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Gloria Grahame a complete package


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Pardon The Interruption but -

 

Congratulations on 8000 posts. Educational, fun and interesting all the time. Thanks for being so dedicated to sharing your great wealth of knowledge and humor with us and me in particular.

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

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I don't have the time to reply to everyone right now, but I hope to do so later tonight.

 

Hi, Jackie -- Please answer me one question, though - If Laurel is the cut and run type, why doesn't she cut and run?

 

inalonelyplace126.jpg

 

Laurel is told she must wait. And look what Laurel says to the travel agent after being told that:

 

inalonelyplace127.jpg

 

"Quickly as you can."

 

I love the above cap because Laurel has one arm in her coat and one arm out... and that is the PERFECT image of Laurel GRAY. Dix was WRONG, Laurel DOESN'T know what she wants. She's not about conviction, but confliction. She's a runner.

 

And I absolutely love Miss G's earlier words about how the phone plays a critical role in this film. She's right. I was amazed by her ability to actually see that, in one shot, the phone is present, but in the next, it's being concealed. I would never catch something like that.

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> {quote:title=HollywoodGolightly wrote:}{quote}

> > {quote:title=sineast wrote:}{quote}

> > I forgot about the Big Heat beverage burn. Those caffe lattes can really sting.

> > I'll go with casual too, Brando over Menjou, though some of those 1940s suits are pretty sharp, as long as you leave out the wild paisley ties (and suspenders). And thank goodness mens' hats have long been out of style.

>

> Well, the good old-fashioned suit at least has never gone out of fashion. :)

>

> Overall, I still like the looks of the 40s a lot better when it's all in a movie, but I'm kind of glad it is easier to dress casual nowadays. ;)

>

> Gloria, of course, always looks smashing no matter what she wears. :D

 

Yeah, the 1940's suits definitely look better with the 1940's background.

I'm sure sweet old Gloria would like fine in a dress made out of burlap

sacks, though the half-bandage look from The Big Heat never caught

on. There seems to have been quite a bit of tension between Gloria

and her soon-to-be ex Nicholas Ray during the filming of +In a Lonely

Place+ and it's difficult to believe it didn't play some part in how the

movie turned out:

 

Grahame and Ray's marriage was starting to come apart during filming. Grahame was forced to sign a contract stipulating that "my husband [Ray] shall be entitled to direct, control, advise, instruct and even command my actions during the hours from 9 AM to 6 PM, every day except Sunday...I acknowledge that in every conceivable situations his will and judgment shall be considered superior to mine and shall prevail." Grahame was also forbidden to "nag, cajole, tease or in any other feminine fashion seek to distract or influence him." The two did separate during filming. Afraid that one of them would be replaced, Ray took to sleeping in a dressing room, lying and saying that he needed to work on the script. Grahame played along with the charade and nobody knew that they had separated. Though there was a brief reconciliation, the couple divorced in 1952. (Wiki)

 

Sounds like there were some premature control freaks, in front of, and behind the camera.

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_Rohanaka_ wrote: *As to what Laurel means... I likely should go back and rewatch this to make sure, but I am thinking that she is sort of feeling guilty that she is having doubts now about Dix.Between the things she's seen, and the things she's heard, she is rattled and having a hard time balancing her love for Dix and her fear of him. And she is laying the blame at Lochner's feet. It is a way for her to justify the frustration and the fear she is feeling without blaming DIX. (or herself) by saying LOCHNER is the one causing all the trouble.*

 

Exactly right. She is referring not so much to Lochner or even her visit. She is referring to the investigation. It as nothing to do with ?listening to people.?

 

_Jackie_ wrote: *She told him at their second meeting that she did not like to be rushed. Now, she tells him she wants to wait to marry, and he tells her she has 10 seconds. That is forcing her to do something against her will, thus controlling her. Dix wants what HE wants WHEN he wants it, and to hell with anyone else's feelings. Just as he persuaded Mildred to break her date so he didn't have to read the book, he now wants Laurel to make her decision at his convenience. If she had done everything he wanted.*

 

Exactly right. And Laural is accused of lying to him when she says yes to marriage. That is not a lie. And she is accused of lying to him when she doesn?t tell him about the pills. That is not a lie. To call those lies is to ignore the context. She was forced into assenting to marriage and she made no attempt to hide the pills. She is afraid of Dix?at least at this point. Dix?s controlling behaviour is reaching a peak here and he spirals downward as the story draws to conclusion, but it was always there. Early on in that long apartment scene when they were being a ?team? he gently cradles her chin and says something like, ?You?ll do such and such and when I tell you do it.? It was done in an affectionate manner because she was acting the way he wanted her to and she took it well because this was a happy time for them but the impulse to control is already shown to be a part of Dix. It is in his nature. The need to control precludes trust. I'm not sure he ever really trusted her completely but he loved her?in his own way.

 

_Jackie_ wrote: *Please answer me one question, though - If Laurel is the cut and run type, why doesn't she cut and run?*

 

 

She is not a cut and run type. As you suggest, if she were a runner she could have left at any time during this protracted fear cycle (which lasts half the movie). You also say, Jackie, ?He seems after all to have control issues, possession issues just the same as Baker.? She left Baker on her own terms and she was able to say coolly and confidently, ??because it wouldn?t have worked out.? She could have made that same decision with Dix and left at any time. But she didn?t because she loved him and was willing to cope with fear to have her love for him fulfilled. He wouldn?t let her because his own issues and his own behavior exaserbated her fears. She only left because she felt herself in danger, not because she is a runner.

 

And *Frank* :) you chose two screen caps that don?t occur until the very end of the story. ;) If she were runner she would have left a long time ago and we would have been walking up the aisle out of the theater still eating our popcorn. ;)

 

But also let me congratulate you on 8,000. :)

 

Yes, only to happy to oblige once again now that the Chargers have vanquished two Cowboy rivals in successive weeks. They are surprising me, these Bolts. I had given up on them. Did not see Dallas game but hard to understand what happened there. It beginning to look like, Frank, that the showdown on Dec 13 might be a big game for both teams..

 

ps. hello there Madamoiselle ButterScotchGreer? :)

 

Edited by: laffite on Nov 16, 2009 1:16 PM for clarity

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*Mon Swasheroo! Bonjour!*

 

Bonjour Miss Banquet Organizer Supreme!

 

*Comment allez-vous ?*

 

Je vais tres bien, tres content to recevoir de vos nouvelles!

 

*i really didnt mean to interupt your In a Lonely Place discussion.*

 

Please be advised that Madamoiselle Butterscotchgreer may interrupt the Lonely Place discussion any time she pleases.

:)

 

Swasheroo

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> {quote:title=sineast wrote:}{quote}

>

> Yeah, the 1940's suits definitely look better with the 1940's background.

> I'm sure sweet old Gloria would like fine in a dress made out of burlap sacks, though the half-bandage look from The Big Heat never caught on. There seems to have been quite a bit of tension between Gloria and her soon-to-be ex Nicholas Ray during the filming of In a Lonely Place and it's difficult to believe it didn't play some part in how the movie turned out:

>

> Grahame and Ray's marriage was starting to come apart during filming. Grahame was forced to sign a contract stipulating that "my husband [Ray] shall be entitled to direct, control, advise, instruct and even command my actions during the hours from 9 AM to 6 PM, every day except Sunday...I acknowledge that in every conceivable situations his will and judgment shall be considered superior to mine and shall prevail." Grahame was also forbidden to "nag, cajole, tease or in any other feminine fashion seek to distract or influence him." The two did separate during filming. Afraid that one of them would be replaced, Ray took to sleeping in a dressing room, lying and saying that he needed to work on the script. Grahame played along with the charade and nobody knew that they had separated. Though there was a brief reconciliation, the couple divorced in 1952. (Wiki)

>

> Sounds like there were some premature control freaks, in front of, and behind the camera.

 

Wow, I had no idea they'd had to go into so much detail - marital detail - in their contracts. I guess the old studio bosses really didn't think there were any boundaries they should observe when it came to dealing with their talent, directors or stars alike.

 

If this was a movie from Columbia, does that mean that was Harry Cohen's idea?

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*Bonjour Miss Banquet Organizer Supreme!*

 

Hey Mr. I've lost my rum Pirate!

 

*Je vais tres bien, tres content to recevoir de vos nouvelles!*

 

pareillement pote! (i think i remember thats how you spell it. heehee)

 

*Please be advised that Madamoiselle Butterscotchgreer may interrupt the Lonely Place discussion any time she pleases.*

 

leffite, laffite, laffite

he is so sweet

when he is on his feet

he wont get his rum back

even if he lets me interrupt the pack...best i could do in a few minutes. heehee!

 

but honestly, i do think we should stick on the subject of mean Laurel and handsome Dix. :)

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*Hey Mr. I've lost my rum Pirate!*

 

Hey, do I care? Just so long as I have mine!

 

*pareillement pote! (i think i remember thats how you spell it. heehee)*

 

I don't understand that. What are doing, making up your own French again?

 

Butterscotch Butterscotch

She like to interrupt

But we don't mind so motch

Because she brings the rum

 

Okay, okay, so the last line didn't rhyme, but I only had a few minutes, hoo hoo.

 

*but honestly, i do think we should stick on the subject of mean Laurel and handsome Dix. :)*

 

No fear, I'm sure we shall.

 

:)

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Hi Mr. G. I want to send you my sincere congratulations on reaching 8,000 posts. You always have something interesting to say. And folks very much enjoy reading YOUR comments. Thanxx for

keeping the spirit of this Message Board a place where we can learn, kibbitz and share our

genuine love of movies with each other...with respect for civility and netiquette.

 

Thank you!

 

:D Congratulations! :D

 

Edited by: CineMaven on Nov 16, 2009 6:50 PM...whew! I finally got it right!

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Hey Shiftless,

 

Mother Molo and I (we're here at The Sands gambling) are drinking a toast.

 

Bet you didn't know how sharp a card player Mother Mo is. I don't recommend playing against her. We are rolling in chips.

 

All the card sharks here are a lot like you, come to think of it. Dapper and falling all over themselves to get on Mother's good side in hopes she'll share her winnings.

 

Little do they know that her "look at me, I've never played before" routine is just that.

 

But, we did want to take a moment and congratulate you on your 8,000 post.

 

And no, she won't be sharing her winnings with you.

 

Better luck when you get to 10,000! ;)

 

Edited by: lzcutter on Nov 16, 2009 4:49 PM because I dropped a few words.

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Okay...enuf with my nice words on my congrats to you (sincerely meant too). I'm back to defend Laurel.

 

In fact, I've come to accept that my pro-Laurel stance and the pro-Dixon folks here are at a stalemate. I will never be able to convince you...and vice-versa. And I think both groups are pretty comfortable with their positions.

 

While here at this coffee shop in TriBeCa, I've been YouTubing "IN A LONELY PLACE." When I'm done with the film (and it looks like they're turning out the lights here at the coffee shop, I will burn the midnight oil to give you my final thoughts re: my position and hopefully answer your question.

 

I look forward to reading your answer to your own question as well.

 

Till later...

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*You do what you wish. All I can do is explain and ask. If my questions go unanswered, they do. But I still must ask them, for I wish to know what others think.*

 

Frank, I answered that way, somewhat at length, because you are investing time to make your responses and you mentioned at the same time that being replied to was important to you and I want to respect that. If time constraints prevent me from making full responses then that might not be fair to you. I will always try to respond to you.

 

*Too bad Dix couldn't have said to her, "Hey, babe, I love you and I want you to be my wife, why wait, honey."*

 

*Would Laurel tell him? How is Dix to know anything when all Laurel does is lie to him?*

 

In the previous scene with Sylvia she told how difficult it was for her to air her feelings so we know she wanted to be able to talk to Dixon. In the marriage proposal scene she tells him she loves him and I if that's true and I believe she is telling the truth with that (Do you?) I believe the story line was about the possibility that she might be willing to talk to him if showed he was open for that. That scene was as much about whether she would talk to him as Dixon being able to loosen up, forget his fear of hearing no and rejection, and talk with her as well.

 

*What's a guy to do?*

 

Not what he did, I hope.

 

*Is it curious at all that he would turn to her and say, "You're lying," when she says that she did not tell him because she did not want to worry him? Does he think she is betraying him? Already? This was the golden age of their relationship, they were happy at that point.*

 

*Yes, he feels betrayed. He feels that a knife has been stuck in his back by the woman he loves. Dix is a murder suspect and he needs to know his woman is on his side; that she believes in him. He needs to confide in her trust. Without that, there's no strength in their relationship. And since they are so happy together, the betrayal hurts all the more. He was blindsided, just as he blindsides the car of "Joe College."*

 

It's curious the movie didn't make more of this. To repeat, If he feels so betrayed why did he forgive her so fast? And why didn't he follow up on it. Its an unresolved issue. It almost seems like a throw away line, as if the screenplay wanted him to say something to her, so they came up with, "Your lying." The fact is he just turned away from her and got mad at Brub, and for good reason because they went behind his back to take Laural down to the station. And if he says she's lying about not telling him then there must be another reason but he seems uninterested what that reason is.

 

*It seems what Lochner and Martha said turned out to be the truth, didn't it? He finally did act out on her.*

 

*Lochner asks Lauren if it "frightens her that a killer is at large," intimating that Dix is the killer. Martha tells Lauren that "they still don't know who killed that checkroom girl," intimating that Dix is the killer. They are proved wrong. In fact, Lochner has to apologize for being wrong. Martha would never apologize for her being wrong.*

 

Yes, of course, they were wrong about Dixon killing Mildred but I took part of the meaning of those scenes as implying that Dixon would act out on Laural. Martha went so far to point out that Dixon beat up the other girl and there might beat up Laural if she stayed with them. They were right about that.

 

*Either Laurel believes Dix killed Mildred or she doesn't.*

 

But how can she know for sure? I believe she thinks not or she wouldn't have hooked up with him in the first place. But a doubt as been planted because of the JoeC scene. She has seen his temper. That's what the story is about at this point. For me, anyway.

 

*There's no "of course," "maybe," or "but."*

 

That sounds like a Dixon Steel marriage proposal ;)

 

*Does she even know what she believes? Sylvia tells her, "you know Dix didn't do it." Laurel says, "I know." Does she know?*

 

She said, "I know," in that way when we murmur something that we want to be sure about. But of course she can't know for sure. She's not God.

 

*I never know where Laurel stands on anything.*

 

That's the story. She is in conflict.

 

*She's all over the place.*

 

???

 

*"But Lochner has a different idea. He thinks she may have done it."*

 

I'm in the camp that says Laural would not give this a second thought if she had not seen Dixon act out on JoeC. She has already demonstrated that she did not believe what Lochner told her, pre JoeC. I thought she came across totally on Dixon's side after that meeting and she seemed comfortable with him after that meeting. If you don't value the significance of the JoeC scene then of course you're going to be confused about Laural and accuse of her of listening to others.

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> {quote:title=HollywoodGolightly wrote:}{quote}

 

>

> Wow, I had no idea they'd had to go into so much detail - marital detail - in their contracts. I guess the old studio bosses really didn't think there were any boundaries they should observe when it came to dealing with their talent, directors or stars alike.

>

> If this was a movie from Columbia, does that mean that was Harry Cohen's idea?

 

 

I don't know the particulars about this specific contract, but it sounds

like something that Ray may have asked for, or demanded, before

the picture started. That's just a guess. And besides, would a

sensitive gent like Harry Cohn make such demands? :D

 

 

 

Gloria%20Grahame%201.jpg

 

Before Sue Ellen Mischke was even a faraway gleam in anybody's eye,

Gloria was sporting the bra as outerwear look. Sexy and prophetic. What

a dame.

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Hey mon pirate!

 

*Hey Mr. I've lost my rum Pirate!*

 

*Hey, do I care? Just so long as I have mine!*

 

no you cant have yours! its too dangerous...its for your own safety....pirates need to be protected too ya know. even if they have to be told by Gloria Grahame.....she's telling me to tell you that! :D

 

*I don't understand that. What are doing, making up your own French again?*

 

no i didnt make that up! i specifically remember learning that in high school silly pirate! it means "likewise pal". look it up, im surely you wil find that somewhere........i dont think i made it up.heehee! wow, thats really bad, now i have to look it up!

 

Butterscotch Butterscotch

She like to interrupt

But we don't mind so motch

Because she brings the rum

 

maybe the last sentence didnt rhyme, b/c it isnt true...heehee! you have to go find it on your own.

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*Hey, do I care? Just so long as I have mine! (rum)*

 

*no you cant have yours! its too dangerous...its for your own safety....pirates need to be protected too ya know. even if they have to be told by Gloria Grahame.....she's telling me to tell you that! :D*

 

Well, okay, if Gloria said so. (Hey wait a minute, I want my rum!) But just so long it isn't that Laural, she's nothin' but a femme fatale, you can't believe anything she says. ;)

 

*no i didnt make that up! i specifically remember learning that in high school silly pirate! it means "likewise pal". look it up, im surely you wil find that somewhere........i dont think i made it up.heehee! wow, thats really bad, now i have to look it up!*

 

Oohhhhhhhhhhh, pareillement...mmm, yep, you're right. I was talking about *pote.* Was that supposed to pirate. Oh no, don't tell me we're going to have to give you a spelling test every time you log on. tsk, tsk.

 

Swasheroo

:)

///

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Well, okay, if Gloria said so. (Hey wait a minute, I want my rum!) But just so long it isn't that Laural, she's nothin' but a femme fatale, you can't believe anything she says.

 

oh but you see, Laurel, is the kind of gal who would just hand you abottle of rum and expect you to give her a kiss for it!

 

*Oohhhhhhhhhhh, pareillement...mmm, yep, you're right. I was talking about pote. Was that supposed to pirate. Oh no, don't tell me we're going to have to give you a spelling test every time you log on. tsk, tsk.*

 

thats a word too! honest! maybe thats the one i spelled wrong. you know me...i cant spell anything right. :) Dix never had this kind of torture...

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