Western Movie Rambles

[FrankGrimes]

Now where's my stick?

[coopsgirl]

You better keep that stick to yourself little mister unless you want a nasty bite!

 

 

Yankees aren't exactly my taste though so I might just try and ignore you and waste for a tasty Southern gentleman to come along .

 

 

I agree with you April, Victor Fleming was hot stuff :x.

[EvePeabody]

> {quote:title=JackFavell wrote:}{quote}

> I'm with you, Izcutter.... I cannot see what the big deal is with Hawks or Vidor. They don't do a thing for me.

>

> Now, Walsh......... I LOVE him. Very dashing. And he's funny.

 

What are some of your favorite Walsh movies?

[EvePeabody]

> {quote:title=coopsgirl wrote:}{quote}

> It was scary but also exciting like MM1951 said. It was a lot of hard work but I can imagine the people (at least the ones who lived to tell the tale) got a great sense of satisfaction out of making something where once there was nothing. My ancestors moved from the Midwest into Texas in the 1820s when it was still wild and quite barren and they established several settlements in the northern parts of the state. Some of the things my great,greatgrandfather, his brother and nephew did would fit right along with a lot of Westerns. Its like Ive got a bunch of Garys in my family except they did in real life the things he only did in the movies .

>

> Just for kicks here's a pic of Wiliam, my direct descendant, who fought at the battle of San Jacinto where Texas won her independence from Mexico in April 1836. The family resemblance is striking and a little spooky after so many generations have passed .

>

>

 

Amazing story, coopsgirl! Your descendants must have been awfully brave. It was definitely the kind of people that it took to make something out of this beautiful country.

 

> {quote:title=MissGoddess wrote:}{quote}

> I LOVE that photo of your ancestor! :x How exciting! I wish I knew even the

> first thing about my family's background but that may never be.

 

That's very sad! Why is that?

[JackFavell]

Hi Eve. These are my favorite Walsh movies.

 

The Thief of Baghdad

The Roaring Twenties

The Big Trail

High Sierra

The Strawberry Blonde

[EvePeabody]

> {quote:title=JackFavell wrote:}{quote}

> Hi Eve. These are my favorite Walsh movies.

>

> The Thief of Baghdad

> The Roaring Twenties

> The Big Trail

> High Sierra

> The Strawberry Blonde

 

Those are all great movies. I think I've seen most of them, though I'm not sure about The Thief of Bagdad. I have _definitely_ seen the 1940 version, but not sure about the Walsh version.

 

I like White Heat a lot, too! Cagney's awesome in that one.

[molo14]

Hi Kathy and April,

 

First off, I picked these up on the ride over:

 

Kathy, This is for you:

 

 

April, this is for you:

 

 

The latest in fine apparel for the loveliest ladies on either side of the Mississippi. Certainly nothing you would want to wear while carrying a cold rope or a shotgun.

 

Well now, I don't rightly know if this is the best time to bring this up what with the rattler's running around an all.

 

The good news is I'm here as promised.

 

The bad news is I only brought excuses.

 

Now wait! Wait! Here me out. I know I have a copy of *Rio Bravo* somewhere. I just can't seem to find it right now. I have looked everywhere the past two nights. I really can't write about it until I see it again. I stopped by the local dvd store and they didn't have it. The library has a copy checked out which I put a hold on. I will search tonight through my boxes of vhs.

 

Well I'm sure you ladies will be mighty understandin' about all this. Just the same I think I'll mosey on over to the next town for a spell. Just til we get this little "rough patch" all smoothed over.

 

Ya'll take care now.

 

Your loyal, usually and most often, reliable pal,

 

Molo

[ElusivePimpernel]

Hiya, pardner! We seem to have gotten a telegraph from you a while back, figured you'd be here soon.

 

You get that "rough patch" all smoothed over and come back and see us, you hear?

[ElusivePimpernel]

> {quote:title=FrankGrimes wrote:}{quote}

> Now where's my stick?

 

That's a mighty interesting stick you got there, pardner. Mighty interesting.

 

Say, you won't mind if I take a look at it, will you? Of course you don't, why would you?

[redriver]

G-Man!

 

I like the concept of somebody trying to leave, but can't. It's an effective dramatic device. I can't NOT watch a story like that. You cite the Hawks women. The Ringo Kid almost makes a getaway when he sees Indians preparing to attack. Now he's really stuck! Steve McQueen is in and out of a German prison camp more times than I can count. And good old George Bailey. The man longs to "shake the dust of this crummy old town and see the world," only to meet one

obstacle after another. We feel the plight of these desperate people and become trapped in the story just as they are. Fascinating stuff!

 

re: Capt. Nathan Brittles, U.S. Cavalry.

 

This is John Wayne's best performance, and some of the finest acting I've ever seen. You hardly recognize the usual traits. They've been replaced by a gentle, peaceful quality that seldom makes its way into the Hollywood western. It's the perfect complement to the rough, restless anachronism he often plays. A fan of Wayne, or of screen acting, should see this movie.

[ElusivePimpernel]

Beautifully said, redriver.

 

Wayne really was awfully underrated as an actor, I guess.

[redriver]

Coopsgirl,

 

My family watched THE REAL WEST shortly after Coop's death. It must have been re-broadcast. My mom's favorite actor, she made sad comments about hard it must have been. If you said Gary Cooper, my mother was there. HIGH NOON, SERGEANT YORK. She kept us home from school to watch BEAU GESTE! There's little doubt as to where my love of classic film was born. Now, Mom's gone as well. But I'll always have the movies.

[MissGoddess]

Oooh, I love my bonnet! :x Don't you worry about this nasty

poster following you from town to town, dear Molo, I'll make

sure the mean old Sheriff who sent these out calls them all

back in.

 

 

Seriously, Larry, no discussion is a "rush" around here, you have plenty of

time!

[EvePeabody]

> {quote:title=redriver wrote:}{quote}

> Coopsgirl,

>

> My family watched THE REAL WEST shortly after Coop's death. It must have been re-broadcast. My mom's favorite actor, she made sad comments about hard it must have been. If you said Gary Cooper, my mother was there. HIGH NOON, SERGEANT YORK. She kept us home from school to watch BEAU GESTE! There's little doubt as to where my love of classic film was born. Now, Mom's gone as well. But I'll always have the movies.

 

I love Beau Geste! :x

 

Cooper is so darn gentlemanly in that one. And those desert locations, they are so exotic. This is really a movie I could watch again and again.

 

[EvePeabody]

> {quote:title=MissGoddess wrote:}{quote}

> Oooh, I love my bonnet! :x Don't you worry about this nasty

> poster following you from town to town, dear Molo, I'll make

> sure the mean old Sheriff who sent these out calls them all

> back in.

>

>

>

> Seriously, Larry, no discussion is a "rush" around here, you have plenty of

> time!

 

That's a great poster, MG! Although I wonder if a reward of confederate money would be much incentive these days!

[rohanaka]

Helloooooooooo Molo the Kid!!!

 

SAY..... This is a new tactic.... bringing gifts to get out of a hangin'!!! (Frank Grimes.. are you taking notes??) Ha. And I LOVE the style.. PERFECT for keeping the hot sun off of me as I sit out here on my wagon full of rope and wait to see if you are gonna show up or if I'm gonna have to come and get ya... Ha.

 

THANKS for the lovely gift... and watch out for all those desperados in your gang that Miss G listed on her poster... I don't know how the KOOLAID KID got mixed up w/ the two of you... but that SHIFTLESS GRIMES is a VERY shady character... (though I have to confess he's been on the RIGHT side of the ramblin' side of town lately... maybe he's reformed.... NAH!!!)

 

Just take your time and come back when you can, my friend... your ramlbes are always a welcome addition and they are always worth waiting for too!!

 

PS.. if YOUR movie collection is even HALF as unorganized and disorderly as MINE.... GOOD LUCK! :-)

[EvePeabody]

Who is the Kool Aid kid?

[VernAlbright]

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[ElusivePimpernel]

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[rohanaka]

Hello there, Mr. Mush....

 

I meant to say, home is where women cook and clean for you

 

HA!!! If that WERE true.... then it could also be said that Home is where the women DO cook and clean...but mostly because the MEN are to dang LAZY to get up and do it themselves!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (oh... I am sure I am going to pay for that somehow....)

 

I was actually reminded of "Frankie Machine" (Frank Sinatra) in

The Man with the Golden Arm while watching Dude.

 

I have to confess... (I will probably pay for THIS too, somehow) I said earlier that I have never been a HUGE Dean Martin fan... but I can barely tolerate Sinatra. (his early music is very good and I do like some of it... just not much else... for me anyway... I can only think of two films I have ever even wanted to watch him in) So that one is not a comparison I could make... but I will take your word for it...

 

This is the act of a "father" looking out for his wayward "son." Keep those

"guns and clothes," Quiet Gal. Keep the faith

 

I agree... there was a bit of a "prodigal" son scenario going on w/ that part of the story... and THAT has always been a VERY dear story to me as well... I am a firm believer that NO one is truly a lost cause until they are six feet under... Thanks for bringing that up, sir.

 

even good men can be "dumb." Often times, it's unknowingly.

 

You are right. And I doubt poor old "Pat" ever knew what hit him. A lot of times we fail to see the threat right in front of us (or even behind us) and it often comes from (as you say) being "unknowingly dumb"... I think other people might say "naive"... or even gullible. I think in his case... he made the mistake of NOT taking the threat as seriously as needed. And as a result, he underestimated the enemy he didn't even know was there.

 

The act of deceiving and harming others, time and time again, is very sad. I'm someone

who cares about humanity, so it is always very tough for me to understand those who

are constantly looking to harm humanity.

 

Well... depending on what you believe... that to me is NOTHING new.. it's been around since apples have been growing on trees... There are those in the world who think nothing of lying and deceiving others... and are bent on nothing else. And they do it to hurt "humanity" as you say. I think it is a very sad way to live. And what's the saddest of all... is that the one they hurt the most is themselves.

 

Do you think the Burdette brothers and all their men were HAPPY with the ending of the story? Think of all that wasted effort being bad. When there was a whole world out there they could have enjoyed and a whole group of people they could have tried to get along with instead of bullying around. All the money and all that effort... wasted. In the end... they may not have been "sorry" for their crimes... but I am SURE they were still sorry at the end of the day, none the less.

 

And that is true in life as well... The "bad guys" NEVER really win in the end (no matter what it may seem like)... but sometimes the end of the story takes longer to get to than others. And it is always sad to see. Choices always have consequences... sometimes sooner... sometimes later.

 

Ok.. you'll have to excuse me for "Mom-izing" things... But it is still fresh in my mind as I just spent part of my evening explaining this all to a mouthy six year old... She COULD have just said "OK, mom"... but instead... she chose to mouth off and argue and stomp her feet... and in the end... she ended up "doing time" by being sent off to bed early, instead of enjoying her evening. It is never a fun lesson... but one best learned early in life, if at all possible. Hopefully one she is learning now so she won't have to learn it later.

 

Walter Brennan is my favorite character actor. Like you, I like him in anything

 

Woo Hoo... nice list.. at least the 6 titles I have seen anyway... I will have to go and check out the others as well. I LOVED him in (#2) by the way... and #7 is one I have NEVER seen but have always wanted to... Not on your list... and not in the ones I mentioned the other day... I have always like him as Judge Roy Bean in The Westerner.... He gets to show a wide range of emotions in this one... I thought he did a terrific job..

 

John T. accused Feathers of being the cheat at the table. When her innocence was proven,

this was step one of earning his trust. Then she stood up to him. Finally, in a very

relaxing moment for both, she told him her story. John T. then felt she wasn't the bad girl

he was making her out to be, like many of the other "stage" girls, like the one Dude

fell for and Fordy Guns

 

It was a nice transition from being her "judge" to being the guy who is going to give her the clean slate she's been looking for... (And PS... April he is INCORRIGIBLE.... let me know when you want to borrow that rope....)

 

Once John T. tore up Feathers' "past," she felt forgiven and accepted, and this freed her. There was no way she was going to let this kind of guy go. She was ready to protect and serve HIM.

 

I like what you said about him "tearing up her "past".... but I don't know that she necessarily felt "forgiven" so much as "vindicated"... because if you think about it... she'd been wronged by her former husband... I don't think she was "in" on his cheating... she'd just assumed he was an "honest" gambler and had been lumped together with him for HIS crimes... all she was guilty of really, was marrying the wrong guy in the first place.

 

I really liked that Feathers came right out and admitted she was indeed the girl

on the handbill. Now that's talkin' straight. What would John T. have thought of her

if she lied to him about that and then he found out the truth? But she didn't lie

 

You're on it... She never lied and she never tried to hide "the real her." And she was right... if she HAD dressed differently or acted differently... then she WOULD have been acting like the guilty person he thought she was.

 

Can anyone ever trust a person who is lying and deceiving others and constantly looking to do it? What good is their word if they are purposely looking to deceive you and others at every single turn? What good are they?

 

"Oh what a tangled web we weave..." One lie almost always leads to another, then another.... etc. And before you know it... all your credibility is OUT the window. That's why in terms of maintaining your credibility.. the UGLY truth is always better than the beautiful lie. No matter how "beautiful" you may want to appear... that ugly is always there... just below the surface. And it will always show itself one way or another... eventually. And when that happens... no matter what else you might have to say afterward... your "believability" factor will never be the same again.

 

By the way, was that Doniphon in the rafters?

 

NO!! I think it was YOU, shadow man... LET ME SEE THOSE BOOTS!!! :p (PS... April... did I mention... he's INCORRIGIBLE.????)

 

Mighty fine ramblin' there.. Mr. Muddy Boots!!! Keep it going! :-)

[moviefan1951]

> Well... depending on what you believe... that to me is NOTHING new.. it's been around since apples have been growing on trees... There are those in the world who think nothing of lying and deceiving others... and are bent on nothing else. And they do it to hurt "humanity" as you say. I think it is a very sad way to live. And what's the saddest of all... is that the one they hurt the most is themselves.

 

On that, I agree with you completely, Ro. It is particularly sad when _grown_ men pretend to be nice guys while being mean to the most vulnerable people in our society. And even sadder when they do so through deception and misrepresentation, all the while pretending they "care" for others. It is very hypocritical, and sadly some people are fooled by the actions of such guys.

[fxreyman]

You know what....It has been a true pleasure reading about what you all have had to say about Rio Bravo. Where else can this take place???? Mr. Grimes and Miss Goddess and all of you have inspired me to write a little bit about another Hawksian film, made eight years after Rio Bravo but covering very similar territory......I hope you all don't mind, but I think it bears some scrutiny.

 

I like Rio Bravo. I really do. But if I had to pick between Rio Bravo and El Dorado, I would have to pick the latter. Rio Bravo is a leisurely paced film that takes it's sweet time to its conclusion. And even though I like the supporting characters and the story, I much prefer the characters and the story in El Dorado.

 

Some have said that it is basically a retelling of Rio Bravo. That in my opinion is not very accurate. And after repeat viewings between the two films, you will then understand that the two are completely different. Similar, yes, but different.

 

Beyond the story of a sheriff and his friends versus a greedy land baron, the film concerns itself with professional standards and the fear of declining abilities. It is a film that takes similar characters and adds eight years onto them. We get to see older men, possibly past their prime, trying to make out in situations only younger men would stumble at.

 

John Wayne's role in El Dorado is in one respect a considerable departure from his usual screen persona. Especially if you compare it to John T. Chance. Here he plays Cole Thornton, a wandering hired gun who goes around helping out paying customers doing their dirty work for them. He is a total professional, one of the three fastest gunfighters around (the other two appear in the film). He is still the hero and is incorruptible but he is also no longer the younger version of himself from ten or even twenty years before. In other words, he has traveled a long and hard road and he is showing it. Cole is no John T. Chance. Chance is in command throughout Rio Bravo. Here, Cole is not always in command. In fact his body is letting him down most of the time. And he is an older gunfighter now. And that shows as well. He is still attracted to Maudie, the town's showgirl, but the age difference is not as great as it was with Feathers in Rio Bravo.

 

Robert Mitchum's J.P. Harrah is El Dorado's sheriff and is quite sober at the beginning of the film. He is a tower of strength and resolve. You can see with his conversation with Cole in the washroom his command of the local politics. But, after Cole leaves town, he meets up with a pretty petticoat and after she dumps him he turns to the bottle. In this J.P. Harrah is silmilar to Dude; a drunk with a badge. Later his friends all pitch in to help him get over this drunken binge. Similar again to Dude and what happens to him.

 

James Caan's Mississippi is a less skilled, but a more inventive equivalent to Ricky Nelson's Colorado Ryan. Colorado is a very loosely developed character in Rio Bravo. Nelson was not a good actor by any stretch of the imagination IMHO. Here Caan has him beat. Caan's Mississippi is a well drawn out character who has many flaws, but is willing to learn from his mistakes. His alliance and friendship with Cole means that he will be able to take what he has learned and use that new knowledge later in his life. Colorado, is a cocky kid bent on establishing himself as a gunslinger and is out for similar revenge for the killing of his mentor/boss Pat Wheeler (Ward Bond). He is less interested in learning from Chance than he is at proving that he can stand up to other gunslingers.

 

Arthur Hunnicutt's grizzled old deputy Bull is Walter Brennan's Stumpy all over again, down to hating then being nice to his boss. But Bull, an old Indian fighter is less a caricature than Stumpy was. He is clearly a supporting player, but without the histrionics as Stumpy had. Charlene Holt's Maudie is Angie Dickinson's Feathers with the same past history but with less screen time. Maudie is confident of herself and knows how to take care of herself. There is no self doubt here as there was with Feathers at the beginning of Rio Bravo.

 

Bart Jason (Ed Asner) is a meaner version of Nathan Burdette. He is more devious as well. After he finds out that Cole won't be working for him against the MacDonalds, Jason goes out and finds an even more dangerous and younger gunslinger to help him, Nelse McLeod (Christopher George). After Cole leaves El Dorado, he meets McLeod in a cantina and it is there that Cole finds out why he must return to El Dorado to help an old friend.

 

That is all I have to say for now as the evening is falling away from me. In other words I have to get some shut eye!! But I will be back for some additional thoughts on this, one of my favorite JW films.

 

See ya.

 

Fxreyman

 

( Rey )

[calypsogal]

That is really awesome, Rey. I confess I've heard so much about the similarities between "Rio Bravo" and "El Dorado" that I didn't think there actually were any major differences between the two. I'm definitely going to come back and re-read your post.

 

Extremely well written!

 

[rohanaka]

Hiya Rey...

 

Great post on El Dorado.. you're going to have us all hopping for sure to keep up!! :-)

 

I have ALWAYS loved Rio Bravo as a favorite, but I haven't seen El Dorado in a very long time so I am sure it is worth another look. (in fact... I can't recall much of anything about it other than a few scetchy details) but I like your comparisons between John T and Cole.

 

Earlier in our RB ramble we've discussed what John T meant when he referred to his past as being a "hired gun"... I'd have to watch ElDorado again to be sure, but I wonder if Cole might be what John T WOULD have been had he not gotten out and settled into being a sheriff instead??

 

I think now I am going to have to check the old Library soon and get a copy of this one to watch now too.

 

Thanks for adding another layer to our "Hawks" comparisons... :-)

[rohanaka]

PS Mr. Mud.. I mean GREY... :-)

 

I meant to include this in my reply a few moments ago....

 

I really like Baby Face and Red River, I believe The Wings of Eagles is

very underrated, and I think The Horse Soldiers is okay.

 

I was checking out some of the titles you mentioned... and WOO HOO!! THE HORSE SOLDIERS is airing on April 17th (and I think also again in June) I will keep looking for the other titles... and PS... one you need to add to your Wanna See's is The Big Trail... a VERY good early Duke for sure.

 

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