JamesJazGuitar

That is a strange looking guitar. Looks acoustic but I wonder what those two 'things' are on the top, on each side. Oh, and when I look at pictures I tend to notice guitars before the gals!

I guess I took what you posted too literally. Most leading noir character are flawed to some degree and often they are very flawed. The minor players are often very unlikable and not just the criminals but the police, spouses etc... i.e. noir is full of unlikable characters. That is one of the reasons I love noir. But I do agree that in most noirs there are some likeable characters i.e. good guys, but then again, they tend to be secondary characters. As for The Letter; I love this movie but I do see your point. Really no likeable character expect many her lawyer (who sells out to aid her and shield his friend). But I find Davis's character in the Little Foxes to be more disagreeable than the one in The Letter.

So I assume you're not a fan of Film Noir?

When I was about 10 the family went out for breakfast. I went to the restroom before the order was taken. When I got back we ordered. I ordered eggs and the waitress asked me how I wanted them. I said 'American Standard'. My dad said, 'that is a toilet maker you dope, not a kind of egg!'. I did say that because I had just seen it in the bathroom. I really wanted 'over easy' and to me that was the American Standard. One of my oldest memories.

Well I do agree that being typecast is better than being ignored.

Not sure I'm following you when you say "Maybe she just enjoyed playing these kinds of characters". Are you saying Eleanor asked for those type of roles? Isn't it more likely that producers saw that she was very good playing certain roles and casts her in those roles and she was not one to fight back (i.e. go on suspension especially in the 50s where there were less opportunities for actors). I relates this to the comments Kim Novak made last night about not being a fighter as it relates to getting certain parts and how she wished she had gotten some of the roles Lee Remick stared in. I'm a fan of Eleanor and as you noted she did more than many people may realize. But as is true with many stars they are often remembered best for their typecast roles.

What I find interesting is how Garson went from playing women younger than she was (which was typical in Hollywood), in movies like When Ladies Meet, to playing one older than she really was in Mrs. Miniver. For example, in When Ladies Meet, after she discover her husband had Joan has his new love, she mentions how she had hoped he would of been over that phase by now and that they could settle down and have children. Thus I assume the Garson character was women in her late 20s or early 30s at best (given the times). Then she goes one to play a mother of a solider. To me she pulls off both roles.

I'm thinking of creating a new thread relate to directors and their relationship to others in the creative process; Mainly studio bosses, producers, authors, and screenwriters. For example, who was the main one that controlled the editing of the movie? If there was a disagreement who made the final call? I assume the nature of these relationships would be different for independent directors versus directors that were under contract. For example; Michael Curtiz; Was he a creative force in the same regards to, say, Hitchcock? (in a thread on Curtiz many felt 'no'); Did Curtiz fight for certain things and the 'end result' we see is a result of him 'winning' those battles OR did Wallis, or others call the shots and the final film is better because of that? I wasn't aware of the Ford Zanuck info. I assumed Ford was one of those 'my way or the highway' type of directors. A lot of this has to do with the fairly modern concept of a 'director's cut'. I believe most people assume that a director's cut is the true version and also a better one, by default. But if what you said about Ford is true a Ford 'director's cut' might of ended up being an inferior product.

Actually Elaine makes a choice NOT to do something; getting married. I think she understood what she was doing there, but that doesn't mean that she will end up marrying Ben or even having a relationship with him. My view of their future is that she thanks Ben for preventing her from making a poor choice but at the same time, tells him that until he grows up, she doesn't wish to have a relationship with him. Ben continues on his mindless wandering. Edited by: jamesjazzguitar on Mar 4, 2013 1:18 PM

Interesting stuff here. I believe most people believe it should be the director that has the final say; i.e. that the artistic vision of a movie should be owned (controlled by), the director. While I understand this POV I believe it is worthwhile to remember that a director can also 'insult' people who feel they should have the final say. Your Rear Window example illustrates this point; Did Woolrich welcome the changes Hitchcock made or instead feel that Hitchcock's changes weaken the story and thus overall picture? So while it is save to assume that those with the power over a director (e.g. studio boss, producer), did more harm than good (i.e. the movie would of been better off if the director got his way), I'm sure there are cases where overriding the director resulted in a better film. I'm sure there are screenwriter and authors that were glad a producer had sway over a director.

My comment about Rebecca was a reply to Finance and his post of: Edward in EDWARD MY SON received no billing at all. He was unseen. Thus the comment was a joke. But TCM did show Gone With The Wind and Rebecca back to back a few weeks back. That just made it that much harder for me to NOT visualize Leigh as Rebecca.

Leslie Howard is my favorite actor. As for my favorite Howard movies they would be: The Petrified Forest, It's Love I'm After, Pygmalion, The Scarlet Pimpernel, Intermezzo, Stand In and Of Human Bondage.

Thanks for the info. Since Howard is my favorite actor I would welcome a documentary on his all too short but wonderful life.

Well Rebecca didn't get any credit either and we all know she was played by Vivien Leigh!

As you know once a work is classified as public domain it can be altered. e.g. colorized, re-edited, revised ending, etc.. Thus some (but I'm not on of them), could view retaining of copyrights forever as a way to prevent the 'harm' caused by colorization and other future technologies.

Women should have better choices than either Carl or Ben. Ben wasn't a replacement for Carl. From my POV it was the other way around; Carl was a replacement for Ben. But given a few days after the final scene, she comes to the conclusion that she didn't love either man.

Yes, Bancroft got first billing. She was the only major star (at that time), in the film.

I feel similar when I go hiking (I hike around 5 miles, every other day). I don't wear headphones because I want to hear nature. i.e. I feel closer to nature without the music and that is one of the joys I get from hiking. But it is funny to see people not only wearing headphones but also viewing their IPod as they hike the trail. Hey, at least they are moving about. To each their own.

I really like bluegrass when it is more jazzy and less country; e.g. David Grisman, Tony Rice. Grisman's first album, The David Grisman Quintet is one of the best albums ever released. Just a very tight band playing a hybrid type of bluegrass jazz music. You're correct that bluegrass musicians are very well trained, high quality musicians. More so,(generally), than blues, rock or country ones.

Interesting topic here (assuming I'm following it correctly): Of course once a film goes into the public domain it's market value is reduced. Does that reduce the odds it will be restored? i.e. would a third party be more likely to restore a work IF they retained total rights to that work (not just the rights to their restored version but all versions)? I would assume the answer to this question is yes. Thus the POV that while having a film in the public domain increases access, the odds are what the public has access to will be of inferior quality.

I'm also not into tweeting or Facebook (and I make my living by developing software), but these methods could be used to attract new viewers to TCM. Sadly these type of viewers would watch a movie while checking their IPad the entire time!

People in America "claiming that they're probably HUNGRY"? Last time I checked we have an obesity problem not a food shortage problem. Consumption of junk food doesn't suppress hunger. Instead it often increases the desire to eat. Lack of exercise is the main reason people cannot reduce their stress level. Thus there is a correlation with watching too much TV or playing video games.

I suspect the main reason these shows have an audience is that the audience is very much like the people on the show. Of course another reason is that people like to watch a train wreak. Is the enjoyment intelligent people get from film noir or gangster and crime pictures really that much different? i.e. the stars of such films often exhibit "uncouth behavior of undereducated sleezeballs". e.g. Public Enemy, White Heat,,,,, OK, it is very different in a lot of way, but still watching bad behavior has always been an attraction. I also understand the POV expressed by someone else here that most of the time it is very old people complaining about the younger generation. e.g. old hippies are now complaining about young punks.

I understand that when viewed in a narrow context the statement is indeed ridculous. I asked you why you felt it was and I agree with you; the statement is ridculous when view in that narrow context. Thus I moved on to other issues a long time ago (e.g. the issue of who really 'own' the artistic vision of a movie;, author of story, screenwritter, producer, studio bosses, director, etc.... But I'm clearly a fool and wasted my time since you had no interest in anything else but proving my statement was ridculous. Again, it was ridculous. You win.

Glad to see there are other latin jazz lovers here. I tend to like bebop and west coast jazz (mostly from the 50s early 60) but that is because I'm listening to improve my ability as a musician as well as just enjoying the 'ride'. But that type of jazz can be too 'busy' for many people, like my wife. She loves jazz but just love latin jazz the most. It has that great feel and swings gently but there is still very fine improvisation. So typically when we are together and listening to music we play latin jazz.