ChipHeartsMovies

Argh, I missed it, it aired in NYC on 1/1 while I was at work. I often accidentally miss PBS shows because of the scheduling being different in different places. Hopefully a rebroadcast soon, or maybe I should just fly to Phoenix to see it.

Thanks for the clarification, filmlover. I'm a bit of a technotard, hehe.

Ziggyelman -- I found them at a Kroger's in Dalton, Georgia, about 90 miles north of Atlanta. Chances are they're at one of yours!

I could watch *The Music Box* every day for a year and still laugh.

scsu1975, I'm confused. I didn't know Joel McCrae and Dinah Shore were gay. (This thread is a scream).

As I stated earlier, there was never a point that someone became so personally hostile that I felt threatened, or felt the need to "report" someone. The one or two times in the past few months that interchanges seemed to veer toward turning personal I just tried to withdraw from the argument. That's just my experience, and as I said I don't participate in the threads (like Frank Grimes Memorial or Western Rambles) that others are citing as the main sources of trouble. Virtually all people who are conservative are reasonable, and they are trying to do what they think is right --- we just may disagree on what is right. Being conservative isn't the same thing as being a bigot, and there are liberal bigots as well as conservative ones. I'm a very liberal gay man in NYC, my sister is an Evangelical Christian in a small town in the South, and we get along fine. Look at the interchange that Jake and I had earlier in this thread --- certainly not threatening or inhospitable to either of us, and I appreciated hearing that he is approaching issues that affect my day-to-day life with an open mind. I suspect the direct hostility comes from one or two cranks --- we've all had experiences with nutty posters. If CelluloidKid is especially sensitive, I'd say that if I were fighting the legal battles he's involved in in order to be able to visit his partner in the hospital I'd be pretty sensitive too.

lol, and just what role did Judy the Chimp from *Daktari* play in this?

Rin Tin Tin had affairs with Asta and three different Lassies. There were rumors about Cheeta but those are just too wild to believe.

Joefilmone was referring to Pasolini's *Salo*. When a movie gets a Criterion Collection release, Joe, it's safe to say it isn't porn. Pretty disturbing work, but not porn. I agree about the sounds layering through *Eraserhead* as being major parts of the tone.

All of the Fox b/w Shirley Temple movies are now packaged with the original version and in newly colorized versions on the same disc. While I am a bit of a purist, at least the colorization process isn't as artificial as it used to be. Also, Shirley herself approved the work and arranged the releases.

We all sound a little like a family that sees each other only on the holidays and gets a little testy after being cooped up together for several days.

Lynn, have you read the books by Darwin Porter (Hepburn, Bogart, and a "new" Hollywood Babylon) and David Bret (Joan Crawford and an upcoming Harlow)? Literally every page is an unconfirmed sleazy rumor. I picked up the Joan Crawford book over the holidays in a rush to the airport without really looking at it, and within three chapters Bret has Joan starring in piles of porno films, arrested for prostitution, having sex with about fifteen men and women, and mowing down a pedestrian in her roadster. And all before *Grand Hotel* even starts filming. They make Kenneth Anger look like the Encyclopedia Brittanica.

This thread is brought to you from the Bizarro TCM Board.

Haha, Fred, you are right. What a weird website. Thanks for suggesting we check it out!

TCM doesn't have the rights to air *It's a Wonderful Life* or most Shirley Temple movies, except *The Little Princess* and the movies she made as a teen, like *Since You Went Away* . NBC has the exclusive rights to *Winderful Life* and Fox Movie Channel owns the Temples.

Jake, thanks for your thoughtful response and for taking my comments in the spirit they were intended.

Without knowing exactly what you refer to, Jake, (and whether you meant only Film_Fatale, or all of us as a group) I'd say this -- Much depends on the context of where the statements on either side are made. In the case of the Gay Pride Month movie discussions a while back, the discussions of gay subtext and content were absolutely appropriate in every way, and it was equally appropriate for those of us who are gay to discuss (and describe for others) WHY it was important for us to see this topic addressed on TCM. It's hardly a new idea, *The Celluloid Closet* book and movie came out over a decade earlier. Yet there were people who became truly nasty about the discussion, and personally insulting. Likewise, any discussion of *Milk* should involve this talk. At the same time, if someone else wants to say that they're uncomfortable with the topic, or the kissing scenes, or whatever, okay; just be civil and make your point, and while I might not agree, we can discuss it without being unpleasant. Continuing to disagree politely isn't "pushing and pushing." In terms of the thread on Proposition 8, please understand that, for gay people, we are looking at a situation that is very scary for us. In the U.S. civil rights are very rarely taken away from anyone. While I live in New York and am not even dating anyone, much less married, it's very scary to me. I know people in California who are legally married today whose marriages may well be invalidated by the courts --- they are terrified. I know that people who are very conservative may feel threatened (or at the very least, strongly disagree with) the idea of gay rights, or specifically gay marriage. I'm happy to talk about our differences in a thread like Prop 8. If you were referring to me in terms of that thread, I apologize if I offended you. I'd much rather have a good discussion --- maybe you'll understand where I'm coming from, and maybe I'll get insight into your concerns. Where it would be largely inappropriate is in threads like Western Rambles (whatever that is, I haven't read it and so have no idea what's going on in there); other than *Johnny Guitar* and of course *Brokeback Mountain* , I can't think of any Westerns that you'd have reason to talk about gay issues. But then, as I acknowledged, I don't really know Westerns, maybe there is something I could learn there. I hope we all make 2009 a year that we respect each other, in EVERY way. As I said, if I offended you personally in the Prop 8 discussions I certainly apologize, that wasn't my intent. And I look forward to future conversations with you, not just about the issues that we disagree over but also about the classic films we both love. Sorry so wordy, but I wanted to really express what I felt I needed to say. XXXChip

Over the holidays I picked up what appeared to be a cheapie budget 3-fer (at a supermarket) for about $10 that included *Born Yesterday, His Girl Friday* and *The Awful Truth* . (There were similar compilations of Steven Seagal films, Stallone films, Matrix movies, etc). Imagine my surprise on opening the box to find three separate, fully loaded with extras, DVDs! They are all Hi-Def DVDs, which are apparently being cleared out as Blu-Ray won the war. Play fine on regular DVD players, though.

Really, it's not like I'm genuinely hurt by some ill-mannered lout, I just don't think shouting back will do anything but raise the volume. And no one was so personal that I felt I needed to complain to TCM; I just sort of ignored them. Really, posted Bible verses don't affect my day-to-day life one bit. I'm afraid I don't have a lot to offer Western Rambles, since there are only a handful of Westerns I like, and they seem to be of the type that star Marlene Dietrich, Joan Crawford, or Jane Withers. Wait --- does *Girl Crazy* qualify as a Western? (Okay, *Stagecoach* is good, too).

Marvsmom, Wikipedia is a great place to start your research, but it often has errors because of the way anyone can post. I'd suggest starting there and then cross-checking on other sites like IMDB and (of course) TCM. They aren't perfect either, but at least when errors are caught there is a way to fix them for the future.

I've had the same experience as Film_Fatale from a few people (and for the same reason) --- when TCM ran the gay-moved movies two Junes ago there were some extremely unpleasant comments made by people uncomfortable with gays who felt that they were under attack by the very existence of these movies, and when I posted about how positively I viewed these films some of the attacks became personal. Sad to say, a couple of times I responded unpleasantly because I was so stunned, which I regret. Some of you may remember that even discussion of what most of us would see as a given --- like the lesbian subtext of *Queen Christina* --- was met by absolute fury from some corners. The same thing seemed on the verge of happening in the threads on Proposition 8 and to a much lesser extent *Milk* in the fall. I'm personally making a serious effort to remain absolutely polite regardless. I have no problem with there being the occasional thread on non-movie issues (like Prop 8), and I honestly don't have a problem with people who disagree with me discussing this; honestly, in terms of the gay stuff, I recognize that most people who are so vehemently anti-gay don't really know gay people or understand why some things are important, and dialogue is important to change that, whether that's about Proposition 8 or *The Killing of Sister George* and *The Children's Hour* . Constructive dialogue, not sniping back and forth and certainly not making ugly personal statements. Message was edited by: ChipHeartsMovies for typos, which he simply can't find until he posts the damn thing.

I still can't believe Estelle Getty didn't win the Oscar for *Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot!*

*The Wizard of Oz* --- same as Lynn, growing up with the annual showing cemented it. *Midnight* --- I had never seen it until TCM aired it, and I love the feel, almost fairytale-like *Destry Rides Again* --- Dietrich and Stewart paired make this my favorite Western *The Women* --- funnier every time you see it. Virginia Weidler is great! *Ninotchka* --- another one that gets better with every repeat viewing *Dark Victory* --- essential Davis

Pia, you're certainly welcome here. I think the initial post referred to specific people who are problematic, not all newer people. These boards can be a lot of fun, stick around.

Symphony Space in NYC is doing "The 1939 Project" this year. Per their website: "Economically, politically, and socially, 1939 was a pivotal year. As the Depression ended, America was infused with a new optimism, even as the atmosphere in Europe darkened. Artists found their voices and a remarkable number of American classics were born. Symphony Space celebrates these watershed works, highlighting American masterpieces in music, literature, film, and dance." The films they're showing include *The Wizard of Oz, Ninotchka, The City, The Little Princess, The Women, Mr. Smith Goes to Washington, Gone with the Wind, Stagecoach* , and *The World of Tomorrow* . A great chance to see some of these gems on the big screen! There's also an orchestra concert of pieces from 1939 film scores. Info: http://www.symphonyspace.org/series/133