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TCM is changing ....

86 posts in this topic

... and so to then perhaps have more moolah ...

 

Actually - and you can all check it out for yourselves as articles have been written about their investment in Filmstruck and other moves; while I'm in no way implying anyone should just take my word for it, I'm not talking out of my hat, either- this is a case of spending money to make money. So, yes, this is an investment, and a marketing strategy, and one that I certainly hope pays off.

 

But as with all ventures these carry risk. So, yes, of course if I knew they were going to put meat on the table, I'd just tuck in my napkin and wait to be served. Fact is that rather than spend money on expanding content they are rolling the dice. I would rather have seen a little of both.

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Everything you are carping about, and using as justification for pronouncing the death of TCM is just peripheral stuff.  All of that marketing, and branding, and such is the price you pay for what is the true and unambiguous value of TCM, the movies.

 

Oh, come on. Where did that happen?

I don't appreciate those type of rhetorical gymnastics, Slayton. Not a fan.

You folks think that was "carping"? I was sounding a "death" knell?

 

Oof.

 

So, basically you wish to trivialize the value of my observations as if there is no thought or rationale behind my thinking, right?

 

Well, let me put you at ease: You can keep your ball.

But...

 

In making your argument/protracted scold, you cavalierly use the word "if" as IF it isn't some titanic speculative creature that means very little while assuming a lot.

So...Rather than bandy about "ifs", let's focus on one little "show me what you got":

 

How about you making a case for Sugarland expanding the TCM brand? Since you obviously see the forest better than I do, clear those trees for me. Back up the mighty implication of your "if". While you are at it, you can explain to me why we rarely hear the theme in question outside of the promos, even though it was composed to be in the rotation (though, I am not complaining about that). Or am I out of line for making that observation? Didn't we cable subscribers and watchers of TCM pay for that theme? Doesn't that give me a right to kvetch about it?

And since I'm flogging Seabiscuit, I'm sure you'll remember that the Bush brothers were asked to reference major cinematic scores either in style, instrumentation or poem. Maybe you will have noticed, maybe not, but interestingly enough ANOTHER theme premiered on TCM after this heavily promoted commissioned piece and followed the same motif (if memory serves it begins by stylistically referencing Simon and Garfunkel's score for "The Graduate").

 

Basically, when I briefly mentioned that theme, my point was that they went whole hog on something that didn't really pan out, and that hardly fills me with a sense of optimism. It's not as if they have all the money in the world with which to gamble.

 

What really cheeses me about your post, particularly ironic considering the condescending tone, is that you failed to acknowledge my own tone of knowing that I wasn't reinventing the wheel with my complaints and that some people especially would find what I had/have to say redundant and trite.

 

I'll agree with the former, and vehemently defend my opinion against charges of the latter.

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Carp.

 

verb (used without object)

1.
to find fault or complain querulously or unreasonably; be niggling in criticizing; cavil:
(Dictionary.com)
 
Yes. . . .that's right.
 
It's not my intention to get into an argument on this topic.  There have been dozens of them, for about as long as there have been forums to do it in.  They commonly degenerate into increasingly subtle disputes over finer and finer points, to the point of absurdity, or roundabouts of 'yes it is' and 'no it isn't.'  Nobody ever changes their mind or convinces anyone.  And I'd rather spend my time posting on what jazzes me about movies.
 
My point is, as I said, posters that complain about TCM, and state or imply ominous consequences for the channel, focus on matters that, compared to its real value, are insignificant.
 
Your point is--to tell the truth, I don't have a clear idea of what your point is, for which I take full responsibility.  My guess is that it's TCMs investment strategy is damaging its viability.  I suppose if the time comes when TCM isn't around anymore you can crow about it.  But by then there won't be any place for you to do it where people can hear you.

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so if 

 

Well yes TCM is changing...however I believe there is a pithy quote out there about change and certainty so complaining won't do much to keep change at bay.   Actually in reference to the documentaries I actually watched quite a few as I enjoy getting some history from films and what I wouldn't do to see a month of "March of Time" presentations that used to show in the movie theatres.  You really had a good view of mid 20th century history through those films however they were rather over the top at times and in some cases production was fabricated.....and March of Time gave rise to PBS's "POV" series with the same sonorous voice over. 

 

I won't complain about TCM changing...because for all the whingers out there...don't forget you have a remote with a channel changer and an on/off button as well as access to Amazon Prime and DVD's....so pick and choose just as others do. 

 

I was hoping for a New Year's Eve of MGM musicals to swing in the New Year or as around my house...another Old Year, but I have a complete box of 10 Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers movies and my own set of Agatha Christie BBC mysteries...so I am all set with my Champagne and caviar (or most likely chopped chicken liver) on crackers. 

 

Happy New Year

 

 

 

so if we want to express disagreement with you  we should just remember we have a remote to change the channel?

 

Would it be okay if we decided to post here our "whiney" disagreement with the change, to TCM, so maybe they might consider our voices?

 

TCM,

 

please stick to classic movies.  

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Perhaps this has been a discussion already.  I rarely read or engage in these types of posts.  I guess it is my age.  I am so disappointed, that I now am venturing outside my comfort level to see if I am the only one disappointed with TCM.

 

I have watched TCM since it was first launched.  I fell in love instantly!  Before there were DVR's, there was TCM that was commercial free.  This was also an amazing place to watch the true classics.  These movies have seen me through some rough times and some great moments.  So over the past few months I have felt betrayed.

 

I understand that I must now accept that movies from the 60's and even 70's are considered old.  I understand that the station must move with the times.  BUT .........  I am so disgusted by some of the programming of late.  Specifically, the raunchy, x-rated documentaries that were aired.  This channel has always been family friendly.  Now that they are airing more recent movies, I must now set an alert for the language and content warnings.

 

I want my TCM back!!  For the first time, I am now trying to locate another source for my true classics.  I have always spent more for my cable because I want TCM.  At this point, I am considering dropping it.  There are more movies in color than black & white.  Is anyone else feeling like this or is this my age showing?  Let me know .....

 

 

I think fans of Turner CLASSIC movies loved the black and white movies of yesteryear and the lack of commercials.  

 

I don't need a phalmadhyde induced host.  I don't want modern movies and I don't want documentaries ---

 

I just want classic movies. 

 

I have found other sources took and I may drop TCM.  It is bad enough watching it through the SLING app anyway.  

 

DirectTV after more than 20 years, went out the door with main stream media's lies.  I was sick of it and I was down to just movies and just documentaries.  

 

But History channel dropped history but TCM was still classics. 

 

Now that is going down the drain.  

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This discussion mirrors one that comes up in the "old car" hobby as to what is "classic" vs. what is too new or too common, etc.

Things change and we all need to accept that.  Just be thankful that there is a channel such as TCM and the HUGE number of movies they do show.  The broader the interests, the more likely it is that TCM will continue to show the movies you do like.

Strictly speaking, none of the one and two star movies TCM shows would be considered classic - and those are my favorites.  Very few, if any, of the Noirs, 30's thru 50's mysteries/suspense, etc.  Let alone the SciFy, Horror, Musicals, Comedies, ad. infinitum.

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I think fans of Turner CLASSIC movies loved the black and white movies of yesteryear and the lack of commercials.  

 

I don't need a phalmadhyde induced host.  I don't want modern movies and I don't want documentaries ---

 

I just want classic movies. 

 

I have found other sources took and I may drop TCM.  It is bad enough watching it through the SLING app anyway.  

 

DirectTV after more than 20 years, went out the door with main stream media's lies.  I was sick of it and I was down to just movies and just documentaries.  

 

But History channel dropped history but TCM was still classics. 

 

Now that is going down the drain.  

 

What is your definition of 'classic movies'?    

 

I'd rather use a term like studio-era films or pre-code and Production code era:  Generally American movies released prior to 1969. 

 

I would like TCM to devote around 80% of their programming to those films.    The remaining 20% can be for foreign films and post 1969 American films. 

 

It is my understanding based on the stats provided that in 2016 TCM was right around that 80%.   

 

(one area I would like TCM to improve on is to lease more films outside the so-called Turner Library;  E.g. 30s Columbia films,  Fox films from the 40s and 50s,  Paramount films,   and 'smaller' studios like United Artist etc... )

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This discussion mirrors one that comes up in the "old car" hobby as to what is "classic" vs. what is too new or too common, etc.

Things change and we all need to accept that.  Just be thankful that there is a channel such as TCM and the HUGE number of movies they do show.  The broader the interests, the more likely it is that TCM will continue to show the movies you do like.

Strictly speaking, none of the one and two star movies TCM shows would be considered classic - and those are my favorites.  Very few, if any, of the Noirs, 30's thru 50's mysteries/suspense, etc.  Let alone the SciFy, Horror, Musicals, Comedies, ad. infinitum.

 

As a corollary I think that the day that they decide not to be "retro eclectic", as I would describe them to be now, is the day that they will lose viewership.  I am enjoying the 1 or 2 star movies too, especially from the early sound era  as well.

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What is your definition of 'classic movies'?    

 

I'd rather use a term like studio-era films or pre-code and Production code era:  Generally American movies released prior to 1969. 

 

I would like TCM to devote around 80% of their programming to those films.    The remaining 20% can be for foreign films and post 1969 American films. 

 

It is my understanding based on the stats provided that in 2016 TCM was right around that 80%.   

 

(one area I would like TCM to improve on is to lease more films outside the so-called Turner Library;  E.g. 30s Columbia films,  Fox films from the 40s and 50s,  Paramount films,   and 'smaller' studios like United Artist etc... )

 

I don't blame them for not changing their identity from TCM to TREM or STREM (Starstruck Retro-Eclectic Movies).  It just doesn't have the same kind of ring. 

 

I also can't picture Ben M. and other hosts saying "STREM" over and over with straight faces.

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so if we want to express disagreement with you  we should just remember we have a remote to change the channel?

 

Would it be okay if we decided to post here our "whiney" disagreement with the change, to TCM, so maybe they might consider our voices?

 

TCM,

 

please stick to classic movies.  

Disagreement is fine...when it's actually based on cold hard facts and not what one perceives (and that's the huge problem with the world today - perception is all that matters to most people, reality be damned.) Otherwise, you are just complaining and piling on a whole lot of nothing.

 

If you can't see that TCM does essentially, "stick to classic movies," then you need to step back, take a breath, and yes, simply change the channel when they're showing something you're not interested in. Surely you have more to do than just watch TCM 24/7. I've been watching this channel for over 10 years and I haven't remotely exhausted what it has to offer.

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Speaking of changing time: Even I remember when one had to watch the same channel all day for not wanting to walk across the room to change it to another channel. I also remember my neighbor having the first remote control in the neighborhood.

 

Now we have those who literally have hundreds of channels at the touch of a button but, are upset that they must press them to change their viewing. If only I had a time machine to ask people from the 70's when I was a child how they felt about that 

 

Reminds me of those who tap their fingers because the microwave is taking too long.

 

 

 

 

 


 

I was hoping for a New Year's Eve of MGM musicals to swing in the New Year or as around my house...another Old Year, but I have a complete box of 10 Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers movies and my own set of Agatha Christie BBC mysteries...so I am all set with my Champagne and caviar (or most likely chopped chicken liver) on crackers. 

 

Happy New Year

 

Well there is this That's Entertainment marathon going so that's not too bad.

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Well there is this That's Entertainment marathon going so that's not too bad.

 

 

Oh, darn, if the blog was still the Morlocks blog, I was going to ask to do a column-long comparison of all 4 TE's, how they differed, and how they reflected our changing view of "old movies" before and after the VHS age.  (Had had a sudden urge to rent the TCM DVD boxset from the library, a month or two ago.)

 

It's not on tonight, is it?  I could do the short version on request, whenever appropriate.

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I just finished reading the excellent oral history of The Daily Show. While the book is focused almost entirely on Jon Stewart's long tenure, in the last few pages current host Trevor Noah, while in his comments appropriately reverential to his predecessor, also speaks frankly about his run will differ. "Jon's Daily Show had by far the oldest demographic of any Comedy Central show. I want to connect with and bring in new, younger viewers, because that model isn't sustainable."

 

Kinda harsh words when you see them in cold, black  print, but the same has to be true in the long run for any network, including TCM. You can't cater forever exclusively to people who want the network to always be as it exists in their memories of 20 years ago, or some day, you won't be on the air anymore.

 

(Also, I've pointed out in a lot of previous threads, every time this damn topic comes up, that people's memories aren't really reliable, because,as has already been pointed out, Robert Osborne said stars of today would be highlighted on TCM during the very first intro he ever gave, I've even provided stats before to show that lots and lots and LOTS of old movies still air on TCM, that honestly, it's not as radically different as people keep claiming. But all that gives me Tired Head, having discussed it so many times previously.)

 

Dialogfan, I would advise you to turn on TCM on February 1, 2017, and leave it on 24 hours a day until March 3. You should be as happy as a pig in slop.

 

Every movie's always new to somebody, but I feel like a lot of us who watch TCM frequently do tire of seeing the same movies over and over, great as they may be. My top request from the network would be increased variety: variety in studios represented, variety in eras represented, variety in stars and genres.

 

 

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I'm still wrestling with the concept of  reading an "oral" history.

 

In school, we sometimes had to do "oral" book reports.  If I had handed in something that required READING, I would have certainly recieved an "F".    But anyway......

 

+1 on your ideas Sewhite.  Perhaps too, they can expand the monthly idea to incorporate plots or concepts.  Like POTM(Plot Of Te Month) in which they showcase movies that utiize similar plots.  I know that now, they often do that on a NIGHTLY basis, like showing movies with similar plotlines all in the same night.  But I'm suggesting something different.

 

Or---CAOM( Character Actor Of The Month)  where they showcase a month of movies in which, say, CHARLES LANE appeared in( but for HIM it'd have to be CAOY--Character Actor Of The YEAR! )

 

As long as TCM doesn't make the same change that AMC did, I'm good.  ;)

 

 

Sepiatone

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Multiple kudos for the use of the word "bolus". I have not seen it in print since 10th grade biology. I appreciate the context in which it was employed.

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so if 

 

 

 

 

so if we want to express disagreement with you  we should just remember we have a remote to change the channel?

 

Would it be okay if we decided to post here our "whiney" disagreement with the change, to TCM, so maybe they might consider our voices?

 

TCM,

 

please stick to classic movies.  

Absolutely not...disagreement and debate is good for the mind. I was just stating that there are options if one doesn't like something, however you are right...we should post our concerns re: TCM and changes.  I too want TCM not to change as I love old movies and TCM is my lifeline for television entertainment.  Its schedule is the first I review for my watching plans and when nothing suits my tastes I am off to search for "Law and Order" series one of my most favourite of TV series in the past 20 some years. 

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Or---CAOM( Character Actor Of The Month)  where they showcase a month of movies in which, say, CHARLES LANE appeared in( but for HIM it'd have to be CAOY--Character Actor Of The YEAR! )

 

As long as TCM doesn't make the same change that AMC did, I'm good.  ;)

 

 

Sepiatone

Sepiatone:   I have long wanted a CAOM and longed for days spent with Eve Arden, James Gleason, Mary Wickes, Spring Byinington, Jack Carson, Eugene Pallet and other talented actors that added so much to the movies they were in.  I know last week they had a day or night of Roland Young who I really liked and I enjoyed some of his featured films shown that evening.  I believe he was at his best in the "Topper" movies.

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Oh, darn, if the blog was still the Morlocks blog, I was going to ask to do a column-long comparison of all 4 TE's, how they differed, and how they reflected our changing view of "old movies" before and after the VHS age.  (Had had a sudden urge to rent the TCM DVD boxset from the library, a month or two ago.)

 

It's not on tonight, is it?  I could do the short version on request, whenever appropriate.

 

They were on New Year's Eve night, with Dana Delany presenting.

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Sepiatone, an "oral history" is a book that consists mainly of the transcribed dialogue of various interview subjects arranged in such a way that it constructs a narrative. The credited author or authors I assume conduct the interviews, but their "writing" is limited to occasional transitional paragraphs to help set the stage for the next topic. The first book I ever saw like this was the excellent history of Saturday Night Live, and those same authors did a similar book about the history of ESPN. I also read one about the history of Led Zeppelin. I quite like them - I sorta feel like I'm watching a documentary! In my head as I'm reading, I kinda feel like I'm seeing the interview subjects as talking heads. It seems to be a little mini-trend in nonfiction books these days. 

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Sepiatone, an "oral history" is a book that consists mainly of the transcribed dialogue of various interview subjects arranged in such a way that it constructs a narrative. The credited author or authors I assume conduct the interviews, but their "writing" is limited to occasional transitional paragraphs to help set the stage for the next topic. The first book I ever saw like this was the excellent history of Saturday Night Live, and those same authors did a similar book about the history of ESPN. I also read one about the history of Led Zeppelin. I quite like them - I sorta feel like I'm watching a documentary! In my head as I'm reading, I kinda feel like I'm seeing the interview subjects as talking heads. It seems to be a little mini-trend in nonfiction books these days. 

 

I'm currently on the last few chapters of the Daily Show book myself, and have also read the SNL book as well a one on the history of heavy metal music, and I second the recommendation of the format. 

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Sepiatone, an "oral history" is a book that consists mainly of the transcribed dialogue of various interview subjects arranged in such a way that it constructs a narrative. The credited author or authors I assume conduct the interviews, but their "writing" is limited to occasional transitional paragraphs to help set the stage for the next topic. The first book I ever saw like this was the excellent history of Saturday Night Live, and those same authors did a similar book about the history of ESPN. I also read one about the history of Led Zeppelin. I quite like them - I sorta feel like I'm watching a documentary! In my head as I'm reading, I kinda feel like I'm seeing the interview subjects as talking heads. It seems to be a little mini-trend in nonfiction books these days. 

 

Yeah, I knew that.

 

I was just having a bit of fun with the oxymoronic nature of the term.  :)

 

A word of advice---"Walking encyclopedias"  are generally known as "buzzkills".

 

Sepiatone

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Howdy All!

 

Belated Happy New Year and Happy Holidays!

Yes, I'm still around. Life changes have meant I haven't been able to post as often as I once did (Please hold the applause).
But this week I happen to be in a position to watch some TCM and so may as well add my two cents to this thread

 


If you can't see that TCM does essentially, "stick to classic movies," then you need to step back, take a breath, and yes, simply change the channel when they're showing something you're not interested in. Surely you have more to do than just watch TCM 24/7. I've been watching this channel for over 10 years and I haven't remotely exhausted what it has to offer.

 

Tend to agree with this as well as much else that has been written in this thread.  Nothing is perfect, and that goes for TCM as well.

But there are so many alternative choices today it's amazing.

 

IMHO, TCM is pretty good for what it offers. Do I like everything? No. I think TCM needs a new host. Not multiple hosts, but one person. How to find a person who would please everyone is the problem.

With all due respect to the likes of Dana Delaney and Ben M. and others, I tend to ignore them and wish they'd hurry up and get to the actual film. That is probably because I remember Elwy Yost from TVO's "Saturday Night at the Movies" and so tend to find TCM hosts lacking by comparison. I don't know, maybe the continuity announcers could do more (I don't know the names of the people who do that for TCM?). Toronto City TV's late Mark Daley was an excellent continuity announcer famous for his witty intro's to movies. You never saw Mr. Daley, just heard his voice (he did do the news for City TV, so you could see him doing that). So maybe dispense with the hosts on camera and just have a "voice" do the movie intro's with the movie trivia, etc.

I mean, do we really need to see Ben M. or Dana Delaney standing or sitting and telling us the movie title and a few bits of trivia?

Then again, others probably love them for what they do and wouldn't want to see any changes.

 

Anyway, just my few Canadian cents worth. And probably not even worth that.

 

Bye for now as I return to hibernation in my igloo in the Great White North...

 

Ciao.

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I think TCM needs a new host. Not multiple hosts, but one person. How to find a person who would please everyone is the problem.

 

I think they should hire James Woods. Sure, he's completely nut-loaf, but they say he has an IQ of 184 or something, so at least we can be happy knowing a bonafide genius is introducing the flick to us all.

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I think they should hire James Woods. Sure, he's completely nut-loaf, but they say he has an IQ of 184 or something, so at least we can be happy knowing a bonafide genius is introducing the flick to us all.

 

He's a good choice if he'd be willing.  Him or Kevin Spacey.  Either one seems at least more personable than Alec Baldwin.

 

I'd be interested in anyone else's suggestions.

 

 

 

Sepiatone

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