TomJH

Racism in Trump's America

416 posts in this topic

It is sadly predictable. A man blatantly dog whistled to racists during an election and was elected to the most powerful office in the world. Most people voted for him for reasons other than that, of course, but they also knew that the appeal to bigotry was there, as well.

 

Now a series of incidents are being reported (kids in school, a passenger on a plane causing a black woman to cry, etc., sometimes with the name Trump being raised). And before you say that racism has always been with us, at least have the honesty to acknowledge that Trump's candidacy has made racist comments more "permissible" for some in the name of fighting political correctness.

 

One poster on these threads proclaimed that he was glad and proud that he was a white man. Before Donald Trump's arrival on the political scene, how likely were we to have seen that same comment here?

 

We have entered an ugly period in prejudice. Scapegoating by some going through times of economic uncertainty will do that. But Trump's appointment of Steve Bannon, a man accused of anti-Semistism and white supremacy, to a top White House role only adds to the fears of many Americans that bigotry resides in the Oval Office. Trump's desire to reward those loyal to him in this case has only added to a nation's racial divide.

 

 

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I have family members and acquaintances who voted for Trump/Pence who insist they aren't racist.... and, no, they are not.

 

There was a famous episode in Golden Girls, "Dorothy's New Friend":

 

Barbara Thorndyke (Bonnie Bartlett): We have a little problem.

Dorothy (Bea Arthur): We do?

Barbara: Yes. Murray Guttman.

Dorothy: Oh! Maybe we can get him to turn his jacket inside out. I am sure the lining isn't as loud.

Barbara: His tuxedo has nothing to do with it.

Dorothy: I don't understand.

Barbara: He can not come to the club.

Dorothy: Why not?

Barbara: Guttman.

Dorothy: What are you talking about?

Barbara: Guttman. He's Jewish isn't he?

Dorothy: I don't know. What difference does it make?

Barbara: A big difference. The Mortimer Club is restricted.

Dorothy: Barbara, why are you a member of a club like that?

Barbara: Because they serve a great breakfast and the parking is free. Besides, it is their policy, not mine.

Dorothy: Yeah, but you tolerate it.

Barbara: Dorothy, I tolerate a lot of things. For instance, I tolerate this evening with Rose and Blanche because of my friendship with you.

 

I should also add, many say "some of my best friends are... " or "I have family members who are... " and they sure tolerate a lot. Bless their little hearts.

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It is sadly predictable. A man blatantly dog whistled to racists during an election and was elected to the most powerful office in the world. Most people voted for him for reasons other than that, of course, but they also knew that the appeal to bigotry was there, as well.

 

Now a series of incidents are being reported (kids in school, a passenger on a plane causing a black woman to cry, etc., sometimes with the name Trump being raised). And before you say that racism has always been with us, at least have the honesty to acknowledge that Trump's candidacy has made racist comments more "permissible" for some in the name of fighting political correctness.

 

One poster on these threads proclaimed that he was glad and proud that he was a white man. Before Donald Trump's arrival on the political scene, how likely were we to have seen that same comment here?

 

We have entered an ugly period in prejudice. Scapegoating by some going through times of economic uncertainty will do that. But Trump's appointment of Steve Bannon, a man accused of anti-Semistism and white supremacy, to a top White House role only adds to the fears of many Americans that bigotry resides in the Oval Office. Trump's desire to reward those loyal to him in this case has only added to a nation's racial divide.

Scratch a Republican voter, you find a racist in many, many cases.  Goldwater, Nixon and Reagan capitalized on that. It was key to their very successful Southern Strategy.

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Scratch a Republican voter, you find a racist in many, many cases. Goldwater, Nixon and Reagan capitalized on that. It was key to their very successful Southern Strategy.

I also think a lot of white voters just feel uncomfortable being in the party that has a black/Latino base.

 

It's not like they have to spend any quality time with any of these people - - it's little bit like the psychology of public transportation.

 

Except in large cities--The General non-big city perception of people who take public transportation is negative-- that there's something wrong with them because they don't have cars.

 

I've seen a few middle-class people commute to a job on the bus, but not very many do that even.

 

Everybody wants to be seen to be associated with the in-crowd - - the upwardly mobile people or the people who have, the how do you put it, mainstream look. LOL

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The current state of racial unrest in the US is more complicated than just old resentments. I think it's a result, both intentional and unforeseen, of how modern society is spending its time. It's the media angle, but one that shouldn't be discounted. A very large percentage of people are on the internet, and getting their news from there. If they're a leftie, it's from places like HuffPost. If they're a rightie, then it's places like Breitbart and Drudge. The cable news has fractured in the same directions, with MSNBC on the left and FOX on the right. All of these outlets are fighting for eyeballs, viewers or clicks. And nothing brings them in like outrage. And one of the hot-button topics in the US is race.

 

So HuffPost and MSNBC push the "innocent blacks killed by police" narrative, while Breitbart and FOX push the "social justice warriors want all whites in prison" type stuff. And then these things get linked on Facebook and Twitter, so more people see it, and more get angry. People tend to self-segregate into like-minded groups, and in this era there are places for them to go so that they never hear the other side. They only hear what gets passed around on "their" side. This breeds even more contempt for people who don't see the world the same way, especially when the the two sides spend as much time demonizing their opposites as they do stoking the fires of fear and outrage.

 

I wonder what the state of things would be if the internet disappeared along with all 24/7 cable news channels and talk radio? Obviously, short of a cataclysm, this isn't going to happen, but people on both sides need to take a step back and look at how they are getting their information.

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The operant word there is overreach and Dore has a point, at least I hope he does. Even with all those repulsive guys, what about Pence. He doesn't appear repulsive with his nice demeanor and happy face but his policies are so odious and non-representative of the electorate he will contribute greatly to the backlash.

 

The Republicans are doing this as a power rush to get things done before the mid-term but as Dore and others are saying here that it might backfire, uh, bigly.

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As I like to say, and in my typical semi-vulgar manner...There's not a Swingin' Dick on this planet, let alone this country, who doesn't harbor deep in their soul at least a small amount of racism and/or some preconceived notions about a person or persons of another race.

 

It all boils down to how much and how well one can control these base human instincts that distinguishes them. 

 

(...and this of course goes for women too...that whole "Swingin' Dick" thing up there was just a euphemism for the entire human race)

 

;)

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As I like to say, and in my typical semi-vulgar manner...There's not a Swingin' Dick on this planet, let alone this country, who doesn't harbor deep in their soul at least a small amount of racism and/or some preconceived notions about a person or persons of another race.

 

It's my belief that nearly everyone is racist to some degree. Someone who was born deaf, dumb and blind probably isn't racist at all.

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Watching reports in Europe the ultra right wing, anti-immigrant neo-fascist parties are rejoicing in the Trump victory and are getting oxygen from it.  Trump has legitimized the racist scapegoating that so many died fighting against in WWII.

The Trump supporters seem to like the fact that liberals are horrified that he has been elected.  I suspect the more deplorable among them won't care that world leaders are horrified as well.

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It's my belief that nearly everyone is racist to some degree. Someone who was born deaf, dumb and blind probably isn't racist at all.

 

Nearly? Are you saying that a newborn baby will only stop crying if (s)he is held by an adult of the same race?

 

Many (not all, of course) Republican politicians out to get the racist and "evangelical" vote will insist that marriage is defined by One Man and One Woman and are against gay couples adopting as well as single parents (a.k.a. Dan Quayle criticizing the show Murphy Brown back in the day). One thing they are correct about: if a baby has One Father and One Mother, preferably of the same race, (s)he is more likely going to be accepted by the neighbors. When the child ventures outside of the home, the risks are reduced. If the parents are of different races or of the same gender, (s)he will always know (s)he is somehow different regardless of how polite the neighbors and others in the environment are.

 

It is like the Sesame Street song: one of these things is not like the other. Can you tell me which one is different?

 

The only way to overcome racism is make the environment more diversified and eliminate all of the "stick with your own kind" thinking (a.k.a. West Side Story). Integration was something fought for centuries, especially after slavery was abolished. After Brown vs. Board of Education, it took the federal government to come down hard to enforce the rules after 1954. Some school districts like Prince Edward County, Virginia fought back by merely shutting down altogether for four years. School bus integration continued to be an issue well into the seventies even up north like Massachusetts.

 

Everybody has their own answer Why Hillary Lost. Obviously Putin from Russia impacted things by exposing how Establishment and anti-Bernie the Democratic party was... a mistake THEY made that cost them. (That is, if Putin did do it all by himself. Two members of the Trump campaign had ties to him and several members of the FBI are affiliated with Breitbart and have access to everybody's server, although this could just be a coincidence .) The FBI's leading Republican James Comey kept opening and re-opening Hillary's emails with as much excitement as Geraldo Rivera once displayed with Al Capone's vault. In a broad view, racist "outsider" Trump represented "change" on his supporters' TV screens, if not in reality, and "change" is what many wanted after so much anger had been generated. As Michael Moore stated, these mostly Caucasian men simply wanted to "blow up the system" as anger management.

 

Yet it also all boiled down to the electoral vote always favoring Rural over Urban votes and having more influence than the popular vote. Rural America (mostly the same race) voted Republican while Urban America (more integrated in race) voted Democrat. This was also how it was 16 years ago during the Bush vs. Gore race, although GUNS played a bigger role in that election with Gore frightening both gun owners and the military industrial complex.

 

Speaking of gun owners and the military industrial complex, Jimmy Dore is correct about war being all about money and fossil fuels, seldom terrorism.

 

 

 

The military industrial complex needs to keep the ammunition manufacturing. This is why the Republicans are obsessed with guns. When there isn't a war going on, money still needs to be made. Making The Adults (since The Children are just learning from their elders) afraid of terrorism and people of religions different than your own is very important. After every mass shooting while Obama was president, the Republicans would attack him for not saying "Radical Islam". They did that even after the Orlando Pulse shooting despite Omar being born within a few miles of Donald Trump's birthplace. Trump himself even tweeted the morning of that shooting "Appreciate the congrats for being right on radical Islamic terrorism". Right? Omar was raised Islamic, but that is the only truth in that statement.

 

Heck, are we even all 100% certain that Al Qaeda worked alone in the 9-11 attacks and NOBODY in this country helped? Mind you, I am not starting a lot of conspiracy talk here, but I still find it hard to believe that all of the tight security in this country failed with three planes.

 

In the debates with Hillary, Donald Trump kept repeating that America needs Law & Order. He also insinuated (in so many words) that the African Americans and Hispanics in the cities needed it even more (which is why he is bringing back "frisking"). Even though you have multiple races living in suburbia and the country, his dog whistle was clearly aimed at Caucasian voters living outside The City who THINK all of the "outsiders" live there.

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The current state of racial unrest in the US is more complicated than just old resentments. I think it's a result, both intentional and unforeseen, of how modern society is spending its time. It's the media angle, but one that shouldn't be discounted. A very large percentage of people are on the internet, and getting their news from there. If they're a leftie, it's from places like HuffPost. If they're a rightie, then it's places like Breitbart and Drudge. The cable news has fractured in the same directions, with MSNBC on the left and FOX on the right. All of these outlets are fighting for eyeballs, viewers or clicks. And nothing brings them in like outrage. And one of the hot-button topics in the US is race.

 

So HuffPost and MSNBC push the "innocent blacks killed by police" narrative, while Breitbart and FOX push the "social justice warriors want all whites in prison" type stuff. And then these things get linked on Facebook and Twitter, so more people see it, and more get angry. People tend to self-segregate into like-minded groups, and in this era there are places for them to go so that they never hear the other side. They only hear what gets passed around on "their" side. This breeds even more contempt for people who don't see the world the same way, especially when the the two sides spend as much time demonizing their opposites as they do stoking the fires of fear and outrage.

 

I wonder what the state of things would be if the internet disappeared along with all 24/7 cable news channels and talk radio? Obviously, short of a cataclysm, this isn't going to happen, but people on both sides need to take a step back and look at how they are getting their information.

 

I believe that this is the most clearly reasoned and impartial analysis of this situation which I have read of recent. 

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The current state of racial unrest in the US is more complicated than just old resentments. I think it's a result, both intentional and unforeseen, of how modern society is spending its time. It's the media angle, but one that shouldn't be discounted. A very large percentage of people are on the internet, and getting their news from there. If they're a leftie, it's from places like HuffPost. If they're a rightie, then it's places like Breitbart and Drudge. The cable news has fractured in the same directions, with MSNBC on the left and FOX on the right. All of these outlets are fighting for eyeballs, viewers or clicks. And nothing brings them in like outrage. And one of the hot-button topics in the US is race.

 

So HuffPost and MSNBC push the "innocent blacks killed by police" narrative, while Breitbart and FOX push the "social justice warriors want all whites in prison" type stuff. And then these things get linked on Facebook and Twitter, so more people see it, and more get angry. People tend to self-segregate into like-minded groups, and in this era there are places for them to go so that they never hear the other side. They only hear what gets passed around on "their" side. This breeds even more contempt for people who don't see the world the same way, especially when the the two sides spend as much time demonizing their opposites as they do stoking the fires of fear and outrage.

 

I wonder what the state of things would be if the internet disappeared along with all 24/7 cable news channels and talk radio? Obviously, short of a cataclysm, this isn't going to happen, but people on both sides need to take a step back and look at how they are getting their information.

I remember back in the 1960, and 1970, I did not have a tv for about 10 years and when I did get one it was like the news had hardly changed in all that time. Today you can get 10 years of news in 3 days. 

 

 

 

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There is no more racism, Obama promised us he changed everything.

 

YEAH?! Then tell me here smart guy...why do we still have morons in West Virginia and elsewhere in this country who post stupid*** comments comparing the present First Lady to a simian on the freakin' internet? 

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Nearly? Are you saying that a newborn baby will only stop crying if (s)he is held by an adult of the same race?

 

Many (not all, of course) Republican politicians out to get the racist and "evangelical" vote will insist that marriage is defined by One Man and One Woman and are against gay couples adopting as well as single parents (a.k.a. Dan Quayle criticizing the show Murphy Brown back in the day). One thing they are correct about: if a baby has One Father and One Mother, preferably of the same race, (s)he is more likely going to be accepted by the neighbors. When the child ventures outside of the home, the risks are reduced. If the parents are of different races or of the same gender, (s)he will always know (s)he is somehow different regardless of how polite the neighbors and others in the environment are.

 

It is like the Sesame Street song: one of these things is not like the other. Can you tell me which one is different?

 

The only way to overcome racism is make the environment more diversified and eliminate all of the "stick with your own kind" thinking (a.k.a. West Side Story). Integration was something fought for centuries, especially after slavery was abolished. After Brown vs. Board of Education, it took the federal government to come down hard to enforce the rules after 1954. Some school districts like Prince Edward County, Virginia fought back by merely shutting down altogether for four years. School bus integration continued to be an issue well into the seventies even up north like Massachusetts.

 

Everybody has their own answer Why Hillary Lost. Obviously Putin from Russia impacted things by exposing how Establishment and anti-Bernie the Democratic party was... a mistake THEY made that cost them. (That is, if Putin did do it all by himself. Two members of the Trump campaign had ties to him and several members of the FBI are affiliated with Breitbart and have access to everybody's server, although this could just be a coincidence .) The FBI's leading Republican James Comey kept opening and re-opening Hillary's emails with as much excitement as Geraldo Rivera once displayed with Al Capone's vault. In a broad view, racist "outsider" Trump represented "change" on his supporters' TV screens, if not in reality, and "change" is what many wanted after so much anger had been generated. As Michael Moore stated, these mostly Caucasian men simply wanted to "blow up the system" as anger management.

 

Yet it also all boiled down to the electoral vote always favoring Rural over Urban votes and having more influence than the popular vote. Rural America (mostly the same race) voted Republican while Urban America (more integrated in race) voted Democrat. This was also how it was 16 years ago during the Bush vs. Gore race, although GUNS played a bigger role in that election with Gore frightening both gun owners and the military industrial complex.

 

Speaking of gun owners and the military industrial complex, Jimmy Dore is correct about war being all about money and fossil fuels, seldom terrorism.

 

 

 

The military industrial complex needs to keep the ammunition manufacturing. This is why the Republicans are obsessed with guns. When there isn't a war going on, money still needs to be made. Making The Adults (since The Children are just learning from their elders) afraid of terrorism and people of religions different than your own is very important. After every mass shooting while Obama was president, the Republicans would attack him for not saying "Radical Islam". They did that even after the Orlando Pulse shooting despite Omar being born within a few miles of Donald Trump's birthplace. Trump himself even tweeted the morning of that shooting "Appreciate the congrats for being right on radical Islamic terrorism". Right? Omar was raised Islamic, but that is the only truth in that statement.

 

Heck, are we even all 100% certain that Al Qaeda worked alone in the 9-11 attacks and NOBODY in this country helped? Mind you, I am not starting a lot of conspiracy talk here, but I still find it hard to believe that all of the tight security in this country failed with three planes.

 

In the debates with Hillary, Donald Trump kept repeating that America needs Law & Order. He also insinuated (in so many words) that the African Americans and Hispanics in the cities needed it even more (which is why he is bringing back "frisking"). Even though you have multiple races living in suburbia and the country, his dog whistle was clearly aimed at Caucasian voters living outside The City who THINK all of the "outsiders" live there.

 

Gotta say here JL, you're kind'a "all over the place" with your reply. NOT, mind you, that I disagree with much that you've stated, but this discussion is about the topic of racism.

 

(...however, when you talked about the idea of people being insular and confined either by choice or by some outside force and to their own particular "cultural realms", THIS was when I think you NAILED IT)

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Gotta say here JL, you're kind'a "all over the place" with your reply. NOT, mind you, that I disagree with much that you've stated, but this discussion is about the topic of racism.

 

(...however, when you talked about the idea of people being insular and confined either by choice or by some outside force and to their own particular "cultural realms", THIS was when I think you NAILED IT)

 

I got a little carried away. Ha ha! Forgive me.

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Tribalism/racialism/nationalism is evolutionary genetics.

 

Tribalism/racism arose because individuals who would socialize to the extent that they would submerge their personal desires for the good of the group enhanced survival of the group. Individuals who would fight and die to protect their group assured survival of the group. Other groups were a threat because their presence limited the food supply and brought new diseases. Evolution favored those groups which would eject any of their own who were significantly different in appearance or behaviour as they endangered the genetic stability of the group.

 

Nationalism arose when it was advantageous to settle in permanent cities. Evolution favored those who were able/willing to live in a stable environment. Evolution favored those groups who were aggressive in protecting their settlements from outsiders.

 

It is instinct to want to be part of a group. It is instinct to want to support and protect your group. It is instinct to be suspicious of other groups.

 

Racism in only one manifestation of this. Same-race antagonism is equally common. United States of America vs. Russia. English soccer clubs vs. French soccer clubs. Muslim vs. Christian.

 

We have learned through sociobiology research that tribalism/racialism/nationalism is as inherently part of being human as having a bladder and a colon which need to be emptied regularly. We can constrain these to an extent in order to conform to the standards of our environmental grouping but it is neither logical nor practical to expect any person to deny in toto the basic facts of biology.

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Gotta say here JL, you're kind'a "all over the place" with your reply. NOT, mind you, that I disagree with much that you've stated, but this discussion is about the topic of racism.

 

(...however, when you talked about the idea of people being insular and confined either by choice or by some outside force and to their own particular "cultural realms", THIS was when I think you NAILED IT)

many years ago I read a newspaper article about all these opinions that harry truman had about his contemporaries.

 

he called eisenhower a "weak field commander". :lol:

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many years ago I read a newspaper article about all these opinions that harry truman had about his contemporaries.

 

he called eisenhower a "weak field commander". :lol:

sure. he let guys like patton and marshall do the hard work. :D

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Nearly? Are you saying that a newborn baby will only stop crying if (s)he is held by an adult of the same race?

 

No. Didn't say anything even remotely like that.

 

I don't include newborns when I use the words "nearly everyone". Let's allow a little life experience to happen before we throw them into the big pot, shall we.

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