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Jim Crow Confederate Monuments Go Down in America


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I don't consider the southern states, during the Civil War, to have been part of the United States. They seceded, during that brief period. They were an enemy country. Countries (meaning when the U.S. was reconstituted after the war) don't generally build statues commemorating the enemies they fought. At best, every one of those confederate soldiers was a traitor to the United States; at worst, they were enemy soldiers of an alien country, involved in killing American soldiers.

 

As for the statues, most of those statues were built much later, as symbols of racial hatred during the later Jim Crow era. 

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I don't consider the southern states, during the Civil War, to have been part of the United States. They seceded, during that brief period. They were an enemy country. Countries (meaning when the U.S. was reconstituted after the war) don't generally build statues commemorating the enemies they fought. At best, every one of those confederate soldiers was a traitor to the United States; at worst, they were enemy soldiers of an alien country, involved in killing American soldiers.

 

As for the statues, most of those statues were built much later, as symbols of racial hatred during the later Jim Crow era. 

the confederacy ultimately did not think it proper for the northern states to be dictating arbitrary edicts that would affect the southern economy plus even before the civil war the northern and southern states never really got along that well with each other and it is also true that the confederacy had a very strong position on states rights.

 

even after Lee surrendered a lot of confederates still felt compelled to fight on which suggests some very strong feelings on states right apart from the slavery issue.

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the confederacy ultimately did not think it proper for the northern states to be dictating arbitrary edicts that would affect the southern economy plus even before the civil war the northern and southern states never really got along that well which each other and it is also true that the confederacy had a very strong position on states rights.

 

even after Lee surrendered a lot of confederates still felt compelled to fight on which suggests some very strong feelings on states right apart from the slavery issue.

 

John Wilkes Booth thought he could resurrect the war.  The harm he did.  If Booth could had seen the most honorable of surrenders.  Where were the daguerreotype camera during that historical event?

 

hith-handshake-lee-grant-E.jpeg

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Sad to see the history and culture of our great country being ripped apart with the removal of our beautiful statues and monuments.

...the beauty that is being taken out of our cities, towns and parks will be greatly missed and never able to be comparably replaced!

 

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Sad to see the history and culture of our great country being ripped apart with the removal of our beautiful statues and monuments.

...the beauty that is being taken out of our cities, towns and parks will be greatly missed and never able to be comparably replaced!

 

 

Just more ignorance of history by Trump:   Most of the Confederate monuments were placed after laws were passed that gave blacks equal rights.   Therefore the main reason the monuments were build was to give the finger to blacks and those that supported these laws;  I.e. they were code for:  NOT going to happen in MY town!  

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From the Onion (parody):

 

Nation Rallies Around Ronald McDonald Statue That Embodies Country’s True Heritage

 

WASHINGTON—Affirming their unwavering support for the fast food mascot, Americans rallied around a Ronald McDonald statue Thursday that they said embodied the country’s true heritage. “We refuse to let what this clown represents to our people and our way of life just be snuffed out,” said Jackson, MS resident Martin Kerpatch, one of the many demonstrators at a McDonald’s PlayPlace who had locked arms in a circle around the fiberglass sculpture of the iconic character relaxing on a bench. “You may not support everything this statue represents—we acknowledge that menu items such as the Arch Deluxe and McDLT complicate Ronald McDonald’s legacy—but to erase it from history would mean erasing the Big Mac and Chicken McNuggets as well. And we will never allow that to happen.” At press time, the protestors had begun swaying and chanting, “Ba da ba ba bah! I’m lovin’ it! Ba da ba ba bah! I’m lovin’ it!”

 

 

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As has been said many times before, Merry...I mean the only

states right that the Confeds were interested in was the right

to own slaves. When they thought ol' Abe might take that

right away they went ballistic, and by doing so ended slavery

in four years. Great job, Johnny Reb. 

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so here are all these liberal democrat mayors targeting for removal confederate monuments...

 

why?...to what end?...no end. just another feel-good unsubstantive move by the left to buy time before too many people start to think.

 

"symbolism over substance" -Rush Limbaugh

 

"what have you got to lose?" -Donny

 

confederate statuary.

 

the young black men of chicago will be forever thankful to this boon before their demise on the killing streets of chicago...tonite?

 

every nite actually. liberal democrats and Rahm Emanuel will have it no other way.

 

outstanding!

 

"soon enough even for the praetor's taste." -mark lenard, 1st season ep balance of terrior

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so here are all these liberal democrat mayors targeting for removal confederate monuments...

 

why?...to what end?...no end. just another feel-good unsubstantive move by the left to buy time before too many people start to think.

 

"symbolism over substance" -Rush Limbaugh

 

"what have you got to lose?" -Donny

 

confederate statuary.

 

the young black men of chicago will be forever thankful to this boon before their demise on the killing streets of chicago...tonite?

 

every nite actually. liberal democrats and Rahm Emanuel will have it no other way.

 

outstanding!

 

"soon enough even for the praetor's taste." -mark lenard, 1st season ep balance of terrior

 

Uh,  the end is the removal of the monuments.     Face it,   the white supremacist have now made the monuments even more toxic by clearly linking these monuments to their racist movement.   I find that funny!    I.e. they protested to prevent the monuments from being removed but instead by linking their movement to these monument MORE monuments are being removed and will be removed.   

 

Therefore expect to see even conservative local officials vote to remove them because as you can see MOST GOP politicians want to have NOTHING to do with the white supremacist movement (e.g. the press conference by very conservative Ted Cruz).

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As has been said many times before, Merry...I mean the only

states right that the Confeds were interested in was the right

to own slaves. When they thought ol' Abe might take that

right away they went ballistic, and by doing so ended slavery

in four years. Great job, Johnny Reb.

The South was also unhappy with all those compromises that we're restricting the extension of slavery into the new territories and new States.

 

In my state you have a special class where everyone has to study Bloody Kansas and what it meant to the history of the entire country. Somebody mentioned on another thread that John Brown was an abolitionist. In Kansas he is

"The Abolitionist".

 

If you ever go to the state capitol, you will see an unbelievable mural there by John Steuart Curry called "Bleeding Kansas" and John Brown is in the middle like a mystical Wildman with his long beard flying in the Dust in the Wind.

 

I had the pleasure in the Chicago History Museum of seeing not only the bed where Lincoln died but also John Brown's Bible.

 

"The Abolitionist" had highlighted and underlined every phrase in the Bible that he could find that told him to set the slaves free. What a guy!

 

 

BTW-- Now I just remembered that the mural is also on the cover of the album

" Kansas " by the Northeast Kansas Group: Kansas; it was released in 1974.

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the confederacy ultimately did not think it proper for the northern states to be dictating arbitrary edicts that would affect the southern economy plus even before the civil war the northern and southern states never really got along that well with each other and it is also true that the confederacy had a very strong position on states rights.

 

even after Lee surrendered a lot of confederates still felt compelled to fight on which suggests some very strong feelings on states right apart from the slavery issue.

 

"States Rights" is a euphemism for permission to be racist.

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The South was also unhappy with all those compromises that we're restricting the extension of slavery into the new territories and new States.

 

In my state you have a special class where everyone has to study Bloody Kansas and what it meant to the history of the entire country. Somebody mentioned on another thread that John Brown was an abolitionist. In Kansas he is

"The Abolitionist".

 

If you ever go to the state capitol, you will see an unbelievable mural there by John Steuart Curry called "Bleeding Kansas" and John Brown is in the middle like a mystical Wildman with his long beard flying in the Dust in the Wind.

 

I had the pleasure in the Chicago History Museum of seeing not only the bed where Lincoln died but also John Brown's Bible.

 

"The Abolitionist" had highlighted and underlined every phrase in the Bible that he could find that told him to set the slaves free. What a guy!

 

 

BTW-- Now I just remembered that the mural is also on the cover of the album

" Kansas " by the Northeast Kansas Group: Kansas; it was released in 1974.

Of course the southern slave owners weren't happy about not being able

to extend slavery to other parts of the country, which I think was Lincoln's

basic belief. But they assumed. incorrectly, that he also wanted to abolish

slavery where it already existed and thus shot themselves in the foot.

 

I've seen the detail of that mural of John Brown. Very impressive. I believe

Brown was originally from Connecticut. Many more monuments to the slave

owner than the abolitionist. Big surprise. 

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Of course the southern slave owners weren't happy about not being able

to extend slavery to other parts of the country, which I think was Lincoln's

basic belief. But they assumed. incorrectly, that he also wanted to abolish

slavery where it already existed and thus shot themselves in the foot.

 

I've seen the detail of that mural of John Brown. Very impressive. I believe

Brown was originally from Connecticut. Many More monuments to the slave

owner than the abolitionist. Big surprise.

In 2007 Les Cowan of the PBS History Detectives and Antique Roadshow appraised a family daguerreotype of John Brown for 60-$80,000. But it was actually sold to an institution for nearly $98,000 that went to the Brown family.

 

The price was so high because they're only about a half a dozen daguerreotypes of The Abolitionist known to exist.

 

The last one sold in 1997, which hangs in the Smithsonian, went for $117,000.

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45]n-Ic9nBO_bigger.jpgWashington PostVerified account @washingtonpost

Analysis: The Capitol has at least three times as many statues of Confederate figures as it does of black people

 

45]o7pTafU9_bigger.jpgRep. Barbara LeeVerified account @RepBarbaraLee

 

 

More

Rep. Barbara Lee Retweeted Washington Post

Serving in Congress, I walk past a dozen statues of men who wanted to keep my ancestors in chains. Think about that.

 

45]

5rooJ7Gm_bigger.jpgElana SchorVerified account @eschor

More

JUST IN: Pelosi to call for removal of Confederate statues from Capitol, urge Ryan to support elimination of the "reprehensible" figures.

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In 2007 Les Cowan of the PBS History Detectives and Antique Roadshow appraised a family daguerreotype of John Brown for 60-$80,000. But it was actually sold to an institution for nearly $98,000 that went to the Brown family.

 

The price was so high because they're only about a half a dozen daguerreotypes of The Abolitionist known to exist.

 

The last one sold in 1997, which hangs in the Smithsonian, went for $117,000.

Apparently there is green in Brown. I didn't realize some of the History Detectives

were on Antiques Roadshow until I saw the young woman on a repeat a couple

of weeks ago. I don't agree with everything Brown did, but seeing what he was

up against, I give him 1.5 thumbs up.

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Perhaps Mr. Trump, who cares so much about history, should speak out about this:

 

45681363683460.jpg

 

 

What's the relevance? The only thing it shares in common, its a statue.  The most iconic scene was the little boy hitting it with his shoe, in the Arab world the worst insult one can give.

 

saddam-statue-hit-with-shoes.jpg

Edited by hamradio
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What's the relevance? The only thing it shares in common, its a statue.  The most iconic scene was the little boy hitting it with his show, in Islam the worst insult one can give.

 

Since we are often sticklers around here, I'll point out that the "hitting with a shoe as insult" is an Arab thing, not a Muslim thing. Yes, most Arabs are Muslims, but the majority of Muslims are not Arabs (Persians/Indonesians/Pakistani/American/etc).

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Apparently there is green in Brown. I didn't realize some of the History Detectives

were on Antiques Roadshow until I saw the young woman on a repeat a couple

of weeks ago. I don't agree with everything Brown did, but seeing what he was

up against, I give him 1.5 thumbs up.

 

When Brown finished with some pro-slavery people in Kansas, indeed, many of them did have 1.5 thumbs up. No LOL

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