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To TCM Programmers: Will You Show LILAC TIME?


TomJH
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I'm very disappointed to see that the October schedule for TCM has now dropped Lilac Time from being broadcast on the 11th. There was no film on the TCM schedule for the past few months that I more eagerly anticipated than this one.

 

This is a rare Colleen Moore-Gary Cooper silent that, to the best of my knowledge, is neither available on DVD nor scheduled to be (though hopefully that will change in the future).

 

To the programmers: are you still working on presenting this film as a TCM premiere?

 

Thanks very much. I'm hoping one programmer may be kind enough to respond to this thread.

 

lilactime18_610_407shar_s_c1.jpg

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     I knew it was too good to be true. When I first saw it as soon as October's schedule came out

I was astonished but didn't want to be overly optimistic. Then when I saw it listed on the October "Now Playing" guide I hoped it was going to be reality. The only thing I was unsure of is why TCM wouldn't put this gem in prime time.

     I got a lump in my throat when I saw this thread. What a bummer! I was SOOOOO looking forward to this film. It's not available anywhere. Very sad!

 

PLEASE TCM re-schedule it! Don't just forget about it.

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Disappointing, but not a surprise to me. With any luck this is because the movie is being rescheduled for a Prime-time Premiere soon. However, more likely it's because no edition has been produced yet for broadcast. Again, last I knew the Vita-phone project was still looking for 3 of the original Firn'a phone scoring discs. It is only fairly recently that all 11 reels of LILAC TIME were accounted for in 35 millimeter. Nonetheless, this is a film that TCM should be aware of. I'd like to see a restored version featured at the TCM Classic Film Festival in 2017. That would be a treat. LT was a First National pictures release made just prior to the merger with Warner Brothers, who now Technically owns the copyright.

 

Back In 2009, TCM had a rare Dolores Costello picture GLORIOUS BETSY (1928) on the May schedule. Later it was discovered that the films entire Vita-phone score was missing. This seems somewhat of a similar situation. Worse GB still hasn't premiered on TCM.

 

Subsequently, In 2010 WHAT PRICE GLORY? (1926) was on the advance May schedule, This was replaced by John Ford's FOUR SONS (1928) since Fox claimed it could not locate a print of WPG in it's archive. This despite the fact that it aired on the old American Movie Classics back in 1996. Part of a War films festival. The good news is TCM Programmer Chuck Tabesh didn't give up on the idea, and finally premiered this movie in November of 2011 on Silent Sunday Nights. Paying for a new broadcast master from a 35 millimeter Movie-tone scored print that David Shepard had in his collection. The bad news is WHAT PRICE hasn't been run again since. Implying possible conflict with Fox over the matter?

 

LILAC TIME is certainly long overdue for an official DVD release. Please vote on the TCM Movie Data Base for a release and request the film on "Suggest a movie" as well. I'm still hoping for debuts of Colleen's restored features HER WILD OAT (1927), and SYNTHETIC SIN (1929) too. With yet another of her formally lost films NAUGHTY BUT NICE (1927) currently pending restoration. Maybe we will get one of these next year?

 

 

14344815_10210909778210698_3413739414472

 

"Oh The Despair! No LILAC TIME (1928) on TCM October 11th!"

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Have they found the Vitaphone score to Glorious Betsy?

 

And regarding What Price Glory?, I'd assume the version aired in 1996 couldn't be run on TCM what with the change to digitization. I can't recall wither FMC/FXM ran the silent What Price Glory?, although I know they've run the James Cagney version. I think it's been several years, however. (I just can't get into the Cagney version, for what it's worth. I have no idea if the silent version is better.)

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Disappointing, but not a surprise to me. With any luck this is because the movie is being rescheduled for a Prime-time Premiere soon. However, more likely it's because no edition has been produced yet for broadcast. Again, last I knew the Vita-phone project was still looking for 3 of the original Firn'a phone scoring discs. It is only fairly recently that all 11 reels of LILAC TIME were accounted for in 35 millimeter. Nonetheless, this is a film that TCM should be aware of. I'd like to see a restored version featured at the TCM Classic Film Festival in 2017. That would be a treat. LT was a First National pictures release made just prior to the merger with Warner Brothers, who now Technically owns the copyright.

 

Back In 2009, TCM had a rare Dolores Costello picture GLORIOUS BETSY (1928) on the May schedule. Later it was discovered that the films entire Vita-phone score was missing. This seems somewhat of a similar situation. Worse GB still hasn't premiered on TCM.

 

Subsequently, In 2010 WHAT PRICE GLORY? (1926) was on the advance May schedule, This was replaced by John Ford's FOUR SONS (1928) since Fox claimed it could not locate a print of WPG in it's archive. This despite the fact that it aired on the old American Movie Classics back in 1996. Part of a War films festival. The good news is TCM Programmer Chuck Tabesh didn't give up on the idea, and finally premiered this movie in November of 2011 on Silent Sunday Nights. Paying for a new broadcast master from a 35 millimeter Movie-tone scored print that David Shepard had in his collection. The bad news is WHAT PRICE hasn't been run again since. Implying possible conflict with Fox over the matter?

 

LILAC TIME is certainly long overdue for an official DVD release. Please vote on the TCM Movie Data Base for a release and request the film on "Suggest a movie" as well. I'm still hoping for debuts of Colleen's restored features HER WILD OAT (1927), and SYNTHETIC SIN (1929) too. With yet another of her formally lost films NAUGHTY BUT NICE (1927) currently pending restoration. Maybe we will get one of these next year?

 

 

14344815_10210909778210698_3413739414472

 

"Oh The Despair! No LILAC TIME (1928) on TCM October 11th!"

 

 

Wouldnt TCM have known this before they scheduled it???

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Count me in as another very disappointed viewer. Been waiting for the '26 WHAT PRICE GLORY too.

 

Personally, I'd just as well see whatever version is available now than wait for any better restoration. Later they can show the restored version as a "premiere".

Shirley they can bump off any old chestnut like NBNW or GASLIGHT for an unrestored version of a rarely seen movie.

 

I've been hoping for more Colleen Moore & Jesse Matthews movies. 

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I should mention that a condensed 50 minute (taking into account 10 minutes of commercials) "Silents Please" version of LILAC TIME ran on American Television in 1960. I have never seen it obviously since I wasn't born for another six years. However, I have first hand information that this did take place. I wonder whatever became of that version? In the 70's a 75 minute (still incomplete) version aired on various Public Broadcasting Stations. No idea what type of scores that these prints had. LILAC TIME was also issued in 16 millimeter prints by UA8 and Thunderbird films.

 

In the first 30 or 40 years after the Silent Era in Hollywood ended Lilac Time was arguably one of the better remembered and most beloved Silent films of the 20's. Subsequently, it has become increasingly obscure. It's high time this Silent Classic and Colleen Moore made a come back!

 

We are counting on Warner's and TCM to do this long unseen movie proper justice.

 

In related news, the effort to restore Colleen Moore's first starring role LITTLE ORPHANT ANNIE (1918) by film preservationist Eric Grayson on both film and digital met funding goals and is moving forward! Perhaps we might see both movies debut on TCM sometime next year?

 

 

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Is Flaming Youth still considered lost?

 

Sadly yes, except for the 10 minutes of random footage that has aired on TCM as part of the Flicker Alley FRAGMENTS Documentary compilation. As far as I'm aware nothing additional from FLAMING YOUTH has turned up so far. However, this is not the case with NAUGHTY BUT NICE (1927) the complete film survives in a Barcelona archive. The movie in notable as the first appearance of Gretchen "Loretta" Young who was christened her new name by Colleen Moore. SYNTHETIC SIN (1929) was of course restored a few years ago by Warner's and the Vita-phone project. It still needs a complete score which survives in-tact on paper. Only one of the Vita-phone scoring discs has been found for the final reel. TWINKLETOES (1926) survives in a complete 35 millimeter print recently restored at the BFI. COME ON OVER (1922) was restored a couple years back by George Eastman House. Another 1922 feature BROKEN CHAINS has had some recent screenings. There was talk of a pending restoration of ORCHIDS AND ERMINE, largely due to the screen debut of Mickey Rooney. So far that hasn't happened I don't believe. IRENE (1926) is certainly also in need of restoration, including the Two-color Technicolor fashion show. Would be very happy to see any of these on TCM.

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Hibi,

 

Colleen Moore actually gave 14 of her films in 35 millimeter masters to the Museum Of Modern Art in 1943 to be preserved for future generations. Sadly, almost none of them were. It's believed these were sent back to Warner Brothers at their request and they subsequently forgot about them. Ultimately, any record of what happened to the prints and negatives has disappeared. Fortunately some of the titles have showed up in various archives around the world.

 

That being said, general availability is still frustratingly low. It was great when Warner Archive unexpectedly put out the fully restored WHY BE GOOD? almost two years ago. That's still the only Colleen Moore title they have released so far. I expected to see HER WILD OAT released first. Still waiting, even though that was restored by AMPAS Academy Film Archive a decade ago in 2006.

 

LILAC TIME has never been a lost film, but it sure is difficult to see in fine quality and complete prints.

 

 

 

10603314_10204663308812867_3702817942130
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Hibi,

 

Colleen Moore actually gave 14 of her films in 35 millimeter masters to the Museum Of Modern Art in 1943 to be preserved for future generations. Sadly, almost none of them were. It's believed these were sent back to Warner Brothers at their request and they subsequently forgot about them. Ultimately, any record of what happened to the prints and negatives has disappeared. Fortunately some of the titles have showed up in various archives around the world.

 

That being said, general availability is still frustratingly low. It was great when Warner Archive unexpectedly put out the fully restored WHY BE GOOD? almost two years ago. That's still the only Colleen Moore title they have released so far. I expected to see HER WILD OAT released first. Still waiting, even though that was restored by AMPAS Academy Film Archive a decade ago in 2006.

 

LILAC TIME has never been a lost film, but it sure is difficult to see in fine quality and complete prints.

 

 

 

10603314_10204663308812867_3702817942130

 

 

This is well documented. MoMA issued a news release to publicize the donation, hoping it would spur others to donate priceless films. But apparently when Warners returned the Moore films they were shelved (at MoMA) and forgotten about. Talk about careless.

 

Gloria Swanson had also donated films (including home movies, etc.) to MoMA and was horrified to find the same fate. She pulled her materials from MoMA in the 1960s but her home movies were ruined.

 

In both cases MoMA claimed they had never been asked to PRESERVE the films, only to store them. To me, this was an idiotic response.

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dredmn said: In both cases MoMA claimed they had never been asked to PRESERVE the films, only to store them. To me, this was an idiotic response.

 

Er, yeah. Even if you were asked to store them, you should at least store them safely, so they don't deteriorate further. I wish the Eastman House had a stronger reputation back then, more may have donated film there.

 

(then again, Eastman House used to have "yard sales" to get rid of cast-offs. I had purchased several items I thought should never have been de-acquisitioned and later helped them track down important items discarded years earlier)

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