marimari

social justice???

131 posts in this topic

STILL though here folks, and DESPITE what the OP said earlier about "hearing something that others didn't" in what Ben said, I'll add MY two freakin' cents in here NOW and say that IF Ben ONLY said what Rich earlier quoted that he said, there was NOT one iota of "politics" and/or "revisionist history" in what Ben said...PERIOD!!!

Nope, READ once again WHAT he ACTUALLY said here, and then tell me where exactly some supposed "political opinion" is either expressed OR implied:

Here is what Ben said:

“Stories of troops stationed throughout the empire had long been popular and movies like The Lives of a Bengal Lancer routinely delivered, packing in audiences eager for a glimpse of an exotic foreign locale, and generally stories of white soldiers fighting dangerous natives to maintain an empire’s grip on its colonies.”

NOPE, all this sounds as if he was merely STATING FACTS! And, I DON'T give a crap WHAT "some people" THINK he might have "implied" with that comment!

(...and although while I have to admit that I didn't actually hear or see Ben say this, I'll bet my house when he said the word "Lancer", it probably sounded pretty darn nasally) LOL

 

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17 hours ago, Dargo said:

Hey Vautrin! Just wanna say here that while ol' Nip evidently didn't catch the intended comedic irony in your statement here(he "liked" it, ya know), I sure as hell did anyway!!! ;)

LOL

I'm thinking of sending Nip The Childrens' Guide to Irony for Christmas.

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17 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:

Ha ha, well, yes, that's happened to me, too.

It got so annoying that I got voicemail. 

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17 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:

When I was a kid, we actually went to the movie theater and saw an American version of "Gunga Din"--it was called "Sergeant's 3".

 It was a rat pack movie. It's been a long time, but I remember that the three sergeants were Frank Sinatra, Peter Lawford and Dean Martin.

At this point I don't have to tell you who played the Gunga Din role, do I.  Sam the Man was the former slave who also wanted to be in the cavalry. I don't remember much else, but I'm just guessing that Sammy Davis jr. ended up the same way as Sam Jaffe's Gunga Din. But it was a nice Technicolor movie for a Sunday afternoon away from black and white TV.

I just checked Wiki, and apparently Sammy is still alive at the end of the movie. In every way it pays to be a friend of Frank Sinatra's. He can even change the plot. LOL

I remember the title, but I've never seen the movie itself. Frankie will protect his buddies,

unless John Wayne knocks on the door at night and complains about the noisy party. 

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14 minutes ago, Dargo said:

(...and although while I have to admit that I didn't actually hear or see Ben say this, I'll bet my house when he said the word "Lancer", it probably sounded pretty darn nasally) LOL

 

No, that word came out find. But when he said "packing," my ears screamed with pain.

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40 minutes ago, Vautrin said:

I remember the title, but I've never seen the movie itself. Frankie will protect his buddies,

unless John Wayne knocks on the door at night and complains about the noisy party. 

Speaking of knocking on doors--Do you know the story about what Frank did with his friend Joe DiMaggio?

Joe, who was recently divorced from his wife Marilyn Monroe, was eating dinner at a Hollywood  restaurant with Frank Sinatra when he got a report from a private eye. Even though his wife had divorced him, DiMaggio had a tail on her. The private detective reported her whereabouts--visiting  someone in an apartment building.

So Joe decided to bust in and have the detectives photograph her to humiliate her. Being a friend, Frank went along with them. LOL

Unfortunately, or fortunately, depends on how you look at it, they broke the door down to the wrong apartment.

This was the apartment of a single woman who was terrorized by the break-in and called the police. But she couldn't identify anyone because of the camera flashes.

Months later the story appeared in the infamous "Confidential" magazine and the whole thing was out in the open.

  So Frank wasn't afraid to help a friend break down a door.

In Hollywood lore, this became known as the "1954 Wrong Door Raid".

 

 

 

 

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Oh, never mind this post. I don't know how to delete it. I thought it was going to appear directly below something I was responding to, but subsequent posts have been made, and it wouldn't make any sense.

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5 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

I didn't get the impression the comments were 'in general terms' based on this "Also I have always disliked the post-Osborne intros to films on TCM as "Today's history lesson, Class, is on.....". 

Post-Osborne intros to films on TCM is speaking specifically about TCM,  isn't it????? 

 

Well, I was just going by what she said in that one post, which doesn't mention any of that stuff.

I did go back and read her earlier post, the one you quote her on. So, I don't know, I'm not sure if she was talking in general, or speaking specifically about Turner Classic Movies.

One thing she did say in the post you're referring to which I profoundly disagree with is this:

"For instance, research on your own why a picture like "Birth Of A Nation" was considered racist by some and an actual truth by others not only when it was released in 1915 but even to this day."

Now, zea is not saying the actions and attitudes depicted in that film are an "actual truth" for her personally. However, it's hard to imagine anyone thinking anything shown in "Birth of a Nation" is any kind of truth. Maybe in 1915. Maybe that's what she was saying.

 

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I'd like to believe you, but re-read her post. Her exact words were people believe that "even to this day", and that it's incumbent on us to do research to understand why. Which is why I responded the way I did above.

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42 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

Well, I was just going by what she said in that one post, which doesn't mention any of that stuff.

I did go back and read her earlier post, the one you quote her on. So, I don't know, I'm not sure if she was talking in general, or speaking specifically about Turner Classic Movies.

One thing she did say in the post you're referring to which I profoundly disagree with is this:

"For instance, research on your own why a picture like "Birth Of A Nation" was considered racist by some and an actual truth by others not only when it was released in 1915 but even to this day."

Now, zea is not saying the actions and attitudes depicted in that film are an "actual truth" for her personally. However, it's hard to imagine anyone thinking anything shown in "Birth of a Nation" is any kind of truth. Maybe in 1915. Maybe that's what she was saying.

 

I think she was saying that many people in the south still view that as the truth today.

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4 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:

Speaking of knocking on doors--Do you know the story about what Frank did with his friend Joe DiMaggio?

Joe, who was recently divorced from his wife Marilyn Monroe, was eating dinner at a Hollywood  restaurant with Frank Sinatra when he got a report from a private eye. Even though his wife had divorced him, DiMaggio had a tail on her. The private detective reported her whereabouts--visiting  someone in an apartment building.

So Joe decided to bust in and have the detectives photograph her to humiliate her. Being a friend, Frank went along with them. LOL

Unfortunately, or fortunately, depends on how you look at it, they broke the door down to the wrong apartment.

This was the apartment of a single woman who was terrorized by the break-in and called the police. But she couldn't identify anyone because of the camera flashes.

Months later the story appeared in the infamous "Confidential" magazine and the whole thing was out in the open.

  So Frank wasn't afraid to help a friend break down a door.

In Hollywood lore, this became known as the "1954 Wrong Door Raid".

 

 

 

 

I've never heard that one before. I wonder how much is true and how much is

lore. Got the wrong apartment, huh. Meanwhile in a different apartment across

town switch hitter Mickey Mantle is showing Miss Monroe his Louisville Slugger.

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4 minutes ago, Vautrin said:

I've never heard that one before. I wonder how much is true and how much is

lore. Got the wrong apartment, huh. Meanwhile in a different apartment across

town switch hitter Mickey Mantle is showing Miss Monroe his Louisville Slugger.

It's true. The New York Times has reported the event.

And in reality there was a court case involving it in which the Confidential magazine was sued and they decided to dissolve the publication.

The lady whose apartment was broken into received an out-of-court settlement from Sinatra's lawyer.

 And the whole end result was that Sinatra and DiMaggio were no longer friends.

I've actually seen video on YouTube of Sinatra being questioned about the whole incident in court. That's how I first found out about it  and decided to do some research.

I go after all those historical things on YouTube and then some similar video will pop up and the next thing you know you've been doing it for 2 hours. LOL

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27 minutes ago, Princess of Tap said:

It's true. The New York Times has reported the event.

And in reality there was a court case involving it in which the Confidential magazine was sued and they decided to dissolve the publication.

The lady whose apartment was broken into received an out-of-court settlement from Sinatra's lawyer.

 And the whole end result was that Sinatra and DiMaggio were no longer friends.

I've actually seen video on YouTube of Sinatra being questioned about the whole incident in court. That's how I first found out about it  and decided to do some research.

I go after all those historical things on YouTube and then some similar video will pop up and the next thing you know you've been doing it for 2 hours. LOL

AH! So THIS explains why Sinatra always insisted his morning cup of Java would never come from a Mr. Coffee machine.

(...always wondered why Frank was supposedly a strict Bunn-O-Matic man)

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Everything has to be political these days, even sports.

I just heard a news discussion about sports historically being politically charged-look at Jackie Robinson's career.

But it does get rather annoying when a person is rude & disrespectful in public, and if called out the retort is an accusation, "You're prejudice/racist/sexist (whatever)!"

My retort: "No, it's just YOU personally that's offensive. You're not a very positive representative of my species."

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I think it's more a case of people, for some reason, feeling they have to interject politics or other pointless views into situations where it isn't called for.  Like your middle paragraph above here, TIKI, I have in the past(and more recently too) been accused of being racist because the person I either didn't like( because he was a first-class jerk) or disagreed with was black.

Sepiatone

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21 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

No one here as ever demanded a film NOT be shown.   You keep on spreading this fake news with an endless lecture to the class.

 

Okay, I'll bite. I wasn't insinuating anyone on these forums (that I know of) ever demanded a film not be shown. It was a generalization about much of the gen pop's attitude of not being willing to take the time to research something before condemning it or blindly hailing it.

I'm sure most others here understood that.

Oh, and what's up with me "spreading fake news with endless lectures to the class"?

#1 Fake News is a term - not invented by - but promulgated by the current administration to assure what they put forth is viewed as the ultimate, unquestionable truth. To disagree or point out the emperor is naked is tantamount to spreading, you guessed it: Fake News.

Sorry, but that's never been either my taste or methodology.

#2 The 'endless lectures to the class' bit? Hey, we all have a certain writing style. What can I say? Don't read my posts? Dunno. Free country (for now).  

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11 hours ago, Gershwin fan said:

I think she was saying that many people in the south still view that as the truth today.

Thank you, Gershwin fan. That's exactly what I'm saying. More specifically, the 'truthful' perception of that movie is not necessarily relegated to the South. Bigots, racists, anti-semites and closed minds cross all state lines, societies and cultures and, sadly, they vote, too.

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A while back, and I've already posted my thoughts, Alicia spoke after "No Time For Sergeants." She claimed movies at the end of Andy Griffith's career were dark. I was kind of put off by such a statement. I also figured it was her opinion based on everything Andy did before. I am not fond of the characters he played in most all his films.

I do love Matlock, where he played the country boy thing as well. Alicia probably didn't consider that role, as it was TV. Nobody was bothered by my post, as far as I am aware.

Here it is:

http://forums.tcm.com/topic/161264-new-hosts-dave-karger-and-alicia-malone/?do=findComment&comment=1729018  

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3 hours ago, jimmymac71 said:

A while back, and I've already posted my thoughts, Alicia spoke after "No Time For Sergeants." She claimed movies at the end of Andy Griffith's career were dark. I was kind of put off by such a statement. I also figured it was her opinion based on everything Andy did before. I am not fond of the characters he played in most all his films.

I do love Matlock, where he played the country boy thing as well. Alicia probably didn't consider that role, as it was TV. Nobody was bothered by my post, as far as I am aware.

Here it is:

http://forums.tcm.com/topic/161264-new-hosts-dave-karger-and-alicia-malone/?do=findComment&comment=1729018  

I think people who were not aware of Andy's great Elia Kazan movie, "A Face in the Crowd" and only knew him as Sheriff Andy Taylor in Mayberry, may have been shocked at some of these later portrayals.

But but the truth of the matter is he was a great actor and he could play anything. He certainly could play these difficult, evil characters extraordinarily well.

After all, that's what an actor does-- he plays/portrays characters. And if he's good, the portrayal is no place close to his own personality.

I've noticed that comedians/ comedic actors and actresses sometimes are able to go deep and play profoundly disturbed characters, sometimes better than Shakespearean actors. Jerry Lewis, Ed Wynn, Milton Berle, Lucille Ball, Richard Pryor, Dick Van Dyke, Carol Burnett and Mary Tyler Moore, just to name a few, could do that-- and so could Andy Griffith.

 

(BTW--Jimmymac71-- I love your avatar. It looks like one of my favorite puppies!)

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21 minutes ago, Princess of Tap said:

I think people who were not aware of Andy's great Elia Kazan movie, "A Face in the Crowd" and only knew him as Sheriff Andy Taylor in Mayberry, may have been shocked at some of these later portrayals.

But but the truth of the matter is he was a great actor and he could play anything. He certainly could play these difficult, evil characters extraordinarily well.

After all, that's what an actor does-- he plays/portrays characters. And if he's good, the portrayal is no place close to his own personality.

I've noticed that comedians/ comedic actors and actresses sometimes are able to go deep and play profoundly disturbed characters, sometimes better than Shakespearean actors. Jerry Lewis, Ed Wynn, Milton Berle, Lucille Ball, Richard Pryor, Dick Van Dyke, Carol Burnett and Mary Tyler Moore, just to name a few, could do that-- and so could Andy Griffith.

 

(BTW--Jimmymac71-- I love your avatar. It looks like one of my favorite puppies!)

What later portrayals?   (because as you know A Face in the Crowd was before Mayberry).

The only film I could find that were made after he was a Sheriff in Mayberry where he plays a somewhat dark character is Hearts of the West (and in this film he has a very friendly persona even though he was trying to rip off the younger man).

Note that when I saw the original post I also wondered what dark role the host was talking about.   Maybe Wiki is only listing a handful of his films,  but the films at the end of his career listed there are mostly lame teen type comedies.

 

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29 minutes ago, Princess of Tap said:

I think people who were not aware of Andy's great Elia Kazan movie, "A Face in the Crowd" and only knew him as Sheriff Andy Taylor in Mayberry, may have been shocked at some of these later portrayals.

But but the truth of the matter is he was a great actor and he could play anything. He certainly could play these difficult, evil characters extraordinarily well.

After all, that's what an actor does-- he plays/portrays characters. And if he's good, the portrayal is no place close to his own personality.

I've noticed that comedians/ comedic actors and actresses sometimes are able to go deep and play profoundly disturbed characters, sometimes better than Shakespearean actors. Jerry Lewis, Ed Wynn, Milton Berle, Lucille Ball, Richard Pryor, Dick Van Dyke, Carol Burnett and Mary Tyler Moore, just to name a few, could do that-- and so could Andy Griffith.

 

(BTW--Jimmymac71-- I love your avatar. It looks like one of my favorite puppies!)

I've been aware of this image for years. I never saved it, or it hides on an old floppy disc. My tuxedo cat avatar was short lived. Gee, do I change my avatar faster than LawrenceA? He is a guide dog puppy from Israel. Thanks.

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2 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

What later portrayals?   (because as you know A Face in the Crowd was before Mayberry).

The only film I could find that were made after he was a Sheriff in Mayberry where he plays a somewhat dark character is Hearts of the West (and in this film he has a very friendly persona even though he was trying to rip off the younger man).

Note that when I saw the original post I also wondered what dark role the host was talking about.   Maybe Wiki is only listing a handful of his films,  but the films at the end of his career listed there are mostly lame teen type comedies.

 

They were made for TV movies. One called " Gramps ", co-starring with John Ritter, made in 1995, was so realistic I have a hard time watching the whole thing.

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2 minutes ago, jimmymac71 said:

I've been aware of this image for years. I never saved it, or it hides on an old floppy disc. My tuxedo cat avatar was short lived. Gee, do I change my avatar faster than LawrenceA? He is a guide dog puppy from Israel. Thanks.

Mine was a pound dog. The only pound dog I ever got and one of the most loyal dogs I ever had!

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12 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

What later portrayals?   (because as you know A Face in the Crowd was before Mayberry).

The only film I could find that were made after he was a Sheriff in Mayberry where he plays a somewhat dark character is Hearts of the West (and in this film he has a very friendly persona even though he was trying to rip off the younger man).

Note that when I saw the original post I also wondered what dark role the host was talking about.   Maybe Wiki is only listing a handful of his films,  but the films at the end of his career listed there are mostly lame teen type comedies.

 

See, now this is how misunderstandings start. The host didn't say the roles were dark, she said the movies were dark. It was probably just poor lighting.

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Andy Griffith was in a number of "dark" Made-for-TV movies in the 1970s, such as The Strangers in 7AGo Ask Alice, Pray for the WildcatsWinter Kill, and Savages, among others.

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