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5 hours ago, cinemaspeak59 said:

Woman in the Window is wonderfully stylized. Scarlet Street is darker, grittier and its theme of fatalism more in keeping with noir. Usually "it was all a dream" is a crutch for lazy storytelling; somehow, due largely to how great Woman in the Window looks - Joan Bennett's apartment/penthouse, the elegant club Edward G. spends time in - it doesn't hurt the film at all.  

SPOILERS

 

 

 

Well in the wrap around Eddie said they had problems with the code due to the suicide ending. But they didnt put up a fight for it either....

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1 hour ago, Hoganman1 said:

Yes. I believe you're right. There weren't many Johnny Cochrans around back in those days. 

Oh, I dunno. Leon Ames does a pretty impressive job of beating Jean Simmons' and Robert Mitchum's murder rap in Angel Face, anyway. ;)

 

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On 11/19/2018 at 7:29 PM, jamesjazzguitar said:

The first Perry Mason book came out in 1933.     

They are now being republished and are available in many places.  If you get one, be prepared as they are not close to the Perry Mason movies of the TV series.  Mason and Paul Drake are not as nice.

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21 minutes ago, TheCid said:

They are now being republished and are available in many places.  If you get one, be prepared as they are not close to the Perry Mason movies of the TV series.  Mason and Paul Drake are not as nice.

I have about 10 or so Mason books that I purchased at used-book sales over the decades.   Yea,  Mason and Drake are not so 'nice' and both have no problem with bending the law (and something out and out breaking it), when it suits their needs.     I like that but I understand why for the T.V. show they 'clean them up'.

 

 

 

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18 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

I have about 10 or so Mason books that I purchased at used-book sales over the decades.   Yea,  Mason and Drake are not so 'nice' and both have no problem with bending the law (and something out and out breaking it), when it suits their needs.     I like that but I understand why for the T.V. show they 'clean them up'.

Sort of like a police state, huh? I never read any of the books, I used to like the B&W episodes of the show.

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52 minutes ago, cigarjoe said:

Sort of like a police state, huh? I never read any of the books, I used to like the B&W episodes of the show.

I received first half-season as a gift a few years ago.  Became addicted.  We ordered the sets as soon as they came out.  We probably watch at least one episode a week.  Watched two last night.

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Fetv on DirecTV runs four episodes of PM, two in the afternoon and two in the evening.

Of course they are edited for commercials. I often watch the two in the evening. I don't

think they would be much more easy to follow even without the ads, especially when

they add in crimes what were committed years ago, illegitimate children, twins, folks

who changed their names, folks who were thought to be dead but aren't, etc. Perry and

Paul seemed to be a little shadier in the late 1950s episodes than in the later ones. Still

an entertaining program.

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2 hours ago, TheCid said:

I received first half-season as a gift a few years ago.  Became addicted.  We ordered the sets as soon as they came out.  We probably watch at least one episode a week.  Watched two last night.

I became addicted about 10 - 12 years ago when they were on T.V. at 10 PM (if I recall correctly), and I believe I have seen most of the B&W series.    They are now on ME-TV at 11:30 PST,  which is a little late for me to watch a one hour program,  but if I haven't seen one OR there is one I really liked (e.g. Martha Vickers from The Big Sleep was in one last week),  I'll stay up.

I enjoy the show a lot but sometimes the endings are just a little to 'out-there' with Mason always being able to get the guilty one to admit they did the deed.   

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13 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

I became addicted about 10 - 12 years ago when they were on T.V. at 10 PM (if I recall correctly), and I believe I have seen most of the B&W series.    They are now on ME-TV at 11:30 PST,  which is a little late for me to watch a one hour program,  but if I haven't seen one OR there is one I really liked (e.g. Martha Vickers from The Big Sleep was in one last week),  I'll stay up.

I enjoy the show a lot but sometimes the endings are just a little to 'out-there' with Mason always being able to get the guilty one to admit they did the deed.   

MeTV also shows it in the mornings. 9 AM ET if I am not mistaken.

Supposedly the series kind of plateaued out in the last few years, but then picked up in last two.  Interestingly they had one episode in color just to see how it went over.  It didn't, so back to B&W.

Guess it was the 53 (?) minute time frame that caused some parts to be rushed.  Yes, the courtroom confessions do seem to come a little too easily.  One good feature is the last few minutes where Perry, Paul and Della get together to wrap up what happened.

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A rare glimpse of compassion shown to Ray Collins; I suspect we won't see the likes of this again:

From Wikipedia:

"In October 1963, Collins filmed his last Perry Mason episode, "The Case of the Capering Camera", broadcast January 16, 1964.[2] Although clearly Collins would not return to work on the series, his name appeared in the opening title sequence through the eighth season, which ended in May 1965. Executive producer Gail Patrick Jackson was aware that Collins watched the show every week and did not wish to discourage him.[27]"

 

And this from " DirectExpose' "

Ray Collins, who played antagonist Lt. Tragg of the homicide squad appeared in only a few episodes after the 1960 season of Perry Mason. Due to illness, it became increasingly difficult for him to memorize his lines, which led to his dismal amid the seventh season. After Collins departed from the show, it was decided to keep his name on the credits. That decision was made in part to help keep his spirits up, but also to allow him to continue receiving medical benefits from the actors’ union. Sadly, Collins passed away in 1965.

 
 
 
 

 

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4 minutes ago, Arteesto said:

A rare glimpse of compassion shown to Ray Collins; I suspect we won't see the likes of this again:

From Wikipedia:

"In October 1963, Collins filmed his last Perry Mason episode, "The Case of the Capering Camera", broadcast January 16, 1964.[2] Although clearly Collins would not return to work on the series, his name appeared in the opening title sequence through the eighth season, which ended in May 1965. Executive producer Gail Patrick Jackson was aware that Collins watched the show every week and did not wish to discourage him.[27]"

 

And this from " DirectExpose' "

Ray Collins, who played antagonist Lt. Tragg of the homicide squad appeared in only a few episodes after the 1960 season of Perry Mason. Due to illness, it became increasingly difficult for him to memorize his lines, which led to his dismal amid the seventh season. After Collins departed from the show, it was decided to keep his name on the credits. That decision was made in part to help keep his spirits up, but also to allow him to continue receiving medical benefits from the actors’ union. Sadly, Collins passed away in 1965.

 
 
 
 

 

Collins is another of those actors who played their characters very well.  Didn't know why he was kept in the credits, but always thought there was a good reason.  This one is.

Thought it was interesting that it was obvious that he was probably the oldest homicide detective in America at the time.  He would have been about 67 when the series premiered in 1957.

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25 minutes ago, TheCid said:

Thought it was interesting that it was obvious that he was probably the oldest homicide detective in America at the time.  He would have been about 67 when the series premiered in 1957.

I always enjoy the episodes with him more than than those episodes that used other detectives.

I suspect that Ray Collins gave Lt Tragg his snarky quality. ;)

 

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So been out of the loop for a couple of weeks, but I wasn't about to miss, THE KILLING (1956).

Such a great and interesting movie.  Only complaint I have would be the shootout.  I know it is supposed to be chaotic and I am fine with that, but it seems to be cut just a hair too quickly to be believed.

Moving on to what I love - ALL HAIL MARIE WINDSOR!!!!!  :D

But seriously, I don't know if I can think of another movie where a supporting player so completely steals the show with their performance.  We've seen this character type a many times, but no other actor will ever do it better.  She is amazing.  Her scenes with Cook might be the best scenes of HIS career. :lol:  She really brought the movie to a different level.  In other words, I thought she was really good. ;)

So Muller talked about the narration.  Where do people stand on this?  

Personally I think there are actually certain scenes that needed it.  I can't believe I am going to say I agree with Studio Executives, but there are certain times I know audiences in the 50's would have been lost.  As an example, when Nikki leaves the farm.  I can see audiences getting confused by who is supposed to be where when.  I tried to imagine it without the narration.  I could see it working today just fine, but not so much in 1956.

Does anyone know of a DVD or Blu-Ray release that has a version without the narration?

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Hey, all you Perry Mason fans...there's seems to be such avid interest in P.M., books, shows, actors who played him, etc. etc., why not start a thread dedicated to Perry Mason?  And you'd probably get a lot more posters with more factettes, comments, etc., about Perry Mason than just on this thread. There seems to be a lot of love for him.

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I'm glad to see the love for Ray Collins, always a favorite of mine, and the love for Marie Windsor and The Killing, too.

In the past we've had some threads about distinctive voices. All five stars of Perry Mason had them: Raymond Burr; Ray Collins, silky smooth with a hint of menace; William Talman, whose voice is irritating in the right way (that is, right for the character without actually being annoying to the listener); William Hopper, with a very attractive voice perfect for the wry remark or the slightly cynical wisecrack; and Barbara Hale, with an alto voice as quietly lovely and appealing as her face.

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I agree with Looney about The Killing - it's very good. This was about the fourth time I'd seen it, and it never gets tired.

Random thoughts about it:  When you watch a heist movie, you notice it's always the little things, the things that even the smartest heist -master couldn't have foreseen, that mess it all up. "The best- laid plans....go aft awry." For instance, poor old Elisha Cook can't resist the importunings of his horrible wife to find out more about the heist. Sterling Hayden's character ("Johnny Clay" - I love that name !) is smart, he should have seen Elisha's weakness and maybe chosen a different race track teller to be in on his plan. He certainly seemed to know what his hard-as-nails wife was all about. You just know when Marie wheedles it out of her poor sap husband that he's in on some kind of robbery that's going to yield big bucks that the whole thing is going to go pear-shaped.

Other "little details" that ruin everything:  Oh, Johnny Clay, why didn't you invest in a brand new really reliable suitcase? Or at least two smallish carrier bags - also brand new, with good locks. You just know something bad's going to happen with that second-hand bag when he keeps having trouble locking it. Of course the fact that's it's bursting with money doesn't help.

But even that might have worked out, had it not been for that obnoxious little dog ( and his equally obnoxious, vacuous owner), who decides to take a run at the baggage car, thus causing the precariously fastened suitcase to fall and release its precious and damning contents all over the runway. 

Then there's that nice, decent parking lot guard, who makes the mistake of trying to be friendly and helpful to weirdo unpredictable Timothy Carey. Johnny Clay couldn't have foreseen that that particular parking lot, the one with such a good view of the racetrack, would have been closed that day, and that Carey would have to interact with the guard to get him to allow him to park there. 

Yeah, it's the little details that you can't predict that usually ruin a heist.

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56 minutes ago, Looney said:

So been out of the loop for a couple of weeks, but I wasn't about to miss, THE KILLING (1956).

Such a great and interesting movie.  Only complaint I have would be the shootout.  I know it is supposed to be chaotic and I am fine with that, but it seems to be cut just a hair too quickly to be believed.

Moving on to what I love - ALL HAIL MARIE WINDSOR!!!!!  :D

But seriously, I don't know if I can think of another movie where a supporting player so completely steals the show with their performance.  We've seen this character type a many times, but no other actor will ever do it better.  She is amazing.  Her scenes with Cook might be the best scenes of HIS career. :lol:  She really brought the movie to a different level.  In other words, I thought she was really good. ;)

So Muller talked about the narration.  Where do people stand on this?  

Personally I think there are actually certain scenes that needed it.  I can't believe I am going to say I agree with Studio Executives, but there are certain times I know audiences in the 50's would have been lost.  As an example, when Nikki leaves the farm.  I can see audiences getting confused by who is supposed to be where when.  I tried to imagine it without the narration.  I could see it working today just fine, but not so much in 1956.

Does anyone know of a DVD or Blu-Ray release that has a version without the narration?

Marie Windsor was definitely the female lead, as even Colleen Gray admitted.  BTW, I think Gray was much better in Kansas City Story, but that was also a "good girl" role.

As for Marie Windsor, she nailed and always did.  She should have received an oscar or at least a nomination for Best Supporting Actress.  Found it interesting that Kubrick held up production so she could finish Swamp Women.  Have that on a multi-movie DVD "mystery" movie set.  She stars in it as the leader of a group of women prisoners on the run.  Touch Connors is the male lead.  Beverly Garland is also in it. 

I think the narration really was necessary to the movie.  I could see how a movie audience would have been confused.  Even though I had seen it before, the backtracking would have confused me this time without the narration.  Not even sure it would work today considering how many characters and how much moving back and forth.  Example:  the TV series Motive uses a similar format and even though I watch closely I still get disoriented at times.  Here again have seen episodes several times.

As for the shootout, agree it took place to quickly.  Also a little hard to believe that many guys killed with so few poorly aimed shots.

As usual Muller's commentaries really make it worth watching Noir Alley.

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More on The Killing:

The two stand-outs in this great cast ( they're all stand-outs, really), are, of course, Marie Windsor and Timothy Carey.

As Looney noted, Marie Windsor is fantastic in this; could anyone do straight-out b1tch the way she could? (By the way, why did she marry Elisha's character, anyway? I love the way she compares their marriage to Aspirin !) Also, for no apparent reason, there's a parrot in their apartment. This is fun; the parrot seems to just be there for added weirdness, and it works. (Like, when Elisha falls and drags the parrot cage with him. At least the parrot is unharmed !)

Timothy Carey: oh, what a weirdo. I love the way this guy specializes in making strange squinty faces and slurry speech. The moments between him and the parking lot guard are painful; when Nick reveals his true nature, snarling racist insults at the guy, it's shocking. Here you think, "great, it's 1956 and a black guy's interacting in a position of authority with a white guy. There even seems to be some mutual respect." But then of course, Nick ruins it all with his poisonous snarl. You can't feel sorry when he gets it from the guard.

Oh, The Killing is so good, I could go on. But I'll just make one more observation: there's a touching scene, just before the heist, where the old guy who's one of the gang and an old friend of Johnny's, suggests maybe they could go away together afterwards, just the two of them, and you realize he has feelings for Johnny. There aren't many gay characters in noirs (although more than you might think), so it's interesting to see this sad little scene. 

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10 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

I agree with Looney about The Killing - it's very good. This was about the fourth time I'd seen it, and it never gets tired.

  When you watch a heist movie, you notice it's always the little things, the things that even the smartest heist -master couldn't have foreseen, that mess it all up. "The best- laid plans....go aft awry."

Yeah, it's the little details that you can't predict that usually ruin a heist.

Yeah, reminds me of Body Heat when 

 

12 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

I agree with Looney about The Killing - it's very good. This was about the fourth time I'd seen it, and it never gets tired.

 When you watch a heist movie, you notice it's always the little things, the things that even the smartest heist -master couldn't have foreseen, that mess it all up. "The best- laid plans....go aft awry."

Yeah, it's the little details that you can't predict that usually ruin a heist.

Yeah, reminds of Micky Rourk in Body Heat when he tells William Hurt something to the effect there are a hundred ways to "f... up" a crime.  A genius can figure out 50 of them "and you ain't no genius."  Of course, it the crimes didn't get screwed up, the movies would not be nearly as interesting.

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7 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

More on The Killing:

(By the way, why did she marry Elisha's character, anyway? 

Timothy Carey: oh, what a weirdo. I love the way this guy specializes in making strange squinty faces and slurry speech. The moments between him and the parking lot guard are painful; when Nick reveals his true nature, snarling racist insults at the guy, it's shocking. Here you think, "great, it's 1956 and a black guy's interacting in a position of authority with a white guy. There even seems to be some mutual respect." But then of course, Nick ruins it all with his poisonous snarl. You can't feel sorry when he gets it from the guard.

Oh, The Killing is so good, I could go on. But I'll just make one more observation: there's a touching scene, just before the heist, where the old guy who's one of the gang and an old friend of Johnny's, suggests maybe they could go away together afterwards, just the two of them, and you realize he has feelings for Johnny. There aren't many gay characters in noirs (although more than you might think), so it's interesting to see this sad little scene. 

1.  He promised to become really rich, as she notes in an early scene.

2.  The black guy was an attendant, not really a guard.  To be clear to others reading your post, Carey was shot by an armed guard, not the black attendant.

3.I picked up on Jay C. Flippen asking Hayden to go away, just the two of them.  But didn't see it as a gay reference.  Just an old man with no one who wanted a son.

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Things would be more confusing without the narration and the narration is kind of funny in

itself. At 2:15 pm Johnny bought a ham sandwich and a coke at Morty's and then secured

his gun in a flower pot. Yeah, Hayden plans everything down to the last minute and then goes

and buys a a cheap suitcase from a pawn shop. Duh. What a freakin' genius. Something always

seems to go wrong in these heist flicks anyhow. And why not take the car instead of an airplane?

Duh. The Cook Windsor marriage should be categorized as sci-fi not noir. What the hell did a

good looking dame like Windsor see in a runt like Cook? I just don't get it. When seen in profile,

Cook reminds me a bit of Michael Redgrave's dummy in Dead of Night. Of course the dummy is

about ten times as smart as Cook is. I've seen The Killing four or five times before but it's always

worth another look. I much prefer the ending of this to that of The Asphalt Jungle where Hayden

goes to the horse farm so can can give a horse one last kiss before he dies. Cornball as all get out.

 

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