molo14
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Posts posted by molo14
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Hi CineMaven,
Please tell your friend that we appreciate so much that she took the time to share her experiences with us. I enjoyed getting her perspective, not only on the event, but also on her recollections of being with you there.
But, to see T. in her element was priceless.
I'm sure it was.
Not to mention, she looked fantastic! Those extra eye lashes worked, T.
I can't wait to finally catch you on the screen. I keep missing the promos.I would also be remiss if I didn't thank TCM for showing us how to throw a freakin' party.
Ohhh. I can only imagine.
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Hi April,
Well those caps might make it seem more abrupt than it actually is but you make a good point. I was also a little surprised that he would do that. Maybe he was just putting it there temporarily until he found a better spot.
I agree though it *is* a curious moment. *It also seems to say that fantasy has taken the place of reality. If Elwood*
*can no longer find a REAL person who will love him unconditionally, he*
*will make do with a fantasy person.*
Hey now! When you start bantering about phrases like fantasy has taken the place of reality and fantasy person you sound like you don't think Harvey is real. I worry about your premise on this one. Even Veta admits that Harvey is really there.
You haven't been drinking any formula 977 have you?
*Wow. I wish it were that easy. But, try as I might, Gary Cooper just won't talk back to me.*
Ha! I think I'll let Mr. Grimes have a little fun with that one.
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Hey there Theresa!
*Girl Crazy is my mother's favorite Judy movie. do you have a thing for Nancy Walker? heehee! she's in two of your musicals.*
Ha! I don't really have a thing for Nancy Walker but I liked the way she performed in *Best Foot Forward*. In *Girl Crazy* I felt sorry for her. I thought everyone was so mean to her and I don't think she really got a chance to sing, which was a real waste.
*what makes The Gay Divorcee your favorite Ginger and Fred movie? is it mainly b/c of the supporting cast? or is it the "continental" song? heehee! hey, its a great song! i love that they put Betty Grable in it too. her little number was too cute!*
I like *The Gay Divorcee* mainly because of the humor and the cast. I'll admit I watched *Top Hat* a while back and it seemed almost as funny. Almost. Fred and Ginger don't do a whole lot of dancing in Divorcee but the "Continental" number was very good. I like all the Fred and Ginger movies because they really are magic together. As for Betty Grable she was so cute. Let's Knock Knees!
*Footlight Parade is one of my favorite 30's musicals along with 42nd Street. Richard Powell and Ruby Keeler make such a cute couple, im glad they did all the movies they did together. i always enjoy a chance when i get to hear Jimmy Cagney sing too. heehee! thats a plus!*
I think *Footlight Parade* really showed what a great pool of talent Warner's had at their disposal. The numbers are all a lot of fun. I really like Blondell and Cagney together. *42 Street* is great too, as is *Gold Diggers of 1933*. That was a great time for those backstage musicals.
*Cabaret has a different story for me. grandmama loves the movie and my mother thought it was indecent for a little girl to be watching, but i loved Judy Garland and grandmama said Liza sounded just like her, so of course i really wanted to see it, so grandmama let me watch it all the time, b/c i had gotten hooked on it at her house, but momma never knew about it for the longest time.....heehee! momma found out later and laughed it off.*
Well good for grandmama!
*Cabaret* has a lot going on beneath the service. There is a building tension in that film that matches the time period in which it was set. The stage numbers are all very well done and I think it is probably Liza's best film. The song done off stage at the Biergarten by the young Nazi boy is very chilling and portends the coming nightmare. The film has it's lighter moments too, but I think it's a very dark film. Liza plays Sally in a "unique" kind of way but it really works for her and the film. The stage choreography is very memorable. Your grandmama is right, Liza sounds a lot like her mom. It's too bad she didn't do more musicals but the times were against her on that one.
*the last song of Easter Parade gives you goosebumps doesnt it? heehee! it always gves me goosebumps b/c i love it so much! did you like Annie Miller's dance routine of "Shakin' the Blues Away"? How about that medley judy and freddy sing together!?*
Yes I really like that closing number. It leaves you feeling good. I did like Ann Miller as well. She was something else. I finally got around to watching *Reveille with Beverly* the other day and was really impressed with her screen presence and dynamism at so early an age. The Judy and Fred medley was great! Two master showman at work there.
*i always love when Virginia O' Brien pops out to sing a song or two. i think they called her "Miss Red Hot Frozen Face". i love it! she did great in Panama Hattie with Lena Horne, even though they didnt sing a duet...i dont think i could picture that actually. heehee!*
Virginia O'Brien has become a big favorite of mine. I always like it when she shows up in a film. The one exception being *The Show-Off* where she is so under utilized that it's downright depressing. They called O'Brien by a lot of nicknames. The "diva of deadpan" is a another good one. I really like *Panama Hattie* it has a little of everything. Lena Horne was wonderful. A duet with O'Brien though? I think you're right some questions are best left unanswered.
Though on second thought....*oh larry, you have to see A Star is Born!! the Judy version is a very emotional one with the best music. Judy and James Mason did a great job with the supporting cast. i still think Judy should have gotten the oscar for it. she really did deserve it. her performance was phenomenal.*
It's very high on my list. When I see it I will write about it and let you know so you can comment. Yes I think it was such a shame that Judy didn't win that year.
I like a lot of other musicals. I hope we can ramble about them as well as the ones on my list at length in the near future. I already have some ideas.
So was Greer ever in a musical??
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*Larry, right after you go out and buy that hat (which, incidentally, will*
*be all starchy stiff and clean so you will have to go outside and kick*
*it around in the dirt, stomp on it, take a bit out to the rim and sit on it*
*a few times before it will be a proper cowboy hat), I hope you'll join*
*the ramble.*
Hi there April!
Hey if we are talking *Rio Bravo*, I'll be there. I love that film. Now where can I find that hat?
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*I'm looking forward to THE GOOD FAIRY tonight. Haven't seen it in ages. Shall we ramble about it tomorrow?*
Hi Barb,
I recorded it. I will try to watch it in the next couple of days. I've been so busy with my pooka that I've fallen way behind here. I'll catch up eventually. By golly!!
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and how are you Mr. Grimes.
*Molo wrote: Sadly, It's been all down hill from there.*
*Frank wrote: And those words are perfect for this film.*
*Molo wrote: Interesting. What do you mean by that?*
*Frank wrote: I believe one of themes of Harvey is that as we become "responsible" adults, we* *lose sight of all the many beautiful things in life. We get caught up in our responsibilities.*
*As Elwood says, "I don't know. I just don't seem to have the time any more. I have so*
*many things to do." In otherwords, it's all downhill.*
Oh I get it. I think I can definitely relate to Elwood on that.
*I believe you are absolutely correct about Elwood's melancholy. He's happy to see*
*Ruth and Lyman coming together. He wanted them to come together. He saw*
*their love for each other despite Lyman not seeing it. But immediately after smiling*
*over Ruth and Lyman, he feels personal pain. He leaves the bar, looking for "Harvey."*
*Harvey is his way of fighting off his loneliness, his unhappiness.*
Yes, That's what I got out of it. He lets his mind wander a little bit. He catches himself and he thinks immediately of Harvey.
*I really like Miss Kelly's saying, "We shouldn't have left him alone!" What she means*
*is that Elwood is escaping. But we know the real meaning behind those words.*
Yes we do.
*This will lead us into the darker side of the story: depression.*
*I also believe Harvey would never leave Elwood. He is his and his alone.*
I find it interesting that Elwood is always introducing people to Harvey and trying to bring them in on the deal, so to speak. Dr. Chumley is the only person we ever see that actually takes him up on the offer, but I get the feeling he doesn't quite get it. He doesn't want anyone to know he sees Harvey. He's afraid. He's not really open to the whole concept. I could never see Harvey staying with him. I think you have a point there that Harvey is uniquely Elwood's. I would be curious what others think about it.
*I actually believe Dr. Sanderson was correct. I think Elwood fell into a depression*
*after his mother died. That changed him. He felt alone. This is part of the dark side*
*of Harvey, for me.*
I agree that the death of Elwood's mother affected him greatly. As Veta said he was a great homeboy, he loved his home. Our home is often our emotional center. It's where things are familiar. Most importantly it's where the people are that we love most and that is what really makes a home. When his mother died Elwood lost a big part of his world. He had a hole in his life, a void, that he needed desperately to fill.
*I find it interesting as to when Harvey came to be.*
*Why did Elwood tell this story to explain how and when Harvey came to be?*
I have been tossing this one back and forth for a while. Why do you make me do that Frank?
I'm not sure I have a good answer yet. I know you have something cookin' in your mind about this.
All I know is that Elwood must have felt very alone at that point. I said earlier that I thought he felt so low that he may have actually wished Harvey into existence.
Maybe that's why I always had such hopes for it.
So what you got cookin' there Frank?
*Elwood is accepted by all until he introduces them to Harvey. Once he tells people*
*about Harvey, most disregard him, many are horrified. This speaks to social*
*norms. Many of us have "pookas." Some are considered worse than others. It*
*just depends on what society and culture in which we dwell. This is what I was*
*getting at with relativity. In a crazy house, it's the sane person who is "abnormal."*
I so understand this. As an overly anxious person myself, who on their best days can be considered "functionally neurotic" my perception of "normal" is also a little skewed in a different direction than most. I always tell my more normal friends that us neurotics have the jump on so called "well adjusted" people because we know something's up. Not really sure what that means but I like to say it.
Anyway I believe in what you said there.*I agree with you. I believe Harvey represents our hopes and dreams. He is whatever*
*we wish him to be. "What a coincidence."*
Indeed.
*I don't think it's a nightmare, but I believe there is some real sadness behind it*
*all. We are to take inventory, which is a good thing.*
Well I guess we can't be truly happy unless we truly know sadness. This seemingly light and simple tale isn't really so simple after all. It speaks to what is really at the heart and essence of living. I think that is why it touches us so.
*As for the meaning of "The same people seldom come back but that's... that's envy,*
*my dear. There's a little bit of envy in the best of us. And that's too bad, isn't it?"*
*That's one I have struggled with. But I think it has to do with inner peace. We all*
*have our moments of envy, and these moments often lead us to feel bad about*
*ourselves and our lives. I believe Elwood was envious of Miss Kelly and*
*Dr. Sanderson after he saw them dancing together. It even gets the best of us.*
I really think seeing Sanderson and Miss Kelly finally happy together warmed Elwood's heart but also brought out some of his regrets for what time takes away from us. There will always be a little envy and regret, even in genuinely goodhearted people like Elwood.He always speaks very philosophically about such things. It's the wisdom of an "old soul".
*And, as fate would have it, I actually had a Harvey moment yesterday.*
For a moment I thought you were going somewhere else with this.
*He was holding a conversation with himself. Oddly enough, I didn't*
*think of him as crazy. Instead, I felt a sadness for him. And then I actually*
*smiled, thinking about Harvey and pookas. It was rather an interesting moment.*
I'm glad you remembered Harvey at that time. Hey, who really knows what's going on out there?
*My second favorite character in the film was Aunt Ethel.*
Now there you surprise me Frank. I like Aunt Ethel but I didn't really give her that much thought.
So who is your favorite character?
*What I find so interesting about Aunt Ethel is that she likes Elwood before Harvey.*
*Are we to discern that Elwood was always a pleasant chap?*
Interesting, yet another clue to Elwood's past. It's possible but maybe she would have liked Elwood no matter what kind of person he was. We don't know much about the kind of person she was either.
*Movieman1957 (Chris) wrote: I especially liked Mrs. Chumley. She herself does not judge Dowd but makes the most of their unusual conversation by enjoying it for the pleasant banter it is.*
*Frank wrote: I also liked her a lot. And I believe she's actually one of the most tragic figures in*
*the film*
Ah Frank, I was thinking the same thing! It must be all those noir films.
My reason was it seemed like she was a beautiful person kind of trapped there. She was being neglected in life and somewhat stunted by her position.
Oh well.
There are still some points you brought up that I want to get to, the relationships and such, but I will close for now.
Thanks for all the great comments.
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Hi there Kathy,
Thanks for answering that. I think it has to be one of those things.
You brought up some good points. I'll get to them eventually.
*Ok.... that's my meandering musings on the matter... hope they made at least a little sense. And if not.. It IS late.. and I am an old worn out woman... so try not to hold it against me... ha.*
Reminds me of something:
I think we both can relate.
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Hi smoothJAZ
I don't think your question is too trivial at all.
The song is called: The Every Thought of You and according to the credits it was written by Reid Hall and Chuck Moore.
I got that from the end credits of the show as I had a recording of it. I can't find the name of the vocalist though.
Welcome to the boards!
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Hi Lynn,
*I think it's possible that Elwood had a nervous breakdown due to the stresses of his job and the loss of his mother.*
I think it is quite possible that Elwood did have some kind of breakdown. I also have noticed several people pointing to the loss of his mother. I agree that this could have been a turning point for Elwood.
In the first scene at Chumley's Rest, when Veta is being interviewed by Sanderson, she brings this up.
but just seconds later, in the same scene, Veta suggests that their mother may have knew about Harvey as well.
Does anyone have any thoughts as to why that line may have been included? Is Veta just making an assumption or misremembering?
*Was he always trying to live up to his mother's high standards or did she try and get him to stop and smell the roses but he always thought he would have time for that later? (We always think there will time enough later when we are older, retired, etc to do the things we keep putting off because of work and every day life.)*
Well, this is all just theory of course, but I like to speculate. It's also possible that Elwood could have witnessed his mother's own regrets at the time of her death. The things she wanted to do but never did. She may have even asked Elwood to take time off and spend more time with her, maybe take her traveling, and Elwood was too busy to do so. This would have certainly caused him to lapse into a greater depression. Death has a way of bringing us quickly around to what matters most in life.
*We also have to remember that treatment for a breakdown was much different than it is today.*
Shock treatment and such was very popular then wasn't it? The idea was also to make a person stop behaving that way, to conform, that was very important.
*And there is the time and context of the film, the 1950s. As I've said before, it's the era of the Man in the Gray Flannel Suit, putting your nose to the grindstone and giving your all for the company. Add to that the need for material things after years of the Depression and the rationing of the War. They didn't necessarily need all those shiny new appliances, cars, fashion, etc but on some level, they were very desired. Especially if you belong to an old family that has fallen on hard times and is trying to regain their former social standing.*
I think that is a very good point. A definite theme of the film. Status and conformity. Elwood is bucking the system. Veta can't understand why Elwood would want to give it all up. He could have a respected position in the community if he only wanted it.
*I think Harvey grew out of Elwood's need to cope with the fact that he didn't want to return to that life. That decision must have been incredibly hard for Elwood as he was likely the main source of money for the family. He would be letting down not only himself but his family as well.*
I think also that Elwood just needs to cope, period. I think something happened, we have discussed numerous possibilities, that made Elwood turn away from the normal way. It's like someone having a continuous anxiety attack, they have to find a way to cope. Elwood is calm and pleasant, but there is also something of sadness and regret in him.....
*But weighed against the trauma of a life that had brought him such despair, Elwood decided instead to break with the conventional wisdom of the day and in doing so became the local, lovable eccentric.*
I like that you used the word trauma. It's a strong word but I think something strong certainly happened to bring Harvey around. I also think that Elwood understands well the trauma that sometimes comes with just trying to make it day to day in our own skins. I thought Elwood's reply in this scene was interesting.
Elwood has learned to focus on the good in life. His mind wonders sometimes but he seems to have a wisdom about him, a wisdom of something very old, that puts it all in perspective.
*Being oh so smart only brought Elwood a lot of pain, being oh so pleasant has brought him a world of happiness.*
Yes, or at least as much happiness as he can possibly hope for. Elwood has definitely found a better way.
*People can tell their dreams, their hopes, their desires to Elwood because after all, he's harmless. They may envy him on some level for being able to ditch all the things that society says you must do to be considered successful. Many of the people drinking with Elwood and Harvey would likely love to get off the gravy train so to speak but they all lack the one thing Elwood has, courage to do so.*
That was very nicely said and I agree. Just one other point, which I've made before. Some of us can never get off that gravy train because we have to make a living to survive. Elwood doesn't have to worry so much about material things and he has Veta to look after the day to day affairs. I don't want to take anything away from Elwood or the wonderful theme of the play though. I said before, it is something we can aspire to, even if we can't completely take Elwood's path. The world is always with us. We can however, strive to be oh so pleasant rather than oh so smart.
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*THAT hat.... WHAT were they thinkin' ??? Ha... (All registered voters... please cast your vote... and PS.... ONLY ONE vote per human being, if you please.)*
I like that hat. John Wayne wouldn't wear a bad hat. Not only do I like that hat, I want to buy that.....
Oh wait a minute! That's the same thing I said last time you asked this question.
Seriously,
It's kind of a cool look. Pretty sharp looking on Wayne. Kind of goes with the character. I vote for the hat.
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*Chris wrote: I especially liked Mrs. Chumley. She herself does not judge Dowd but makes the most of their unusual conversation by enjoying it for the pleasant banter it is.*
*Rohanaka wrote: Chris... thanks for bringing up Mrs. Chumley... I really liked that little conversation. She is so congenial and seemed genuinely kind... she COULD have been played much differently. But I liked that angle a lot. I love when she asks her chauffeur... "Did he say, Pooka?" :-)*
Hi,
Just a quick comment here. I so agree with both of you about the conversation with Mrs. Chumley (Nana Bryant). It is a delightful scene. I love the way that played out.
Just one little thing. It has always bothered me that Mrs. Chumley goes to all the trouble to look up the word "pooka" only to leave without taking just a minute to read it. Of course, we need that to happen so Wilson would look at it. I wonder if Harvey had something to do with that?
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I want to respond to everyone as soon as I can. This is a great discussion and I appreciate everyone taking there time to share their thoughts about *Harvey*.
Hi Kathy,
*Molo... I think it was your original post where you made a comment about liking the dialogue even if it was a bit "hokey". For me, I think it is ANYTHING but hokey... It is actually quite nicely written and very witty as well as rather poignant sometimes... YES ..there is a lot of "sentimentalism" in the middle of it all now and then... but that is ok too because it fits with the storyline so well.... but... Hokey... okey dokey if you want to call it that... I just didnt' see it that way...*
I didn't say it was hokey. I said Some cynics might find it all a little hokey but this cynic finds it all very insightful. That is a little defense mechanism I use sometimes in my postings, particularly way back then, when I'm worried the consensus might be against me. I just wanted to clarify that. I do agree with you, it is all beautifully written.
*So many times when you see a movie about someone having a relationship w/ an "invisible" character.. that person is always getting frustrated and running around trying to hide the fact that the invisible friend is there... or trying to explain away their conversations with that unseen person... Elwood never does this... because he KNOWS Harvey is there... To him Harvey is just as real as anyone else he is talking or relating to at the moment... so he treats Harvey that way. It's not HIS fault you can't see him. So he doesn't take any false responsibility to try and convince you. As far as Elwood is concerned... that would be like him trying to convince Harvey that YOU exist... and that would be a bit silly, now wouldn't it?*
That's a really good point. There is something in the way that Elwood is so open about Harvey and in telling others about him that strikes a certain reflexive feeling from the audience. Even though you know the story, you feel, especially in the early parts, a little uncomfortable for him when he brings up Harvey.
This is Veta's reaction. She knows Harvey is there and she may not like it, but she will talk to Elwood about it when she has too. What really bothers her is that he brings it up to other people. He kind of flaunts it, from her perspective. That really shames her. She wants it kept in the immediate family. It's like your typical crazy relative, you can deal with them just fine, but it embarrasses you, and makes you feel embarrassed for them, when they show themselves to be different out in public. We worry about them and ourselves.
I worry about Elwood. Even as I become comfortable with Harvey, I instinctively worry about how others might react. I think this was a point that Mary P. Chase was trying to get across. We have to understand that in Elwood's mind none of this matters. He knows what he knows. He is used to dealing with all this and he knows other people can be blind to it. They are the ones we should worry about.
*Which explains why Elwood was so at peace with himself and Veta was such a basket case.*
Exactly. She's so worried what others will think.
*I like what Miss G said way back when about how "Elwood places greater value on kindness than on smartness" And that "he thinks consideration of people other than himself is more important than self-importance". There are so many examples of this too... like how no matter HOW nasty anyone gets... (such as when Wilson gets VERY nasty in the bar..) Elwood never responds in kind... he sticks with "pleasant" because it works for him..*
That is such an interesting scene. Wilson is just the kind of person that worries me around Elwood. He sees Elwood as just another in a long line of nut cases. He even worries that Elwood is nuttier than most. He just can't understand why everyone is treating Elwood so delicately. He is not prone to too much contemplation on the matter. He's like a one man mob mentality as far as the issue of Elwood is concerned. Harvey even has a little fun with Wilson:
He has a job to do and he's doing it the best way he knows how. He only carries it so far though. Once Veta and, finally Elwood, are no longer his responsibility to worry about, he lets it go. Elwood is fine with that.
Veta...not so much...
What I like is that Elwood, unlike Veta, knows that Wilson is just the sort of person Myrtle Mae needs to be happy.
*And he always treats every conversation with anyone he meets as the most important thing he has to do at the moment... he talks with kindness and respect toward all... no matter what their station. (like the excon at the bar) And Konway87 mentioned Herman Schimmelplusser... I liked how he tells Elwood that "most folks just call him Herman". But Elwood follows up by calling him Mr. Schimmelplusser... (he calls everyone "mr or miss"... and shows admiration for all the work and ingenuity that went into the fence design... while everyone else in the world that passed through those gates never gave it a second thought.*
Yes Elwood is always respectful and he's always interested in people. Konway was so right in bringing up Mr. Schimmelplusser. I love that scene, and I did notice that Elwood refers to him as "Mr".
*Elwood notices a LOT of things everyone else is too busy to see... maybe THAT'S why Harvey took the time to introduce himself...*
Maybe so. I mentioned that I thought Elwood may have wished Harvey into existence. That isn't to say that Harvey isn't real, it's just that maybe Harvey knew Elwood really needed him.
You made some great points. I enjoyed reading your take on things. Keep it coming.
I'll be back later to reply to some of the other comments people are making.
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*Hey, where can a girl get a drink around here?*
You should head over to Charlie's at 12th and Main. You can join up with Elwood, Frank, Lynn and Harvey. They should be in their usual booth.
Just be warned though. They've been there for quite a while now, so I'm sure they're all pretty spiffed!
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*Molo wrote: Sadly, It's been all down hill from there.*
*Frank wrote: And those words are perfect for this film.*
Interesting. What do you mean by that?
Anyway,
I'm going to take a stab at a few things here and see if I hit on anything.
Frank what you wrote got me to thinking, which as you know, can be very dangerous!
I'll try to venture into the dark side of the story some, since I know that's where you are most comfortable.
There is a lot to talk about and I am only going to scratch the service tonight. I'll respond to some of your other comments later.
Well, Harvey and I sit in the bars, have a drink or two, play the jukebox. And soon the
faces of all...all the other people, they turn to mine and they smile. They're
saying, 'we... we don't know your name, mister, but you're a very nice fellow.' Harvey
and I... warm ourselves in all these golden moments. We've entered as strangers. Soon
we have friends. And they come over and sit with us, they drink with us, they talk to
us. They tell about the big, terrible things they've done... and the big wonderful things
they'll do. Their hopes and their regrets, their loves and their hates, all very
large... because nobody ever brings something small into a bar. And then... I introduce
them to Harvey. And he's bigger and grander than anything they offer me. And... and
when they leave, they leave impressed. The same people seldom come back, but
that's envy... envy my dear. There's a little bit of envy in the best of us. That's too
bad, isn't it?
*So what's your take on that monologue?*
This scene is where I think we really get a glimpse of what makes Elwood the way he is. He's reflective and there is more than a wisp of melancholy in his voice. Elwood walks out into the alley after watching Sanderson and Kelly begin their dance. He's looking for Harvey. We have heard him speak of being pleasant rather than smart, or of winning out over reality, but here he is asked a simple question.
He gives a very eloquent reply. He seeks out humanity, he basks in it's warmth, he listens to it's troubles, it's regrets, and it's dreams. Fortified by alcohol, no doubt, people will open up to him. What happens right before this scene is what I found interesting. He tells Kelly he hasn't danced in years, he even tells her of some of the old dances he used to do. there is also that look that he gives her and Sanderson.I get the feeling there is some regret in Elwood's mind.
It reminds me of this saying
The trouble with the rat race is that even if you win, you're still a rat.
Elwood seems to really understand that. He has taken himself out of the game that everyone else is playing. He knows that there should be something more, even if there isn't. He's found that something in Harvey. When Harvey is with Dr. Chumley, Elwood seems a little lost, he needs Harvey.
*I do believe the film is about acceptance. I also got the sense of inner*
*peace, the joy of life, and allowing others to seek their own happiness. It's funny as to*
*what comes to represent "normal" in life.*
I really think you are on to something with that inner peace comment. I think Elwood is doing what he can to find peace in a very harsh world. Maybe something happened in Elwood's past to make him want to get away from life's anxieties, to rise above the mundane, to wish something so badly that he attracted the attention of a six foot three and half inch pooka. Or maybe he's just wiser than we are. I can't get around the fact that he was on this path even before he met Harvey. He also drinks a lot, which is one of the most popular ways to escape. Whatever his reasons, he seems to know that without fantasy or escape or dreams there isn't much of a point to all this.
That is something even Veta can understand in her heart, even if she can't open up to it in life.
*That is one of the most important pieces of dialogue spoken in the film and it's*
*fascinating that it comes from Veta. Our dreams do carry us on. Many of us dream*
*of the same things, but our paintings are different. We are the same but different.*
Exactly, that is a big theme here, there is a definite message about acceptance. There is also, as you said. a point about accepting one's own self. You can't cope if you can't do that. Elwood seems to be coping the best way he can. While he engages socially with people whenever he is able to, he has separated himself from them at the same time. Like Kathy and April were saying earlier, Harvey serves as a means of keeping Elwood apart. He is always trying to introduce people to his pooka and bring them in, but as he says: most people are blind. They can't appreciate what Elwood has and that keeps him and Harvey on the outside looking in.
Getting back to the monologue. So people tell Elwood everything and he offers them Harvey. Harvey represents the most important thing in life. Our dreams. Only Harvey can take our dreams to the next level. He can allow us to live our dreams. We know Harvey is mischievous, is Elwood better off with his pooka? I have to believe he is.
But there is a dark side to it, isn't there?
Now see what you've done Frank? You've taken my nice little mood brightening film and turned it into a potential nightmare! Thanks.
I'm going to throw this back at you.
What do you think Elwood means here. Is he thinking of himself? Is he envious of Sanderson and Kelly? Does he miss the game a little? I am reminded of that look on his face as he watches them dance. He is smiling, and then he starts to think, but quickly he remembers Harvey, and he gets up and leaves.
I think this scene is very telling and kind of sad:
So anyway I made it down here to 18th and Fairfax.
Where did everybody go?
Frank?.....Kathy?....Lynn?
Oh wait, who is that over there?.......
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I guess we're both waiting for the rumpot.
Hey! Is that me??? Why I haven't been spiffed in hours!!
Kathy, that was hilarious.
Veta and I actually did get sidetracked on our way down to 18th and Fairfax!
Talk about spiffed!!
Have you guys ever taken a good look at what she carries around in that pocketbook?
Oh I kid Veta, but seriously, I'm so sorry for being so late to my own rumble...I mean ramble.
I have a pocketful of excuses!!!
It's a work thing! I'll be finished hopefully tomorrow. I really want to reply to Frank while it's all still fresh for me.
Did you see Lynn down there?
Was she spiffed too??
A thousand pardons!! I'll be down at the corner tomorrow night I promise. Really!
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Oops! Sorry Rayallen, I didn't see your post. I should realize that when I'm writing one of my longwinded replies I should check to see if others have already answered the question.
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If you are referring to the Jack Davis that appeared in the original *Our Gang* silent shorts, I don't think he did any work during that period. I remember reading in one of the books on the series that when Harold Lloyd married the boy's sister Mildred Davis, the first thing he did was send young Jack off to military school. I always thought that was a little strange.
Anyway that little tidbit, along with the fact that he went on to become a Doctor is all the information I can find about him. There is his filmography at IMDB which I'm sure you have checked out. He was quite active according to that listing. It seems a little odd that he would work in films as much as he did since that he was a Physician. Maybe a Harold Lloyd biography would offer more details.
; *Jack Davis*
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0204733/
Message was edited by: molo14
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Thanks to an earlier post in this thread I can say for sure that I last watched *Harvey* on April 25th of last year. I'm going to go watch it again right now, just for a refresher.
If anyone else (Lynn?, April?, anyone?) wants to go ahead and jump in please do. Frank has started the ball rolling. Kathy, I hope you can get a copy.
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Other Favorites: Are they supporting actors or character actors?
Is there a difference?
Agnes Moorehead---------Billie Burke------------------ Alice Brady ------------Jean Hagen
Eugene Pallette------------Rags Ragland-------------William Demarest----------Guy Kibbee
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*Truthfully, I'm not all that certain that some of the actors on my list would be considered "supporting actors."*
I agree it's a fine line with some.
Two of my all time faves had their moments in lead roles but most often were in supporting parts.
Two of the very best:
Jack Carson and Gloria Grahame
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*Are you ready to break this movie down, Molo? Anyone else? I've got PLENTY to say.*
Are you challenging us to a Harvey ramble Frank?
You hear that Lynn?
I'm up for it. Anybody else?
Let's all meet down at the corner of 18th and Fairfax and settle this thing once and for all!
*Come'on Veta!*
Seriously, I'll be back later!
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I'm afraid my poor Uncle Elwood is a bit too long in the tooth to do much bending these days, but from the stories I've heard, he certainly used to. He probably would be flattered.
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I'm not having much luck with my rambles. I settled down to watch *Night Must Fall* last night, only to discover it was the 1964 version. That means I don't even have the 1937 version, like I thought I did. I have a large stack of dvdrs I need to finalize and label. Somewhere in there is *A Tree Grows in Brooklyn*. I'm going to work on that tonight.
I decided not to watch the 1964 version of *Night Must Fall* and ended up watching another Roz and Bob flick called *Live, Love and Learn*. I've seen *A Kiss Before Dying* and remember liking Wagner's performance but it's been too long since I've seen it to comment in depth.
Anyway , I've been enjoying what everyone else has to say, while being careful to avoid spoilers. I've seen both *Night Must Fall* and *A Tree Grows in Brooklyn* but it's been so long ago that I don't remember all the details. I'll be back on track shortly.
I know you are all just on the edge of your seats about all this aren't you?
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I'm trying to keep with the idea that it's a name which no one you knew ever had.
I am stumped. Harvey just seems right. I considered Thaddeus, Godfrey, and even Elwood, but I have an uncle named Elwood.
I can't wait to finally catch you on the screen. I keep missing the promos.
Western Movie Rambles
in Westerns
Posted
*BUT..... that MOLO.... WHERE could he be???? I am keeping my "wagon" close by... Just in case I need to break out my "persuasive" peacemaker tools....*
WESTERN UNION TELEGRAPH CO. MARCH 31ST
LOCATION: GRIME'S REST, USA TERRITORY
DESTINATION: RIO BRAVO, TEXAS ------------------TO: ASSEMBLED RAMBLERS
MAKING SLOW PROGRESS STOP GOT LOST IN GRIME'S PASS STOP RAN INTO
LITTLE TROUBLE NEAR GODDESS FALLS STOP GUEST OF SHERIFF LAST NIGHT STOP
MYSTERIOUS LADY PICKED UP MY TRAIL SOUTH OF COLD ROPE STOP PROCEEDING CAUTIOUSLY STOP ARRIVING TOMORROW PROMISE STOP
FROM: THE MOLO KID----------------------FORM NO.14