Movie Rambles

[Bronxgirl48]

[route66]

 

5 cents sounds about right. The movies probably cost about the same, too.

[Catwoman915]

You know when they played Goodbye Mr. Chips on TCM I didn't even bother to watch it (no offense to Peter O'Toole. I was just soooo disappointed that it wasn't the Robert Donat/Greer Garson one. Oh well, maybe I'll have better luck next time.

[moviefan1951]

Catwoman,

For what it's worth, I'm a pretty big fan of Peter O'Toole and even I can't stand the remake of "Goodbye Mr. Chips", the songs were a particularly low point for me. I don't blame O'Toole, but I don't know who should have been blamed.

 

I think we'll all be better off if we stick with the original Donat/Garson version.

[JackFavell]

I remember watching a documentary about cinematography some time back, and they were talking to Conrad Hall, or maybe Richard Brooks about the movie In Cold Blood. They filmed a scene with the reflection of rain on the actor's face, which was a total accident - but it was a great image....

 

Well, the last time I watched A Tree Grows in Brooklyn, this is what I found....filmed 20 years earlier.

 

 

What you can't see here very well is the movement of the falling rain, and the light reflected on Katie's face.... it plays around her face, landing on the pillow and her cheeks or forehead occasionally. It is not a light intended to make her more beautiful. It is there to point up the shadows that have crossed over the family. Emotion deferred has a powerful shadow..... But in the end, Katie is illuminated.

 

I was thinking about the movie last night, and realized that aside from the street music at the beginning, I don't think this movie has a score. At least, I don't remember one. It feels right too, because we are immersed in the real life of these people. There is no music in these people's lives, except that which Johnny brings to them. None that could point up their situation any more eloquently. There is the hint of music to come, since Katie has mentioned that Francie should have piano lessons.... and when Katie sets her mind to something, it actually happens.....

 

I used to watch this movie totally from Francie's viewpoint. But I have noticed that lately, I find myself identifying so much with Katie. Katie must give her children the strength to go out into the world and MAKE IT, even if it kills her, even if she is hated for it. This is what drives her, causing her to be hard and unemotional. She has to be hard so her children will have the skills to cope in that difficult world they belong to. The beauty of the movie is that you can identify with Katie and Francie at the same time.

[rohanaka]

Kathy, you will love and appreciate this movie, I just KNOW it

 

Well my little Bronxgirl... you were RIGHT!!!! (Sorry to be so late to the party, folks) :-)

 

I was so happy to get to watch A Tree Grows In Brooklyn last night. I don't know why I haven't seen it before... just one of those "things" I guess... but I did enjoy it very much..

 

You all have said so many things about this film already... so I don't know what I can add to these rambles that would not just seem like overkill... but I will make a few comments...somehow I am sure I can manage to find SOMETHING to jabber on about... :-) (I know... big surprise... Ha)

 

I think this story really has an interesting title... because it sounds very "poetic"... and Jackie... you mentioned the poetry angle I believe... I may be re-stating someone else's thought... But the "tree" in the title is not the one outside their window in the story... It's Francie...

 

Think of her life... and how she is the "best" of both her parent's (but mostly of her dad) and how she is there... in that "hard" life sprouting so BEAUTIFULLY in the middle of it all. Her mother gave her the strong roots... and her father gave her the lovely branches... She's the tree.

 

I also agree that there are some comparisons to How Green Was My Valley... nice catch there, MissB. Aside from the uncanny physical resemblance between Peggy and Roddy..... their two characters were similar in a lot of ways.

 

I think there are some differences too though, from the other movie... because their family unit is NOT built from the same sort of strong weave as the one in HGWMV... the mother was still the tie that bound them together... But in a MUCH different way... And the two father's were VERY different... and Neely was WAY different from the brothers in HGWMV...

 

But one other thing that WAS similar (at least in my mind) to HGWMV... was the use of music...

 

Jackie.. I think you are right that there did not seem to be much of a "score" for this film... butstill there was music going on almost ALL the time... it was playing in the streets or in the other apartments... or Johnny was singing.... or the church bells and congregation were singing... almost throughout the entire movie... and almost to the point of distraction for me. But I think it was there for a reason... it was the music... the sound, if you will, of their lives. Sort of like a little "opera" going on in the background.

 

There were a LOT of interesting moments in this story that add so much to the understanding of these characters and who they are as people... Francie telling the librarian that she is working her way alphabetically through every book in the library (and the librarian giving her "another" book to keep her from getting so weighed down by the one she had chosen).... Neely and his "streetsmart" attitude.... he has NO illusions about his dad by the way... (he is too much like his mom in that regard) Johnny with his big dreams... I like how Sissy tells Francie that he always "means it" when he makes them those golden promises... just that sometimes things don't always work out... And SISSY... ha... She was SOMETHING. But her heart seemed to be as big as all outdoors. I also liked McShane... what a STAND UP guy...

 

And I loved the part where BILL finally gets up his backbone and becomes STEVE. The Grandmother says... "We FINALLY have a man in the family." ha. And wasn't SHE something?? I loved the part where she tells the children their reading WILL go on... and why.

 

And then... there was Mama... Dorothy Maguire did such a good job in this film... she showed just the right range of emotion throughout. She was a perfect example of a woman whose dreams had all but gone... and had who become SO caught up in surviving she'd forgotten the need to "live".

 

Katie totally ignores... I think on purpose... the sick little girl's pretty new dress... because she doesn't think it is a good idea to spend money on such things. (and ps.. I LOVED how later on.. Johnny makes over that little girl and how beautiful the dress is... and Francie sees it all) ... and then later on, Katie tells (I think it was Sissy) about how Johnny would have bought her babies dolls instead of bread if she had let him... She KNOWS money is not for anything "frivolous" because she has learned it and lived it the hard way. She won't even give a "thank you" dime to the iceman who helped her family move. She is not miserly.. she just can't afford the luxury of being kind with her coins.. That money is there for her family's "needs" and nothing else matters.

 

Her little can of pennies was the thing that kept her head up... and it was more about "pride" for her family rather than "pride in her family". They all had such a struggle due to Johnny's drinking and lack of income... that her driving desire was to make sure she and her family stayed "above" the poverty of character that so many gave into while they were fighting physical poverty as well. (I loved how everytime she runs into McShane she goes out of her way to tell him that her family is NOT a problem and that they are all staying out of trouble and do not need any help)

 

Katie had NO time for dreaming or for letting her children dream as well... But deep inside her, there was a little ember of the woman she used to be still glowing and it was beautiful when it would shine from time to time. I loved the scene where Johnny comes home from that party and she starts letting herself relax and enjoy the stories and she even relives some of the old "romance" with him... but then that reality of their present life just drags her back down again... and the moment is lost.

 

After Johnny's death.. she starts to take stock of her own life.. and what she'd become... and she realizes not too many people would mourn her passing the way they had his... and it works on her. I liked the transition... the conversation with the bar owner and then next with Francie seemed to be the "nudge" that finally got her rolling in the right direction...

 

I loved the ending w/ McShane.. He holds back a LOT earlier on in the story out of respect for their pride.. and admiration for Katie.. And then when he decides it is time to NOT hold back anymore...I loved the way he makes the WHOLE family a part of the decision

 

And then I loved the way the two kids start to speculate on their futures (and on all the stuff their sister will miss out on) while they are talking up on the roof. What a great closing line... "AW... cut the MUSH!" :-)

 

PS. Barb... you mentioned the coffee too.. you are so right... It is ALL throughout that film... and it gets used in a variety of ways... but mostly it seemed to be a drink to draw strength from or to maybe "center" themselves in moments where things seemed to be getting out of hand. "Francie.. make some coffee"... It was like the one thing the mother knew would help when they were trying to figure out how to make everything else work too.

[route66]

*Well, the last time I watched A Tree Grows in Brooklyn, this is what I found....filmed 20 years earlier.*

 

Good catch, Wendy! Maybe that's where they got the inspiration for the similar shot in "In Cold Blood". In any event, it looks good on-screen, and that's what counts. B-)

[JackFavell]

I am so glad you got to watch the movie!

 

>Think of her life... and how she is the "best" of both her parent's (but mostly of her dad) and how she is there... in that "hard" life sprouting so BEAUTIFULLY in the middle of it all. Her mother gave her the strong roots... and her father gave her the lovely branches... She's the tree.

 

Ooh! You just took my breath away with that sentence. I never thought it out all the way- I sort of knew that they were growing in a city of cement, but the way you carried that out to it's logical conclusion was amazing. I am overwhelmed how you saw that and were able to put it down. I fumble and fumble, and then, out you come with such a simple statement. I love that - "the mother gave her roots and the father the branches." It is the perfect analogy. I don't know how I could have missed it, now that you said it.

 

>Katie totally ignores... I think on purpose... the sick little girl's pretty new dress... because she doesn't think it is a good idea to spend money on such things. (and ps.. I LOVED how later on.. Johnny makes over that little girl and how beautiful the dress is... and Francie sees it all) ... and then later on, Katie tells (I think it was Sissy) about how Johnny would have bought her babies dolls instead of bread if she had let him...

 

I think Katie ignores the dress on purpose too. She even thinks it is bad for the little girl to hear such flattery and nonsense. And I love that you showed how that theme is followed along through the movie. You are absolutely right. At the end of that short little scene, as the little girl runs back into her apartment crying, Katie and Francie give each other a shrug, as if to say, "What was that all about?". It's one of my favorite moments between Katie and Francie.

 

It is a brilliant script, because each little tiny thread is tied to all the other little threads, until the whole movie is a cloth interwoven so finely that it holds together perfectly. As hard as it is to watch emotionally, it is a real pleasure to see an almost perfect movie.....

[rohanaka]

Hiya Wendy.. thanks for the kind words...

 

It is a brilliant script, because each little tiny thread is tied to all the other little threads, until the whole movie is a cloth interwoven so finely that it holds together perfectly.

 

That is very well said and you are right... it is almost a perfect movie in that respect.

 

And PS... I have never seen you "fumble and fumble"... you always do a terrific job of bringing out the best parts of a movie.

[JackFavell]

Why thank you! You don't know how good that makes me feel. I always had writers block when I was young - more like a phobia than a block actually. This place has been such a great place for me to learn to write all over again. I only do it because most everyone is so kindly here, and I really care about movies so much.

 

But many times I can't get the feeling or thought that's in my head down on the paper... ur... computer screen. Sometimes my feelings are just so vague I can't even think what words would describe them. Or I look at my words, and they seem like they aren't even sentences anymore. It is like a fog up here in this brain....

[moviefan1951]

> This place has been such a great place for me to learn to write all over again.

 

Glad to hear that. I mean, to read that.

[rohanaka]

Wendy I know what you mean about using this place to work on your writing skills... I think that is why I like to "ramble"... (Once again.... hail to Miss G for her stroke of genius in starting this thread so long ago)

 

And I also just enjoy the freedom of being able to jabber sometimes... Ha. So much of our day to day conversations in real life are more like the "leave a comment and move on" sorts of threads on here. But I tend to speak just like I write.. and even in verbal conversations I am way too "chatty". I am much more of a "rambler". (It drives the QT absolutely NUTS... "Get to the point"!! But what he doesn't always understand is that for me to be able to explain the point... I have to lay the groundwork of what I am trying to say first. Ha) He is a "short sentence" talker... I am more like an "entire chapter" kinda gal)

 

So it is nice to have an outlet for that. It's good to have a place to be able to explore all the possibilities of what a film might or might not mean or why or why not one film is more enjoyable than another. And you are right.. most of the folks her ARE kindly... and have been very nice to put up with all my "jabbering".

 

And PS... I think my whole brain is one big "FOG" bank... and every now and then I just have to come here to make a "withdrawl" and hope it makes sense.... Ha. :-)

[JackFavell]

It drives the QT absolutely NUTS...

 

Oh, I hear ya! My guy is always sooo embarrassed when I end up talking to someone for any length of time. He always says, "WAY too much information... " That is a gentle hint to me that I have said too much! I am not indiscreet with what I say, I am just a midwestern girl at heart, and we are naturally gregarious types as you well know! I will go off on a tangent (he thinks) when really I HAD to bring up the tangent in order to explain the ...... oh, gee. I DO talk too much.

[rohanaka]

We're rambling about.... rambling!! ha.

[JackFavell]

hee hee....

[Bronxgirl48]

Kathy, boy is your ramble worth the wait!! I was totally knocked out by it, and agree with Wendy about your poetically insightful description of "her mother gave her strong roots and her father gave her the lovely branches" You put it s-o-o-o beautifully, it couldn't have been said better.

 

I didn't think of it before, but you are absolutely right about the similarities in the use of music here and in HGWMV, the everyday score of life going on!

 

I love what you write about Katie, how caught up she was in surviving and not living - how she's not miserly but can't afford the luxury of being, as you say "kind with her coins" (this is great; you know how to turn a phrase, girl) Your comments about Katie's and Johnny's reactions towards Flossie's dress were very well stated. When you wrote about the embers still glowing in Katie for the woman she used to be, I was awestruck, that was just....beautiful. I liked that you brought up Grandma and her reverence for "the learning" in that important scene that places the fictional Nolan family story in historical context. I liked what you had to say about Officer McShane's character.

 

You really make me want to see the movie again, which I will, on Saturday when it airs on the Fox movie channel.

 

A great, great ramble.

 

Message was edited by: Bronxgirl48

[rohanaka]

Thank you little missy for saying all that... but you'd better stop now or I may NEVER be able to get my BIG HEAD through the door. Ha. :-)

 

I think there were just so many good things to get from all these characters and from the movie in general that it was fun trying to put it all down in a way that hopefully made some sense... AND... PS... I was just following everybody else's lead... I think everybody had some really good thoughts on this one... and again.. it would have to be because it is just that good of a story.

 

One other little "tidbit" that I have been thinking on was the conversation between Katie and Johnny about the little neighbor girl w/ the pretty dresses...

 

After the little girl dies, Katie makes some sort of remark about how those dresses didn't do her any good and then Johnny says something like... "But she had the dresses" and then Katie says something like... "And now she'll have to be buried in "Potter's Field". It was like that was THE ULITMATE issue for her... and in her mind it was literally a fate WORSE than death.

 

And it all goes back to what I was saying about her not really "living".. She was willing to pay so much of her family's money to the insurance man to make sure they all had proper burials... when they could have easily used that money for "living" things. But I don't think she saw any of them as having anything to look forward to except a good funeral in the end... and she was going to make sure they got it... It was a HUGE matter of pride for her, and it was the ONLY luxury she was willing to spend any money on. And it is really a sad thing to see how of all the plans she had for her family... that one seemed to mean the most.

[Bronxgirl48]

You're a terrific writer and reading this particular ramble was so enjoyable and addictive, like potato chips, for me, I wanted to hear more and more of your insights and thoughts.

 

You are so right about Katie's pride, and how she strove hard to make sure everyone knew their family wasn't deficient in character, only money. Officer McShane intuitively picked up on this, "I guess I know a lady when I see one".

 

Your insights into Katie not "living", and her wish for the family to have a decent funeral, are brilliant.

 

Now I'm going to make myself a big pot of coffee (like the Nolans, I can't live without it) because I want to stay up for KNIGHT WITHOUT ARMOUR. (don't miss it!)

 

Message was edited by: Bronxgirl48

[rohanaka]

Ok.. now thanks to you my hat size is going to be going up... but THANKS for the kind words... and may I also say... right back at ya, little lady. You are quite the "phrase turner" yourself.

 

And THANKS for the tip on the Marlene film.. I have a new appreciation for her ever since I saw her in Destry Rides Again back at the first of the year...

 

I stayed up a little too late last night... but I will try to make a go of it and give it a "watch'...

 

Maybe I should put on some coffee too.. but all I keep in the house is DECAF... It won't keep me awake from the caffeine.... but... if you recall our recent little chat about coffee.. It WILL keep me awake. Ha. :-)

[moviefan1951]

> You really make me want to see the movie again, which I will, on Saturday when it airs on the Fox movie channel.

 

Thank you for the reminder! I really want to catch this again.

[Bronxgirl48]

I've got to get up early tomorrow, but I don't want to miss KNIGHT WITHOUT ARMOUR; it's been so long since I've seen it.

 

I've never forgotten the scene at the train station, where Robert Donat, with his inimitably beautiful voice, recites a bit of Robert Browning to Marlene.

[JackFavell]

Oh golly! *Knight Without Armour* ! I LOVED it!

 

It's pretty silly, really, but I didn't care....Robert Donat was dreamy..... good lord, the man could carry me across Russia in a big furry hat ANYTIME.....

 

Did you guys make it? I had tea instead of coffee, but I fell asleep during Things to Come, and woke up at about the point in *Knight* where Donat and Dietrich are starting out together.

 

Oh my gosh, I was on the edge of my seat the whole time. I hardly knew what was going on at first, having woken up out of a sound sleep, but it didn't matter. Marlene was as gorgeous in this one as I've ever seen her, especially the scene at the river where she looks wild and free as she is bathing, and her hair is all messy (in a movie star way). I don't think I've seen Dietrich that open looking and loose before. She is usually so serious and sort of tight inside herself. It was charming. I like her best about this time in her career - 1935-1938-ish. I like her foolish romances with Gary Cooper, Donat, and Charles Boyer.

 

But *Donat*.... I can't believe how sick he was during the filming. RO said that he had a week long asthma attack during filming. Marlene actually prevented him from being recast, and she also nursed him back to health. This is the second time I have heard about her doing something like this, and it changes my opinion of her as a person a bit. I really need to read up on her.

 

Anyway, *Donat* was _such_ a great actor that he actually looked robust and strong throughout the picture. A real leading man. Rugged, even. Sigh. There was a scene where he and Marlene are either in a hay pile or maybe it was when they first got on the train, and he says something to her and just rolls his eyes up - he looks so smitten with her I about died. I always forget that Donat can be sexy, so very sexy...... my word! I was smitten again. Every time I see him in a movie, I fall for him.....uh, sorry for rambling on incoherently about him! He does it for me, that's all I can say. I just love him. And his furry hat. I am seriously star struck. He has a combination of manly charms and sensitivity that I find sooo appealing. And I totally bought his character. I would love to be in a pile of hay alone with him, even though I am allergic to hay.......maybe he could rescue me from it

 

And Poushkoff, played by John Clements, was almost as wonderful.... I was really shocked at the outcome of that part of the story.

 

OK. I really don't have that much to say about the story. Goofy, but I loved the way it was filmed. Nicely epic and suitably big and beautiful. They should do an evening of Russian rescue movies. Reds is one I have been dying to see again... and it would make a great double feature. Although Reds is 4 and a half hours long.... maybe not a double feature after all......

 

Oh, never mind. Maybe just a festival of all of *Robert Donat* 's movies, back to back..... Heaven!

[rohanaka]

Wasn't that a terrific movie!!! I am sorry you missed the beginning of it..

 

;

 

THANKS so much Barb for the tip. I WAS sleepy but I didn't have any trouble keeping my little eyes open to watch this one... And Jackie... you took the words right out my mouth.. or um.. right off of my keyboard... Marlene was the most beautiful I have EVER seen her (though I must confess I have a limited range of knowledge to work from with her)

 

It was a veritable ROLLER COASTER ride to be sure... I just kept saying over and over.. NOW how are they going to get out of THIS one...

 

My favorite shot may have come to early in the film for you Jackie... but did you see her out on the lawn by her little pond in the flowing white gown... when all of the "revolting people" showed up... OH MY GOLLY... and she turns to them and sort of freezes... and then holds her head up and walks right toward them... oh my.

 

But I also was more or less melted into my socks w/ the scene between her and Donat when he comes back to find her in the forest after he hid her under all those leaves.... (HUGE sigh!!!)

 

And I agree with you... poor young Poushkoff, what a charmer.. and so tragic. I imagine he could be a representative of a lot of young men who got more or less unwillingly caught up in the "hysteria" of the revolution and had little or no taste for what he was called upon to do... and it was a HUGE surprise what happened... I was expecting him to do the opposite... (and it would be hard to explain what I mean w/out giving too much away so I hope you can figure it out for yourself... or let me know and I will PM you.. Ha.)

 

Thanks again Barb for recommending this film... It's playing again in April and in May.. so I am going to try to get it on tape. It's a keeper for sure.

 

Message was edited by: rohanaka

[JackFavell]

> {quote:title=rohanaka wrote:}{quote}

> Wasn't that a terrific movie!!! I am sorry you missed the beginning of it..

Me too!

 

 

Gorgeous poster. Let's just look at those big eyes again.......and i'm NOT talking Marlene here....

> ;

 

> It was a veritable ROLLER COASTER ride to be sure... I just kept saying over and over.. NOW how are they going to get out of THIS one...

I didn't see how they were going to get out of it that last time! And I was sure that he was going to get shot as he ran between the Red Cross trains.... so suspenseful....

 

> My favorite shot may have come to early in the film for you Jackie... but did you see her out on the lawn by her little pond in the flowing white gown... when all of the "revolting people" showed up... OH MY GOLLY... and she turns to them and sort of freezes... and then holds her head up and walks right toward them... oh my.

That may have been right when I woke up - the white dress sounds right but I was too sleepy to really be aware - I think what really woke me up was her walking right past and through those people - it was one of those suck in your breath moments.

 

> But I also was more or less melted into my socks w/ the scene between her and Donat when he comes back to find her in the forest after he hid her under all those leaves.... (HUGE sigh!!!)

 

Oh - my - gosh! I am swooning here! Why oh why did I not tape this one? I HAVE to record it in April, just for that scene alone! I am telling you, it was jaw droppingly romantic. My heart has been fluttering all morning. It makes me wonder if anything happened in real life.... I know Marlene had a habit of ... well, if I looked like that, I would get together with my leading men too!

 

> And I agree with you... poor young Poushkoff, what a charmer.. and so tragic. I imagine he could be a representative of a lot of young men who got more or less unwillingly caught up in the "hysteria" of the revolution and had little or no taste for what he was called upon to do... and it was a HUGE surprise what happened... I was expecting him to do the opposite... (and it would be hard to explain what I mean w/out giving too much away so I hope you can figure it out for yourself... or let me know and I will PM you.. Ha.)

I totally know what you are talking about.....

 

> Thanks again Barb for recommending this film... It's playing again in April and in May.. so I am going to try to get it on tape. It's a keeper for sure.

 

Absolutely. Thanks for re-engaging my obsession.....

[JackFavell]

I found this picture:

 

 

and this one is just ...... aaaah.