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So, why does SHANE get to be so special?


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Not sarcastic or anything, I get that it's a great movie...

 

I'm just curious as to why this FESTIVAL OF 100 WESTERNS isn't just:

 

TCM PRESENTS A FESTIVAL OF 100 GREAT WESTERNS,

 

but instead IS:

 

TCM PRESENTS SHANE (AND 100 OTHER GREAT WESTERNS).

 

Something special about the print? a restored version? (couldn't find any info on the main site, they have an annoying flashplayer and want me to to sit through some fancypants animated schedule and any explanation on why SHANE gets to be SO SPECIAL is contained somewhere within.)

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Not sarcastic or anything, I get that it's a great movie...

 

I'm just curious as to why this FESTIVAL OF 100 WESTERNS isn't just:

 

TCM PRESENTS A FESTIVAL OF 100 GREAT WESTERNS,

 

but instead IS:

 

TCM PRESENTS SHANE (AND 100 OTHER GREAT WESTERNS).

 

Something special about the print? a restored version? (couldn't find any info on the main site, they have an annoying flashplayer and want me to to sit through some fancypants animated schedule and any explanation on why SHANE gets to be SO SPECIAL is contained somewhere within.)

 

Someone explained that in the early days of TCM, they had a western festival entitled something like "100 Great Westerns (except Shane)", because they couldn't get the rights to show it, and they wanted to explain right up front why it wasn't being shown. This new fest's title is a callback to that.

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O God, my heart was pumping there for a minute, I thought that there might be someone else in the galaxy that though not so far as not liking it but of the opinion nevertheless that perhaps just perhaps it might not be all up that's it cracked up to be. Everybody is so gushy about it. It's a beloved film, that I know, and I know it a great film too, mostly by the great acclaim it receives, but it hasn't done me that well the though, as usual, I'll hide behind having not seen it for ages. I will suspend judgement until then. A fascinating thread title.

 

It's special because of its acclaim, and anyone of the faith would probably have a heart attack if the pre-emptive* warning was not there. I think you know this already.

 

Carry on.

 

*cool word

:)

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Someone explained that in the early days of TCM, they had a western festival entitled something like "100 Great Westerns (except Shane)", because they couldn't get the rights to show it, and they wanted to explain right up front why it wasn't being shown. This new fest's title is a callback to that.

 

"you're 'putting me on.' "

 

1974%20Young%20Frankenstein%20-%20El%20j

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and YES, for the record, I ADMIT I was picking a somewhat provocative wording for the title**; for the record I understand anyone who wants to make the case that SHANE is in fact THE greatest western ever made, i'd certainly give it four stars; it's pretty damned great.

 

I really hope the version they show doesn't have those night shots that're too dark to see though.

 

anyone else remember that?

 

** sue me. it's been slow and quiet around here

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and YES, for the record, I ADMIT I was picking a somewhat provocative wording for the title**; for the record I understand anyone who wants to make the case that SHANE is in fact THE greatest western ever made, i'd certainly give it four stars; it's pretty damned great.

 

I really hope the version they show doesn't have those night shots that're too dark to see though.

 

anyone else remember that?

 

** sue me. it's been slow and quiet around here

 

The version of SHANE that I saw last on TCM did have some darker night shots but at least Brandon deWilde's final line "Bye, Shane!" wasn't drowned out (removed?) as it was on the DVD release of the movie.

I think someone mixing the sound for the DVD thought they were doing good by bumping up the score at that moment, not realizing that they were eliminating  dialogue. (I would argue that this is important dialogue since it contrasts with the the child's "Come back, Shane!" moments earlier.)

It's interesting that when I turn on the French subtitles on the DVD "Au revoir, Shane" appears on the screen even though Brandon deWilde's voice cannot be heard at that moment.

 

Ideally I'd like to see a version of SHANE with less dark night scenes AND the "Bye, Shane!" dialogue audible.

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I always used to just suppose SHANE gets the accolades and special attention it does because for the time it came out it was SO different from what people had come to expect from the genre.  And it's not without it's influence.

 

Anyone who's seen CLINT EASTWOOD's PALE RIDER probably( and a bit sardonically) referred to it as "Shane The Preacher".

 

Sure, I've heard over the years many refer to SHANE as "The greatest Western ever made".  I also heard the same about THE SEARCHERS.  I thought a bit about that last night watching the latter.  A very good movie, yes.  But, the "greatest Western"?  I-I-I-I- dunno.....

 

I rarely go by what some AFI wag clams about any particular movie.  I more rely on what I LIKE the best.  And for me, neither fits the bill.

 

In comparison, I have a SHIRT I like the "best", but my wife is sick of seeing.  She likes guacamole while I think it looks like a plateful of what happens when a dog eats too much grass.  But many people LOVE it, and mine is only one opinion amongst many.

 

And I never mull over the ending.  Whether it's good or bad, what's said and heard or not.  I'M the type of guy who wonders what happened next.  Did Starret ever have a successful farm or ranch?  What kind of man did Joey grow to be?  Or did Marian from then on always envision Shane when making love to her husband?   THAT sort of stuff!

 

Sepiatone

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The version of SHANE that I saw last on TCM did have some darker night shots but at least Brandon deWilde's final line "Bye, Shane!" wasn't drowned out (removed?) as it was on the DVD release of the movie.

I think someone mixing the sound for the DVD thought they were doing good by bumping up the score at that moment, not realizing that they were eliminating  dialogue. (I would argue that this is important dialogue since it contrasts with the the child's "Come back, Shane!" moments earlier.)

It's interesting that when I turn on the French subtitles on the DVD "Au revoir, Shane" appears on the screen even though Brandon deWilde's voice cannot be heard at that moment.

 

Ideally I'd like to see a version of SHANE with less dark night scenes AND the "Bye, Shane!" dialogue audible.

 

YES!

 

The controversial "up yours, kid" non-director's "cut" of the movie. i recall the discussion of that as well. that's one little tweak that makes one BIG difference. 

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Thank you, Lawrence. And thanks to Barton Keyes for posting the link, if I may be so bold as to paste the following paragraph from the interview.

 

Q: You are hosting TCM’s Shane Plus A Hundred More Great Westerns this month. What brought you into this particular project, and what can you tell audiences that they can expect?

 

A:Well, I originally started my relationship with TCM when I did the voice-over for their star of the month, Greer Garson a few years back, and I kept expressing to them how much of a fan I was of what they were doing to preserve classic films. I’m a huge fan of classic films in general, and obviously of the Western. So, I was speaking with them about participating in this kind of presentation and they came up with this idea of a month of classic Westerns, and of course I was in. Audiences can expect two nights a week, Tuesday and Wednesday nights for four weeks in July, I will be hosting some of the greatest Westerns of all time. And it will be categorized into different tiers, sometimes we will be dealing with stars of the genre like John Wayne, and sometimes we will be dealing with directors such as John Ford or Howard Hawks. It will be very entertaining and informative!

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OH, AND LAWRENCE:

 

I do have to add though that nowhere in the article did I find a reference to your statement that SHANE has been singled out of thIS YEAR'S pack of 100 for special citation because it was formerly prominently not included in another TCM Tribute due to right's issues.

 

however:  i find your explanation so utterly charming that- in honor of my entry for the title of "the greatest western ever made"- THE MAN WHO SHOT LIBERTY VALANCE- I say we print that sucker as FACT.

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I remember reading in some film journals from years ago, that the very things that made some people love "Shane" were the same things that made others hate "Shane" but that deep down the original antipathy toward the film was based on an anti-George Stevens conglomerate who were not impressed with his largesse of work.

 

This group found that the perfection that Stevens reached for, while shooting nauseating. The fact that Stevens might position a deer in a lake and wait for hours for the deer to raise its head at the exact moment that the sun was in the correct spot, was looked down upon by his detractors.

 

Stevens often supposedly tried to mold the natural elements to fit his scenario and some of those who denigrated such concepts found this noxious and untrue to their criteria of what film should portray. I think many of these same principles are in action in the split here, even if the participants are unaware of the previous controversies about George Stevens and his oeuvre.

 

Personally I like "Shane", but then I like anything with Brandon de Wilde in it.

 

I shan't cotton to either side of this brouhaha!

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I always used to just suppose SHANE gets the accolades and special attention it does because for the time it came out it was SO different from what people had come to expect from the genre.  And it's not without it's influence.

 

Anyone who's seen CLINT EASTWOOD's PALE RIDER probably( and a bit sardonically) referred to it as "Shane The Preacher".

 

Sure, I've heard over the years many refer to SHANE as "The greatest Western ever made".  I also heard the same about THE SEARCHERS.  I thought a bit about that last night watching the latter.  A very good movie, yes.  But, the "greatest Western"?  I-I-I-I- dunno.....

 

I rarely go by what some AFI wag clams about any particular movie.  I more rely on what I LIKE the best.  And for me, neither fits the bill.

 

In comparison, I have a SHIRT I like the "best", but my wife is sick of seeing.  She likes guacamole while I think it looks like a plateful of what happens when a dog eats too much grass.  But many people LOVE it, and mine is only one opinion amongst many.

 

And I never mull over the ending.  Whether it's good or bad, what's said and heard or not.  I'M the type of guy who wonders what happened next.  Did Starret ever have a successful farm or ranch?  What kind of man did Joey grow to be?  Or did Marian from then on always envision Shane when making love to her husband?   THAT sort of stuff!

 

Sepiatone

 

What westerns do you like more then Shane?    

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Lawrence is correct about the reason Shane is specifically mentioned. It's a shout out to the people who were watching TCM at the time of the earlier Western series when they couldn't get the rights to Shane. I wasn't watching back then, but I've heard numerous people talk about it.

 

George Stevens' films became more--shall we say "monumental"?--as he got older. Even the resolutions of The More the Merrier and The Talk of the Town are dragged out beyond my liking. WWII was an overwhelming influence on Stevens; he was actually there filming when one of the concentration camps was liberated. (See Mark Harris' book Five Came Back.) Stevens turned to more serious subjects. In general, his post-war films became more serious, longer, and slower. A Place in the Sun and Shane are probably his best-liked films, but not everyone can accept the deliberate pacing.

 

Max von Sydow has talked about working for Stevens on The Greatest Story Ever Told. Stevens would set up a very wide shot. After he got the take he wanted, he would move the camera in slightly for the same shot, and get a take from that angle. Move the camera closer, get another take. And so on.

 

 

 

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Not sarcastic or anything, I get that it's a great movie...

 

I'm just curious as to why this FESTIVAL OF 100 WESTERNS isn't just:

 

TCM PRESENTS A FESTIVAL OF 100 GREAT WESTERNS,

 

but instead IS:

 

TCM PRESENTS SHANE (AND 100 OTHER GREAT WESTERNS).

 

Something special about the print? a restored version? (couldn't find any info on the main site, they have an annoying flashplayer and want me to to sit through some fancypants animated schedule and any explanation on why SHANE gets to be SO SPECIAL is contained somewhere within.)

 

So, you're not actually saying,

 

" I HATE YOU, SHANE ! "

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Lawrence is correct about the reason Shane is specifically mentioned. It's a shout out to the people who were watching TCM at the time of the earlier Western series when they couldn't get the rights to Shane. I wasn't watching back then, but I've heard numerous people talk about it.

 

George Stevens' films became more--shall we say "monumental"?--as he got older. Even the resolutions of The More the Merrier and The Talk of the Town are dragged out beyond my liking. WWII was an overwhelming influence on Stevens; he was actually there filming when one of the concentration camps was liberated. (See Mark Harris' book Five Came Back.) Stevens turned to more serious subjects. In general, his post-war films became more serious, longer, and slower. A Place in the Sun and Shane are probably his best-liked films, but not everyone can accept the deliberate pacing.

 

Max von Sydow has talked about working for Stevens on The Greatest Story Ever Told. Stevens would set up a very wide shot. After he got the take he wanted, he would move the camera in slightly for the same shot, and get a take from that angle. Move the camera closer, get another take. And so on.

 

So TCM is approaching this with a sense of humor.  Good for them.   

 

While I'm a big fan of The More The Merrier and The Talk of the Town (mainly due to Jean Arthur),   both films would have benefited from having a tighter ending.      The deliberate pacing doesn't impact Shane as much due to the stunning visuals as it does those urban films.    

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The version of SHANE that I saw last on TCM did have some darker night shots but at least Brandon deWilde's final line "Bye, Shane!" wasn't drowned out (removed?) as it was on the DVD release of the movie....

 

Ideally I'd like to see a version of SHANE with less dark night scenes AND the "Bye, Shane!" dialogue audible.

 

I mentioned the darker scenes a couple of months ago, but no one here seemed to think anything of it - didn't notice, I guess. 

 

All the versions TCM has shown over the past year (at least) have looked this way. It was immediately noticeable to me, anyway.

 

I recall watching Shane riding into town in full dress for the final showdown. Earlier showings were very bright and clear, but recently have been darkened for some reason.

 

This scene is in bright sunlight, but the film is darkened.

2sNbDWZ.jpg

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So, you're not actually saying,

 

" I HATE YOU, SHANE ! "

Everytime I see the film I wonder "Just what is Shane's last name?"

 

I mean, Shane being a derivative of Sean of course would be from the Irish, and the name John, and so he might have been Shane Donovan, or Shane Gallagher or even Shane Plunkett though that's not too romantic a name, but it is on all the lists of surnames that you can buy things embroidered on in Ireland. Being that I'm related to the Walsh surname I only purchased things with that on it, just like I bought tartans for the Kerr surname in Scotland. I'd say Alan Ladd had to be from the Celtic side so I'm guessing something like Shane Flanagan maybe.

And think of the myriad of boys named Shane in the US, after this movie came out. It might have been a fairly common name in Ulster, just like Elvis was down in Tupelo, but it was still not so well known outside those environs.

 

Shane, come back and tell us your last name and we hope it's not Plunkett!!!

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To me, this thread suggests that some people might have problems with others elevating a film to iconic status, whether it deserves it or not.

 

As Larry mentioned, the programming concept refers to an earlier time when TCM didn't/couldn't air the film. But it has been shown several times in recent years. 

 

If this were a channel where Paramount films were regularly available, then SHANE would be broadcast often and there would be no need to differentiate it as an important TCM event.

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Yes, when the film was restored several years ago they found the original music elements and remixed the soundtrack.  In doing so, they brought the music-only track up too soon for the End Title and eliminated "Bye Shane!"  Pretty unforgivable. Very glad to hear that it has been repaired.  I held onto my original betamax copy because it was the last version that had the original soundtrack.

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Everytime I see the film I wonder "Just what is Shane's last name?"

 

I mean, Shane being a derivative of Sean of course would be from the Irish, and the name John, and so he might have been Shane Donovan, or Shane Gallagher or even Shane Plunkett though that's not too romantic a name, but it is on all the lists of surnames that you can buy things embroidered on in Ireland. Being that I'm related to the Walsh surname I only purchased things with that on it, just like I bought tartans for the Kerr surname in Scotland. I'd say Alan Ladd had to be from the Celtic side so I'm guessing something like Shane Flanagan maybe.

And think of the myriad of boys named Shane in the US, after this movie came out. It might have been a fairly common name in Ulster, just like Elvis was down in Tupelo, but it was still not so well known outside those environs.

 

Shane, come back and tell us your last name and we hope it's not Plunkett!!!

 

Maybe he's just plain Shane. Since, technically, "Shane" could serve as either a first or last name, perhaps he just wanted to keep it simple  - or maybe keep people guessing -  and just call himself "Shane". He was way ahead of Clint Eastwood. Clint may have been the Man With No Name, but Shane was "the Man With One Name".

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Maybe he's just plain Shane. Since, technically, "Shane" could serve as either a first or last name, perhaps he just wanted to keep it simple  - or maybe keep people guessing -  and just call himself "Shane". He was way ahead of Clint Eastwood. Clint may have been the Man With No Name, but Shane was "the Man With One Name".

 

And of course everyone knows Shane's two daughters;  Valli and Cher.

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