Vautrin
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Posts posted by Vautrin
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1 hour ago, Hibi said:
You could see where it was going by the people who were being interviewed. (as opposed to those who weren't) I was shocked she got it in the back though. There have been several episodes over the years about disputed boundary claims. Never ends well!
Yes, after the half way point some people are obvious by their absence in the interview
sections, which gives one the idea they were probably the victim. Yes, boundary claims
often figure in the program, along with pets and kids loudly playing outdoors. I think the
older woman had lived there much longer than her neighbors and likely felt some
resentment when they claimed what she thought was her land as their own. I also get the
idea that some of these disputes last longer than they seem to in the show, so that things
are simmering over the years until someone blows their top.
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1 hour ago, Hibi said:
Not to change the subject, but did you watch Fear Thursday night?
Uh oh
. Yes I did see it, classic FTN. This land is my land, this land ain't your land. I'm sure that
older woman could be a pain, but to shoot her in the back of the head. And by the guy who was
only indirectly involved in the land dispute. I'm glad they put him away. I was hoping that there
would be a legal determination of the dispute because it wasn't clear where the boundaries were.
The death of the woman made that a moot point. I love the beginning narration of each episode,
Joe Blow hoped to start anew in the quiet and peaceful neighborhood of X. Then everything slowly
goes to hell.
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14 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:
I had to read "Wild Strawberries" in College English class and watch the movie.
This was the 70s and Bergman was really hot in inteligencia America. And Liv Ullmann was becoming hot with the general public.
Maybe you can refresh my memory, is " Love and Death " his Bergmanesque type movie?
I've liked okay the few Woody Allen movies that I've seen, but so many of them all seem to be very similar.
"Play It Again, Sam" is one of the few that I really enjoyed. Probably because at the time I had not yet seen "Casablanca". LOL
I think Bergman started to be in vogue in the mid 1960s to mid 1970s. I remember a girl mentioning him during a college class like it was a big deal and I guess at the time it sort of was. Love and Death is just your basic Woody Allen 1970s comedy set in 19th century Russia instead of 20th century NYC, with a parody of 19th century Russia literature included. I haven't seen it in years, but it's not one of my favorite Allen films. I haven't seen any of his recent films, but there was a time when they seemed to revolve around the same types of big city intellectuals with relationship problems, nttawwt. To me Interiors was his first Bergman like film, so alike that it's unintentionally funny. Bergman's films are about universal themes, but I've always wondered would they come off the same if they were set in Acapulco instead of Sweden.
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The Woodman "borrowed" a lot more from the Bergman than the Farrowwoman ever did.
I caught part of it just by chance. The comments were just run of the mill Bergman stuff,
nothing very special.
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3 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:
I have the impression that Ratso really wanted to impress Joe for the sake of his own ego and self worth. I also think they came to respect and love each other as friends and urban survivors.
If you want to see a movie where 1 box office heavyweight actor plays a homosexual, you can watch " Dog Day "-- another great film by a great director, but no happy ending there.
Yeah, the country mouse and the city mouse finding one another and making an alliance
that slowly turns into a friendship. I got a kick out of Ratso giving Buck advice about
how to be a gigolo. I've seen Dog Day Afternoon two or three times. Very well done.
Pacino and Cazale were even dumber than Ratso and Joe.
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I can imagine that Ratso could be interested in Joe, but it's hard to see how Joe, unless
he had some kink, would be interested in Ratso.
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That totally sucks
. I was a little surprised myself.
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6 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:
"Midnight Cowboy" is one of my favorite college movies. I bought the the soundtrack three times: on record, on tape and finally on CD.
It Is a tour de force for both actors, but I do think that Dustin Hoffman has the "flashier" role. I have no idea if it is consistent or partially constructed from the novel. It doesn't matter, because it's a cinematic Masterpiece.
Once you get into this perverted mindset with these two characters, you can't help but be on their side, even though they're both hopeless idiots.
When I saw this movie in Paris, I loved the title the French put on it "Macadam Cowboy"-- emphasizing the all encompassing on the street quality of the movie.
Nothing about this movie bothered me until the very end. I didn't expect a Hollywood ending, but I couldn't help but root for Ratso. And John Wayne, who's mentioned in this movie, stole Ratso's Oscar. That was really weird oh, but I guess both those actors cancelled each other out.
And then it's hard to compete against cancer.
Three soundtracks, that's devotion. I was never much into movie soundtracks. The only one I have
is A Clockwork Orange in LP form. I agree that Hoffman's role is a showier than Voight's, though
both do very well. I always thought Buck was just a naive guy who got into situations because,
for the most part, he didn't know any better. Ratso was just a streetwise con man, at least at the
beginning. To me Macadam Cowboy sounds more like a guy in a suburb somewhere. It did have
that upbeat ending which doesn't seem to go along with the rest of the movie, but most people
are probably glad that Joe Buck was going to get a second chance in sunny Florida. Just think
of all the rich middle-age widows down there. No more sticky floored movie theaters. And it's also
hard to compete against a well loved but Oscar less actor who is getting along in years
and won't have many chances left.
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I've seen it maybe a half dozen times over the years and enjoyed it. A small town hick coming
to the big city to make his mark and utterly failing meets a native who isn't much of anything.
These guys go together. I'm rarely depressed by depressing movies, which Midnight Cowboy
is in certain respects. There are many comic moments too. My favorite is when Joe gives up
on high end women and has to hustle in Times Square, where he lets Bob Balaban as his
schoolboy client suck him off while he watches that low budget sci-fi flick. Priceless. I still recall
hearing that Florida orange juice commercial on the radio which Joe and Ratso listen to as they
shiver in their condemned building. I don't know if I'll watch it again this time. For films that
I've seen a number of times it all matters what mood I'm in.
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12 hours ago, EricJ said:
I'm not sure of the age here, but it's a good way to tell other Millennial movie-phobes when they have symbolic ideas of movies in their imaginations just from a decade or a genre. They're always "90% certain", but a great movie gets you with that 10% of uncertainty, and looking for that is how we grow up. 😁
For example, you may think you know what "Astaire & Rogers" is about, until you sit down for "Shall We Dance?" and find out just what a snarky overconfident wiseguy Fred could be in his movies, and how much Ginger could be a romcom-sparring-partner for him...Or are we just going to quote that feminist t-shirt/coffee-cup/bumper-sticker again?
Now, when I was a kid, the very idea of watching Shirley Temple was insulting (an idea mostly formed by Cindy Brady, when Jan & Marsha told him dad's client was really a Hollywood agent)...But, sitting down one night with an old movie channel, they were showing "Heidi", and--well, yes, her movies were corny, but little Shirl was such a trouper, she's in complete command of every movie she's in. Later on, I found out that EVERY movie she made was a clone of "Heidi", so I felt I'd gotten the essential cross-section, but it didn't kill me to get that basic ground information.
I'm a boomer, so we can't blame our millenial friends. As I've already said, I've sampled some of these
movies and have no desire to see them in full. I don't doubt the talent of Astaire and Rodgers or l'il
Shirley, I just don't have any interest in watching them. So my lack of interest in concrete, not symbolic.
I should add that I do like Shirley Temple in some of the movies she did as an adult. To balance things,
I do like Vertigo, 2001, Katharine Hepburn, Bringing Up Baby, Godfather I & II (III was pretty hard
to take), even Shadow of a Doubt. Sure Uncle Charlie almost wears a Kiss Me I'm a Psycho tee
shirt, but that never took away my enjoyment of the movie.
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13 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:
I mean ... wow. You're gonna do what you're gonna do, but I feel like you're depriving yourself. If you really want to have a broad base appreciation of some of the big themes and threads of movie history, I feel like you ought to take in some of this material. You could suffer some of these movies just once, surely!
That's why I would never make a good cinephile. There are some types of movies I'm just not
interested in. I've seen bits of some Shirley Temple films and I have no interest going any farther.
I wouldn't use the phrase I can't stand them, I just have no interest in watching them. I realize
I'm missing a bit of movie history, but I can live with that.
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I can usually figure out, when I know in general what a movie is about, whether
I want to see it or not. I'm about 90% certain I wouldn't want to see The Sound of Muzak,
The Unsinkable Molly Brown (the dumb title is enough of a clue), Gigi, etc. I also stay
away from those overlong Biblical epics like The Ten Commandments, Ben-Hur, etc. I've
never seen a Shirley Temple film and don't plan to. The same goes for Astaire and Rogers.
No doubt they're very talented hoofers, but I just ain't interested. I did watch Mister
Smith Goes to Washington when it was last on, only because I hadn't seen it in about
20 years. Pretty cornball, which does lead to some unintended comedy.
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On 7/31/2019 at 4:05 PM, laffite said:
Agree entirely, and I would say to a considerable degree, especially for 1931 when they were just learning to make movies that talk.
A Place in the Sun also left out large chunks of the novel but I prefer it to the 1931 version.
It has a certain energy that the earlier version lacks for me. More assured direction and of
course Monty Clift and Liz Taylor instead of Philip Holmes and Frances Dee.
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14 hours ago, laffite said:
And i as well. With the advent of CD audio books I sometimes get antsy that there are enough discs for the length of the book and go through any trouble necessary (including bothering librarians who don't know either) to nail it down.. The notion that if there is no indication, then it must be unabridged, does not always satisfy. That's a good rule of thumb but sometimes I'm not convinced. Now that I have access to the Library of Congress (due to some vision impairment) and am sensitive to time (number of hours) rather number of discs, I am immediately en garde when there are more than one item per book (or oeuvre) and ensure discrepancies in time duration are ironed out before choosing. In other words, only unabridged will do.
One would think that unabridged would be straightforward, but I imagine that that is not always
the case. I saw the 1931 version of An American Tragedy on TCM a few nights ago. The bare bones
of the novel are there, but that's about it. The details of what made the book what it is are pretty
much missing, though given the time constraints of the movie that's understandable to a degree.
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15 hours ago, Gershwin fan said:
Let me guess. You dislike him because of the Perdicaris Affair? lol. Roosevelt was right that Dickens can really be a bit of a bore. Dickens could have really benefited from a better editor.
In non-literature matters, I dislike him because he was a loud mouth, clueless imperialist. I don't
know his tastes in fiction, but I would guess Dickens was not enough of a he-man writer for TR.
Dickens, like most great writers, had his flaws, but Roosevelt's criticism sounds more like that of
an ignorant spoiled child that that of a serious critic.
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Personally I stick to the unabridged editions. If people, for whatever reason, prefer an
abridged version that's fine. Great Expectations has had so many adaptations that the
original book seems to get a little lost in the crowd. I've always liked it and read it >1. Like
other Dickens' characters, Pip has to go through a number of humbling experiences before
he sees the light, at least as Dickens considered it. A book I've always enjoyed is Tristram
Shandy. Hard to summarize and with not much of a plot but a very wild, unusual piece of
literature. ~~~~~~~~~. I don't take advice on literature from overweight American
imperialists and won't be starting now.
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14 hours ago, laffite said:
Yes, that makes perfect sense, in fact, it was naive to think I would find those Tapley-Lupin segments in the same order as the screenplay. But the adaptation, as I said before, does a good job of covering it. I didn't think, just for the record, that the TV adaptation over sentimentalized that little romance, I thought it was just right.
Tapley is a feel-good character in a way, for his insistence to be "jolly" all the time and he is altogether quite a decent chap. In the TV show he is given a weird accent that is probably cockney or related to it.
...and I believe he practically saves Martin's life while in America. As you and others probably know, Dickens visited America in 1842 and was none to pleased about the place. MC was his first novel post-America visit and he airs his decidedly naegative views.
Even in the face of overwhelming odds Tapley remains upbeat, though I think there were
a few times when even he had some doubts, though he kept on being jolly. Yes, Martin
came down with a serious fever due to the pestilential conditions of the new town where
they settled, which was totally unlike the glowing recommendations of the founders,
and Mark nursed him back to health. The satire on America is very biting and
entertaining and something that would not be out of place today.
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Make a great second rate Tennessee Williams' play
The front porch of the old Beauregard manse. It is but a shell of its former self. Kudzu grows rampant on the porch rails, hairs grows rampant on Ida Mae's chin as she opens the creaking porch door and sits in an old rush bottom chair and fans herself.
Ida Mae: For lord's sake it's a hot outta here. It's even hotter than the night old man
Blamtinder kilt himself in an auto-erotic hoedown. Lulu Mae (raises voice) LULA MAE.
Lula Mae: (speaking behind the screen door of the porch) Yes mamar, what dues you
want?
Ida Mae: Damn, it's hotter than pig's snot out here. Bring me some of dat sweet tea from
the icebox. And Lulu...
Lula Mae: Yessum.
Ida Mae: Put a little sumtine extry in it.
Lula Mae: You wants some more sugar?
Ida Mae: Oh lordy, you are dumber than ditchwarter. I mean put some lively spirits in that
sucker. Where's Pa?
Lula Mae: I think he's down in the back room of the pool hall putting Miz Oglethorpe behind
the eight ball.
Ida Mae: Well when he gets home I gonta take a hot poker and put it up his nevermind.
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4 hours ago, laffite said:
More than once, I admire that. Thank you for mentioning whales and whaling, the so-called diversions. I'm sure you're right they are more interesting that I gave them credit in an earlier post. I dissed the novel for having these and that wasrather silly, really. It's my lack of patience was at issue, not the novel itself.
I read half of this some years. I think I ran out of gas, not out of boredom, other constraints probably. Earlier I plugged MiddleMarch as a very good BBC TV production, and Martin Chuzzlewit is another, (Paul Scofield and Tom Wilkinson, for two) The latter's portrayal as the unctuous (as well as other sundry negative traits) Mr Pecksniff is a gem for the ages. All six episodes are available on a single disc. The love interest between Mark Tapley (whose signature attribute is to be always cheerful) and Mrs Lupin, the hostess of the Blue Dragon, is rather sweetly depicted. Mrs Lupin is a widow and slightly older than young Tapley, which adds a certain charm. There is a scene prior to Tapley's venture in America, and one after. The lump in my throat over these two led me to search for the corresponding passages in the book, but I couldn't find them. Are they elsewhere in the narrative, or did the TV production enhance the relationship a bit? If so, the enhancement was deftly applied and touched my inner sap. As I grow older my perennial instance that "I am not sentimental, dammit?" is losing it's insistent quality as my resistance grows dimmer and dimmer. But I at least maintain, probably defensively, that these types of things have to be done effectively to reach me. I'll spare you the delicious scene of rapprochement where Tertius Lydgate, the new doctor in town, woos Rosamund Vincy in MiddleMarch. Perfection!
I suppose to some degree Melville was following the old adage to write about what you know.
Even with his uniquely weird style there are some parts of the book where all the information
about whaling gets to be dull, but to me they are survivable and a minor annoyance to the
greater pleasures of the book. I've meant to read Middlemarch for the last few years, so maybe
I'll get around to it in 2020. As I recall, the gradual romance between Tapley and Mrs. Lupin is
in the novel but it takes place at long intervals between other action, so it's a bit non-continuous.
In a novel this long it's not unusual for some characters to "disappear" for stretches of time.
Tapley also aids Martin in taking stock of his character and making improvements to it. The
overly sentimental occurs sometimes in Dickens but I think for the most part he manages to
keep it at bay. I enjoyed Martin Chuzzlewit as much as any other Dickens' novel even if it is
not as famous as some of the others.
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3 hours ago, cigarjoe said:
They Drive by Night (1940)
I've seen that one but I think the one I recall isn't TDBN. I'll have to do a little checking
and see if I can come up with a title.
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3 hours ago, LornaHansonForbes said:
1. I guess living in ASHEVILLE, it's got a deep meaning for you.
2. I keep thinking about reading some of the lesser known Dickenseses, this and also BARNABY RUDGE.
Actually I read it before I moved to North Carolina. For some reason I lost interest in
Wolfe and never read any of his other books. Maybe Look Homeward, Angel has
something in it that appeals to younger readers. I live outside Asheville, but I did visit
Wolfe's home a long time ago. As you may know, there was a fire there a number of
years ago and it took awhile for it to be restored so it could be open to the public again.
Martin Chuzzlewit is another of those tales of an arrogant though unaware
young man who must go through a lot of tribulations before he learns to be a better
person. There is also a hilarious section set in America, making fun of the braggadocio
and cluelessness of the inhabitants of the new country. Next I'm going to read The
Golden Bowl, blindfolded with one hand tied behind my back.
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A crooked produce peddler noir or the poor man's version of The Wages of Fear. The last twenty
minutes or so were pure Hollywood cornpone. All of a sudden Polly, who seemed okay, turns into
a money hungry shrew. I guess that's so Conte can marry the wisecracking pro with a
heart of gold.
Sorry, doesn't pass the smell test. Other than that it was pretty good, though nothing
very special. Even Lee J. Cobb didn't go full bore. I got a laugh out of how, at the end,
Jack Oakie makes sure to keep together the money that Cobb has scattered on bar. Here's
a man with his head screwed on right. I seem to remember another film about crooked
produce peddlers and truckers, though I can't remember the title.
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Well I looked at my watch, it was the midnight hour,
I told the old bag don't be so sour,
And we was reelin, reelin' and rockin' rollin' till the break of dawn.
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. Yes I did see it, classic FTN. This land is my land, this land ain't your land. I'm sure that
Disappointed to see the commentary by Woody Allen on TCM
in General Discussions
Posted
Yes, revival theaters, bookstores, auditing college classes, that's where you could find the typical Allen characters of that period. I remember going to revival houses in the early and mid 1970s and they showed both the studio era classics and the usual suspects foreign films--Bergman, Fellini, Truffaut, etc. At that time there weren't other options to see these films so one had to head out to the revival theaters or to MOMA. The former were usually short on amenities but that was just part of the experience. Not as convenient as popping a tape or disc into a machine but more enjoyable.