Dargo
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Posts posted by Dargo
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One of the problems that I have with The Dawn Patrol is that its screenplay tries to have it both ways. On the one hand, if offers the clear anti-war sentiments, as espoused in the dialogue above. On the other hand, the film also features scenes with Flynn and Niven playing dashing daredevils in the skies, whooping and hollering, acting much like schoolboys having an adolescent adventure.
The Dawn Patrol does end on a solemn note, clearly anti-war in its sentiment, the film released at a time when war clouds were gathering over Europe. But those images of Flynn and Niven laughing in the skies in the film's earlier action sequences (a reflection of the first 1930 Dawn Patrol, as well) do conflict for me with the film's final message.
However Tom, isn't this "conflicting message" common to all the better made War movies? Because, without this contrast don't you just end up with a simplistic Propaganda film?
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It has always seemed odd to me that a dozen or so guys on each side in the war, take off every morning and fly toward each other, then try to shoot each other out of the sky. And everyone on both sides is upset because their buddies are killed.
Going up each day takes no territory. It has nothing to do with the ultimate outcome of the war. All it does is kill the pilots.
Why not call the other side on some kind of telephone and say, "Hey, let's agree not to go up today? Let's take a day off. Or a week. Or a month??"
LOL
Yeah! Ya know, actually not a bad idea at all! And then all get together at Frenchy's Cafe situated halfway between each enemy's lines, and sing a rousing chorus of "Lili Marlene" while downing the local brew!
Yep! I sure would've been up for somethin' like THAT instead if I were one o' those guys.
(...probably might've ruined my chances of ever gettin' one o' them there Frenchy Croix de Gere thingies, though...but like I care about THAT!!!)
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Dargo, you just referenced two of my favorite "war" films, and I would include THE BRIDGES AT TOKO RI (Fredric March sending William Holden on a dangerous mission) as well. War is always hell, although one can debate just how necessary the war or the individual actions are. The commanding officer has to weigh the cost vs the benefit of the mission. Assuming the CO is at all human, he still feels the pain of the loss he knows is coming even if the mission is worth pursuing.
Good additional thought here, Mr.R. Yes, I suppose TBATR might also fit into these basic story lines...well, except as I recall the story in that one primarily focuses upon Bill Holden and his doing the fighting(and dying), and a little less so on Fredric March's role in doing the ordering of such.
(...though March's final 'soliloquy' in this one that begins "Where do we get such men?", has always been one of my favorite final lines in any movie too...a war movie or not)
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OH so sorry to have held a mirror up to someone.
(...I always make SO many "friends" that way, ya know!) LOL
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I've never been able to watch Command Decision all the way through -- don't know why.
Hmmmm...interesting rosebette. I wonder if perhaps the lack of "action" sequences in this one might be the cause of that? As "Command Decision" IS pretty much a "boardroom drama".
(...just venturing a guess here, that's all)
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This thread is funny. Some of you are taking all of this way too seriously.
Not ME! 'Cause MY only contribution to this thread was to lightly poke fun at a certain Canadian friend of mine's "coulrophobia"!!!
BUT, I have to say I DO find it rather ironic that the OP's initial post which was more or less just an innocent question about if "Conan's TCM presence is now over", was turned by you into a "serious" statement of your dislike for these Carson interviews being shown on TCM, and that you now have stated "people are now taking this too seriously".
(...yep, ya see, SOMETIMES "sidetracking" ISN'T always done JUST by means of a humorous comment being inserted into a thread, huh!)
LOL
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Was it only me, or did anyone else here maybe think that this film and how its central theme of, "Commanding Officer must carry and to the best of his abilities conceal the personal emotion wounds of ordering men into battle to die", might have influenced the scriptwriters of both WWII-themed films, "Command Decision" and "Twelve O'Clock High"?
(...well, I saw some similarities anyway)
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I think he was an asset in those technicolor confections, where his breezy persona and his dark looks were.contrasted effectively against Fox blondes like Betty Grable.
Yep, and Esther Williams...though she wasn't a blonde, of course. Yep, I think Vic's contribution to "Million Dollar Mermaid" probably made that one the best of all of her movies, too.
(...of course I suppose it COULD have been the kangaroo...naah...it was definitely Victor)
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Today they ran one with James Stewart and he spent a few minutes talking about THE GREATEST SHOW ON EARTH.
HEY TOM!!! Hope you missed this one!
(...as I now know how much Jimmy really freaks you out in that one)
LOL
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I don't see anything in this thread touting Mature for SOTM, which is surprising, since virtually everyone else has been pushed for SOTM status on these boards.
Hmmmm....ya know finance, you're right.
And sooooooooo....
HEY TCM!!! ARE YA LISTENIN' HERE?! HOW ABOUT VIC GETTIN' A SOTM TREATMENT, HUH???!!!
(...I ain't gonna hold my breathe though...I know JUST how slowly the wheels turn around this place)
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The main reason I became a hugh fan of Olivia DeHavilland was because she played strong female roles but did so with a sense of humor; e.g. The Strawberry Blonde. Even in the films with Flynn her characters are generally strong females. e.g. Dodge City.
I think the main difference between how, in general, DeHavilland's on-screen relationships with her primary leading man Errol Flynn were resolved, as at first many times in their films her character also "has issues" with him before falling for him, is that UNLIKE in how these similar "relationship conflicts" were most often settled in the O'Hara/Wayne films, DeHavilland is most often ultimately "charmed" by Flynn, and whereas Wayne's characters were seldom if ever "charming".
(...'cause ya know, a "REAL" American he-man shouldn't EVER have to "stoop" to being "charming" to win his gal, 'cause THAT'S "sissy stuff" that "of course" should STRICTLY be left to those European/British and/or Tasmanian men to do!!!) LOL
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Very intelligent dialogue in this film. It would take pages and pages of this thread to post some of the more memorable in it.
One of my favorites is when Adams discovers Jefferson hasn't gotten anywhere with his first draft of the document....
Adams: "You've had a week and haven't finished?"
Jefferson: "No. I haven't even begun!"
Adams: "My God, man. The EARTH was finished in a week."
Jefferson: Yes. One day you must tell me how you accomplished that."
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It sounds like Dargo is a pretty easy going guy, one who doesn't get offended easily. --- Maybe if I call him an "upstart" ...
LOL
"Sure! Go ahead and see what happens, big fella!"
(...btw Mr.R, thanks for your thoughts about "Kiss of Death"...GREAT point!...I agree...while Widmark's is the flashier performance, Mature actually carries the picture)
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Thanks for the heads-up Tom(and Andy). I'll keep my eyes peeled for "The Long Haul" when and if TCM shows it again. It does indeed sound interesting and one I don't believe I've ever caught.
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Excuse me Joe, but that's a picture of Paul's fellow "Blackboard Jungle" cast member Jamie Farr.
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Thanks for the reply, Joe.
(...ya know, for a second I was thinkin' you might've had me on your ignore function 'cause you TOO had become tired of all of my jokin' around, around here!) LOL
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(okay, and before we get started here, let me just say that I, as the thread's originator, don't give a rodent's rear-end if somebody wants to sidetrack this thread somewhere along the line for a while AND/OR make fun its subject, Mr. Mature, such as in the case of the guy who's picture I use as my avatar(that would be Groucho) once making a joke about Victor's "k nockers" being bigger than Hedy Lamarr's, and/or in that vein, 'cause I LIKE humor of ALL sorts, and I DON'T think anything and everything I say around here should be treated as some kind of "sacrosanct" material...but yeah, that's just ME...and so now that I've gotten THAT out of the way....) LOL
While watching "I Wake Up Screaming" the other evening, it occurred to me how versatile an actor Victor Mature truly was. In the case of this film, playing with such ease and naturalness the glib entertainment promoter who's under suspicion of murder.
And then there was his turn as Doc Holliday in John Ford's "My Darling Clementine", and of which studio head Darryl F, Zanuck once sent word to Ford of being pleased that he had cast Mature in his picture with the following words:
"Personally, I think the guy has been one of the most under-rated performers in Hollywood. The public is crazy about him and strangely enough every picture that he has been in has been a big box-office hit. Yet the Romanoff round table has refused to take him seriously as an actor. A part like Doc Holiday will be sensational for him and I agree with you that the peculiar traits of his personality are ideal for a characterisation such as this."
Add to these thoughts that Mature would be very well cast and acquit himself quite well in many of the better Noir films such as "Kiss of Death" and "Cry of the City", AND be as believable as anyone COULD be in many of the "sword and sandal" epics, and I think this goes a long way in proving my point about his versatility.
And while you'd never what to see him attempt the title role of The Bard's "Hamlet", I think Mature's seemingly natural ability to express real human emotions on his face, from anger to joy and many emotions between those two, SHOULD give rise to the thought that he was more than just "Beefcake".
(...oh, and I LOVE the story of his wonderful self-deprecating humor and an example of which that goes that when told he was rejected for admission into a certain country club because he was an actor, his reply was reportedly: I'm not an actor...and I've got sixty-four films to prove it!"...yep, my kinda guy...no pretentiousness at all)
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Nicely stated post, Lorna. However, I've always gotten the sense that while she did play "the strong woman" very effectively in many of her roles, her roles with Wayne always seemed to have her ultimately bending to his will by the end of the movie. Though of course, that WAS the predominate man/woman dynamic of that era in both reel AND real life.
(...might that be the reason you say you got "pummelled" for stating this the last time?...not so much the quality of her performance(s), but the idea that her character's "feminist" stances in these instances only went so far?...just wonderin')
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I can't help it, Dargo. It's my new word of the week and, believe me, it's a tough word to fit into most conversations.
LOL
Yeah, I suppose.
(...unless of course one might happen to be a Ringling Brothers and Barnum & Bailey groupie, and THEN it might come around into a conversation now and then)
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You little coulrophobe, you.
"Give a man a fish and he will eat for one day, but TEACH a man to fish and......"
LOL
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I never met him, but know his beautiful daughter who bears a striking resemblance to him. She has wonderful stories about his time in Hollywood.
Word is Mature had a wonderful self-deprecating sense of humor.
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Happens all the time now with me...though I'm the one who usually instigates the conversation. I'll explain...
About six months ago and at the behest of my wife who told me that now that we were both retired, I needed to "get out of her hair occasionally"(I'm sure some of you people around here can understand that LOL), I jokingly relayed this "request" of hers to one of my tennis buddies one day and who then assisted me in getting a little part-time gig with a shuttle service that runs from Sedona to the Phoenix Airport and back, and which he had been doing for about a year or so.
The two-hour drives each way seem to go a heck of a lot quicker whenever there's a conversation going on inside the van or town car. And so, seeing as how I have "a captive audience" during these runs, I will often steer the conversation toward this subject and by asking the people I'm shuttling, "So, who likes classic movies, and what are your favorite films?"
The most common response I hear is that my riders "like" classic film and occasionally watch TCM, but are not passionate about it and possess modicum knowledge of the subject at best, though I DO every once in a while come across someone with more interest, passion and knowledge than the norm. These rides of course really seem the shortest.
Very often when I mention my favorites, "The Apartment" and "The Best Years of Our Lives", many of the people with that aforementioned "modicum knowledge" will admit that they're not familiar with those films or haven't watched them in such a long time that they can't remember too much about them. And so, after giving them a brief synopsis of these two films(and sometimes doing a little of the great dialogue in them) I'll, half-jokingly, tell these riders that "their homework" is to seek those two films out and watch them the next time TCM shows them.
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Looking at Mr. Litel's VERY lengthy filmography in the IMDb website just now, I believe we might have found someone who appeared on the screen(both the big and small) even more than Ward Bond.
Seems that face of his, a face which projected earnestness and sincerity in spades, and his overall manner lent him to be cast many times as a judge or some other public official when movie and early television producers were looking for that type, and especially in his later years and especially during and in the "Golden Age" of television Westerns. Though yeah, I do also remember him playing a few villains early on in his career to good effect.
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Wow, Dargo, I must admit to being impressed with your vocabulary and use of the word coulrophobic. I had to look that one up - the fear of clowns.
Well, whata ya know, I'm a coulrophobe!
Obviously, I'm not alone in this because there's a word for it. I'd post a picture of one of those painted faced creatures from Hell here right now except I'm too scared to do it.
Sorry to disrupt this thread with all the clown talk. Over and out and back to the topic of first movies seen at the show.
Yeah, I'm actually a lot smarter than I usually let-on, ya know. And THAT of course is because I'm not one inclined to...
..."blow my own horn".
(...sorry...didn't mean to scare ya here, ol' buddy!) LOL
Lookalikes?
in General Discussions
Posted
Wow, Ham! Now THAT'S a good one!
How about a caption for "The Amazing Colossal Man" picture of maybe:
"Who loves ya, Baby?! Well, I WILL if you'll run down to the store in that Mercury of yours and buy me every lollipop they've got! This quitting smoking is KILLIN' me here!"