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10 minutes ago, chaya bat woof woof said:

Interesting comment above.  Not about taking junk (Christopher P. once said that).  I think he said something about his castle needed heating.  But it reminded me of another actor:  I think he found it easier to lose himself in a role rather than live a troubled (in some ways), alcoholic life.

What actor was that? No need to be discreet, this is an old movie website.

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With the possible exception of Bogart, no Hollywood star appeared in more good to outstanding films during the '40s than Joseph Cotten.

Citizen Kane, Magnificent Ambersons, Journey Into Fear, Shadow of a Doubt, Since You Went Away, Gaslight, Duel in the Sun, Portrait of Jennie, The Third Man. It was a remarkable run.

If he was appearing in junk towards the end of his film career (like a lot of other actors - Carradine, Karloff, Chaney, Lugosi, Rathbone, etc.), who the heck today even remembers a Baron Blood as opposed to Citizen Kane, Shadow of a Doubt or The Third Man? Joseph Cotten's film legacy is assured, even if he as an actor (look at the contrast between his psychopathic charmer in Shadow of a Doubt as opposed to bumbling everyman in The Third Man) is perhaps a bit undeservedly overlooked.

Even on this thread, with all the recent comments about Shadow of a Doubt, while Teresa Wright's performance deservedly received praise, I didn't notice a single poster single out Cotten's great performance in the film.

One of the most chilling scenes in the film revealing the mind of a psychopath, thanks to Hitchcock's direction and Cotten's performance:

 

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3 minutes ago, TomJH said:

With the possible exception of Bogart, no Hollywood star appeared in more good to outstanding films during the '40s than Joseph Cotten.

Citizen Kane, Magnificent Ambersons, Journey Into Fear, Shadow of a Doubt, Since You Went Away, Gaslight, Duel in the Sun, Portrait of Jennie, The Third Man. It was a remarkable run.

If he was appearing in junk towards the end of his film career (like a lot of other actors - Carradine, Karloff, Chaney, Lugosi, Rathbone, etc.), who the heck today even remembers a Baron Blood as opposed to Citizen Kane, Shadow of a Doubt or The Third Man? Joseph Cotten's film legacy is assured, even if he as an actor (look at the contrast between his psychopathic charmer in Shadow of a Doubt as opposed to bumbling everyman in The Third Man) is perhaps a bit undeservedly overlooked.

Even on this thread, with all the recent comments about Shadow of a Doubt, while Teresa Wright's performance deservedly received praise, I didn't notice a single poster single out Cotten's great performance in the film.

One of the most chilling scenes in the film revealing the mind of a psychopath, thanks to Hitchcock's direction and Cotten's performance:

 

Tom, you are right.  I should have mentioned Joseph Cotten's wonderful performance in Shadow of a Doubt.  He was unforgettable as the psychopathic killer who tries to put on a "normal" front when he flees to his sister's home.   I say  "tries", because, as the clip you posted here demonstrates,  the cracks show when he talks about certain topics.

It's interesting, by the way-  interesting and disturbing -  to ponder just why Uncle Charlie committed these murders in the first place.  It's been mentioned already that he really did not put much value on money per sec, leaving it lying around, etc.  The money seems to be incidental to his hatred of the "fat lazy widows"  who "eat and drink" their money.  It's almost as though he feels he's some kind of angel of death on a mission to rid the world of these poor ladies  ( not "poor ladies" to him, though,  obviously.)  And Cotten gets his bizarre,  pathological contempt for the rich widows across perfectly.  The viewer feels a chill almost as much as the family around the table does after this ominous speech.

Yes,  Joseph Cotten was a great actor,  and it's a shame he's not as much recognized as some others are from the classic Hollywood period.  I agree, all you have to do is watch  The Third Man  and Shadow of a Doubt to appreciate his versatility. 

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Miss W excellent post. Part of the reason and probably the most important reason why Uncle Charlie committed the murders is explained by his sister. When Charlie was 10, he was in a serious bicyle accident, they thought he would die. Emma tells us that after the accident he became shy and withdrawn not speaking. I'm pretty sure that the point was Charlie was brain damaged and changed in some way that eventually turned him in a serial killer,

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Tom, excellent post and I agree. Joseph Cotten's performance in Shadow of a Doubt cannot be overlooked. He is very effective as the seriel killer and you're right under Hitchcock's direction and Joseph Cotten's understated yet chilling performance, Uncle Charlie is a very frightening character .Cotten was an excellent actor in every film I've seen him in and the whole cast was great. Without a doubt, Shadow of a Doubt, is a terrific film.

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18 minutes ago, lavenderblue19 said:

Miss W excellent post. Part of the reason and probably the most important reason why Uncle Charlie committed the murders is explained by his sister. When Charlie was 10, he was in a serious bicyle accident, they thought he would die. Emma tells us that after the accident he became shy and withdrawn not speaking. I'm pretty sure that the point was Charlie was brain damaged and changed in some way that eventually turned him in a serial killer,

Absolutely,  lav,  you're right,  I'm sure we're supposed to take note of Emma's recounting of her brother Charlie's accident  and connect it to why he became the way he did.  He was changed after the accident, as you say.  Even after he "recovered" and came home from the hospital,  he was "never the same".

Hitchcock seemed to like childhood accidents  (and other trauma)  as a way to explain an adult's mental illness.  Remember Gregory Peck's childhood accident in Spellbound ?  Now,    SPOILER   !    even though Peck is NOT the killer in that film,  his recurring dream, which harks back to this childhood accident,  is meant as an explanation of why he is disturbed   (although thanks to Ingrid Bergman, he can be cured ! )

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I imagine a lot of actors take just about any role or TV commercial just to stay in front of the cameras.  But, probably a lot from Hollywood's "Golden Age" made very little compared to later actors and not investing wisely didn't help.  

I remember one actress who was a guest in a lot of TV shows in the 50's and 60's who quit to become a clerk in a manufacturing company or something such as that.  She said she could not support herself and her child on what she made from guest appearances.

I find it interesting to look up actors and actresses from supporting roles in pictures from the 30's through the 50's to see what they did and what happened to them.   More than a few left acting for more stable careers.

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I always think of that line Dustin Hoffman says in Tootsie, "I did it for the work". Many actors and actresses from the Golden Age of cinema appeared in many tv shows in the 1960's- 2000. All you have to do is watch Murder She Wrote and there will always be at least one famous classic actor appearing. Ray Milland on Hart To Hart or Columbo. Columbo is an example of seeing familiar faces for the classic film fan. Taking roles in lesser films the way Joan Crawford did, etc. was for the work, being in the limelight and the money. I enjoy seeing these older stars not fade away even if some of the films were schlock they were in.

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I just want to say, here and now:   Aaargh !

I was really looking forward to the upcoming Noir Alley pick,  Guilty Bystander.  I've never even heard of this one, let alone seen it,  and a fresh brand-new , never-before viewed noir for me is really a treat.

However !  due to July 4th Independence Day, and it's being a Sunday this year,  Noir Alley is only being aired in the Saturday night time slot,  not the Sunday morning one.

Now, it's true that I actually think Saturday night is the ideal time for noir viewing, Sunday morning  (especially sunny ones !)  is not a very film noir day or time.  And yes, I did say this when Noir Alley first began  ( dear lord,  4 years ago, it was ).   But actually, and    perhaps hypocritically,  I usually catch Noir Alley in its Sunday time slot.  But this weekend the Sunday one has been bumped,  I guess for some Independence Day -themed movie.

This would not be a problem, except that  1) 12:30  am is a bit late even for me to start a full-length movie    and  2)  my husband loves Saturday Night Live,  even the re-runs,  and would not be willing to sacrifice that last half hour of that show , not even for Noir Alley.

And we always watch Noir Alley in real time, and we have but one tv set.

Why don't I record it?  I'm looking into that.  I'm so low-tech, I'm not sure how to do that.  I think my television is a "smart" one with a dvr,  but believe it or not, I've never availed myself of this feature.

Go ahead and laugh at me, everyone,  I know I'm a dinosaur.

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4 minutes ago, lavenderblue19 said:

I always think of that line Dustin Hoffman says in Tootsie, "I did it for the work". Many actors and actresses from the Golden Age of cinema appeared in many tv shows in the 1960's- 2000. All you have to do is watch Murder She Wrote and there will always be at least one famous classic actor appearing. Ray Milland on Hart To Hart or Columbo. Columbo is an example of seeing familiar faces for the classic film fan. Taking roles in lesser films the way Joan Crawford did, etc. was for the work, being in the limelight and the money. I enjoy seeing these older stars not fade away even if some of the films were schlock they were in.

I think being in the limelight was main motivation for some.

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10 minutes ago, Sepiatone said:

And some sadly, kept plugging away and wound up plugging mundane everyday products, like the great ANN MILLER here.     :(

https://youtu.be/swDzAPvj6k8

Sepiatone

I disagree. I remember that commercial and thought it was great seeing Ann. I have no problem with any of these stars plugging products. Times change, tastes change, stars get older and if they wanted or needed to make money doing the ads, good for them.

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1 minute ago, misswonderly3 said:

I just want to say, here and now:   Aaargh !

I was really looking forward to the upcoming Noir Alley pick,  Guilty Bystander.  I've never even heard of this one, let alone seen it,  and a fresh brand-new , never-before viewed noir for me is really a treat.

However !  due to July 4th Independence Day, and it's being a Sunday this year,  Noir Alley is only being aired in the Saturday night time slot,  not the Sunday morning one.

Now, it's true that I actually think Saturday night is the ideal time for noir viewing, Sunday morning  (especially sunny ones !)  is not a very film noir day or time.  And yes, I did say this when Noir Alley first began  ( dear lord,  4 years ago, it was ).   But actually, and    perhaps hypocritically,  I usually catch Noir Alley in its Sunday time slot.  But this weekend the Sunday one has been bumped,  I guess for some Independence Day -themed movie.

This would not be a problem, except that  1) 12:30  am is a bit late even for me to start a full-length movie    and  2)  my husband loves Saturday Night Live,  even the re-runs,  and would not be willing to sacrifice that last half hour of that show , not even for Noir Alley.

And we always watch Noir Alley in real time, and we have but one tv set.

Why don't I record it?  I'm looking into that.  I'm so low-tech, I'm not sure how to do that.  I think my television is a "smart" one with a dvr,  but believe it or not, I've never availed myself of this feature.

Go ahead and laugh at me, everyone,  I know I'm a dinosaur.

Thanks for the heads up.  I used to record it, but now watch it on Sundays.  My DVD recorder tends to reduce the picture size.  Guess I will be recording.

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2 minutes ago, lavenderblue19 said:

I disagree. I remember that commercial and thought it was great seeing Ann. I have no problem with any of these stars plugging products. Times change, tastes change, stars get older and if they wanted or needed to make money doing the ads, good for them.

How do you feel about Joe Namath's commercials?  I hate them.

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1 minute ago, ElCid said:

How do you feel about Joe Namath's commercials?  I hate them.

Do you mean the medicare commercials now being aired? It sort of freaks me out, remembering him as a young man, he didn't age all that well. I cannot stand all those medicare advantage commercials because it seems every other ad is for that. It's overkill.

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5 minutes ago, ElCid said:

How do you feel about Joe Namath's commercials?  I hate them.

Y'know, coming across it first without seeing the beginning, I first thought it was MAURY POVICH!   I couldn't understand it.  I thought his show was still doing well.  ;) 

And now JIMMY "JJ" WALKER is doing one for the same product.

LAVENDER:  I can understand probably needing the money,  but after such a celebrated career I think those stars deserve to be seen more respectable.  

Sepiatone

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When all is done and the film has ended, does anyone feel sorry for Uncle Charlie in Shadow of a Doubt?

I do, at least to a degree. We know that his psychopathic urges to kill rich widows appears, based on that dinner conversation clip of him posted above, to be out of his control. There may been be, perhaps, something physically wrong with his brain (from that bike accident as a young boy?).

Joseph Cotten shows us, along with the frightening aspects of his character, what Uncle Charlie might have been if he hadn't been, essentially, nuts. We see the graciousness and easy charm of a gentleman. And he really is a charmer. While some might dismiss it as a superficial exterior calculatingly masking a monster within, I think that charm and graciousness is a reflection of the person he would have been if something hadn't happened to him.

If memory serves me correctly, as I haven't seen Shadow of a Doubt for a few years, young Charley (Teresa Wright), feels sorry for him in the final scene, despite the fact she knew he had tried to kill her, even on the train at the very end. I can understand her feelings.

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Sepia, I understand how you feel, for me though, always being a golden age film fan, it was hoot seeing Ann and the rest. I didn't and don't think any less of them or their contributions to films. I just thought it was fun seeing them and I still respected them. We'll agree to disagree on this one, although believe me I understand how you feel.

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17 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

I just want to say, here and now:   Aaargh !

I was really looking forward to the upcoming Noir Alley pick,  Guilty Bystander.  I've never even heard of this one, let alone seen it,  and a fresh brand-new , never-before viewed noir for me is really a treat.

However !  due to July 4th Independence Day, and it's being a Sunday this year,  Noir Alley is only being aired in the Saturday night time slot,  not the Sunday morning one.

Now, it's true that I actually think Saturday night is the ideal time for noir viewing, Sunday morning  (especially sunny ones !)  is not a very film noir day or time.  And yes, I did say this when Noir Alley first began  ( dear lord,  4 years ago, it was ).   But actually, and    perhaps hypocritically,  I usually catch Noir Alley in its Sunday time slot.  But this weekend the Sunday one has been bumped,  I guess for some Independence Day -themed movie.

This would not be a problem, except that  1) 12:30  am is a bit late even for me to start a full-length movie    and  2)  my husband loves Saturday Night Live,  even the re-runs,  and would not be willing to sacrifice that last half hour of that show , not even for Noir Alley.

And we always watch Noir Alley in real time, and we have but one tv set.

Why don't I record it?  I'm looking into that.  I'm so low-tech, I'm not sure how to do that.  I think my television is a "smart" one with a dvr,  but believe it or not, I've never availed myself of this feature.

Go ahead and laugh at me, everyone,  I know I'm a dinosaur.

There are a few good looking copies of the restored Guilty Bystander on You Tube.

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1 hour ago, lavenderblue19 said:

I disagree. I remember that commercial and thought it was great seeing Ann. I have no problem with any of these stars plugging products. Times change, tastes change, stars get older and if they wanted or needed to make money doing the ads, good for them.

A national ad can be quite lucrative for an actor.  Minimal work and residual pay.

Even A-listers today do them.  Some only do print ads.  Some of them only do ads for non-U.S. markets, because they are afraid it will hurt their image here.

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14 hours ago, Sepiatone said:

Y'know, coming across it first without seeing the beginning, I first thought it was MAURY POVICH!   I couldn't understand it.  I thought his show was still doing well.  ;) 

And now JIMMY "JJ" WALKER is doing one for the same product.

LAVENDER:  I can understand probably needing the money,  but after such a celebrated career I think those stars deserve to be seen more respectable.  

Sepiatone

Actually Sepia, I'm with lavender on this Ann Miller soup commercial. And in my case, because I've always loved it whenever I see older stars satire themselves and their image, and that's exactly what Ann was doing with those series of soup commercials she made back in the day. 

It shows me that they don't take themselves too seriously.

And besides when this commercial was made, Ann could still hoof it up pretty darn well and certainly didnt't embarrass herself at all in this regard, don't ya think?

(...and in this one of 'em specifically, I always thought Dave Willock's last line in it was perfect and funny)

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I just viewed Guilty Bystander for the first time and, even though it's admittedly a minor film of the noir genre, I think fans of the genre will find much to appreciate in it. Good luck on following the plot but you can enjoy it for its seedy atmosphere, impressive black and white photography and a couple of the key performances. It's a little orphan "B" no one knew that had been assigned to public domain hell for years, further seeming to assure it of film obscurity. I'm glad it's been restored with, I believe, the only 35 mm print of the film known to exist.

I also appreciate the fact that its lead protagonist, an alcoholic ex-cop in what initially appears to be a dark tale of redemption, realistically falters a number of times to stay on the wagon. An interesting little drama which makes me wish Zachory Scott had had better film opportunities afterwards. And for those who remember Mary Boland as a flighty non-stop talkative film comedienne (often teamed with Charlie Ruggles), look out. This is a Boland you've never seen before.

The Nitrate Diva ar Twitter: “"You haven't gone as far as you can until  you're dead." GUILTY BYSTANDER (Joseph Lerner, 1950)… ”

 

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16 hours ago, Sepiatone said:

And some sadly, kept plugging away and wound up plugging mundane everyday products, like the great ANN MILLER here.     :(

https://youtu.be/swDzAPvj6k8

Sepiatone

I loved that Ann Miller commercial! At least she was doing what she loved in it (Dancing!) Ann kept pretty busy in live theater in her later years. On Broadway; touring and summer stock. So she was making money. I'm sure that commercial paid well too (expensive to shoot!)

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16 hours ago, lavenderblue19 said:

Do you mean the medicare commercials now being aired? It sort of freaks me out, remembering him as a young man, he didn't age all that well. I cannot stand all those medicare advantage commercials because it seems every other ad is for that. It's overkill.

I hate those. And it seems like I see him several times a day. Sad to see him looking so old. Wouldn't think he'd need the money, but maybe he has other reasons for doing them.

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