Sign in to follow this  
cigarjoe

Getting It Right

46 posts in this topic

A few days ago I watched The Subterraneans  about the Beats, then I thought of Hollywood's ridiculous depictions of the 1960s counter culture and how they almost never used any then current rock music. 

So that got me thinking that if they could get those wrong, then probably everything else they ever depicted is probably off too. They weren't making documentaries, lol.

Western Cattle Drives have been shot pretty authentically looking until you notice the cattle are usually herefords rather than the Texas longhorns they should have been.

Off the top of my head think the bikers in The Wild One, what about the surfers in all those Beach Party films. I'm sure we can think of more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a friend who's a train enthusiast and knows all the lines and where they run, and he can barely even watch a movie in which a line that runs only on the West Coast is shown in a movie supposedly set in Kansas or Florida or Rhode Island. I think he's walked out of some movies because of that.

I guess my own pet peeve is pop music, and I tend to bristle at era inaccuracies. American Graffiti is set in 1962, I think? 1963? Late enough that the specter of Vietnam is beginning to loom. While one Beach Boys song plays during the movie, the car radios for all the rest of the movie are blaring first-generation rock & roll songs from about 1956-1959. Maybe pop radio was much different then than what I remember? Instead culling 90 per cent of their playlists from songs that were in the Top 40 at that moment, the radio stations of 1962 spent 90 per cent of their time playing songs that were five years old? But I suspect they just played the music George Lucas wanted them to play, accuracy be darned.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, sewhite2000 said:

I have a friend who's a train enthusiast and knows all the lines and where they run, and he can barely even watch a movie in which a line that runs only on the West Coast is shown in a movie supposedly set in Kansas or Florida or Rhode Island. I think he's walked out of some movies because of that.

I guess my own pet peeve is pop music, and I tend to bristle at era inaccuracies. American Graffiti is set in 1962, I think? 1963? Late enough that the specter of Vietnam is beginning to loom. While one Beach Boys song plays during the movie, the car radios for all the rest of the movie are blaring first-generation rock & roll songs from about 1956-1959. Maybe pop radio was much different then than what I remember? Instead culling 90 per cent of their playlists from songs that were in the Top 40 at that moment, the radio stations of 1962 spent 90 per cent of their time playing songs that were five years old? But I suspect they just played the music George Lucas wanted them to play, accuracy be darned.

In a similar vein to the story of your train enthusiast friend here sewhite, I have a neighbor here in Sedona who's quite well versed in the subject of firearms. His favorite movie genre is Westerns. And, his little pet peeve is watching a western and the firearms shown in it not being of the proper vintage to the year or years being portrayed within it.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Haha, along the line of firearms....the entire Tiki family are gun enthusiasts and we all burst out laughing when we see anyone gesture shooting a handgun-whether turning their arm sideways or jerking their elbow (pumping). James Cagney is the king of shooting with pumping action.

Anyone with knowledge about a subject generally dislikes movies just for the inaccuracies, like the aforementioned trains. I dislike most movies about horses and often howl out loud at medieval knights riding horses in modern Western bridles/bits & saddles tarted up with costuming. Even the type of horse is "wrong". But you certainly wanted the star riding a gorgeous horse like Trigger, not a Budweiser draft horse. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:

I have a friend who's a train enthusiast and knows all the lines and where they run, and he can barely even watch a movie in which a line that runs only on the West Coast is shown in a movie supposedly set in Kansas or Florida or Rhode Island. I think he's walked out of some movies because of that.

I guess my own pet peeve is pop music, and I tend to bristle at era inaccuracies. American Graffiti is set in 1962, I think? 1963? Late enough that the specter of Vietnam is beginning to loom. While one Beach Boys song plays during the movie, the car radios for all the rest of the movie are blaring first-generation rock & roll songs from about 1956-1959. Maybe pop radio was much different then than what I remember? Instead culling 90 per cent of their playlists from songs that were in the Top 40 at that moment, the radio stations of 1962 spent 90 per cent of their time playing songs that were five years old? But I suspect they just played the music George Lucas wanted them to play, accuracy be darned.

The only real inaccuracy  in GRAFFITI would be WOLFMAN JACK blasting on the radio in June of '62( I've always heard he started at the Mexican based station in '63) but the music's right as his tendency was to take requests and play "oldies" a lot.  The only other issues would be some of the situations those guys got into, created of course, for movie entertainment.

Most of MY accuracy issues are with peripheral matters, like colored, plastic telephones being used several years before their creation, some "not stylish for the times" hair-dos and such.  I can't get to specifics with any movie titles,  but I'll keep eyes peeled and wrack my memory and maybe come up with some other examples.  

And too, I've ALWAYS had a problem with what I call "Hollywood rock'n'roll" , a prime example being that lame instrumental record that girl plays over and over in MR. HOBBS TAKES A VACATION('62).

Sepiatone

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:

...I guess my own pet peeve is pop music, and I tend to bristle at era inaccuracies. American Graffiti is set in 1962, I think? 1963? Late enough that the specter of Vietnam is beginning to loom. While one Beach Boys song plays during the movie, the car radios for all the rest of the movie are blaring first-generation rock & roll songs from about 1956-1959. Maybe pop radio was much different then than what I remember? Instead culling 90 per cent of their playlists from songs that were in the Top 40 at that moment, the radio stations of 1962 spent 90 per cent of their time playing songs that were five years old? But I suspect they just played the music George Lucas wanted them to play, accuracy be darned.

According to Wikipedia, American Graffiti is set at the beginning of Sept. 1962, right at the end of the summer.  Also according to Wikipedia, all of the songs in the movie except one were released by then.  The one exception is the last song in the movie, "All Summer Long" by the Beach Boys, which was released in 1964. 

I don't like this kind of historical anachronism myself, but in this case, I'm willing to give it a pass.  For me, "All Summer Long" has exactly the right spirit for that point in the movie.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, BingFan said:

According to Wikipedia, American Graffiti is set at the beginning of Sept. 1962, right at the end of the summer.  Also according to Wikipedia, all of the songs in the movie except one were released by then.  The one exception is the last song in the movie, "All Summer Long" by the Beach Boys, which was released in 1964. 

I don't like this kind of historical anachronism myself, but in this case, I'm willing to give it a pass.  For me, "All Summer Long" has exactly the right spirit for that point in the movie.

I believe the reason the Beach Boys song was used in American Graffiti was to present the thought of how the John Milner (Paul Le Mat) character was stuck in a late-'50s mindset, because as he's cruising around in his hot rod with the young Carol (Mackenzie Phillips) character and that song comes on the radio, he tells her that he hates surf music, and was a very popular music genre during the early-'60s.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Dargo said:

I believe the reason the Beach Boys song was used in American Graffiti was to present the thought of how the John Milner (Paul Le Mat) character was stuck in a late-'50s mindset, because as he's cruising around in his hot rod with the young Carol (Mackenzie Phillips) character and that song comes on the radio, he tells her that he hates surf music, and was a very popular music genre during the early-'60s.

I think you're right that a Beach Boys song is playing during that scene between Milner and young Carol in his car.  But isn't the song "Surfin' Safari"?  It definitely fits the scene as you describe it.

There are two BB songs in the movie, and the other one, "All Summer Long," is at the very end of the movie, after Milner wrecks his car in the drag race , if I remember correctly.   (It's been a few years since I last saw American Graffiti, so I could be wrong.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, BingFan said:

I think you're right that a Beach Boys song is playing during that scene between Milner and young Carol in his car.  But isn't the song "Surfin' Safari"?  It definitely fits the scene as you describe it.

There are two BB songs in the movie, and the other one, "All Summer Long," is at the very end of the movie, after Milner wrecks his car in the drag race , if I remember correctly.   (It's been a few years since I last saw American Graffiti, so I could be wrong.)

I believe you're right on both counts here, BF.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Dargo said:

I believe the reason the Beach Boys song was used in American Graffiti was to present the thought of how the John Milner (Paul Le Mat) character was stuck in a late-'50s mindset, because as he's cruising around in his hot rod with the young Carol (Mackenzie Phillips) character and that song comes on the radio, he tells her that he hates surf music, and was a very popular music genre during the early-'60s.

That's getting a little too much into interpreting Milner as the "main character" of the movie, which he clearly isn't.

The song's one of only two Beach Boys on my iTunes just for its American Graffiti use, namely that the song over the credits conjures up the ultimate idea of personal nostalgia (and not just George Lucas's) for the era, and the 50's/60's That Will Never Die.  Any other sentimental BB song--just try putting "Wouldn't It Be Nice?" in there--just wouldn't have created that mythical "Where were you in '62?" summer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, BingFan said:

According to Wikipedia, American Graffiti is set at the beginning of Sept. 1962, right at the end of the summer.  Also according to Wikipedia, all of the songs in the movie except one were released by then.  The one exception is the last song in the movie, "All Summer Long" by the Beach Boys, which was released in 1964. 

I don't like this kind of historical anachronism myself, but in this case, I'm willing to give it a pass.  For me, "All Summer Long" has exactly the right spirit for that point in the movie.

I didn't object to the Beach Boys number, though I didn't realize its inaccuracy. My objection was to every other song in the movie, which would have been three-five years old at the time they were blasting on everyone's car radios.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, slaytonf said:

So what were the songs playing in '62?

The movie is set in September of '62. The top songs for, say, that July through September were:

  • "Roses Are Red (My Love)" - Bobby Vinton
  • "The Stripper" - David Rose and His Orchestra
  • "I Can't Stop Loving You" - Ray Charles
  • "Sealed With a Kiss" - Brian Hyland
  • "The Wah-Watusi" - Orlons
  • "Breaking Up Is Hard To Do" - Neil Sedaka
  • "The Loco-Motion" - Little Eva
  • "Ahab, the Arab" - Ray Stevens
  • "Sheila" - Tommy Roe
  • "Ramblin' Rose" - Nat King Cole
  • "Sherry" - Four Seasons
  • "She's Not You" - Elvis Prelsey

Those were all in the top five of the Billboard charts from July through September of '62.

 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pretty sure none of which are in the movie. I mean, don't get me wrong. The soundtrack is awesome. My point is, it's just not the songs that would have been playing on Top 40 radio stations that year. I doubt the oldies station had been invented yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, LawrenceA said:

The movie is set in September of '62. The top songs for, say, that July through September were:

  • "Roses Are Red (My Love)" - Bobby Vinton
  • "The Stripper" - David Rose and His Orchestra
  • "I Can't Stop Loving You" - Ray Charles
  • "Sealed With a Kiss" - Brian Hyland
  • "The Wah-Watusi" - Orlons
  • "Breaking Up Is Hard To Do" - Neil Sedaka
  • "The Loco-Motion" - Little Eva
  • "Ahab, the Arab" - Ray Stevens
  • "Sheila" - Tommy Roe
  • "Ramblin' Rose" - Nat King Cole
  • "Sherry" - Four Seasons
  • "She's Not You" - Elvis Prelsey

Those were all in the top five of the Billboard charts from July through September of '62.

 

What? No Herb Alpert and the Tijuana Brass?

Related image

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, jakeem said:

What? No Herb Alpert and the Tijuana Brass?

No, but "Monster Mash" did enter the charts for the first time in September of '62, at #17.

SeveralSoulfulBass-size_restricted.gif

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm absolutely sure they had some hits in 1962 but apparently no Top Five hits during the months Lawrence mentioned! I think "The Lonely Bull" was from '62.

Edit: Oh, Lawrence already replied for I could complete the post.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, sewhite2000 said:

I'm absolutely sure they had some hits in 1962 but apparently no Top Five hits during the months Lawrence mentioned! I think "The Lonely Bull" was from '62.

Edit: Oh, Lawrence already replied for I could complete the post.

I just looked it up. "The Lonely Bull" was released in August of 1962 and got as high as No. 6 on the Billboard pop chart.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, jakeem said:

I just looked it up. "The Lonely Bull" was released in August of 1962 and got as high as No. 6 on the Billboard pop chart.

Yes, it entered the top 20 in November of '62, at #19.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No. I must respectfully disagree. Going into a movie, you recognize outright that the movie will get it wrong. If what you see on screen is so awry that you feel impelled to rise and depart? The fault is yours. You chose the wrong flick and you went in with exalted expectations.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow-a lot of discussion about AMERICAN GRAFFITI. Here's another angle for your consideration...

I recall reading in Lucas' earliest biography (SKYWALKING, I think it's called) that he originally wanted Elvis tunes to set the tone for the radio play in the movie. Unfortunately, the rights to get even one Elvis song was way out of his budget, so he had to choose from everything else.

Even if one of his choices was a "fudge" from the future, it still works great for me, without Elvis. Besides, like Sepiatone stated, there's only so many current hits on the chart at any given time.

A DJ playing a two year old song on the radio is wholly acceptable "filler" for the current top 10. After all, you couldn't rotate only the top 10 or 20 songs all day long, could you?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Realize Sarge, that most of the complaints about such things are done in RETROSPECT. And too, don't( and didn't) cause any later dislike or antipathy of any movie.  And sometimes, noticing some of that kind of stuff is part of the fun of it all. 

Like, I don't DISLIKE "Mr. Hobbs Takes A Vacation" because of the silly "Hollywood rock'n'roll".  ;)

Sepiatone

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hollywood tended to project, I guess it would be appropriate to call a, "Disneyland" view of small town America. We know it wasn't all a bed of roses.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

New Members:

Register Here

Learn more about the new message boards:

FAQ

Having problems?

Contact Us