not answering his question. “But why is it refreshing to make false statements?” he asked.

And then the interview got testy as Pence claimed that nobody knows if Trump’s statement is false or not, leading Stephanopoulos to hit Pence hard to conclude the interview....

 

http://addictinginfo.org/2016/12/04/watch-mike-pence-is-taken-to-the-woodshed-by-abc-host-for-defending-trumps-lies/

What is on his mind? His mind is spilling over with falsehoods.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Pence also called being gay a choice and said keeping gays from marrying

was not discrimination, but an enforcement of “God’s idea.”

 

That kind of thinking is not merely reactionary, it's downright archiac. Astonishing.

 

He dodges the discrimination charge by invoking God. Directly in violation of the separation of church and state. This may be, Tap, the reason you ask. If he frames this kind of language in a bill, he should be challenged on that, though in our current climate, he likely will not.

 

 

My Congressman had an ad during the election, part of which stated that Freedom of Religion does not mean freedom from religion.  He won with over 70% of the vote. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Pence also called being gay a choice and said keeping gays from marrying

was not discrimination, but an enforcement of “God’s idea.”

 

That kind of thinking is not merely reactionary, it's downright archiac. Astonishing.

 

He dodges the discrimination charge by invoking God. Directly in violation of the separation of church and state. This may be, Tap, the reason you ask. If he frames this kind of language in a bill, he should be challenged on that, though in our current climate, he likely will not.

 

 

Clearly discrimination should be illegal in this instance and gays should be granted equal rights.    But I don't recommend the 'because it isn't a choice' defense for that POV.     That just plays into the hands of the homophobic.    It doesn't matter why anyone choices to be or do what they wish to do,  as long as it doesn't impact the lives of others in a harmful way,   it shouldn't be prohibited.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Clearly discrimination should be illegal in this instance and gays should be granted equal rights.    But I don't recommend the 'because it isn't a choice' defense for that POV.     That just plays into the hands of the homophobic.    It doesn't matter why anyone choices to be or do what they wish to do,  as long as it doesn't impact the lives of others in a harmful way,   it shouldn't be prohibited.

 

Of course not, they should be granted equal rights because they are people. The "because it isn't a choice" card should not even be in a discussion, because I don't believe and many (most? all?) others think it is a choice either. It should be an axiom. I'm not gay but I find it ridiculous that anyone would think it's a choice, by common sense even, i.e., how could anyone fake a life-style like that. Yes fake, if being gay is not a congenital, inveterate, and totally natural impulse from within, then you're faking it (for whatever reason, only God knows).

 

My impression is that gaydom is either genetics or an overwhelming predisposition and that there is a near unanimous  general agreement on that. That Pence would believe that homosexuality is a personal choice is just plain nuts, and is a disease to be cured is nothing less that astonishing to me, a totally Medieval cast of mind.  His preoccupation with God notwithstanding.  He doesn't believe in God anyway. If he did, he wouldn't be perpetrating this madness on the gay community.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My Congressman had an ad during the election, part of which stated that Freedom of Religion does not mean freedom from religion.  He won with over 70% of the vote. 

 

Well, OF COURSE the dude won 70 percent of the vote in that state o' yours, Cid!

 

Last I heard, South Carolina is STILL full of hypocritical Bible Thumpers who STILL somehow believe the U.S. Constitution is based upon Christian doctrine, now isn't IT???

 

(...it's NORTH Carolina where I hear it's now said you overhear more YANKEE accents being spoken now days than good ol' Southern drawls, RIGHT?)

 

;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course not, they should be granted equal rights because they are people. The "because it isn't a choice" card should not even be in a discussion, because I don't believe and many (most? all?) others think it is a choice either. It should be an axiom. I'm not gay but I find it ridiculous that anyone would think it's a choice, by common sense even, i.e., how could anyone fake a life-style like that. Yes fake, if being gay is not a congenital, inveterate, and totally natural impulse from within, then you're faking it (for whatever reason, only God knows).

 

My impression is that gaydom is either genetics or an overwhelming predisposition and that there is a near unanimous  general agreement on that. That Pence would believe that homosexuality is a personal choice is just plain nuts, and is a disease to be cured is nothing less that astonishing to me, a totally Medieval cast of mind.  His preoccupation with God notwithstanding.  He doesn't believe in God anyway. If he did, he wouldn't be perpetrating this madness on the gay community.

 

Human sexuality is far too complex for it to be viewed in a binary manner of 'born this way' or 'chosen'.     I find it funny that you claim that it shouldn't matter and than go on and on to support the we are all 'born this way'  POV.     To me the only common sense POV is to have NO POV especially not a dumbed down binary position on something so complex.

 

But since you have such a strong position on the topic, are bisexuals 'born that way'?   

 

PS:  I'm fine with Pence believing that bring homosexual is a choice as long as he ALSO believes that being heterosexual is a choice.     

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, OF COURSE the dude won 70 percent of the vote in that state o' yours, Cid!

 

Last I heard, South Carolina is STILL full of hypocritical Bible Thumpers who STILL somehow believe the U.S. Constitution is based upon Christian doctrine, now isn't IT???

 

(...it's NORTH Carolina where I hear it's now said you overhear more YANKEE accents being spoken now days than good ol' Southern drawls, RIGHT?)

 

;)

More "yankee" accents throughout the South than in the past.  That is why some early polls thought S.C. and GA might actually be in contention.  However, it is still a relatively small group compared to most voters.  In addition, the GOP legislatures have done an excellent job of suppressing their votes by corralling them into as few county, state and federal districes as possible.

One of the ironies of many of GOP Southern governors is their belief that attracting retirees will be a financial blessing at no cost to the state.  They seem to ignore that many of these retirees are far more moderate than the standard voters in Deep South.

Same with selling out taxpayers to attract major corporations to build plants or move HQ's down South.  That is what changed NC.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PS:  I'm fine with Pence believing that bring homosexual is a choice as long as he ALSO believes that being heterosexual is a choice.     

 

Being sexual at all is also a choice, since you can certainly survive without it. Is Mike Pence doing it only as his God intended? That is, in order to procreate lots and lots of babies so that the future armies will be well stocked with soldiers just like in Old Testament Times and Germany under Mein Führer? That is the whole point of heterosexuality being "normal" and all other orientations not, am I right? (Good thing so many conservative Christians... not so sure what Pence thinks necessarily... are convinced Adam and Eve were created separately from the Animal Kingdom and God helped Cain begot children without any women besides his mother around. Otherwise I don't know how they can ever deal with all of the "alternative lifestyles" observed with apes, penguins, giraffes and so forth.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Today on CNN, Jake Tapper asked Mike the doorstop Pence about 8 times if he was aware that the Trump campaign had asked for a security clearance for Mike Flynn's wingnut racist son and each time the oily weasel Pence did not answer the question.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Being sexual at all is also a choice, since you can certainly survive without it. Is Mike Pence doing it only as his God intended? That is, in order to procreate lots and lots of babies so that the future armies will be well stocked with soldiers just like in Old Testament Times and Germany under Mein Führer? That is the whole point of heterosexuality being "normal" and all other orientations not, am I right? (Good thing so many conservative Christians... not so sure what Pence thinks necessarily... are convinced Adam and Eve were created separately from the Animal Kingdom and God helped Cain begot children without any women besides his mother around. Otherwise I don't know how they can ever deal with all of the "alternative lifestyles" observed with apes, penguins, giraffes and so forth.)

 

Where Pence and other religious nut cases like him are wrong on this issue is they believe everyone is 'born this way' but only as heterosexuals.   You're correct that the whole point of that POV is that being heterosexual is 'normal'.    

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Human sexuality is far too complex for it to be viewed in a binary manner of 'born this way' or 'chosen'.     I find it funny that you claim that it shouldn't matter and than go on and on to support the we are all 'born this way'  POV.     To me the only common sense POV is to have NO POV especially not a dumbed down binary position on something so complex.

 

But since you have such a strong position on the topic, are bisexuals 'born that way'?   

 

PS:  I'm fine with Pence believing that bring homosexual is a choice as long as he ALSO believes that being heterosexual is a choice.     

 

I like your comment in general. Many facile assertions are often made without considering complexity.

 

And speaking of "binary" we might apply that to politics, Right v Left, Democrats v Republicans, Conservatives v Liberals. And all of it complex. We love the binary thing. Maybe we should abandon POVs. Too complex.

:D

 

In fairness, I mis-wrote. Instead of "congenital, inveterate, and totally natural impulse" I meant "congenital, inveterate, or natural impulse" which makes your charge of binary thinking valid. So if I may be granted a mulligan on that.

:D

 

I have held---perhaps wrongly but I doubt it---that being gay is not considered a personal choice but comes about either from genetics, and/or deep-rooted psychological factors that would precede any conscious choice, as in, "Gee, I think I'll convert to homosexuality." I opine that does not happen. I think that homosexuality is something that the person has no control over, whether genetics or environmental, or other factors and therefore should not be prosecuted just as a person should not be prosecuted for ethnicity as that is also something that is beyond control. The beyond control term morally protects them by way of the Constitution. It is necessary to understand that, which is something that extremist Conservatives are constitutionally (small c) incapable to doing. They don't understand anything that is not in accordance with the Manifesto. Being fair in accepting someone who has no control of who they are is nowhere in their playbook.

 

Pence hides behind the "it's their choice" thing and that, according to him, makes them vulnerable to the charges of either being immoral (biblically speaking) or as having a mental illness that has to be "cured" both which are utter nutter nonsense. He surreptitiously ignores the plain fact that if heteros wanted to attempt a gay lifestyle, they are within their rights to do so without official, legislative, or judicial interference as they are protected by Constitutional freedoms.

 

The link below says (among other many things) that although homosexuality was widely and traditionally thought to be genetics, new research has suggested that there is more to it than that, i.e, more complex. So my position is dated on that score. Point conceded.

 

Provisionally at least, if we can believe this site, which appears to have an agenda. But article still reads well to me, i.e., it goes into detail and sounds responsible and not propaganda (but it is). More research would be in order. But I think they're probably right on the new research thing.

 

http://www.godandscience.org/evolution/genetics_of_homosexuality.html

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We had a big discussion about this a while back. Not getting into all of the details here and I am just paraphrasing (so feel free to make corrections)...

 

In the 1940s, Alfred Kinsey and his team insinuated (if not exactly confirmed) that few people were 100% heterosexual or 100% homosexual but somewhere in-between. Culture, religion and family obligations made most conform as much as possible to heterosexuality. Many, many people married accordingly to preserve the status quo. However Kinsey was bisexual in his tastes and probably slanted somewhat in his views. In addition, many of his subjects were interviewed during World War II and shortly later, so they were likely more honest in their answers regarding desires and experiences. Also because the Kinsey team was the first, people were simply honest because they had nothing to lose as long as all information was kept confidential.

 

Later in the '50s and '60s, the heterosexual Master & Johnson gave a much smaller percentage for those leaning to the homosexual side or being bisexual. Yet they were doing their studies after McCarthyism (and all of the phobias about being "found out" about ALL sorts of things including the non-sexual) had taken its toll and many were conforming with what was "normal" (a.k.a. heterosexual) even on a psychological level. Also these two were quite biased in their own way, since they were "heteronormal". They even experimented with conversion therapy, which Pence supports. This was NOT something "live and let live" Kinsey would have approved of, being that he died in 1956 before they started their work.

 

It is very difficult to do an accurate study on all of this regardless of how private the interviews are. All of us are influenced by our environment and few are willing to be "different" even when questioned by a stranger in total confidence.

 

One interesting trend of this past decade is the increasing number of men and women in their 40s-70s "coming out", often after divorce, losing a spouse and kids growing up. Later in life, they have decided to pursue their real desires with members of the same sex. Keep in mind that, despite gay liberation in the 1970s and The Times Of Harvey Milk, you had AIDS and the Reagan and two Bush administrations forcing many BACK into the closet and also impacting those who were teenagers in, for example, the 1980s. Even today, you can still lose your job if you were discovered to be gay in some parts of the country because the laws are still not fixed yet... and might not be with the Republicans swinging the pendulum backward again.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pence takes steps to blaze his own, non-Trump trail-

 

 

"As vice president, Mike Pence has already been caught – several times – trying to defend Donald Trump in ways that turned out to be completely untrue. Whether he knew he was deceiving the public is a matter of some debate, but Pence has nevertheless been caught peddling brazen falsehoods on the president’s behalf.

And so, I was curious to see what the veep would say today, now that we know Trump World tried to collude with Russia during our adversary’s election attack.

Here’s the official statement Pence’s press secretary gave NBC News this afternoon:

 

“The vice president is working every day to advance the president’s agenda. He was not aware of the meeting. He is also not focused on stories about the campaign – especially those pertaining to the time before he joined the campaign.”

 

It’s those last 11 words that stand out. Pence didn’t literally say, “Hey, I wasn’t even on the ticket when Team Trump wanted Russia’s illegal help,” but the subtext isn’t exactly subtle...

 

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/pence-takes-steps-blaze-his-own-non-trump-trail?cid=sm_fb_maddow

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

landscape-1475690382-pence3.jpg

 

"It's the greatest privilege of my life to . . . you know . . . do it every time the President bends over."

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"....Pence “has been courting scores of the country’s most influential donors, corporate executives and conservative political leaders over the past several months in a series of private gatherings and one-on-one conversations.”

Pence is also the first sitting vice president who isn’t running for president himself to create his own political action committee.

 

 

Sarah Posner had a good piece yesterday, noting that it’s easy to believe that Pence is taking these steps, not to help Trump’s ambitions, but rather to help his own...

 

"Despite Pence’s protestations to the contrary, the vice president looks to be preparing for his own political future. Beyond this clear signal about his own political ambitions, Pence’s actions raise the question of whether he has lost confidence in Trump’s ability to come out of the Russia investigation unscathed."

 

 

This, of course, predated by a day Pence learning about Team Trump’s attempts at collusion – at a time “before he joined the campaign.”......

 

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/pence-takes-steps-blaze-his-own-non-trump-trail?cid=sm_fb_maddow

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

45]obBB1x2a_bigger.jpgSalonVerified account @Salon

 

 

More

GOP's health care bill now involves blatant falsehoods — because their voters will literally believe anything

http://www.salon.com/2017/07/17/how-can-mike-pence-get-away-with-outrageous-lies-about-the-health-care-bill/

 

Pence_Republicans_34054.jpg-5540d_c0-199

 

45]DJRE8wGp_bigger.jpgShareblueVerified account @Shareblue

 

 

More

Pence has been laying groundwork for a presidential campaign But polling shows Americans don't like him http://shareblue.com/mike-pences-shadow-campaign-is-failing-poll-says-hes-no-better-than-trump/ By @owillis

DFEn5T5W0AA7S18.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like any other vice president, I haven't been paying Pence much mind and only remember he's there whenever there's footage of him shilling for Trump.

 

 

Sepiatone

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

New Members:

Register Here

Learn more about the new message boards:

FAQ

Having problems?

Contact Us