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LawrenceA

Rock'n'Roll HOF 2018

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The shortlist of nominees for the next group of inductees into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame have been announced. They are:

 

Bon Jovi

The Cars

Depeche Mode

Dire Straits

Eurythmics

J. Geils Band

Judas Priest 

Kate Bush

Link Wray

LL Cool J

MC5

The Meters

The Moody Blues

Nina Simone

Radiohead

Rage Against the Machine

Rufus featuring Chaka Khan

Sister Rosetta Tharpe

The Zombies

 

The final selections will be announced in December.

 

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Kind of dismaying to learn it took them until 2018 to finally put NINA SIMONE in contention. 

 

She should ALREADY be in the HOF.  :angry:

 

 

Sepiatone

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Kind of dismaying to learn it took them until 2018 to finally put NINA SIMONE in contention. 

 

She should ALREADY be in the HOF.  :angry:

 

 

Sepiatone

 

While I have a lot of love for Simone,   she doesn't belong in the rock and roll HOF,  but then there are many musicians, like Miles Davis, that also don't belong.

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While I have a lot of love for Simone,   she doesn't belong in the rock and roll HOF,  but then there are many musicians, like Miles Davis, that also don't belong.

 

They created a separate category for influences and pioneers. Simone should be included there, as should Sister Rosetta Tharpe (pioneer gospel artist). Previous regular HoF inductees like Miles Davis should be in that section as well.

 

Other members of this section include Robert Johnson, Hank Williams, Woody Guthrie, Lead Belly, Charlie Christian, Louis Armstrong, Dinah Washington, Nat King Cole, Billie Holliday, and many more.

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Yet again Sparks--the brothers Ron and Russell Mael--have been dissed, despite their 40 plus years performing, and serving as an influence for many bands. Maybe next year, but I don't feel optimistic.  Quality rarely trumps commerciality.  

 

Strange also it's taking so long for the Moody Blues to be inducted. 

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While I personally never much cared for SPARKS, I must say fair is fair.  There are too, many OTHER artists I never cared for that have been inducted, and so will say Sparks certainly deserves consideration.  After all, like the Academy Awards or Grammy's, it ISN'T supposed to be a popularity contest.

 

Sepiatone

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Some of this year's nominees show up often on the shortlist but never get chosen: MC5, the Moody Blues, the Cars, J. Geils Band, the Zombies. Some of them are dismissed by some as only having one or two notable songs, because the critic/voter doesn't know enough of their back catalog of songs, like MC5 and J. Geils Band, both of whom were major live acts that didn't translate to radio play that often. Groups like the Moody Blues and the Cars are loved by many but detested by just as many more as being toothless pop. I personally like both groups.

 

Speaking of also-rans, I noticed a few of the most frequent nominees failed to even make the shortlist this year: Kraftwerk, Joy Division, Nine Inch Nails, and the Smiths. Perhaps their window has passed.

 

Others here belong to genres that have vocal proponents voting for more inclusion: heavy metal and hard rock don't have as many acts inducted as they should, and thus Judas Priest and Bon Jovi are nominees, although that latter group, while talented hit-makers, are perhaps the most mall-friendly "hard" rock act of all. Judas Priest was never a favorite of mine, but I'm aware of how much impact they've had on their genre of music, both in sound and look.

 

Then there are the 80's electro-pop/synthpop fans who argue for more inductees, so there's Depeche Mode and Eurthymics up this year. Depeche Mode deserve it, I think, as they've been a highly influential act on modern artists while also maintaining a very long and varied career. Eurythmics may get in based solely on singer Annie Lennox's charisma, and because the HoF tries to include at least one female inductee a year.

 

The two newest acts, Radiohead and Rage Against the Machine, are also the most likely to get inducted. Radiohead has been a critic's darling for decades (I'm a fan as well) and Rage Against the Machine have been highly influential despite only releasing three albums of original material. And in this highly politicized atmosphere, I can see the HoF wanting to make waves with the inevitable volatile statements that guitarist Tom Morello would make. I'm also a fan of Rage, and they're also the only group on the list this year that I saw live (great show).

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I'm surprised Chaka Khan is not already in the Hall of Fame. Maybe she's already been entered as an individual. I don't know. Also a little surprised about The Moody Blues.

 

The Eurythmics certainly deserve the honor.

 

Only other group I would be interested in would be The Zombies - - I always enjoyed them, but I never thought they were that great.

 

But when you see the competition-- it's just not there--so let's go with

The Zombies.

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The inductees were announced this morning:

  • Bon Jovi
  • The Cars
  • Dire Straits
  • The Moody Blues
  • Nina Simone

 

Some surprises - I really expected Radiohead to get in, but they may have ticked the HoF off when their nomination was announced and they stated that they wouldn't show up if inducted. I'm also kind of surprised by Simone making it in, since she's by no stretch of the imagination a rock and roll artist.

Perennial also-rans The J. Geils Band, MC5, and Rufus featuring Chaka Khan all failed to make the inductee list yet again, while Judas Priest and Depeche Mode, who have both had very vocal proponents for their inclusion for many years, are also not honored.

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 Can't blame the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame if rock and roll is on its last leg.

 

What I Hear of current Rock sounds like stale covers or elevator music, with All Apologies to Mantovani.

 At this point, they should promote the artists that they have . And maybe try and keep some of that quality music in the mainstream, so that people can still hear it and maybe learn from it. 

Who knows, it still might Inspire someone to take rock and roll to the next level.

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The usual suspects. I'm a bit surprised the Moody Blues didn't get

in sooner considering how long they've been around. Maybe all that

Om Om stuff put people off. Nina Simone is no rocker, but I guess

she had a certain pop folk thing going that was close enough. The

local news mentions her childhood home in Tryon, NC once in a

while. There was a plan to turn it into a museum, but I don't think it

ever came to fruition. 

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On 10/6/2017 at 7:10 AM, Sepiatone said:

While I personally never much cared for SPARKS, I must say fair is fair.  There are too, many OTHER artists I never cared for that have been inducted, and so will say Sparks certainly deserves consideration.  After all, like the Academy Awards or Grammy's, it ISN'T supposed to be a popularity contest.

 

Sepiatone

Sep--

It looks like next year will be down to Gary Puckett and the Union Gap. Or maybe The McCoys of the Shadows of Knight. It's too bad Paul Revere recently died because I think he may be coming up next. What do you think?

BTW-- My tongue is sticking out of my cheek. LOL

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There are still literally dozens of groups and performers from the 70's, 80's, and 90's that deserve induction. The 50's and 60's have been covered rather comprehensively at this point. Time to move forward.

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1 minute ago, LawrenceA said:

There are still literally dozens of groups and performers from the 70's, 80's, and 90's that deserve induction. The 50's and 60's have been covered rather comprehensively at this point. Time to move forward.

You're absolutely right. But without the mainstream power of AM radio to back these other groups up, it's going to be hard for any of them to get a majority consensus.

It's all about how many people you can get in to tour the museum, as well as how many people you can get to watch the induction special or buy an induction special DVD-- or just to make charitable donations.

But there always was a strong commercial aspect to rock and roll.

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Just discussed this in another forum.  The HOF isn't just about R'n'R performers, but also those who influenced the music's direction or artists too.

RAY CHARLES never considered himself a "R'n'R" performer, just a musician and performer.

Same with BOB MARLEY.  But both are in there.

And ARETHA FRANKLIN too, never thought what she was doing as Rock'n'Roll, but SHE'S in there too.  Which is why I'm glad to see THIS lady make it also...

I mean really.....If they're gonna put MADONNA in there, why NOT someone with a good measure of SOUL? ;)

Sepiatone

 

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So, how come THIS guy, who predates Britain's BEATLES and CLIFF RICHARDS( who's in the HOF) was never even NOMINATED, let alone inducted?

Clip from a '56 performance I believe......

 

Incidentally, it's Mr.Steele's 81st birthday today. :)

Sepiatone

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A very simple answer, this guy  has no mega or mammoth fans in the United States. I never heard his records in the 1950s on the radio. Though they used to play Lonnie Donegan skiffle occasionally-- Does your chewing gum lose its flavor on the bedpost overnight?--as a kind of novelty record.

As big as The Beatles were, there was a tremendous backlash of hatred against them from the established music business and from many adults. The very thought of foreigners coming over here playing our rock and roll just really disgusted a lot of those who were controlling the business. I even heard that Elvis Presley looked in to having their work permits resended  because he was so jealous of them. Many people attributed there smooth takeover of the United States to the sophisticated diplomacy of Brian Epstein.

And as big as Cliff Richards has been in the UK,  it took him into the 70s until he established himself in the US. And he didn't set the world on fire, like the Bee Gees, but he did establish himself by selling a credible amount of Records. I even bought "We Don't Talk Anymore".

I bet you don't remember a guy named Adam Faith? He never did hit over here on any level.

France's rocker Johnny Hallyday died last week. He never became big in the United States because he primarily sang in French, but I don't know what would be the excuse for these others except maybe they were actually blacklisted, blackballed by the American  music business establishment.  That's just a guess. However, the Juggernaut of The Beatles was so strong nothing on Earth could stop it.

The Beatles also had the plus of their record company, EMI, owning Capitol Records--so their distribution and marketing was already put in place for them.

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Lonnie Donegan, Tommy Steele, Cliff Richard, Adam Faith, Johnny Hallyday...none are in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. None found much success stateside, and as you've both pointed out, many people in the U.S. have never heard of them or could pick them out of a lineup, while in their home countries they are legendary. Adam Faith starred in a few movies, and they barely got any release here due to lack of name recognition. But it's interesting how many other British acts are in the HoF, but not these mega-sellers. In the case of Hallyday there's a language barrier, and there are no other French acts in, either. I was trying to think how many performers from countries that are not primarily English speaking have been inducted, and all I could think of was ABBA from Sweden. 

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I remember hearing the names of those big English stars, but never

heard their music on the radio or anywhere else. 

 

I don't think most of the oldsters disliked the Beatles because they were

English, but because they had long hair and new music. Epstein may have

been sophisticated as an ambassador, but I've read that due to his lack of

business acumen they lost millions of dollars in U.S. merchandising deals.

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Well, who's to say Steele DIDN'T influence many of the "British Invasion" heroes that in turn influenced many of the American rock'n'roll artists of the mid to late '60's and beyond?

And I don't know what radio YOU were listening to PRINCESS, but a couple 'round HERE used to play a couple of Steele's records on occasion.  And like Cliff Richard after him, he also got into a bit of film acting.

BTW:  A teacher at my high school( taught a class called "family living" )assigned our class to go to a local theater to see Cliff's movie "Two A Penny" .  Supposedly had some content relevant to the class criteria.  What was funny was that for some reason I was the ONLY guy int the class that's ever HEARD of Richard before. :D  He used to be frontman for pre-Beatles British rock band THE SHADOWS.

Sepiatone

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12 hours ago, Vautrin said:

I remember hearing the names of those big English stars, but never

heard their music on the radio or anywhere else. 

 

I don't think most of the oldsters disliked the Beatles because they were

English, but because they had long hair and new music. Epstein may have

been sophisticated as an ambassador, but I've read that due to his lack of

business acumen they lost millions of dollars in U.S. merchandising deals.

The oldsters disliked Elvis because of his hip shaking etc...    so yea, I doubt it was because the Beatles were English (how if they were French,  that would be another story!). 

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I don't know if the animus of some folks toward the French was quite

as strong back in the 1960s. But I'm sure there would have been

some head shaking about the French Invasion. One thing I do recall

about all those British solo stars was that they changed their names,

just like many of the studio era Hollywood stars.

Adam Faith=Terence Nelhams-Wright. :)

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Sure.  Lonnie Donegan was ANTHONY JAMES Lonegan, Tommy Steele was THOMAS WILLIAM HICKS. CLIFF RICHARD was HARRY(not Harold) RODGER WEBB.  But the only BAND member with a name change I can think of is RINGO STARR(Richard Starkey).  If there are others, I'm unaware of whom.  

As for animus towards the French, it depends on who you talk to.  I'm not aware of any general enmity though.  And remember, in the '60's there was a sort of "thing" about French singers, especially the breathy, monotonal female French singers like Claudine Longet and others in the same vein.

Sepiatone

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