lzcutter
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Posts posted by lzcutter
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As to who gets to decide(as far as TCM programming is concerned)-I'd say,along the lines of a republican form of democracy-it would be impossible to have direct "majority rules",but TCM should make a point of at least determining what the majority of its viewers,and potential viewers who are seeking to view classic movies,would like to see,and then of course using their necessary discretion based upon that.>>
But Melanie, isn't that what TCM is currently doing? Yes, there are those who want only classic films made before 1959, those that want to include films made until the demise of the studio system and then those of us who want the films of the 70s included and even those that want more recent films. Is any one group larger than all the rest or is it possible that our numbers are all pretty similar and so TCM is trying to program for all of us?
If we go by a majority rules then we have to be willing to live with the consquences. For example, what if the numbers for silent films is less than all the rest, should TCM stop running silents because the majority of viewers don't like them or watch them?
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NYgirl,
There's a thread "We lost Shelley Winters" a little further down if you want to read what folks are saying.
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lzcutter,you seem to be up on these things-just when did the studio system,as a whole,really end? I know that it didn't happen all at once and overnight,but what's the timeframe that is usually accepted as being the end of the studio system? I'm under the impression that the end of it all came sometime in the mid-sixties,I don't know why I'm thinking that.>>
The studio system (as many of us think of it) lasted until the mid-1970s when MGM had its famous auction, Jack Warner finally retired and the studios moved into the hands of corporations such as Gulf -Western, Kinney and others. Many of the big blockbuster musicals of the late 1960s were produced by the then waning studio system. Many cite "Easy Rider" as the death knell of the studio system but in reality, the changing taste of the movie going public coupled with the death or retirement of many in the executive offices plus the fact that the studios were all having trouble making money. In the early 1950s the studios started trimming what they considered the fat by cancelling stars contracts and letting their big name talent go in hopes of staving off the red ink. The ink kept flowing and cuts kept being made. The reality was there was no way Americans would return to movie theatres in the numbers they had during the 1930s and during the War Years and the men who ran the studios kept hoping that wasn't the reality. All were all factors in the passing.
The 1970s are often referred to the second golden age of movies and a number of wonderful movies that would never get made today were produced. With the burial of the Hays Code movies were allowed to be more realistic in dealing with life matters, adult themes and it wasn't all four letter words and nudity. Some truly classic movies came out of that era such as "Last Picture Show", "What's Up, Doc", "The Godfather 1 & 2",
"Three Days of the Condor", "McCable and Mrs. Miller", "Nashville", "All the President's Men", "Coming Home", "The Parralax View", "Chinatown" and more.
It would be shame for TCM not to show these films because you cannot see them presented in letterbox format and unedited on the majority of cable stations. Many of these films have withstood twenty years (and more) are regarded by many as true classics.
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Oldisgold,
It is more than likely a problem with your cable or satellight provider.
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Melanie,
I don't know that first time viewer coming to TCM to watch the Miyazake festival would get a distorted view of TCM. The promotional material between films would still be the "classic" TCM material so the viewer would get a better idea of what TCM is offering I would hope.
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Bollywood,
That was my first thought before I read your reply!
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This was brought up on the Miyazaki anime thread and whether or not his films should be shown as part of TCM and I thought it might be interesting to open the argument to everyone:
Who or what defines what classic films should be shown on TCM?
My take:
The term classic means many things to many people and TCM provides the big tent in which we can all, at some time during the broadcast day, find something we enjoy. Should TCM narrow its focus to only show "classic" movies made before 1959? How do you define "classic". Too narrow a definition leaves out many great thrillers, film noirs, b movies, low budget gower gulch productions, etc and the audiences that enjoy them. The same holds true for too wide a definition runs the risk of alienating the core audience that TCM has.
There has to be a middle ground and TCM is trying to walk that middle ground. They have said, as recently as last week, that they are not going the way of AMC but they are trying to provide films that appeal to everyone in the tent. Some folks love the Young Composers festival and some don't. Some love the documentaries and some don't. Occasionally there is a Star of the month that won't appeal to everybody. What do you do? The Miyazaki festival is only a month long. There will be folks who watch it, there will be folks who have never watched TCM before and because of this festival will get a better idea of what TCM is about. And there will be those that don't like it. Do you not run something because of offending someone who's definition of classic doesn't include Miyazaki or do you run the films because, though it was made post 1959, the animation, the stories and the character are timeless and classic?
Where do you draw the line and who makes the decision for all of us of which movies deserve to be called classic?
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Mongo,
Here's a piece of history that I remember from an article about "Cuckoo's Nest" (I think it was in Rolling Stone) that when casting the picture they put an ad in the paper that said:
"Do you have a face that scares off timber wolves? If so, contact...." Vincent Schiavelli was one of the actors that responded to the ad. Maybe an urban legend but I remember reading it back when the article was first published. Showing my age, I know.
My favorite role of his is in "Buckaroo Banzai" as "Big-Boo-Tay".
Wasit him or Curtis Armstrong that was married to the woman who played the assistant on "Moonlighting"? I'm thinking it was Vincent and they met on the set. Armstrong played her on-screen love interest.
Does that ring a bell?????
Lynn in Sherman Oaks
Message was edited by:
lzcutter
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There really do have be some boundaries,and at one time,there were some generally,fairly loose ones of what was a "classic" movie-but they're becoming SO ambiguous that before it's over,it'll just be that "SOMEone considers it a 'classic'". >>
Melanie,
The term classic means many things to many people and TCM provides the big tent in which we can all, at some time during the broadcast day, find something we enjoy. Should TCM narrow its focus to only show "classic" movies made before 1959? How do you define "classic". Too narrow a definition leaves out many great thrillers, film noirs, b movies, low budget gower gulch productions, etc and the audiences that enjoy them. The same holds true for too wide a definition runs the risk of alienating the core audience that TCM has.
There has to be a middle ground and TCM is trying to walk that middle ground. They have said, as recently as last week, that they are not going the way of AMC but they are trying to provide films that appeal to everyone in the tent. Some folks love the Young Composers festival and some don't. Some love the documentaries and some don't. Occasionally there is a Star of the month that won't appeal to everybody. What do you do? The Miyazaki festival is only a month long. There will be folks who watch it, there will be folks who have never watched TCM before and because of this festival will get a better idea of what TCM is about. And there will be those that don't like it. Do you not run something because of offending someone who's definition of classic doesn't include Miyazaki or do you run the films because, though it was made post 1959, the animation, the stories and the character are timeless and classic?
Where do you draw the line and who makes the decision for all of us of which movies deserve to be called classic?
Message was edited by:
lzcutter
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Perhaps one of the arts or even cartoon channels would be more appropriate.>>
What little I have seen of Miyazaki's work, in terms of animation and story, is leaps and bounds ahead of anything the cartoon networks show. I can't imagine his work being showcased on Cartoon Network.
I applaud TCM for showing us international cinema. Not every classic is silent or black and white or made prior to 1950 or American made.
As for a TCM mandate of only showing us "classic" movies. I never knew TCM had a mandate other than to show us quality classic films (from all decades and all countries), uncut and commercial free.
What I consider "classic" others may not and what they consider "classic", I may not.
TCM tries to keep us all happy even though we all have different definitions of "classic"
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I am an adult who PAYS Turner CLASSIC Movies in order to see CLASSIC movies. >>
Melanie,
You actually pay your cable company for TCM. Your money does not directly go from your cable company to TCM.
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Perhaps because sometimes TCM likes to broaden our horizons and introduce to us films that we might not bother watch in the theatre but might be willing to give a look at via TCM???
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MovieJoe,
Are you sure that "Lion Roars" was produced by PBS? I originally saw it on TNT (back when they were an all movie channel in the early-90s) and thought it was a TNT production or at least an MGM production. It was made during that time that most film studios were turning a significant number (in terms of age) and many were doing "A History of" documentaries.
I didn't realize there was a companion book.
I had completely forgotten about the RKO series. It was great!
Really wish Warner Bros would release the "Lion Roars" and TCM should definitely look into running it. It runs about six hours and would most TCM-ites be willing to to give up a two hour chunk of the schedule for three weeks to show it instead of classic movies?
Either way, it should be shown. It's awesome.
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Cooper,
With the exception of February and the 31 days of Oscar, it doesn't feel like TCM is showing more and more modern movies and fewer of the others.
That last few nights have been a pre-code delight!
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Mandy,
Go to the schedule page and up in the upper left corner is the search database window. Change the automatic default setting from database to site. Then type in name or title you are looking for and the results will come up including if it's being shown in the next three months.
The key is to change the default setting from database to site.
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Speaking of James Wong Howe, his widow, the writer Sanora Babb, died over the weekend.
They met in Hollywood and she ran a Chinese restaurant that he owned in North Hollywood for awhile in the early 1940s. They dated despite the fact that it was against the law at that time.
By all accounts, they were a happily married couple.
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Ron,
Excellent idea. One of the things that we (the universal we) tend to do here is lump everyone working in Hollywood today into "celebrity". I still maintain there is a big difference between the Paris Hiltons, reality stars and those that are more famous for making headlines and the actors and actresses who show up, know their lines, practise their craft and go home.
If we (the universal we) would stop watching "Access Hollywood", "Entertainment Tonight" and stop reading the tabloids (including People, Star, Us etc) perhaps there would be less of an emphasis on those who are mainly famous for their churlish behaviour.
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Donna,
Check the box set of Universal Horror films. I believe it's part of that package.
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Chuckles,
I agree wholeheartedly. Would love to see this wonderful series re-run and available on DVD.
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Frank,
One of the things that happens is that we as a culture change and that change affects the music we hear, the tv shows and the movies.
Commercials are a great way for celebrities and actors to make some good money fast (especially overseas) so they probably won't go away.
But as our tastes change it makes finding good scripts harder and harder for actors to find.
They aren't necessarily ready to retire but they sometimes don't make the wisest decisions about the scripts either. On the other hand, the payday may too good to turn down.
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Another hold up could be that the film is not on a digital format (digibeta or comparable) that TCM can run.
Lynn in Sherman Oaks
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Rudy is going to be the star of the month in May, I believe and TCM may be showing "Rocks" as part of that tribute.
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Neil,
We don't have a flat screen but do have 36" Sony television and a great surround system.
It not only looks great in letterbox but they did a good job on the mix as well. Still think they show too much of the Phantom's face in the beginning but I think it is a good adaptation of the musical.
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Bollywood,
That's the one! I tried searching using film library, film libraries but could not find it!
Thanks so much. I agree with you that it should be a sticky!
Who or what defines a TCM classic
in General Discussions
Posted
Rusty,
Wow, thanks for the compliment! It is something I will certainly think about.