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8 minutes ago, CaveGirl said:

Yeah, sorry...I just got up, and am still groggy [don't ask!] and those guys always remind me of each other, but you are right. It was Nick who did the bits after filming had ended, since Dean was dead and had mumbled his way through the scene as I recall.

Thanks for the correction!

 

Don't be sorry...I am glad to contribute to your thread.

I also got up late. And next time, I may need your help! :P

 

 

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I am no expert with this movie. I might suggest using a set of headphones and listening to the YouTube clip. There are ways to download YouTube clips, convert them to audio, such as MP3, then manipulate them with audio products like Audacity. You may recall the recent "Yanni versus Laurel" audio clip. Some were able to change the results by altering the pitch or frequency equalization. Okay, I just listened on my computer, with my headphones and the voice sounds different. Beyond that, it is out of my league. Suddenly, "Wake Up Little Susie" is spinning in my head. To quote country music group Alabama, "In the corner of my mind, stands a jukebox."

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8 minutes ago, Sundance said:

Don't be sorry...I am glad to contribute to your thread.

I also got up late. And next time, I may need your help! :P

 

 

Though groggy, I still should be able to tell the difference between Nick and Dennis, but when I think of them back then I do think they sort of resembled each other with the blonde locks and all. Of course, Dennis lived a lot longer. Is the name Sundance, in honor of Redford, the film festival or Earl Holliman of the tv show, "Hotel de Paree", if you don't think it is too personal a question?

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On 5/26/2018 at 6:31 PM, Vautrin said:

It was Wilmer practicing his ventriloquism skills just before he slipped out the

back door. 

Now that makes sense! I hate to brag but I have really great voice identification skills. I was the only one in my family who could tell on the phone, which twin was calling of my two cousins, who not even their mother could tell apart on the phone. And of course, I can usually tell celebrity voices on tv commercials plus I won 100 bucks once for betting a guy that the person singing the song, "Don't Let Go" was not Elvis, so hearing that Wilmer might have thrown his voice in the area of the falcon, makes a lot of sense. Thanks, Vautrin!

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On 5/28/2018 at 2:15 AM, Sundance said:

The script has Greenstreet uttering the words "off camera" or CLOSEUP of the Bird.

576260974_ScreenShot2018-05-28at12_49_10AM.png.934d6d79eed902097c1ebff3200d0578.png

IMG_5620.thumb.jpg.1a4f617f807e75f54c6428299924f755.jpg

The line,"it's a fake" shows Greenstreet uttering it on camera

but it's a shot which doesn't last long.

I agree, it does not sound like the "fatman", but keep in mind that he was very frustrated.

IMG_5622.thumb.jpg.e62bab000d9f39b7dfceb19fd1cfac47.jpg

Hmmm...so the script says:

"GUTMAN
[hoarsely]
It's a fake!"
 

Are you implying, Sundance that it was father of actor, Lee Hoarsely, who played Matt Houston on tv?

Oh wait, he spelled it "Horsley".

Never mind...

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On 5/28/2018 at 11:15 AM, Hoganman1 said:

Interesting. I think see where you want to go with this thread. There are many "mysteries" surrounding movies. One famous one is whether or not Shame slumps in the saddle and dies at the end. Another one is how did Doc Holiday (Val Kilmer) get out of his sick bed and beat Wyatt Earp (Kurt Russell) to the showdown with Johnny Ringo in Tombstone. Another thing that's always bothered me was that in The Untouchables (with Kevin Costner and Sean Connery) they killed Frank Nitti during the trial of Capone. History reveals that Nitti actually outlived Capone and ran his organization long after Capone was imprisoned as shown in the 60s TV show The Untouchables. I'm sure there are many more out there. I plan to give this some thought to see how many I can find.

You got it, Hoganman! Should we just believe all that we read in books and movie magazines or dig in when things don't seem to fit the bill? Movie mysteries are all around us, just waiting to be cracked open. Like for example, who is the Billy Gray listed in the credits of "Some Like It Hot" since it definitely does not seem to be the darling Bud Anderson of "Father Knows Best" fame. What exactly is stuck on the lamp in the bedroom scenes in "Dracula" with Helen Chandler. So many mysteries, so little time but I will uncover who was really the voice at the end of MF someday I'm sure. Thanks for your most sage post!

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On 5/29/2018 at 1:36 PM, Ray Faiola said:

It's Greenstreet. It was looped in studio as a "wild" insert.

Now, if you want oddball voices, watch some Universal films of the 1930's. Whenever a voice insert was needed, they would have one of the technicians (probably Bernard Brown himself - who else would have the gall) to dub in the line. This practice was rampant in the serials. The insert would sound NOTHING like the on-screen actor's voice (Lugosi was often victim to this heinous practice).

In HOLD THAT GHOST, Don Terry's voice is dubbed (only one line - "Wait a minute, we know our way around") by a virtual soundalike for Cliff Clark. Was it Cliff? He was shooting MOB TOWN on the lot.

Thanks, Ray but I just don't buy it.

One cannot just go on credits or the typical background story about such things. Let's use for example the case of the famous "Twilight Zone" episode, called "The Eye of the Beholder".

According to the credits, noted Actors Studio graduate, Maxine Stuart, was chosen to do all the scenes as the bandaged Janet Tyler, since she had a notable throaty and very intense voice. At the end of the episode, as we all know, the bandages come off, and the "ugly" Janet is revealed to be the beauteous, Donna Douglas of Elly Mae fame on "The Beverly Hillbillies". The "ugly" [but to us very handsome guy from the home for the unsuitable and unsurgically possible victims of their unattractiveness] fellow comes in to tell Janet Tyler [who is now being played by Donna] that she will enjoy her new home and she says something like "Why are we like this?" or whatever, and of course it was thought that she was dubbed by Maxine, since their voices are not the least alike.

But in actuality, Donna Douglas supposedly had been listening all during the filming and was able quite effectively to mimic the very unique voice of Maxine, and the production crew decided not to do the voiceover as a match, and left the voice of Douglas in. I always wait for this moment to listen and see if it really sounds right, and Donna does an excellent rendition, in fact much closer to Maxine's voice than the voice in the MF sounds like Greenstreet. Even this legendary story have some detractors but the version about Douglas has been confirmed by many, though maybe not Stuart.

So, I rest my case...and won't stop searching till I find definitive proof, or maybe contact Gutman from beyond the grave!

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3 hours ago, jimmymac71 said:

I am no expert with this movie. I might suggest using a set of headphones and listening to the YouTube clip. There are ways to download YouTube clips, convert them to audio, such as MP3, then manipulate them with audio products like Audacity. You may recall the recent "Yanni versus Laurel" audio clip. Some were able to change the results by altering the pitch or frequency equalization. Okay, I just listened on my computer, with my headphones and the voice sounds different. Beyond that, it is out of my league. Suddenly, "Wake Up Little Susie" is spinning in my head. To quote country music group Alabama, "In the corner of my mind, stands a jukebox."

There are some interesting things floating around out there, but I don't consider the "Yanni versus Laurel" audio clip to be one of them.  I had the opportunity to hear this for myself, as a certain radio host seemed obsessed with it and kept playing it over and over (I soon changed the channel).  I later downloaded the podcast so I could repeat this test under my own controlled conditions.  As expected, I got different results for different time marks, but more importantly was able to repeat the results for each time I repeated the same time mark.  So at least for me it is not so much a situation of ambiguity and selective hearing.  Rather I would describe it as someone running two sources at the same time and playing around with a simple DJ-style cross-fader.

I did this with a pair of speakers which I am familiar with, and stayed in the same position throughout.

P.S. There are other possibilities, such as position-dependent phase cancellation, which could be used to alter apparent volume of different sounds in a stereo image, depending on your location between two speakers (another use, though different, is noise-cancelling headsets).  Also there is the precedence effect, whereby small millisecond delays can be used to alter the apparent direction from which a sound is coming from between two speakers, though the sound is the same exact volume level from each speaker (you really need to be equidistant between two speakers for this to work).

I doubt the "Yanni versus Laurel" audio clip uses anything anywhere near this level of sopistication though.

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1 hour ago, CaveGirl said:

Now that makes sense! I hate to brag but I have really great voice identification skills. I was the only one in my family who could tell on the phone, which twin was calling of my two cousins, who not even their mother could tell apart on the phone. And of course, I can usually tell celebrity voices on tv commercials plus I won 100 bucks once for betting a guy that the person singing the song, "Don't Let Go" was not Elvis, so hearing that Wilmer might have thrown his voice in the area of the falcon, makes a lot of sense. Thanks, Vautrin!

I feel a little sorry for any guy named Wilmer, even if he was a jerk. One of my favorite parts

of The Maltese Falcon is the interplay between Gutman and Spade in the former's hotel room,

the whole I like to talk to a man who likes to talk to other men who like to talk, etc. Cracks me

up every time. 

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6 minutes ago, Vautrin said:

I feel a little sorry for any guy named Wilmer, even if he was a jerk. One of my favorite parts

of The Maltese Falcon is the interplay between Gutman and Spade in the former's hotel room,

the whole I like to talk to a man who likes to talk to other men who like to talk, etc. Cracks me

up every time. 

Snappy dialogue for sure and Bogart was always up to it, with that overlying commentary. Poor Elisha! My mother always said she felt sorry for him since he always looked worried, even as late as in the film "The House on Haunted Hill". To this day, I've always wondered if he was Junior, then just what did Elisha Cook, Senior look like? I think the time has come to find out, so excuse me while I go hunting him down online. 

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With regards to my avatar name.

Sundance was a Bombay cat that was with me for 14 years but died recently.

I'm using it as an homage on this forum.

Greenstreet off camera voice does sound different. But on screen you can see and hear him utter, "it's a fake".

He was disappointed & frustrated, perhaps that's why his voice sounds different. 

But if you find something different, I'll be happy to know about it.

Thanks!

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1 hour ago, CaveGirl said:

Now that makes sense! I hate to brag but I have really great voice identification skills. I was the only one in my family who could tell on the phone, which twin was calling of my two cousins, who not even their mother could tell apart on the phone. And of course, I can usually tell celebrity voices on tv commercials plus I won 100 bucks once for betting a guy that the person singing the song, "Don't Let Go" was not Elvis, so hearing that Wilmer might have thrown his voice in the area of the falcon, makes a lot of sense. Thanks, Vautrin!

I too would know "Don't Let Go" was not Elvis. I cheated and looked it up. Roy Hamilton. So, who actually sang "All American Boy?" If it is an over-dub, good thing they weren't trying to cheat Bogart or Lorre. This was before Rich Little's time. When listening on headphones, and once again, this isn't a movie I know very well, the voice in question sounded a wee bit British or something similar. Greenstreet, to me, sounded like a cigar smoker, while the other voice was cleaner. I want to believe the voice was added later, as it sounded more like directly talking into the microphone, like when someone sings in a movie and you know it was done in a studio setting.

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6 hours ago, CaveGirl said:

Snappy dialogue for sure and Bogart was always up to it, with that overlying commentary. Poor Elisha! My mother always said she felt sorry for him since he always looked worried, even as late as in the film "The House on Haunted Hill". To this day, I've always wondered if he was Junior, then just what did Elisha Cook, Senior look like? I think the time has come to find out, so excuse me while I go hunting him down online. 

Cook did often look like he was nervous and that someone was about to come out of a

closet and beat the **** out of him, which wouldn't be too hard to do considering his

small physique. He had the same look in the TV shows he guested on. 

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18 hours ago, CaveGirl said:

You got it, Hoganman! Should we just believe all that we read in books and movie magazines or dig in when things don't seem to fit the bill? Movie mysteries are all around us, just waiting to be cracked open. Like for example, who is the Billy Gray listed in the credits of "Some Like It Hot" since it definitely does not seem to be the darling Bud Anderson of "Father Knows Best" fame. What exactly is stuck on the lamp in the bedroom scenes in "Dracula" with Helen Chandler. So many mysteries, so little time but I will uncover who was really the voice at the end of MF someday I'm sure. Thanks for your most sage post!

Here's another one. Why do they show an armadillo in the Bela Lugosi film "Dracula". My understanding is they are not native to Eastern Europe. That's always caught my attention when watching that old horror flick. I guess we'll never know for sure,

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10 minutes ago, Hoganman1 said:

Here's another one. Why do they show an armadillo in the Bela Lugosi film "Dracula". My understanding is they are not native to Eastern Europe. That's always caught my attention when watching that old horror flick. I guess we'll never know for sure,

It is supposed to be a large rat, but guess they had to substitute the armadillo.  My wife and I laugh every time we see it as it is quite obvious that it is not a rat.

You may be referring to Mark of the Vampire (1935).

Sort of like the shrews in The Killer Shrews (1959).  Obviously dogs with pieces of cloth over them.

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Ha, I never thought of that, but it sure makes sense. I thought I was the only one to notice these obscure, but questionable details in movies. Most people don't pay attention or simply don't care. I'm glad to know there are others like me. 

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2 minutes ago, Hoganman1 said:

Ha, I never thought of that, but it sure makes sense. I thought I was the only one to notice these obscure, but questionable details in movies. Most people don't pay attention or simply don't care. I'm glad to know there are others like me. 

I updated my post.  You may actually be referring to 1935's Mark of the Vampire.

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3 minutes ago, TheCid said:

I updated my post.  You may actually be referring to 1935's Mark of the Vampire.

No, he's right. There are armadillos in the Lugosi Dracula too.

Image result for dracula 1931 armadillo

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1 minute ago, TheCid said:

I updated my post.  You may actually be referring to 1935's Mark of the Vampire.

Maybe that is the actual title. I know Lugosi did several films as Dracula. Is Mark of the Vampire the one where Renfield goes to the castle in Transylvania to close the deal on the mansion the count has purchased in England? I think that's the one with the armadillo.

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5 minutes ago, Hoganman1 said:

Maybe that is the actual title. I know Lugosi did several films as Dracula. Is Mark of the Vampire the one where Renfield goes to the castle in Transylvania to close the deal on the mansion the count has purchased in England? I think that's the one with the armadillo.

SPOILER:  Mark of the Vampire is the one where Lugosi, his daughter and another man are actually actors pretending to be vampires.  They are hired to root out a murderer.  All takes place in the mansion in Prague.   Entirely possible they used armadillos as rats in other "vampire" movies though.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_of_the_Vampire

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4 hours ago, Hoganman1 said:

Here's another one. Why do they show an armadillo in the Bela Lugosi film "Dracula". My understanding is they are not native to Eastern Europe. That's always caught my attention when watching that old horror flick. I guess we'll never know for sure,

Director Tod Browning was probably paying homage to the German film, Nosferatu.

nosferatu_1922_21012_by_mcdisenio-d5avhs3.thumb.jpg.610b78e0dda12809f84786793dbf6829.jpg

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Didn't they make a Spanish speaking version of Dracula after hours. Maybe

they put the armadillo in for that and forgot to take it our for the U.S version. 

I never drink...sangria.

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Dracula also features a possum, which looks like a large rat. You also see a beetle or cricket of some sort crawling out a coffin. They obviously used a tiny coffin, I guess to make the bug look like it is enormous. 

They used possums, armadillos and bugs, as Dracula was supposed to be in tune with the "low things" of the world. Audiences were creeped out by the armadillos in areas of the country where they aren't native, and many viewers had never seen one before.

a.possum.png

ItEV.gif

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25 minutes ago, Vautrin said:

Didn't they make a Spanish speaking version of Dracula after hours. Maybe

they put the armadillo in for that and forgot to take it our for the U.S version. 

I never drink...sangria.

The Spanish version was made in the evenings somewhere near the desert which included the use of armadillos. For the English version, the same set was used in the day including the armadillos which Browning approved.

The bottom photo of the crawling insect that LawrenceA posted

could be found in the California desert as well.

 

 

 

 

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31 minutes ago, LawrenceA said:

Dracula also features a possum, which looks like a large rat. You also see a beetle or cricket of some sort crawling out a coffin. They obviously used a tiny coffin, I guess to make the bug look like it is enormous. 

They used possums, armadillos and bugs, as Dracula was supposed to be in tune with the "low things" of the world. Audiences were creeped out by the armadillos in areas of the country where they aren't native, and many viewers had never seen one before.

a.possum.png

ItEV.gif

Old joke.  An armadillo is a possum on the half shell.

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