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mr6666

War on Christmas??

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does PBS have your permission to show bell systems old "the spirit of christmas" with the puppets? :P

 

Is that the one with Benny and Cecil, or the one with Bert and Ernie???

 

(...btw, and speakin' of the latter two...you DO know, doncha ND, that there's been talk in the past about what kind'a "relationship" those two have, AND I hear that MANY of those SAME folks out there who keep persisting that there's some kind'a "conspiracy" that others are tryin' to get rid of people sayin' "Merry Christmas" ain't too crazy about THAT sort'a thing EITHER!!!!)

 

LOL

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Always thought Happy Holidays was created by merchants so they could use one set of decorations for Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Year's.

Or that it was an attempt by good people to be more inclusive of others.

The people that I know who believe in the "War on Christmas" are the least Christian acting I know. Just another example of extremists trying to push their beliefs on the majoroity or criticize those that aren't like them.

There can be Christmas decorations without having religious displays.

Besides, if it ever was a religious holiday, that ended many decades ago.

 

Well we can agree to disagree on this one.   To me Christmas is a religious holiday and that is why I don't observe the holiday.  Just like I don't observe Yom Kipper or Ramadan.  

 

In addition if a more secular society is trying to take the Christ out of Christmas I can see why some Christians would view that as a 'war on Christmas'.    Yea I'm as secular as they come but to me Christmas is a holiday for Christians.

 

Many people I know celebrated a secular Christmas because they didn't want their kids teased for being atheist\non believers (as well as just for the fun of the holiday like giving and getting gifts that have no religious connection).  I get that since the vast majority of kids going to school back in those prior decades were Christians.   But today,  like gays,  atheist don't have to be in the closet.   

 

But hey to each their own.   For those secular families that get joy from celebrating Christmas,  I say go for it.   It just isn't my cup of tea.

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Is that the one with Benny and Cecil, or the one with Bert and Ernie???

 

(...btw, and speakin' of the latter two...you DO know, doncha ND, that there's been talk in the past about what kind'a "relationship" those two have, AND I hear that MANY of those SAME folks out there who keep persisting that there's some kind'a "conspiracy" that others are tryin' to get rid of people sayin' "Merry Christmas" ain't too crazy about THAT sort'a thing EITHER!!!!)

 

LOL

this harmless quaint visual ode to 1950s american christmas life?... :)

 

 

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...But hey to each their own.   For those secular families that get joy from celebrating Christmas,  I say go for it.   It just isn't my cup of tea.

 

Hmmmm....I wonder if TCM will refund the money for that Wine Club membership I sent them last week as James' "Secret Santa"???

 

(...oh well...maybe DGF drinks the stuff) 

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Hmmmm....I wonder if TCM will refund the money for that Wine Club membership I sent them last week as James' "Secret Santa"???

 

(...oh well...maybe DGF drinks the stuff) 

 

I said it wasn't my cup of tea.   I'll always accept wine!      :lol:

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"Holiday", in old English, once DID mean "holy day".  But that was WAY back

 

The English have also long used the word "holiday" to mean any period of respite.

 

Here in America, we have MANY days we call "holidays" that have NO religious connection.  like---

 

THANKSGIVING

 

MEMORIAL DAY

 

NEW YEARSDAY

 

MARTIN LUTHER KING DAY

 

KWANZAA

 

For years that I can remember, a lot of people always decry the "commercialism" of Christmas.  Even those who regularily show up with the manic hordes on "Black Friday".

 

Yeah, although I consider myself an agnostic, I still have a bit of spiritualism and enough respect for those devoted as to not make too many waves on the day.  I go along with it out of tradition more than Christian beliefs.  My only departure is that I NEVER go "overboard" on any gifts.  One year, I baked BREAD for eveybody.

 

What I don't fully understand is the griping other religious factions do at this time of year.  I can only apologetically explain that since the day known as CHRISTMAS has long in this country, been stretched out to a "season", and largely held by Christians for generations, who at the time DID make up the largest part of this country's population is why it's still commercially a big deal.

 

Perhaps if ISLAM and other religions were followed by an equal number of people, for all those years, proper and equal celebration would also be acknowledged.

 

WAR on CHRISTMAS?  Just because some say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas"?  After all, none of these jerks seem to whine when Perry Como can be heard on the radio singing, "Happy Holidays".

 

And WHO CARS that STARBUCK'S just offers a plain red cup?

 

Their MAIN complaint should be about the SWILL they FILL it with!

 

 

Sepiatone

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"Holiday", in old English, once DID mean "holy day".  But that was WAY back

 

The English have also long used the word "holiday" to mean any period of respite.

 

Here in America, we have MANY days we call "holidays" that have NO religious connection.  like---

 

THANKSGIVING

 

MEMORIAL DAY

 

NEW YEARSDAY

 

MARTIN LUTHER KING DAY

 

KWANZAA

 

For years that I can remember, a lot of people always decry the "commercialism" of Christmas.  Even those who regularily show up with the manic hordes on "Black Friday".

 

Yeah, although I consider myself an agnostic, I still have a bit of spiritualism and enough respect for those devoted as to not make too many waves on the day.  I go along with it out of tradition more than Christian beliefs.  My only departure is that I NEVER go "overboard" on any gifts.  One year, I baked BREAD for eveybody.

 

What I don't fully understand is the griping other religious factions do at this time of year.  I can only apologetically explain that since the day known as CHRISTMAS has long in this country, been stretched out to a "season", and largely held by Christians for generations, who at the time DID make up the largest part of this country's population is why it's still commercially a big deal.

 

Perhaps if ISLAM and other religions were followed by an equal number of people, for all those years, proper and equal celebration would also be acknowledged.

 

WAR on CHRISTMAS?  Just because some say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas"?  After all, none of these jerks seem to whine when Perry Como can be heard on the radio singing, "Happy Holidays".

 

And WHO CARS that STARBUCK'S just offers a plain red cup?

 

Their MAIN complaint should be about the SWILL they FILL it with!

 

 

Sepiatone

how could KWANZAA possibly have any religious historical significance?...

 

it didn't exist before 1966. :lol:

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"Holiday", in old English, once DID mean "holy day".  But that was WAY back

 

The English have also long used the word "holiday" to mean any period of respite.

 

Here in America, we have MANY days we call "holidays" that have NO religious connection.  like---

 

THANKSGIVING

 

MEMORIAL DAY

 

NEW YEARSDAY

 

MARTIN LUTHER KING DAY

 

KWANZAA

 

For years that I can remember, a lot of people always decry the "commercialism" of Christmas.  Even those who regularily show up with the manic hordes on "Black Friday".

 

Yeah, although I consider myself an agnostic, I still have a bit of spiritualism and enough respect for those devoted as to not make too many waves on the day.  I go along with it out of tradition more than Christian beliefs.  My only departure is that I NEVER go "overboard" on any gifts.  One year, I baked BREAD for eveybody.

 

What I don't fully understand is the griping other religious factions do at this time of year.  I can only apologetically explain that since the day known as CHRISTMAS has long in this country, been stretched out to a "season", and largely held by Christians for generations, who at the time DID make up the largest part of this country's population is why it's still commercially a big deal.

 

Perhaps if ISLAM and other religions were followed by an equal number of people, for all those years, proper and equal celebration would also be acknowledged.

 

WAR on CHRISTMAS?  Just because some say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas"?  After all, none of these jerks seem to whine when Perry Como can be heard on the radio singing, "Happy Holidays".

 

And WHO CARS that STARBUCK'S just offers a plain red cup?

 

Their MAIN complaint should be about the SWILL they FILL it with!

 

 

Sepiatone

yeah, who the hell is gonna drink coffee made with ground cockroaches? :o

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JJG said: Yea I'm as secular as they come but to me Christmas is a holiday for Christians.

 

I agree with you JJG....it's a holiday for Christians. If I were Christian, I'd be disgusted to see what has become of my holy day.
 

Vautrin said re: happy holidays - I always figured it was a rather practical greeting everything is covered.

 
Call me grumpy, but since I don't celebrate ANY of those holidays, strangers saying "Happy Holidays!" is actually offensive to me. It's as if they ASSUME their "holiday" is universally celebrated.
 
It's not.
 
My religion is art. To me, it's the human attempt for godliness; creating & connecting with others. I worship by attending the yearly screening of ITS A WONDERFUL LIFE.

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Call me grumpy, but since I don't celebrate ANY of those holidays, strangers saying "Happy Holidays!" is actually offensive to me. It's as if they ASSUME their "holiday" is universally celebrated.
 
It's not.
 
My religion is art. To me, it's the human attempt for godliness; creating & connecting with others. I worship by attending the yearly screening of ITS A WONDERFUL LIFE.

 

 

:P

grumpy-cat-christmas.jpg

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I think it covers most people, though not everyone. I believe most

people say it just to be polite, and don't think too much more about

it. I enjoy the holidays for the most part, though I realize there are

some who, for various reasons, are stressed out at this time of the

year.

 

The people that are stressed out are the people that are celebrating the holiday.  The season doesn't phase me one way or the other expect that I avoid all shopping centers, non food stores and malls until after the season is over.   I just stocked up on bird food and guitar strings so I'm set until January.

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The people that are stressed out are the people that are celebrating the holiday.  The season doesn't phase me one way or the other expect that I avoid all shopping centers, non food stores and malls until after the season is over.   I just stocked up on bird food and guitar strings so I'm set until January.

 

Eeh! You just sound like one of those "typical too laid-back" and "Godless" Californians to me, James! ;)

 

(...and no, sorry, you've already blown your chance at gettin' that free case of wine from me for Christmas, dude!...I already got my refund back!!!)

 

LOL

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Some are, some aren't. Some people actually enjoy all the parties,

events, even shopping, and other get stressed out by it. Every

year around the holiday season there are always TV stories and

newspaper articles about how stressful it is for some people. I

take a low key approach and part of it is just being in a warm, cozy

place when it's cold and nasty outside. I do agree about staying

away from malls and stores during the time. Thank goodness for

Amazon. :)

 

I didn't say ALL those that celebrate are stressed out but instead that those that ignore the holidays are NOT stressed out.

 

e.g. my mother who isn't Christian gets stressed out and complains she doesn't have the money or time to buy gifts.   I have told her for years to just STOP doing that.  Just comes to the dinner my sister host (which I pick her up and drive her to) and that is it.   No stress.   (we do all bring food but when Mom complained about that my wife and I agreed to cook her dish for her just to stop her endless complaining).

 

But she says she has to get gifts.  OK, even I got gifts when the kids were minor children but how that they are adults,  no more gifts.  Last Christmas these adult children got gifts from their aunt.   Lots of them,  while this was a nice gesture from the aunt government these 'kids' just left all of them at their moms and told her to do what they want with them.   (they were shirts and ties they said they would never wish to wear).    I told these "kids" they could exchange them but they weren't even interested in that since they would have to go to a mall and they do EVERYTHING on-line.     

 

Now when these 'kids' have their own kids that will be interesting.  Like I said they are all atheist.  So I will be asking them IF they want others in the family to get their kids Christmas gifts.   One or two have already said they will NOT be celebrating Christmas,  period (but their girlfriends said not so fast) other than coming to moms for dinner so please NO gifts.    So it looks like this next generation of atheist isn't going to celebrate even a secular holiday season.   To me that is progress but to others it is sad.

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To those who think we American are too quick to put up the decorations (season's, Christmas, holiday, or whatever); you should see London at the moment. I arrived here last night. There is Christmas decor everywhere -- it's quite nice.  The Brits don't have Thanksgiving, which used to be our punctuation that began the Christmas season for us. So the Brits have always been earlier with the decorations. Generally they start around Halloween (another former pagan holiday).

 

Whatever you call it, it makes Blighty seem even more festive than usual. As Dargo might say, it make the town more colourful!

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Well, all I can say here is that even THIS here Agnostic(that would be me) has always been of the mind that it's a rather nice little thing that for at least ONE day each year people might actually take a few moments to ponder the thought that once there was some dude who walked this planet who attempted to teach the freakin' human race to live peacefully together.

 

(...but then again I think we all know what happened to THAT poor dreamer, now don't we)

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Well, all I can say here is that even THIS here Agnostic(that would be me) has always been of the mind that it's a rather nice little thing that for at least ONE day each year people might actually take a few moments to ponder the thought that once there was some dude who walked this planet who attempted to teach the freakin' human race to live peacefully together.

 

(...but then again I think we all know what happened to THAT poor dreamer, now don't we)

 

Yea,  the death of John Lennon was a shame.    OH,  you mean another dreamer.    

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Yea,  the death of John Lennon was a shame.    OH,  you mean another dreamer.    

you liberals are truely amazing. outta one side of your mouths you will extoll the virtues of jesus christ and out of the other side of your mouths you will denigrate judeo-christian morality whenever you can.

 

you pick and choose. so do five-year olds. :lol:

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We never go overboard on the gifts either.  I never understood how the idea of spending far beyond one's means got to be what Christmas was all about.  Many of my favorite gifts over the years, and in recent years as well, have usually been the simplest, not so expensive gifts.  And ones that suited my personal vibe.  For instance, someone once gave me a coffee mug(plain) and a can of my favorite coffee.  Loved it.  As well as all the "Far Side" collections I've gotten over time, too.

 

I do quite a bit, bot not OVERdo Christmas decorations in the house.  Some angel "statues"( ceramic heads on those plastic cones, covered in fabric) and a lot of Santas( the Mrs. IS a Santa freak).  But not to the point you can't move through a room.

 

Sepiatone

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I would guess there are people who do not celebrate it but still get stressed

out by it anyway. It's hard to ignore. Be that as it may, I still enjoy Christmas,

though I'm not religious. I read an article yesterday on the "War on Christmas,"

which blamed Santa Claus. That jolly old bearded man takes too much attention

away from Jesus. Ho ho ho.

 

 

MarxChico01.jpg

 

"Eeh! You no'a fool me! There AIN'T'a such'a somebody like'a him anyway!"

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I would guess there are people who do not celebrate it but still get stressed

out by it anyway. It's hard to ignore. Be that as it may, I still enjoy Christmas,

though I'm not religious. I read an article yesterday on the "War on Christmas,"

which blamed Santa Claus. That jolly old bearded man takes too much attention

away from Jesus. Ho ho ho.

Seems kinda stupid to blame HIM after all these years. 

 

Anyway, I thought he was more or less based on an actual person.  Not that the actual person flew through the air on a sleigh pulled by eight tiny reindeer, but you get my drift.  The St. Nicholas/Santa Claus connection and all.

So, how come we don't get this kind of horsepucky around EASTER about the EASTER BUNNY?

 

Sepiatone

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Seems kinda stupid to blame HIM after all these years. 

 

Anyway, I thought he was more or less based on an actual person.  Not that the actual person flew through the air on a sleigh pulled by eight tiny reindeer, but you get my drift.  The St. Nicholas/Santa Claus connection and all.

So, how come we don't get this kind of horsepucky around EASTER about the EASTER BUNNY?

 

Sepiatone

 

Well, THIS is obvious, ain't it Sepia?!!!

 

THAT'S 'cause the freakin' Easter Bunny isn't a WHITE MAN!!!

 

And YOU KNOW how there's ALSO been a little "war" goin' on against THEM for some time now TOO, doncha?!!!

 

(...well, ironically, at least according to some of the very same people constantly pressin' this whole freakin' absurd idea that there's been some kind'a "war" goin' on against Christmas for a while now too, anyway) ;)

 

LOL

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you liberals are truely amazing. outta one side of your mouths you will extoll the virtues of jesus christ and out of the other side of your mouths you will denigrate judeo-christian morality whenever you can.

 

you pick and choose. so do five-year olds. :lol:

 

This JC dude was just another dude.   I might like him more if I owned any of his records.

 

As for Judeo-Christian morality,  some of those are fine (like no stealing since I support personal property rights),   but some are just silly and some down right hateful.

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you liberals are truely amazing. outta one side of your mouths you will extoll the virtues of jesus christ and out of the other side of your mouths you will denigrate judeo-christian morality whenever you can.

 

you pick and choose. so do five-year olds. :lol:

 

Funny, ND ol' buddy, but I'VE tended to notice during my 63 years on this planet that in general it tends to be "you conservatives" who are a little more inclined to "pick and choose" the passages from that certain book which suit YOUR purposes best.

 

And, "funny" AGAIN, but I've ALSO noticed in that same length of time that the passages from that certain book "you conservatives" will MOST often quote from PRE-DATE the time of the man you just referenced and HIS sage advice.

 

Yep, now ain't that funny?! Yep, God(if there IS one of course)'s universe is suuuuure one funny place, now ain't it?! 

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