AndyM108

Yancey, either you're French or you're crazy, or both. I'd rather have a SOTM devoted to that character actor in the 30's who stutterered his way from one movie to another. Can't remember his name at the moment, but he was ten times as funny as Jerry Lewis. Just because one generation had a misguided sense of humor doesn't mean that TCM should have to honor their misguidance. If we want to honor pure slapstick, let's give the Three Stooges a SUTS day and leave Jerry Lewis to Dean Martin's ghost. At least the Three Stooges were somewhat endearing.

I agree with you about Caged . There are plenty of good films about women's prisons -- up to the last reel. But Caged definitely has the most realistic ending of the lot, and it's to TCM's great credit that it seems to have been put in their informal rotation. And here I also agree with you that within the context of the plot and the time period, Jenny would've at best been given a long sentence with an early parole, hopefully assigned to a prison with a good beautician so she didn't come out looking like May Robson. But in a more just world, or with a less vigilant production code, the substituted prosecutor would have said *" that rat Calhern only got what he deserved "* , and a ceremony at City Hall would have bestowed a medal on Chatterton for public service, sort of like the *" Happy ending, nice and tidy "* song that wraps up the 1954 production of The Threepenny Opera . And Charles Boyer for a chauffeur who meets her as she emerges from prison wouldn't be out of the question, either..... (Oh, well, a man can dream, can't he?)

But Andy, anyway you look at it, Jenny was a murderer! That's what she was being punished for, not for the rackets she was involved in. And still, she could have escaped the severity of her penalty but chose not to. And if she *had* chosen to spill the beans, and if she *had* then been able to escape from the gallows and live happily ever after off her various ill-gotten gains ( as Harlow did in Red-Headed Woman ), then you would've really had an ending that likely would have wound up on the cutting room floor. This is why IMO the issue of Jenny's free choice in the matter is interesting but not particularly germane to the larger issue of not letting crime pay. My only wonder is how Red-Headed Woman was successfully passed off as a comedy in order to avoid the fate of the cutting room. That movie was truly the exception that proved the rule. But I'd love to see Blonde Venus . If only TCM would show it.

The thing about Frisco Jenny: She did commit a crime, but there were mitigating circumstances. Her fate was to some extent her within her control. She chose NOT to tell the true story. So unlike other films, where murder must be punished by society, Jenny ACCEPTED her sentence, though it was within her power to change it. That makes Frisco Jenny a variant of many endings of its time, but the bottom line is that along with 99% of the other endings of pre-code and post-code films, a woman who's lived a life of vice doesn't get to enjoy its benefits. This is why the absence of *any* sort of endgame punishment in Harlow's case truly sets Red-Headed Woman apart from just about every other "low life" movie of the time.

It may be more an exception than the rule, but I feel that the characters in TROUBLE IN PARADISE seem to "sin" and get away with more than most other pre-code film characters. Except that in Trouble in Paradise Hopkins and Marshall play the archtype "gentlemen thieves", and Kay Francis is for the most part a willing victim. Everyone more or less is in on the deal, nobody really gets hurt, and everyone's a good sport about it. It's a fabulous movie, but it's never presented as any sort of moral tale. OTOH in Red-Headed Woman , Jean Harlow plays the sort of home wrecker who inevitably winds up either dead, disgraced or punished ( Safe in Hell , Frisco Jenny ), or repentant and marrying the Good Man in order to live happily ever after ( Baby Face ). But while nominally disgraced, in the final scene you see Harlow not only living the grand style at a French race track, you also see that she still has her long time paramour working as her new husband's chauffeur. It's a wonderful ending, but by Hollywood standards, even pre-code, it totally goes against the grain. Apparently they got away with it by billing it as a comedy, but while Harlow's mere presence means that there are some comic moments, for the most part she's portrayed in more or less the same way as Stanwyck was in Baby Face .

Again, it's only because that I've seen that sort of a "noble" ending in so many other movies before I watched Frisco Jenny that the ending of the 1932 movie seemed somewhat of a cliche. If I had watched all these movies in the order in which they'd been originally released, my reaction would likely have been much different. But since I watched Angels With Dirty Faces for the first time about 40 years ago, it was *ROCKY DIES YELLOW* that seemed fresh and original to me, even if it actually came out 7 years after Frisco Jenny . Which means that while I can appreciate Frisco Jenny for its historical significance, on its own two feet it doesn't particularly stand out from dozens of other pre-codes that feature criminals with good motives. And yes, I understand the definition of "Hollywood ending" as you describe it, but even if the ending of Frisco Jenny , unlike Baby Face , is more consistent with what went before, it still fits the "no criminal deed should ever go unpunished" formula for avoiding the censor's scissors. That doesn't make it a bad movie at all, but it reduces it more or less to a very well made Hollywood soap opera about a mother's love for her child. Not exactly an original concept. And while Stanwyck's Lily Powers in Baby Face is forced into a rather implausible ending (to say the least), for the first 99% of the movie she's a much more believable character than Frisco Jenny, depicted without a single redemptive quality other than the standard "my environment made me what I am" defense. There's absolutely nothing in Frisco Jenny to match in force the tirades that Stanwyck launches against her father in the opening scenes of Baby Face . Those early scenes define the pre-code spirit just about as well as any movie you can find, matched only by a tiny handful of others.

Well, it can't be as bad as the Neil Diamond remake of The Jazz Singer, can it ? I'm not sure why any sane person would ever watch anything with Neil Diamond in it, but the movie has yet to be made that could possibly be any worse than the original Al Jolson version of The Jazz Singer . On a scale of pain, that was the equivalent of watching Mitt Romney try to recite the Gettysburg Address.

When I wrote that the noble ending is used to death, it isn't that I'm blaming Frisco Jenny for copycatting Angels With Dirty Faces , it's just that after seeing so many movies with similar endings, after a while they all run together, regardless of what the particular release date might be. This even affected my take on the scrapbook burning, which though it was a dramatic scene, was still utterly predictible. What other favor was there left for Chatterton to ask, since she'd already sworn Amah to secrecy? I agree about the ending in Baby Face , but the sheer rawness of the opening scenes goes far beyond anything in Frisco Jenny , and while Stanwyck is portrayed as a "ruthless schemer" (although forced by circumstance) right up until the very last scene, the Chatterton character is always motivated by her motherly instinct for her child. She states that motivation right up front and never once wavers from it. Noble, no question, but far more conventional a Hollywood story. Given the ending, I don't see any reason it couldn't have passed by Joe Breen himself. And yes, Safe in Hell is nearly the gold standard, and I love the movie, but it also has the ending with the woman (in this case, innocent) who nobly chooses death rather than (in this case) dishonor. The truth is that code or no code, the censors simply weren't letting even "good" lowlifes "get away" with anything at the end, This led to a few good dramatic finishes in individual movies like Frisco Jenny , but taken as a group it's (to me, anyway) rather maddening. One of the very few movies that seems to keep its full integrity in the ending is I Am a Fugitive From a Chain Gang , which had the advantage of being based on a real life character. Muni didn't "get away" with a crime he didn't even commit, but at least the movie didn't end with violins implicitly playing in the background, and " *I STEAL!* " may be the most memorable final line Hollywood ever gave us this side of " This is Mrs. Norman Maine ", though the Garland line was obviously memorable for a far different reason.

Jusf finished watching Frisco Jenny a few minutes ago. Not bad, but nothing to write home about compared to Baby Face or Temple Drake or Red-Headed Woman or dozens of other much grittier pre-codes. Chatterton did play her part very well, but that noble ending is used to death as a way of getting around the censors, most famously by Cagney in that "ROCKY DIES YELLOW" ending to Angels With Dirty Faces . It would have been far more compelling (not to mention unusual) a twist to let the D.A. son know that he'd just fried his own mother, even if the scene would've likely wound up in the cutting room. Besides Chatterton's first rate performance, though, there was one other redemptive feature, and that's that I can now count one more film where Louis Calhern plays an almost perfect bounder. From The Blot to The Man With Two Faces to Asphalt Jungle to Executive Suite and many points in between, he's got to be one of the greater portrayers of romantic and criminal slime that the screen has ever known. They could really use a Louis Calhern SUTS day.

What's the problem with Beyoncé? A Star Is Born is a timeless story that can be told in a million variations. Now Tom Cruise, that's another story. It's hard to picture James Mason or Fredric March getting drunk and jumping up and down on a couch.

But do watch out for the slap that caused the earthquake. It's funny, but I've been watching my DVD of Greed for the first time tonight, and when I saw it was apparently set in northern California, if not San Francisco itself, I was wondering when the earthquake was going to make its appearance in the McTeague household. Three hours into it and no earthquake so far**, and it's only after seeing these references to the earthquake in Frisco Jenny that I realized that I'd previously read the earlier comments about the Chatterton movie and conflated this part of the plot with the plot in Greed . Small world, so to speak, or at least a bit of a coincidence. **Which makes sense now that I think of it, since it's already up to 1922 at the three hour mark, and anyway, the Norris novel was written in 1899, seven years before the quake.

Frisco Jenny is definitely on my must-see list for the plot and for Calhern, even if Chatterton's looks are to Stanwyck's or Young's as Mayo Methot's were to Lauren Bacall's. I know she's a big favorite among most of the other pre-code fans I've met, but I've never understood her appeal. Hopefully I'll change my mind after seeing this one.

Man, not again. I have to add SPLENDOR IN THE GRASS to the list. In 2012 alone, it's listed for every month through the May schedule. Jeez, give that turkey another year or two and it'll pass NBNW, which is at least a good movie.

I love Loretta's pre-codes, but since I started recording in late 2009, I've noticed that she seems to get the first 14 hours of the day on her Jan. 6th birthday each year, a practice I hope they continue. I'd love to see 24 hours of her pre-code films (and a select few of her later ones), but compared to some of the other neglected stars, she's not as underrepresented as her lack of a SUTS day might indicate.

I notice that Robert Montgomery has never had a day in SUTS. You're not the only one, and he'd be an excellent choice. But after watching Girl Missing and realizing just how great she is, my # 1 Hollywood candidate for a SUTS day has got to be *Glenda Farrell* . Joan Blondell got her well-deserved day last year, and Farrell would be the natural complement. And once they're finished with whatever Saturday morning series succeeds Boston **** (which is itself a total winner), why not run the seven Farrell episodes of Torchy Blaine ?

After watching The Grapes of Wrath last night, the sincerity finally overtook the bad accents and cornpone dialogue, and raised it from about a 3 to an 8 on a 10-scale. But I still can't see how it makes anyone's all-time top 100 list.

I'm reading Kevin Starr's multi-book history of California. According to his book, Endangered Dreams (which centers on California in the 1930s), police in California often "deputized" vigilantes to give legitimacy to the thuggery they practiced . The link below is to a poster website (disclosure: It's mine), but the book whose cover it depicts is a powerful expose of all those strikebreaking techniques, which were Big Business indeed in the 1930's. These strikebreaking outfits were used not just by companies, but also by many states, counties and cities, including New York. And yes, the use of phony "deputies" as a mask was indeed a commonplace practice. http://www.georgetownbookshop.com/display2.asp?id=240 And the book itself for sale on abebooks: http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?bi=0&bx=off&dj=on&ds=30&recentlyadded=all&sortby=17&tn=ibreakstrikes&x=0&y=0

The problem of including primarily foreign language & silent films is that the average TCM viewer (not the hardcore fans who post here) do not like "reading" films. For example, when TCM had Kurosawa's 100th Birthday Anniversary month, many posted here on the day that they showed 24 hours of his films of too many foreign language films. Now, Gish made lots of sound movies so not a problem, but with Pickford she only made a couple of sound pictures so most of her day would be her silent films. However, Jean Gabin day went by without complaint so maybe that would open the door for more foreign language stars. I'd surely hope so. Toshiro Mifune is worthy of a SOTM, and a SUTS day would be the least they could do. Quiet as it's kept, he's an actor every bit as worthy of the honor as any American star. I know this isn't a popular opinion, but although I recognize the need to balance the wants of the buffs with the wants of the "casual" classic film fan, it doesn't seem that TCM is exactly drowning in films that need to be "read". I seriously doubt that the combined percentage of subtitled films on our favorite network exceeds 10% in the average month, that one Kurosawa blowout aside. Not to mention that a disproportionate number of the silents seem to be either Chaplin, Lloyd or Keaton, many or most of which have been widely shown for decades. Meanwhile, in April we've got *50* Doris Day or "Spring Break" movies alone. At what point is enough enough? Why don't they just buy the Double Bubble factory while they're at it? (/rant, and yes, I know that May will be a huge improvement. I'm just blowing off steam after being bookended by 31 days of Oscar repeats and Doris Day.)

Just finished watching this minor classic, and were you ever right----it was even better than I'd hoped. Glenda's right up there with Joan Blondell as my favorite pre-code gum-snapper, and AFAIC this was her best role yet, even better than she was as Paul Muni's tormentor in Hi, Nellie , or as Sybil Jason's protector in Little Big Shot . I don't remember if she's ever had a SUTS day, but brother, does she ever deserve one. Silk Express was very good, too---nice twist at the end---but anyone who's recorded Girl Missing and put it on the back burner should know just what a treat they're in for.

Ann Dvorak is one of a number of actors that, for a variety of reasons, didn't have careers to match their talents (Juano Hernandez, Leena Horne, and Jane Greer included). That's a subject worthy of a whole separate thread, and you sure picked four very good examples to begin with. And although I kind of liked A Life of Her Own (I'll never knock a movie with Louis Calhern), I agree that in the brief time before she jumped out the window, Dvorak's role was the most compelling.

They showed 7 straight pre-codes on Tuesday and I'm glad I recorded all of them. Molly Louvain has been the best of the lot so far, but your recommedation has moved Girl Missing to the top of my queue, especially since it's got my girl Glenda in it. I'm going to need every last DVD off my backlog to survive that unimaginably horrible April schedule.

The worst thing is when they take a truly great movie and consign it in the overnight part of the schedule. High and Low is returning for the first time in two years on April 1st---at 2:30 AM. The last time it ran, it ended at 1:00 AM. It'd be nice to show movies like that in prime time rather than an endless parade of mindless "Spring Break" movies that run together like so many flies on a windowsill.

On Big Sleep, Andy, did you see it today? It is soooooooo confusing that each viewing is like the first viewing. I still don't know what it was about, and I just finished seeing it. But Bogey's bookworm impersonation is priceless, as is the last shot of the two lovebirds. Man, they burned up the screen. Didn't see it today, but I've liked it better every time around, and for the same reason: 24 hours after I've finished watching it, I can never remember what it was all about, so it's almost like a new movie the next time. Of course it helps if you've got a great cast and atmosphere, and The Big Sleep has that in spades---or maybe I should say it has it in Marlowes.

Andy, I think it comes down to the particular film and the viewer. Yeah, we all have our own baggage that we bring to movies, no question about that. I love Rohmer. I can watch his films again and again. Ok -- Perceval is an exception; though the subject matter interests me, I found it rather boring. I find a couple of Rohmer's films -- or bits of them -- annoying. One of my favorite Rohmer films is A Summer's Tale -- part of the seasons quartet -- but one that I find annoying is simply called Summer ( Le Rayon Vert in French). I'm not sure why Rohmer appeals to me as much as he does, but after Kurosawa he's my all-time favorite director. Maybe it's in part because his films are such a perfect counterpoint to my favorite American genres: Film noir and pre-code dramas with lots of low-life action. Maybe it's because I like his combination of moral seriousness and lack of pretension. Maybe it's because so many of Rohmer's women represent the sort of types I've always been attracted to---the two girls in Four Adventures of Reinette and Mirabelle , Beatrice Romand in Autumn Tale , Zouzou in Chloe in the Afternoon , and above all Emmanuelle Chaulet in Boyfriends and Girlfriends . I also love what we call "slice of life" films when they're done on such a high level as Rohmer's, presenting fairly ordinary people in ordinary situations, but in such a way that you become interested in how their lives play out. Whatever it is, he's one director where I could live to be a thousand and never get bored with his films.

Movies that improved a lot on second sitting: Children of Pardise Stolen Kisses The Maltese Falcon The Big Sleep Dr. Strangelove The second time broke the spell: A Thousand Clowns Cabaret Bonnie and Clyde East of Eden The Wild One The St. Valentine Day's Massacre My Brilliant Career