FrankGrimes

Awwww. Like Tramp! Push that meatball over to my plate. You just made me smile, Bronxie. What's so perfect about what you said is that you would ask me to push the meatball over to you. That's very you. But are you a "Lady," Bronxie?

More like mutt.

I think Tracy's career didn't necessarily take the most artistic route. Had he stayed for a long haul at Warners or freelanced sooner he might have carved a different niche and done more noirish, complex roles he was capable of. But he had a family to support and for whatever other reasons, chose to make going to work as comfortable an ordeal as possible. MGM was a good studio for that and they respected him enough to provide him with their considered best roles, mostly patriarchal and authoritative and soon the public came to regard him (still does) as something like what's carved on Mount Rushmore. Tracy is a cerebral actor. His performances tend to be very intellectual and I appreciate them on that level. He rarely affects me emotionally, though. Bogie and Sinatra affect me emotionally, hence I like them more. Bogie and Frankie were more apt to be scrappy about their career decisions, and, of course, Bogie was provided with ample scrapping opportunities with Jack Warner as his boss. Frank was at Metro, too, but when his music career dove into the can it may have been one of the best things ever to happen to him because when he came back he came back more of an artist and less willing to compromise. I'm sorely lacking in knowing and understanding the off-screen stories of performers, so I thank you for the knowledge, Teach.

I'm most definitely a dog, Bronxie. I don't think I'm a border collie, though.

I never thought about it that way but it's true. Spence is maintaining the facade, until it's time for the character to crack, but he was often cast in somewhat authoritative roles which didn't always give him leeway to crack. Maybe that's why I find him so awesome in Fury and Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde because we get both in one role. Tracy's manic performance as Jekyll & Hyde is definitely one of my favorites of his. He really lets loose in that film. Tracy was an actor's actor, a true professional, a perfectionist. This doesn't always work with me because I feel it's too sharp, too fine. Bogie and Sinatra's performances often feel more real to me. They are more regular guy to me. Frank was a loose cannon but learned remarkably well how to contain his emotional power in scenes, saving stuff for the right moment. I like his quiet moments best because I can never tell just when the explosion's going to come but I know it's gotta come at any moment. I've been very impressed by Sinatra's ability to turn the emotional switch on and off. One second he is effectively boiling and the next he's drowning in his own emotional pain. This is the biggest reason why I like Sinatra as an actor. He possessed exceptional emotional range. Not bad for a "crooner." He has a weary, ravaged face, too---all three did and those are great "acting faces" to have. Excellent observation and point. Bogie's face really lent itself to his playing the cynical, tough guy roles. He was no pretty boy, and I think this is why many guys cite Bogie as one of their favorites.

Hiya, Ava -- yes i do agree alot of ppl did not consider him a great actor or maybe even a good actor..but u know what i say... so what...i mean hes FRANK SINATRA!......lol.....my point is that was not his cup of tea....i think he prooved he could do it...which i know he wanted to do..and as i said he prooved it by winning the award Frankie's legendary singer status will always overshadow any of his other accomplishments, but I really do like him as an actor. which btw if it wasnt for AVA...heehee...he never would have even gotten the role if it wasnt for her..She made the call to the director and she begged to please give Frank the role role, being Ava Gardner well she did have mega clout.....lol....he obliged Ava and Frank not only got the roll but he kiiled it...and won the award...cool story huh? I didn't know this. Thank you for the lesson. I need quite a few, by the way. Love conquers all....heehee Most of the time. BTW.......loooooove those pics ...are those from Man with the golden Arm or Pal Joey...i know Kim was in Pal Joey..but i think she was in The Man with the golden arm to...so i think there from that am i right? Yes, the caps are from The Man with the Golden Arm. Bonjour, Missy G -- Oh my goodness! Did you finally watch The Man with the Golden Arm??????? After such a reaction as that, I'm now wishing that I had. It looks like I've got another film to watch. I may need to watch it after I watch a certain trashy film. Frank would have been honored to be compared to Bogie, because I think he learned the most about the craft from him and Spencer Tracy. I didn't know this, either. Bogie wore anguish so well and the Sinatra films I have seen to date have him playing characters with great anguish, and I feel he wears it similarly well. I think Sinatra's delivery is also similar to Bogie. He's rather quick and emotional; very choppy. Spencer Tracy has a smooth flow. Even though Tracy's characters may turn emotional, he remains in complete control of his dialogue. I prefer Bogie and Frank's spittin' style, although I greatly admire Tracy. I've often flet that had he concentrated on acting instead of music, he could have been up there with those guys more consistently. But I wouldn't sacrifice his music for anything so I guess he made the right choice after all. Quite possibly.

The Lady from Shanghai is another favorite of mine that features a forboding narration. Fools know they are being fooled. That's what makes them fools.

Hey there, Ava! -- I do agree that he was underrated but also keep in mind he won the acadamy award for From Here To Eternity, so i feel he was appreciated as well as The Man With The Golden Arm was great...i looved him in Guys and Dolls to....Sooooo many good ones.. I'm not sure how many people in the classic film community consider Sinatra to be a good actor. It's rarely said. Of the films I have seen him in, he has reminded me of Humphrey Bogart, and I love Bogie.

My feelings are that "Rebecca" and "Now Voyager" are two films that deal with common female insecurity issues, making them very popular with the ladies. Very well said, Tiki. I wholeheartedly agree with you. I also believe the popularity of the film is very much due to the popularity of the novel. "Rebecca" is a book many women have read and will read for years to come. Rebecca is a solid Hitch film for me. I like the gothic look and atmosphere of the film, Joan Fontaine's emotional peformance, and the supporting peformances by Judith Anderson, George Sanders, and Florence Bates. I'm not into the story that much and Laurence Olivier doesn't do much for me in the film. I also don't consider Rebecca to be a true Hitch vision. I wish that it were.

Most certainly. That's probably why I tend to most admire the work of directors who started out in silents (even though I love "talky" pictures, too). I actually love silent sequences in talkies a lot. "Silence" draws me in. Unspoken languages often affect me more than spoken ones. The Searchers is full of unspoken language. In fact, I believe the unspoken language is much better than the spoken. I think those who don't like The Searchers tend to be those who don't hear such languages that well. They value the spoken more. "Laurie" is the character in the film whose spoken language affects me the most.

Fascinating! So Ford did take the dramatic closing scene from the book, it's just that the scene comes earlier in the book. Not much earliler, this was in the last chapter. Ahhhhh... very good. SPOILER!!! And it was right at that moment that Martie fatally plugs him because he thinks the girl is Debbie, too, and that Amos is going to kill her. Wow! That's quite a different ending. I definitely like Ford's more. His is more poetic. The reason I say I kind of like LeMay's ending with Martie/Debbie is because of the way it's written. It's quite haunting and beautiful but simple. In fact, so's the whole book. I'm very glad to have read it. You are glad to have read a fictional book, eh? I'll have to file that one away for future reference. And yes, I think the right "look" was extremely important to Ford. He saw things like a painter would. I believe the greatest directors value the look and feel of their film above else.

I've started to notice how Ford sometimes picks actors for their physicality. The way they move, stand, use their whole bodies, not just their faces or dialogue to convey emotion. That's why you often see important emotional moment played by a performer with their back to the camera, with an averted or even completely hidden face...Sometimes these postures can be more moving than a closeup of an anguished face which is what less creative directors would choose to do. I haven't seen nearly enough Ford films to make a worthy comment on such a thing, but you most definitely can and I have noticed what you speak of. One thing you have written about Ford and Maureen O'Hara is that he really liked her eyes more so than her ability at the outset. That tells you Ford sought a look and feel for his films. One other thing I noticed in the book that was interestingly transferred to the movie: during the raid on Scar's village Ethan/Amos is chasing the Indian girl he thinks is Debbie (he's on horseback and she's running) and he has his gun on her and just as he's about to pull the trigger, the book says he "unexpectedly" switches the gun to his rein hand and reaches out to pluck up the girl. The girl turns out to be an Apache maid, not Debbie, but how interestingly this turned into the chase into the cave! Fascinating! So Ford did take the dramatic closing scene from the book, it's just that the scene comes earlier in the book.

That's one spell I don't intend to ever give you the antidote to. We'll see about that. Simple but effective. One could say the same about John Wayne, although I'm starting to believe his performances were complex more so than simple. Can you elaborate? Because I'm not sure if I agree. And I don't mean that disparagingly to his acting prowess, it's just that I think his straightforward characters are very effective, as much as another actor's more complex ones. Just different. But if I'm missing something I'd like to know. On the surface, Wayne's performances in Ford films look to be very straightforward, but I believe there's much more beneath the surface. It's one thing for Wayne to say, "that'll be the day," or "pilgrim," it's another for him to display emotion and, more importantly, hide emotion. Wayne's characters don't always speak what they feel. They are emotionally hiding and I think Wayne shows this with his acting. My appreciation for his abililty as an actor has soared for this very reason. I give a lot of credit to Ford for extracting this from Wayne, too.

You have seen every Pride and Prejudice, ButterscotchLIZA? Could you talk about what you like and dislike about each of them. I have yet to see any of them nor do I plan on watching any of them, but I'd love to hear your opinions.

I finally finished reading The Searchers last night. It's about time! I've read three books in the same amount of time. What kind of books? I shall not say or know. I like the ending ...and this is a major SPOILER for anyone who plans to read the book....which is rather romantic because Martie ends up with Debbie while Laurie (poor thing) married Charlie MacCorry after all. Haw haw haw! That's very interesting on many levels, although it could be viewed as creepy, too. As good as the book is, and it's very good, I can appreciate how Ford turned it into something great. He is vastly more wise at handling and developing character than LeMay was. LeMay provided a great "skeleton" and a trace work for interesting characters. Ford added dimensions and layers that LeMay apparently never dreamed of. From what you have shared with us about the book, I totally agree with you. Surprising, non? Ford's The Searchers is very layered and exceptionally rich, especially character-wise. What I'm most impressed by with Ford is how carefully developed his characters are, especially from an emotional point of view. Okay, now remove the spell from me. Free me! It's quite remarkable how much of the dialogue in the movie was lifted straight from the book. That is rather remarkable considering the changes Ford made. But the 'signature' line that Wayne speaks is not in the book: "That'll be the day" Simple but effective. One could say the same about John Wayne, although I'm starting to believe his performances were complex more so than simple.

What's up, Liveliest Gal in Town -- You're a big troublemaker, CineBabe. That's why I like you, girl. Thanks for the love, Love. Hi, Ava -- I'm curious to see some of Frankie's films in May. I like Sinatra as an actor. I think he's underrated.

Let's Play One Hundred Sixty Two, ChiOuch! -- Dear Frank-We-Wish-the-Cubs-Could-Play-the-Bucs-All-Season-Grimes: So does every other team in the league. Unlike many of your so-called friends, I have not participated in this sleazy little game of torturing you. Thanks for the friendship... and the knife in my back. Friends don't torture, they kill quick. I now, as a friend and compatriot, turn to you for advice. If you are turning to me for advice, you are bleeding from the head. One should never turn to a dead man for advice. Which one of the following classes should I take this summer at Facets Multimedia? Ingmar Bergman: Scenes from a Marriage and Beyond Watch the Skies!: Science Fiction, 1950's and Us Ford at Fox: The Emergence of a Hollywood Master Silent Shadows: The Films of F.W. Murnau Damn you! You are a lucky S.O.B.! A man with a lovely wife and lovely daughters should not be allowed to have his film cake and eat it, too. No way. You know darn well what my knee-jerk selection would be. I don't even have to tell you. What I'd like to know is, how many Bergman, Ford (Fox), and Murnau films have you seen recently (last few years)? The reason I ask is because I think you would appreciate and gain the most from a class on the director you have seen the least of their work featured. In terms of your personal taste, I'd surely say Murnau. If this dead man's memory serves correctly, we both consider Murnau to be the greatest director in cinematic history. Murnau was also very influential on the kind of films we both like: visually dark. I don't see you being a Sci-Fi guy, but I could be very mistaken about this since you are someone who understands and values social and political allegories. The best part of that class would be its emphasis on how the Cold War helped launch the sci-fi genre in America. It's interesting how sci-fi can be viewed as both Left and Right. Without knowing the answers to some of my questions, I'm going to say Murnau is definitely the class for you, but I would not put it past you choosing the Ford class. I'd have to know what films are being shown in the Bergman class.. Hi, Lynn, dear! -- Anybody else want to throw in? So you are down with an F.W. Murnau film class?

Yes it does. And I shall cry into my pillow tonight over his treacherous behavior toward us.

I think "LIZA" has something to say about you both...

What's the score, Molo -- I found both Earle (Robert Ryan) and Johnny (Harry Belafonte) to be sympathetic at their lowest moments, but they both turned to arrogance and anger when confronting their emotional pain, thusly pushing them away from their women and us, the audience. I can see that. In Earle (Ryan) particularly because he just has that look of a beaten man. Johnny's actions in the club after he's roughed up when he goes on stage while the lady's singing just kind of made me say "what a jerk" "pull yourself together and do something about it", but I say the same thing about people I know today. Life and people just don't work that way. It's important to "get that". The pain is very human and understandable but the way they react to it is harder to understand but it's no less real and must be considered. I completely agree with you. I think many people make the mistake of thinking all characters in film should act and behave as they would in a situation. I don't like to view films this way, though. I find it to be more compelling when characters are different than I. Sometimes when I'm watching a movie like this one I'll get stuck on one aspect and start pondering it and then miss something else important. Reading your comments has brought it back into focus for me. Ruth's actions are justified but I can see their effect on Johnny's frame of mind. That's a great point about Ruth playing the odds. Johnny wants to keep all of his joys in life (read: vices) but Ruth is telling him that he cannot do this. He must surrender his destructive side if he's to have a future with her and Eadie. If Johnny truly wanted to be with them, he could, because it's quite obvious that Ruth's door remains wide open for him. But Johnny is always looking for the quick fix, the easy way out. So you're a softy, Molo? Very good. A little bit. Not as much as you might think and mainly in private. What melts ole Molo's heart are damaged people, especially if they don't really know they're damaged. It's hard for me to explain. Gloria's Helen seemed like one of those people to me anyway. We're not that far off then. I tend to fall for girls who are hurting. I also like very emotional girls. Helen (Gloria Grahame) falls into the "hurting" class due to neglect. Strangely, that's not what attracts me to her. I'm very selfish when it comes to her. It's all sexual. You deserve to be with Gloria because of your concern for her. My mind is always in the gutter with Gloria. I'm using her just like Earle. She deserves better. Aw but Frank, maybe Helen but not the Gloria Grahame. She doesn't want concern. She knows where your mind is at and that's okay as long as it suits her. You may be right about that. I really haven't researched Gloria's life away from screen that much, so I don't have a good idea about her personality. Actually, I don't research the off-screen lives of any star. It just doesn't appeal to me. I believe this places me in the minority on this board. All I care about is their performances on the screen. Maybe you're more like Bogie while I'm more Franchot Tone. I dream of Grahame, Lupino, Russell and Sheridan but I'll probably end up with Alice Faye. I wish I were like Bogie. No, I'd be the sucker who gets used by any femme fatale that crossed my path. Although, I'd probably give it back pretty darn good after a while. It wouldn't be pretty. I like all of those dames, but Gloria takes the cake. Of the five you named, Ida Lupino is the one I'd love to be with the most, though. She was brilliant. At best I aspire to my main man Mitchum but he never quite gained the upper hand with his women did he? Does any man ever gain the upper hand with a woman? Anyway, I thought it was decided that Carole Lombard was your main squeeze. Of the actresses that attract me, she'd be the one I'd marry. I think she would be the best at providing stimulation (of all kinds), relaxation, friendship, loyalty, and love. Those are the most important things to me. Ciao, CineBabe -- You both write so well. Nope, I'm not sucking up. I've really been enjoying reading your exchange. Thanks, Lively Gal. Now, you've prettied up your talk on Double G becuz there are ladies reading this thread. So tell me...what are your REAL thoughts on Gloria Grahame. Gimme the locker room version. I've been on record as stating that Gloria Grahame equals sexuality to me. Her and Claudia Cardinale are the two actresses that bring out my sexual side the most. I really cannot place why Gloria does this to me other than to say she does. It's rather primal. If anything, it is how she looks at a man. Her looks speak a sexual language to me. It has nothing to do with her curves. Like I mentioned earlier on this thread and on other threads, I consider Grace Kelly to be the most beautiful actress ever with Gene Tierney a close second. They are more beautiful than Gloria Grahame. If all three were to walk into a room at the same time my eyes would immediately go to Grace first and then Gene then Gloria. But over the course of the evening, my eyes would slowly start to leave Grace, they would keep checking out Gene, and they would start to get cozy with Gloria. Eventually, my eyes would never leave Gloria. The unspoken language is heard and felt by both sexes and it pulls each in for various reasons. I hear and feel Gloria's unspoken language loud and clear. Well now, I think Frank had better go first. He's been busy down in the Films and Filmmakers forum flirting with all the ladies. Do wrongheaded, pushy, snippy girls qualify as "ladies"?

Time to clean your inbox out, Scott; it's a bit dirty. Sorry! I just wish y'all would stop sending me all these darn Coop photos. I get the point, he's a man who looks pretty in make-up. I agree with you!

Westerns are in costumes and have damsels in distress. And I love superhero stuff, which features silly costumes and damsels in distress. There's an edge to westerns that I don't believe exists in "swashies," and costumes do play a role in that. A guy just doesn't look all that tough wearing frilly stuff. And I don't want to read words like "dashing." Blah! The dashing "Ethan Edwards." The gallant "Skip McCoy." Such elegant men. Noirs just have men in distress. Damn straight. And what's usually the cause of those men in distress, Miss Femme Fatale? I think you just mean you don't like European costumes. That's very xenophobic of you. I like young French women in swimsuits.

That works for me. I'm all for badgering. Yes, Theresa and I have the marks to prove it! What are you talking about?! I'm nothing but a gentleman with you two. I call you the sweetest of names and I'm constantly giving you bouquets of compliments. I feel so unappreciated. So which other Tyrone Power have you seen, besides Nightmare Alley? The Razor's Edge, Silly Goose. As you know, I didn't like the film all that much because of Power's "Larry Darrell." I would have thought you'd jump to see Gene in a grass skirt. You would think, but I have held off and held off and held off. I've been too busy watching trashy films. The shame of it all. I have learned one thing though, you don't want Greer Garson to fall in love with you because she'll put an ocean between you and her. She's super frigid. The Mark of Zorro is on my radar. I wonder why... I can't see me getting into "swashies," as you call them. But who knows, I may be surprised. I wonder why, too. A certain Miss Darnell maybe? She's ravishingly beautiful in it, for sure. Now why did you have to say that to me? Damn you! Many guys like the swashies because of all the action (violence and blood! blood and swash!) and the ones I named are the most spectacular and well directed. The Mark of Zorro is extra good because Ty gets to play two characters, one that's so foppish he's hilarious and the other being the serious hero; so he gets to really act for a change at that point in his career. I'm just not into the costumey films that much and sword fighting just ain't that thrilling to me unless Darth Vader is the villain. I'm wondering if women like "swashies" a little more than men. It seems like they are very "damsel in distress" storybook stuff. Film noir, westerns, war, and horror pics are the classic films I tend to associate with men the most. Son of Fury just barely qualifies as a swashbuckler in my opinion. To me, it's more a historical drama and a good one. I will be entering my viewing thinking it's not a "swashie." I think I have only seen Nightmare Alley and The Razor's Edge. I do not like Ty's "Larry Darrell" except for his philosophy on life. I like Gene's character the best, and her Uncle Elliot. Ann Baxter is also very good. Gene is definitely my favorite in the film. She's the reason why I find the film to be okay. I also like Lucile Watson. Ty just looks gorgeous but he's very "remote". It's not an easy character to portray, and frankly the book doesn't make him any more defined or delineated. He seems more like a walking symbol of "the search for self" than a real person. The minute he goes on his journey, the film goes south for me. He basically becomes an empty suit to me. I love his philosophy on life, but my goodness, does he need to be such a bore? I enjoy "Isabel's" selfishness and childishness the most. I eat that kind of stuff up, especially from Gene. I loved your photo-quotes! I love when you do that.

I'm not so crazy about Nightmare Alley as most are. That doesn't surprise me in the least. You are too girly-girl to appreciate the dark. I find the most interesting characters to be Ian Keith and Joan Blondell's. Joan Blondell is my favorite in the film but I also like Coleen Gray, who reminds me of Sweet T. Without checking Ty's filmography (Goddess lazy), I think I have only seen Nightmare Alley and The Razor's Edge. I do not like Ty's "Larry Darrell" except for his philosophy on life. But then, I've only seen it once and I might like it more the next time. I guess because I found Ty's character very "cold" and I'm just not used to seeing him that way. A big component to film noir is the loss of self and mind, especially from a man's point of view. "Stanton Carlisle" is a shining example of such losses. I love the picture of Maureen O'Hara. I just love her wild hair. Perfect.

I have The Black Swan. It's a fun, entertaining swashie, full of humor and sassy lines between him and Maureen. I think they had great chemistry together. I love they way he badgers her to call him "Jamie boy" while she hates the very sight of him. Too funny. That works for me. I'm all for badgering. What did you think of Son of Fury? It's almost in the Pride and Prejudice category. There's even a fancy dress ball. I haven't watched it yet. I don't even have to tell you how I'm pathetic I am because you do a good job of reminding me of that fact. The BEST swashbuckler I've ever seen, though is Captain Blood. I like it even better than The Adventures of Robin Hood or The Sea Hawk, though they are great films, too, beautifully produced and superbly directed by Curtiz. Tyrone's best swashie was not in that set you bought, The Mark of Zorro. No one will ever be a better "Zorro" to me than Ty. The Mark of Zorro is on my radar. I wonder why... I can't see me getting into "swashies," as you call them. But who knows, I may be surprised.