Western Movie Rambles

[CineMaven]

*"It was a different sort of role for her. She was playing older than she was, a sort of vain, frivolous sort of woman. It was a real departure from what I've seen her do, especially in the thirties." - Miss Goddess*

 

Oh darn it!

 

*"Stripes with pom pom lace up shoes? A fashion don't." - Jack Favell*

 

Ooops! That was my outfit at the festival's closing night party. Well, I'd better delete that pix from my album.

[wouldbestar]

Regarding: *Ride Lonesome:* I tried to review all the postings I'd read about this movie but the computer would not let me go back that far so if this is redundant I'm sorry.

 

First, the cast. Scott, Van Cleef, Best, Coburn, and Roberts all in one film and mostly making believable and interesting characters-you don't have it come together like this that often. A story you think you have all figured out and then they hit you with an ending that you don't expect but can through approve of. The scenery fits the tone of the story and is beautiful without being garish. And they did all this in less than 90 minutes-a lesson for those who think overblown stuff with no substance is the way to go.

 

Okay, here goes: I don't think Karen Steele was all that bad. After she was panned so strongly before I wondered if I'd want to throw tomatoes at the screen but while she wasn't Oscar worthy I thought she did all right. The one who irritated me was Pernell Roberts whom I never really liked and kept waiting to see "bite the dust." I'll not say anything more and spoil it for anybody who hasn't seen the movie. It's a little gem that was written off in 1959 as "just another Western" but has since been discovered for the polished piece it is. It was worth the wait and thanks to everybody from those long ago posts who got me watching.

 

Edited by: wouldbestar on Apr 24, 2012 10:28 PM

[movieman1957]

Glad you enjoyed it. The beauty of all those Scott/Boetticher films is they are all about 80 minutes and they are all pretty good. They are much deeper as a film goes than I suspect anyone thought.

 

You almost take a film for granted until you get in here and read what others think and then start to think more deeply about it and it opens up all kinds of insights.

 

"The Tall T" is another on which we've had long grand discussions. If you haven't read those posts they are rich for the mining.

[fredbaetz]

I remember we had a long discussion on what many consider the best of the Westerns of Scott and Boetticher which is "7 Men From Now" with a great supporting cast headed by Gail Russell and the terrific Lee Marvin. A Bajak production from John Wayne's company and to star Wayne, but he was involved with Fords "The Seachers" , so he bought Scott aboard who bought Boetticher on board. The was the first of the Scott/Betticher/Brown and the first of the five westerns that Burt Kennedy scripted. One of the truly great Westerns that was lost for a long time after Waynes death, but finally saw the light of day again and recognized as a classic piece of film making...

[wouldbestar]

{font:Times New Roman} Movieman and fred: I do remember the discussions about *The Tall T* and *Seven Men from Now;* in fact I was in on them. Again, I can only go back to January, 2011 before getting knocked out of the thread. That’s because this is such a heavily posted one. Others I can access three or five years back if they’re not so heavily used. I love both movies especially Lee Marvin in *Seven Men;* you regret his getting killed at the end even if he is an outlaw. This is why Marvin is an Oscar-winning actor; he often gives his villains shades of vulnerability that make you like them in spite of their evildoings. *The Tall T’s* Richard Boone is in this same league but Pernell Roberts pales in comparison to either one; all I saw was a smug grin, an air of arrogance but little substance. I had the same feeling watching him on *Bonanza* and *Trapper John.* {font}

 

{font:Times New Roman}The only other Scott film I need to see is *Buchanan Rides Alone* which has been discussed on the thread quite a bit. I guess that will come in time. {font}

 

Edited by: wouldbestar on Apr 25, 2012 7:43 PM

[fredbaetz]

Another terrific Scott oater is a very under rated film called "Hangman's Knot". A slam bang western with Donna Reed and five years before they did "7 Men From Now" Lee Marvin You knew the guy was going places and my former boss Claude Jarman Jr. { The Yearling }. Not a Budd Boetticher film, but well directed by Roy Huggins.It has some great old timers in the cast, Frank Faylen, Monte Blue, Ray Teal and Guinn "Big Boy" Williams.

Confederate soldiers rob and kill a squad of Union soldiers and steal a gold shipment and learn the war is over afterwards. They're on the run with a posse of bounty hunters on their trail. A great shoot out finale in a torrential rainstorm. If you missed this Randolph { chorus please } Scott western do yourself a favor and catch it....

[lzcutter]

Roy,

 

Hello! Can you believe I don't think I've seen *Hangman's Knot* ? I know, given how much I love Randolph (cue chorus) Scott and Lee Marvin.

 

Now I have a film to look forward to!

 

Thanks!

[fredbaetz]

Dale,

 

I can't believe I bought you and Randy and Lee together again for the first time. I know how Dolly Levi felt....

 

But I think { and hope} that you enjoy this Scott/Marvin fast paced western. It was films like this that placed him in the top 10 box office in a number of years in the 1950's...

 

 

[movieman1957]

"Hangman's Knot" is a good little film as Fred mentioned. I watched it just last week or so. It's about their survival when the posse gets to them.

 

Marvin is good and mean. Reed is just a woman in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

Not the depth of the Boetticher films but fine straight entertainment.

[JackFavell]

I think I have Hangman's Knot somewhere..... groan.... finding it is the problem....

[movieman1957]

If you can't find it I know where to find my copy.

[JackFavell]

I meant to go look for it, but somehow got sidetracked as soon as I got to the dvd cabinet. I seem to be getting more absent minded lately, probably in direct correlation to the untidy state of my dvd collection.

[wouldbestar]

I've just spent another evening in *Sundown* with Mr. Scott and am waiting for a movie about Custer, *The Great Sioux Massacre*, later on. I've not yet seen it but the trailer looks like it's a more realistic version and is sympathetic to the N/As. In one scene Darren McGavin asks how the whites can expect respect from the "Indians" when it is not returned so it looks promising. It's scheduled for 11 on Encore Westerns. I hate to seen like a traitor to TCM but sometimes some of the other guys come out on top.

 

I did watch *Massacre* and it was okay but less than I hoped for. As with most stories made about real events it's hard to seperate fact from fiction. I've decided that no matter what you call this incident in American history it, like the OK Corral, might never be told truthfully. This is sad because we should know why so many men died and if it didn't have to happen who caused it and for what reasons. Perhaps it's too late to know for certain.

 

Edited by: wouldbestar on Apr 28, 2012 2:02 PM

[JackFavell]

As I recall you and I liked Sundown best. Was it on Encore Westerns as well? I wish I got that channel, So many westerns I miss seeing.

[MissGoddess]

Yes, *Decision at Sundown* was on last night. I stared right at the listing and it didn't register what movie it was. So many "sundowns" and "sunsets" in cowboy movies I get (easily) confused! Then I realized too late to record it. I liked that one, too...especially dear Noah Beery, jr. who I've come to especially like.

[wouldbestar]

{font:Times New Roman}Jack and Miss Goddess: I don’t know if I have a “favorite” Scott/ Boetticher movie anymore because there are all good in different ways. I’ve seen them all but *Buchanan Rides Alone* and am just waiting for the chance. Except for *Westbound* they have unusual endings that you don’t expect and not really the “happy” one we get used to. {font}

 

 

{font:Times New Roman} {font}{font:Times New Roman}*Sundown* has the strangest. The “villain” leaves town with the woman who really loves him at his side while the “hero” leaves alone and bitter with his only real friend dead and his illusions about his late wife shattered. The town gets some self-respect back but not in time to save an innocent man. Only the doctor and bartender can hold up their heads. The doc gets the only things he really wants, Lucy and the town’s regeneration. {font}

 

 

{font:Times New Roman} {font}{font:Times New Roman}I haven’t seen *Comanche Station* in a while and that’s another end you don’t see coming. Scott’s working with Nancy Gates and Claude Akins this time around but it’s a good combination. I don’t remember all of *Hangman’s Knot* but fredbaetz wouldn’t steer you wrong. It’s another for the “must see list”. {font}

 

Edited by: wouldbestar on Apr 28, 2012 2:55 PM

[clore]

> {quote:title=fredbaetz wrote:}{quote}I remember we had a long discussion on what many consider the best of the Westerns of Scott and Boetticher which is "7 Men From Now" with a great supporting cast headed by Gail Russell and the terrific Lee Marvin. A Bajak production from John Wayne's company and to star Wayne, but he was involved with Fords "The Seachers" , so he bought Scott aboard who bought Boetticher on board. The was the first of the Scott/Betticher/Brown and the first of the five westerns that Burt Kennedy scripted. One of the truly great Westerns that was lost for a long time after Waynes death, but finally saw the light of day again and recognized as a classic piece of film making...

I hope that you don't mind, but I have to correct you here Fred. Harry Joe Brown had nothing to do with 7 MEN FROM NOW. He had been making films with Scott for years already, but was absent for this one. Nor did Scott bring Boetticher into the mix. The director was brought in by Wayne who had produced THE BULLFIGHTER AND THE LADY a few years earlier. Once he read the Kennedy script, he jumped at the chance to direct it.

 

It was Wayne's decision to cast Scott, he wanted to throw a former co-star some work. According to Boetticher, Wayne thought that Scott was finished career-wise. I guess he didn't notice that Scott was in the top ten of all stars from 1950-53 according to the Quigley poll.

 

I wish that TCM would dig up the Scott/Brown film THE WALKING HILLS. It's a hidden treasure film and with Arthur Kennedy, John Ireland, Ella Raines and Edgar Buchanan, it has one of the best supporting casts of any Scott film of the period. Noted blues singer Josh White also has a role and performs, thus committing one of the blues greats to celluloid.

 

John Sturges directed, long before the bloat began to set into his films and it runs a lean 78 minutes. Charles Lawton was the cinematographer and must have impressed his bosses as he made five more films with them.

 

It comes from a novel by Alan LeMay who also wrote THE SEARCHERS.

[JackFavell]

Wouldbestar, I meant that you and I were the two who liked Sundown the most in the discussion, not that it was your favorite Scott-Boetticher movie (although it is my favorite) sorry for the confusion. I think you are right about the films, they are all good, but they suit different purposes at different times. I could easily go back through and like every one of them equally well, depending on the mood I'm in at the time.

 

I love the way you describe the ending, I knew it was twisted, but I didn't realize until I read your post that it completely turned every tradition of the conventional western upside down by the end.

 

Miss Goddess, I am glad you at least got to see the movie. I do love Noah in that role, he's such a sweetheart in it. He grounds the Scott character so much, making you see what he maybe used to be.

 

Clore, I will definitely keep my eyes open for The Walking Hills, what a pedigree that one has.

[movieman1957]

I'll chime in approvingly for "The Walking Hills." I've only seen it once but it is a little offbeat but pretty interesting.

 

Edited by: movieman1957 on Apr 28, 2012 10:33 PM

[fredbaetz]

clore,

You are quite right about Brown. I mistyped, it should have been Andrew McLaglen along with Wayne as producers. There was some confusion as to who bought Botticher in . It was most likely Wayne, but Budd was upset at Wayne and Ford after "The Bullfighter and the Lady" was cut about 30 minutes by John Ford. But you are probably right.

"The Walking Hills" is indeed a wonderful small well acted and directed gem.The years 1948/49 seemed a good time for hunting for gold. Beside "The Walking Hills", there was "Lust for Gold" about the Lost Dutchman and a little film called "The Treasure of the Sierra Madre".....

 

Edited by: fredbaetz on Apr 29, 2012 3:09 AM

[clore]

Boetticher was a bit pragmatic about it all. While he may have been greatly disturbed by the cutting of his film, he did say that it was the opportunity of his lifetime to have gotten to make the film in the first place.

 

Another Scott/Brown film that I'd love to see on TCM is CORONER CREEK. It anticipates the Boetticher films in that Scott is on the vengeance trail after his fiancee has been killed. I have a VHS copy made from a Cinemax airing at least 20 years ago. However, they didn't air it in the admittedly cheap Cinecolor process, a shortcoming of some of those Brown/Scott westerns of the period.

[fredbaetz]

I always though "Coroner Creek" was a well made little Western. The thing that stuck in my mind was the brutal fight between Scott and Forest Tucker and Tucker crushing Scott gun hand.

This was the first of three films George Macready did with Scott. The great "Baddie", always love that scar of his. He did "The Doolins of Oklahoma" where he played the good guy and Scott the outlaw. I would have loved to have had then do the real story of Bill Doolin instead of the made up one. The wonderful Noah Beery jr and John Ireland were in the cast also, a good Western, but could have been so much more. and "The Nevadan" also with Scott. But to me his greatest role was in Stanley Kubrick's "Paths of Glory" as the General who orders his troops to attack the "Ant Hill"

[clore]

What was it with Columbia westerns and hand injuries? In THE MAN FROM LARAMIE, James Stewart gets shot in his hand at close range and in ALVAREZ KELLY, William Holden gets a finger shot off.

 

I very much enjoy THE NEVADAN, which also has some elements of the later Boetticher films in the relationship between Scott and Tucker. Frank Faylen and Jeff Corey add color as two villainous brothers.

 

Once in a while, Macready got to play something other than the cold villain. He shows up with Kirk Douglas for the fourth time in SEVEN DAYS IN MAY (DETECTIVE STORY and TWO WEEKS IN ANOTHER TOWN being the other two besides the Kubrick film) and he also has a decent sized part as Secretary of State Cordell Hull in TORA! TORA! TORA!

 

In the rarely screened ALIAS NICK BEAL, Macready actually gets to play a minister, the one who first notices that Ray Milland may indeed be the devil.

[fredbaetz]

Plus who could forget Georgie boy and his beautiful scar as Rita Hayworths not so nice hubby in "Gilda". A really fine actor who could play a good guy, but always made a terrific villain..

[clore]

Macready has a great time as the villain of the George Raft film JOHNNY ALLEGRO. The beginning of the film isn't much but the last twenty minutes or so are a variant on THE MOST DANGEROUS GAME with Macready hunting Raft and Nina Foch on an island with a bow and arrow.

 

"I never miss with a silver arrow."

 

Coincidentally, he was the villain the previous year in the Louis Hayward film THE BLACK ARROW.