misswonderly3
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Posts posted by misswonderly3
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8 hours ago, TomJH said:
Holst's "The Planets" has always been a great favourite of mine which I usually listen to at least once or twice a year (I'm overdue).
The Mars, Bringer of War opening always brings to my mind the vision of vast faceless armies on the march, ready to trample over anything in its way, while the later, gentler (Neptune, is it?) passage brings such a contrasting sense of peace and calm, as well as a vision for me of a sense of a twinkling eternity in the vast far reaching spaces of the solar system.
Well Tom, if you'd read my post about "The Planets" (it's the second one on the thread), you'd have seen that I mentioned "Neptune", saying it was my favourite of the pieces ( along with "Jupiter"), and that it was "mysterious". Although, as we all know, Neptune was the god of the sea, Holst seems to think he was also a mystic, which is how he titled the Neptune composition.
( At first I thought it was the "Saturn" piece, but I corrected myself in an edit in that same post.)
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38 minutes ago, mr6666 said:
This film is offbeat, with a psychological focus that some consider pretentious and theatrical, though it's certainly compelling. It's also certainly a film noir, with its seamy portrayal of doomed underworld characters and a fine supporting cast of noir stalwarts including Akim Tamiroff, Henry Morgan, Charles McGraw, and Elisha Cook, Jr. (Keep a lookout for Shelley Winters as a cashier.) ....Sounds fun to me !
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3 hours ago, TheCid said:
The Gangster, Sep. 29/30 feature. Read the Wiki synopsis and it sounds like it may be confusing. ImDB gave it 3 stars. Reviews say it leans towards artsy. Anybody seen it?
Often I have already seen the noirs Eddie airs on Noir Alley, ( which is just fine, I always like to see them again), but once in a while he shows one I'm not familiar with, and this is the case with The Gangster. It's kind of a treat for me to see a brand new noir ( brand new to me), so I'm looking forward to it.
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I love Holst's "The Planets" suite. I learned a bit about classical music from my parents, especially my father, who played from his classical record collection all the time. I remember him playing "The Planets" and talking to me about the different planet compositions, the personality, so to speak, of each planet. And as we know, the planets are named after Greek and Roman gods, so each musical piece kind of reflects the character of the god the planet is named after. My two favourites are "Jupiter", because it's so triumphant and happy sounding, and "Saturn", because it's mysterious and eerie.
It's not surprising this music has been used, either directly or via influencing sountrack composers, in movies.
By the way, Frank Zappa loved the "Planets" suite and made musical allusions to it sometimes.
edit: I was mistaken, it's not "Saturn" that's the "mysterious" piece, it's "Neptune" . (Aren't you all glad I corrected that? ?)
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2 hours ago, speedracer5 said:
...I am wondering what the significance of the song was that Simmons played on the piano throughout the film. I don't know if that was her meditation period where she contemplated her next move, or what exactly she was doing, but she played the same song each time....
Yes, good observation, speedy. The piano-playing thing is somehow significant. Like you , I knew it meant something, but couldn't quite figure out what.
For one thing, I think the filmmakers wanted the audience to first see Jean (Diane) in a sympathetic light, the more to fool us as to the true nature of her character. And I always find musicians sympathetic, or at least, I'm prepared to like them if only because they care about music. Also, the piece Diane plays is quite "soothing" and emotional in a melancholy sort of way; it reminded me of Chopin (1940s and '50s movie makers seemed to love that particular kind of piano composition...)
And also, it's not only the first the audience sees of Diane, it's Frank's (Robert Mitchum's) first sight of her too. So what he sees is a quiet young woman, perhaps trying to comfort herself by quietly playing the piano to cope with her step-mother's near-death (through accidental gas fire leakage, of course...yeah, right.)
Interestingly, this is not the first time Jean Simmons appears in a film as a troubled young pianist. Clouded Yellow, a really good little-known British noir made in 1950 (two years before Angel Face), also features at least one scene (I think more) showing Jean Simmons' character sitting at the piano and playing a melancholy tune when the male protagonist first encounters her.
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10 hours ago, David Guercio said:
For those of you who are TCM Backlot members. Did anyone have trouble with the volume on Facebook as you were trying to watch the Q&A session with Scott McGee and Gary Fieldman?
I think you might get more of a response if you posted this in the "TCM Backlot" forum. Here:
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On 9/22/2018 at 2:08 AM, Erika said:
Does this exist? Is it only available in the US? I am an avid TCM fan. Why can't I be a back lot member and be in Canada? I would love a T-shirt and a bag, to show my support.
Good luck with that, Erika. I looked into becoming a TCM Backlot member a few years ago, or whenever it first started. Not sure I would have joined, but just wanted more information about it to make a decision. However, I didn't get very far before I found out that Canadians, at least, Canadians living in Canada, cannot join.
And how about all those times TCM shows interesting and sometimes rare films, but they're blocked from airing in Canada? Some kind of "rights" issue. Very frustrating.
Hey, since you posted this there was that terrible tornado in the Ottawa area. Hope everything's ok.
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40 minutes ago, Hibi said:
I've seen The Stranger a dozen times probably, but watched it again, partly to hear Eddie's comments. The film reminds me in some ways of Hitchcock's Shadow of a Doubt. Both are set in small towns where nothing very bad could ever happen, but then something does. Someone from the "outside" world who brings with them the evil lurking out there.........
Yes ! Smart girl, Hibi ! I was thinking the very same thing, but didn't want to add to my already very long post about this film.
But yes, I too thought of Shadow of a Doubt while watching The Stranger. As you say, both films have a small town setting, with friendly ( and rather nosy) citizens. Both seem like "nothing very bad could ever happen", but then "something does". And "someone from outside" brings evil to the little town...
Also: in both films, the protagonist is female. And she's the opposite of a femme fatale, she represents decency and innocence. And each of these protagonists at first utterly loves and trusts the very person who brings evil to their sweet, supposedly safe, home. Both Mary and Charlie realize the terrible nature of their beloved gradually, at first refusing to believe it. And both of them have their lives put in jeopardy when the formerly trusted evil one realizes that the young woman who previously adored him is now on to him.
Of course, there's the difference of Mary's adored trusted villain being her husband, whereas "Charlie"'s is her uncle. So it's kind of worse for Mary, because of what I said earlier about how she has to deal with the fact that she's (presumably) been sexually intimate with this monster. Although the film does somehow get across the idea that their newly-wed sex life might not be so great....
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Loretta's character is too hysterical to take seriously. She always seems to be on the edge of a nervous breakdown.
Sagebrush said:
"I think that's what makes her performance good. She's trying to hide her gradual discovery of who her husband really is while also trying to convince herself and those trying to enlighten her that he isn't the man they are looking for."
I thought this aspect of The Stranger was the most interesting element of the film, and said so. Yes, as Vautrin points out, Loretta's character is "hysterical" and "seems to be on the edge of a nervous breakdown". But I would be too, if I were having to deal with the revelations about my new husband that she's having to deal with.
I think it's kind of in bad taste to quote oneself, but still, I'm going to do it here because what I said in my earlier post about this movie so completely addresses this matter of Mary's emotional "hysteria" :
"The most compelling aspect of this film is her gradual realization that the man she married is a vile Nazi war criminal. And this happens in stages: First, she is told by her husband that the odd little man who came to their home that day she was hanging curtains ( the same day they were married ), was a blackmailer, and that he (Charles Rankin is the name he goes by) paid him off and got rid of him. That in itself is disturbing and unsettling to her, the idea that her adored husband is hiding something. Then, stage two: he admits to her that he in fact murdered this man, claiming that he wanted to spare her and her family from scandal. Get your head around that, Loretta !
THEN, as if that's not enough, she's told by her own family - beloved father and brother, people she absolutely trusts - as well as Eddie G., that the man she married and is in love with is a monstrous Nazi war criminal, responsible for some of the worst atrocities of the Holocaust. It's these revelations in stages that I find interesting, and Loretta does a really good job of showing her dawning realization of who exactly she's married to in her face. First dismay, then disbelief, then confusion, then horror. And don't forget, these two have just returned from their honeymoon. She has to deal with the fact that she's been physically intimate with a Nazi war criminal. I love the way this is suggested, never openly talked about. But we get a sense of it when Charles, admitting to her that he killed the "little man" who (he falsely claims) was blackmailing him, says something like "Yes, my darling, these very hands that caressed you the night before strangled that little man." Plus, when she finally recognizes to herself just who her husband is, she tells him to go ahead and kill her, but to do it without touching her : "Just DON'T PUT YOUR HANDS ON ME ! !" "
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16 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:
The same way someone over 50 doesn't know who Drake is.
I can't help but know who he is, Drake is Canadian and so the Canadian media here never shuts up about him.
(Drake seems like a nice man, but his "music" is absolute rubbish.)
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18 hours ago, Hepburn Fan said:
I too used this link:
http://amishamerica.com/do-amish-use-electricity/
Television does not appear on their list of necessities.
Perhaps some of you think Newbies don't belong.
Why do we care about any of this, why did we suddenly start talking about the customs and use /lack of use of technologies of the Amish, and why aren't we talking about movies?
There is the "Off Topic" forum for those eager to explore the life style habits of Amish and Mennonite people.
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28 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:
??? What one earth is it about that picture that bothers you??
...You seem to be easily bothered.
7 minutes ago, Hepburn Fan said:Most recently, you do as well.
I'm only bothered by posters who make cryptic posts.
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21 hours ago, TheCid said:
I didn't watch it. Saw it many years ago and didn't like it very much.
Me too. As I said. I saw it at least twice before this weekend's viewing, and it "left me cold", as I said in my post about it. But I also said I decided to give it another chance, and that this time around I loved it. That can happen with re-viewing movies you've seen a long time ago and then "revisit". You revisit the movie and sometimes you revise your opinion of it.
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5 minutes ago, Hepburn Fan said:
TopBilled, I agree with how this could easily go the wrong way. The above picture from hamradio bothers me.
??? What one earth is it about that picture that bothers you??
...You seem to be easily bothered.
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What's goin' on, my fellow noiristas ? It used to be, within a few minutes of Eddie's noir airing for the week, this thread would be "hot" with all the posts people'd make here. Now, for the second week in a row, hours after The Stranger has screened, we've got more crickets than a New England meadow.
I don't want to always be the first to comment here, it's like being the one who's always a little too early for a party. But then again, maybe sometimes it's those early birds who get the party going. Ok, where's the punch? I'll start.
Loved The Stranger ! Funny thing is, I've seen it twice before, and both those other times it left me kind of cold. But this time, I thought it was great ! (exclamation points warranted. ! ) Maybe it had something to do with this is the best print of it I'd ever seen. But also, I seemed to get a lot more out of it this time around.
SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS ( You've been warned.)
The Stranger grabbed my attention right from the opening credits and never let go. Even though it's not particularly action-packed and there are no rain-swept urban streets or glitzy nightclubs, just a little old New England town with trees, a cemetery, a town clock, and a gossipy old checker-playing gent who runs the local convenience store ( or its equivalent), I loved the setting. I was interested to hear Eddie inform us that it was all literally a set on the Universal (I think?) backlot. And that crazy medieval clock, virtually a major character in the film, was designed by Welles and built especially for the movie. How did they do that angel and devil thing ?? Were they models based on actual medieval clock statues? Oh well, doesn't matter, it was enormously effective.
Sometimes noir movies have obscure, even meaningless titles. (I think Vautrin's pointed this out once or twice.) But The Stranger is a perfect title for this odd and disturbing noir. I like the way it has multiple meanings: there are three strangers: the ex-Nazi, that doleful little man who knocks on Loretta Young's lacy curtained door; there's Edward G. as the government Nazi investigator. And there's the real stranger, Loretta's husband. That's of course what the title is really referring to, and despite the sweet little town setting and all the kindly family and friends there, The Stranger explores an extremely dark and classically noir theme: how an ordinary woman (or man) can love and marry an evil person. To me, that's the crux of the biscuit of this story: Innocent decent Loretta Young marries the frighteningly deceptive Orson Welles, believing him to be the innocent decent history professor he's posing to be.
The most compelling aspect of this film is her gradual realization that the man she married is a vile Nazi war criminal. And this happens in stages: First, she is told by her husband that the odd little man who came to their home that day she was hanging curtains ( the same day they were married ), was a blackmailer, and that he (Charles Rankin is the name he goes by) paid him off and got rid of him. That in itself is disturbing and unsettling to her, the idea that her adored husband is hiding something. Then, stage two: he admits to her that he in fact murdered this man, claiming that he wanted to spare her and her family from scandal. Get your head around that, Loretta ! THEN, as if that's not enough, she's told by her own family - beloved father and brother, people she absolutely trusts - as well as Eddie G., that the man she married and is in love with is a monstrous Nazi war criminal, responsible for some of the worst atrocities of the Holocaust. It's these revelations in stages that I find interesting, and Loretta does a really good job of showing her dawning realization of who exactly she's married to in her face. First dismay, then disbelief, then confusion, then horror. And don't forget, these two have just returned from their honeymoon. She has to deal with the fact that she's been physically intimate with a Nazi war criminal. I love the way this is suggested, never openly talked about. But we get a sense of it when Charles, admitting to her that he killed the "little man" who (he falsely claims) was blackmailing him, says something like "Yes, my darling, these very hands that caressed you the night before strangled that little man." Plus, when she finally recognizes to herself just who her husband is, she tells him to go ahead and kill her, but to do it without touching her : "Just DON'T PUT YOUR HANDS ON ME ! !"
Sorry to go on so long about that, but it just struck me this time around that that whole aspect of the story and Loretta's character is key to what makes The Stranger a fascinating film, and also one that belongs in the noir canon.
This is really loooong, so I'll just wind up (ha! an unfortunate pun !) by saying that I love all the clock stuff. And that dramatic final scene is fantastic ! I know it's kind of over-the-top, but in a good way. And it's so perfect that it's the clock's angel, and not its demon, that finally kills Franz Kindler. An avenging angel indeed, and heaven's justice wrought on earth. Well, something like that.
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1 hour ago, TheCid said:
Have the same thoughts about His Kind of Woman. You would probably like The Big Steal and Macao as well. TBS has Jane Greer and William Bendix and Macao has William Bendix, Gloria Grahame and Jane Russel, as well as Mitchum in the leads.
Yup, Cid, seen 'em. And as you say - or suggest, anyway - there are comedic elements in those two films as well, especially The Big Steal. I don't seem to enjoy Macao quite as much, despite that great cast. But maybe I should give it another chance, only saw it once.
What His Kind of Woman has that those others lack is the priceless Vincent Price.
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Of course, I love many Robert Mitchum films, and actually Ryan's Daughter is not one of my favourites.
I guess my list includes all the usual suspects already mentioned here, including Out of the Past. I like His Kind of Woman, but mainly, despite james' point that there's some ugly violence in the film, for its comedy. In fact, for some reason, even though as just acknowledged, there is some bleak darkness in His Kind of Woman, especially those final scenes in the boat (yikes, that needle gradually getting closer and closer to Mitch's arm !), I still regard it as mainly a comedy. I'd list it as an example of a noir comedy, a topic I plan to start a thread about one of these days.
Nobody's mentioned the Westerns Mitch was in, of which there are quite a few. I like Pursued (although the plot is flawed, even a bit silly) and The Lusty Men.
And, as many have already noted, Mitch can be pretty darn good as creepy scary weirdo, as in Cape Fear and especially Night of the Hunter. The latter is a truly great movie, pure poetry on film.
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On 9/19/2018 at 3:39 PM, CaveGirl said:
"Ryan's Daughter".
Why? Because he is so unlike Robert Mitchum in the film that I was mightily impressed.Damn, you beat me to it ! I was thinking, "how come nobody's mentioned Ryan's Daughter ? I'll be the first !"
Oh well. Makes me wonder if not many people have seen it. I agree, the role of the gentle, quiet, passive middle-aged teacher who almost reluctantly marries the beautiful much younger Sarah Miles is very "unlike" what we usually associate with Robert Mitchum.
Although, hold on...his character is quiet and passive. And when he realizes his SPOILER wife is having a passionate affair with a war-ravaged English soldier, he's also kind of resigned to it.
"Quiet" "Passive" "Resigned" - hey, I never thought of it that way before, but actually, Mitch clearly was able to discover aspects of his typical screen character in the role of Charles Shaughnessy.
I was always interested in seeing Ryan's Daughter, but for some reason, the film is rarely screened and it's hard to find. I was delighted when TCM finally aired it a couple of years or so ago. I'd always wanted to see it because:
a) It was one of those films I'd always heard about, even when it first came out (when I was quite young, I hasten to add)
b) It's set in the time of the Irish Easter uprising, when tensions between the Irish and the English were very high. I find Ireland fascinating anyway, and that particular part of its history extremely sad and interesting ( have you seen Odd Man Out? )
c) It stars Robert Mitchum - - playing an Irish man !
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16 hours ago, CaveGirl said:
Thanks, Spence for digging up such a good topic!And even more, thanks to TikiSoo, for resurrecting this thread ( appropriate choice of word for the topic, eh?)
It's clear that TikiSoo has made a bit of a hobby of visiting old cemeteries, especially those that include the graves of our beloved old movie stars. Must be fascinating, Tiki, on two counts: it's interesting, and somehow moving, to see the resting places of these people we've seen so many times on screen. And also, cemeteries are beautiful, mysterious, peaceful places to walk through in their own right. I also like to visit them when I'm in another city or town, and it's always an interesting and somehow pleasant experience.
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4 minutes ago, TheCid said:
I also had to look up seminal when I first came across this thread. Agree that the cinematography, night scenes, etc. might be noirish, but I don't think this influenced later noir, but then again what do I know. Couldn't you say the same thing about a lot of mystery and horro movies?
It just did not seem to flow very well.
I did already know what "seminal" meant, but for the purpose of the point I was trying to make in my post, I looked it up for a specific, hard definition that would apply to what I was saying.
For sure, a lot of those 30s ( and even silent) mystery and horror movies were influential in the look and style of film noir. Nobody denies that they too, contributed to the development of the noir style.
Anyway, as for your not enjoying Stranger on the Third Floor, fair enough. We don't always like the same movies, not even us noir fans. I always like to say, "a chacun son gout".
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2 minutes ago, Hibi said:
With all the hybridization going on maybe someday they'll come up with a blue rose. They are getting close....
Well, in the meantime we can enjoy the beautiful "Angel Face" rose you and Lorna mentioned.. And also listen to "Blue Rose", the album.
Oh, and watch "the Thief of Baghdad". The not-as-good 1961 version, not the great 1940 one.
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5 minutes ago, Hepburn Fan said:
Kind of like the Big Band Era, where the vocal was secondary. The music was for dancing and the vocal was a plus. Notice how the singing starts a minute and a half into the song. If there is a 78 RPM version, I'd love to hear it.
You're right about the band playing almost halfway into the song before the singer starts singing, that was quite common back then.
However, in the case of the album "Blue Rose", the idea was to pair Ellington's great music and instrumentation to Clooney's lovely voice; they wanted to promote Rosemary Clooney, and gave her pretty much equal billing on the album.
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7 minutes ago, TheCid said:
Just watched Strange on the Third Floor. Boring. Had to force myself to watch it. Not very well crafted and too many gimmicks. Not the least of which is the heroine finding Peter Lorre and then him confessing just as he dies. Not my idea of Noir.
Really? I've seen it two or three times, and have never found it boring. Now, if you're saying it's not up to the standards we usually see in later noirs, like the cinematography, acting, dialogue, etc., I'd have to agree that it's a bit lacking in sophistication compared to the later films we associate with the "classic noir era". But remember, the O.P was just saying she thinks Stranger on the Third Floor is a seminal noir, "seminal" meaning "influential", "formative". (hey, I looked it up.) It's not really fair to compare SOTTF to the later noirs.
What it does have in common with those later noirs, and where you can definitely see the influence on them ( er, the later noirs), is in the shadowy cinematography, the late night scenes ( diners, walking those slightly ominous city streets), the shabby walk-up where the hero lives, the very noirish dream/nightmare sequence, and the themes of misplaced guilt, isolation ( hey, who's more isolated than poor old Peter Lorre?), and paranoia.
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On 9/17/2018 at 11:52 AM, LornaHansonForbes said:
Hibi nailed it with the “lavender” thing; Angel Face (the rose) Is as close as you get to a blue rose.
Sorry, Lorna, I couldn't resist. "Blue Rose" is the title of an album by Rosemary Clooney and Duke Ellington. The song selections are first-rate, from what they call "The American Songbook" - all great tunes composed by the Duke.
Duke Elllington and his band are in fine form, as is Miss Clooney's silky voice. I love this record.
Ok, now I'm really being self-indulgent. I just have to include here one of the tracks. Of course it's got "Mood Indigo", which is appropriately noir, plus indigo is blue. But I'm going for a lesser-known song, the opening track. I just love the way she sustains her voice on the opening note. You can just imagine Rosemary in some posh nightclub in the early 50s, wearing a glittering gown and gently setting down her champagne cocktail as she gets ready to sing. Noirish, eh?
Hey Baby
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Centennial of Holst's "The Planets"
in General Discussions
Posted
Tom, I just thought of something else about that "Neptune" piece. Although this is admittedlly a long shot.
So, you're from Toronto, I think?? Did you ever go to the Royal Ontario Museum? In their dinosaur exhibit ( now changed of course, this was years ago) they had an area that played Holst's "Neptune" constantly, I think it must have been some kind of loop. The dinosaur display was kind of dark and mysterious, and naturally, that music rendered it even more so. I remember just standing there in that half light, the images of those giant ancient creatures before me in their display cases, listening to that eerie music. It went so well with that part of the museum. Long gone, of course. I'm just telling about this in the extremely unlikely chance that you might know what I'm talking about, since I know you lived in Toronto at some point.