Bogie56 Posted December 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said: I do find it interesting that anti-Trump folks and media outlets like CNN, appear to be blaming the SA government for the shooting in Pensacola. They had on guy one that mentioned the 9\11 hijackers. What's next, calling for a Muslim ban? (that is an ironic joke!). Who knows what the investigation will yield. But it was curious how quick Trump and his administration were to not only exonerate the Saudis but thank them for their promised co-operation. Talk about trying to control the narrative. And given Trump's record of believing the Crown Prince re the Kahshoggi assassination over his own intel it makes this trust even curioser. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted December 9, 2019 just a reminder............. Trump's ties with Saudi Arabia run deep- ....."We know that historically the Saudis have spent huge money on Trump properties and we know that since he became a candidate and was elected they have targeted discretionary spending at his hotels," Weissman added. Here are some of Trump's ties to Saudi Arabia. ..... https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-has-deep-ties-with-saudis-from-selling-yacht-to-sword-dancing-2018-10#in-2001-trump-sold-the-45th-floor-of-trump-world-tower-to-the-saudi-court-for-45-million-in-2008-the-floor-became-part-of-the-saudi-mission-to-the-united-nations-2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamesjazzguitar Posted December 9, 2019 33 minutes ago, Bogie56 said: Who knows what the investigation will yield. But it was curious how quick Trump and his administration were to not only exonerate the Saudis but thank them for their promised co-operation. Talk about trying to control the narrative. And given Trump's record of believing the Crown Prince re the Kahshoggi assassination over his own intel it makes this trust even curioser. I assume Trump and his admin providing quick cover for the Saudi government and primarily their I-hire-assassins leader was 99% about Trump and his ego. I.e. yet another example of Trump defending another one of his poor judgments in the area of foreign policy. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bogie56 Posted December 9, 2019 4 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said: I assume Trump and his admin providing quick cover for the Saudi government and primarily their I-hire-assassins leader was 99% about Trump and his ego. I.e. yet another example of Trump defending another one of his poor judgments in the area of foreign policy. Agreed. That was my point all along. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gershwin fan Posted December 9, 2019 1 hour ago, TheCid said: I also find it amusing that some of the most ardent critics of Trump and Republicans being racists very quickly jumped on an Arab nation and its people. And don't say you didn't. This is one of the dumbest things in the entire thread. It is NOT racist to criticize the government of Saudi Arabia and its policies. You are just freaking lost. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-48028518 Saudi prisoner 'executed and crucified' https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6980209/saudi-arabia-executions-eye-gouging-crucifixion EYE FOR AN EYE Saudi Arabia executions – paralysis, eye gouging and crucifixion among the medieval punishments faced by kids as young as 14 -If you support this then that is fine but you should come out and say you are okay with it instead of slandering others as "racist" for opposing it. 1 hour ago, TheCid said: If you are talking about me, look in the mirror. I do not recall ever saying anyone was stupid (maybe Trump). I have said they may not be well informed about many things, but that is not the same. Larry was replying to James' post. Learn to follow a conversation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sepiatone Posted December 10, 2019 Well, James.... The 9/11 highjackers were Saudi nationals, but operating under orders from Osama Bin Laden. Not the Saudi government. I never blamed them for that OR the recent shooting at the Naval base. But then I don't see the reason to keep up a friendly relationship with SA a good reason to train Saudi pilots. After all, those Saudi highjackers managed to learn to fly complex aircraft without our help. Sepiatone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheCid Posted December 10, 2019 17 hours ago, Gershwin fan said: This is one of the dumbest things in the entire thread. It is NOT racist to criticize the government of Saudi Arabia and its policies. You are just freaking lost. Larry was replying to James' post. Learn to follow a conversation. This is the post which I copied from another post. Apparently the moderators had deleted the original post or I could not find it. I do follow the conversation. This conversation is about one Saudi Arabian military person killing people in Florida. "22 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said: Hey, Larry; Typo: Meant to say that I agree with others (e.g. Bogie), that Cid's views about SA are mostly bull." As for racism, it appears some here are attacking the Saudi Arabian people and Muslims as well as their governments. You might want to be more careful about how you word things. Incidentally, I do not condone the methods of punishment which many Muslim countries use, but that has NOTHING to do with one Saudi Arabian killing people at Pensacola Naval Air Station. You, and others, are drifting toward racism by condemning an entire nation which happens to be Muslim. The government of SA practices punishment with which the vast majority of their citizens agree. Just as many US states still practice capital punishment (death). While most are by lethal injection, some states still prescribe hanging, firing squads or electric chairs as options. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheCid Posted December 10, 2019 19 minutes ago, Sepiatone said: Well, James.... The 9/11 highjackers were Saudi nationals, but operating under orders from Osama Bin Laden. Not the Saudi government. I never blamed them for that OR the recent shooting at the Naval base. But then I don't see the reason to keep up a friendly relationship with SA a good reason to train Saudi pilots. After all, those Saudi highjackers managed to learn to fly complex aircraft without our help. Sepiatone Actually the 9/11 hijackers learned more how to aim the aircraft, not really fly them. I have already explained why it has been US government policy for many decades to train pilots from other nations, including Saudi Arabia. As for keeping up friendly relations with Saudi Arabia, part of the deal is that we base forces there. We also base them in Kuwait, Bahrain and other nations in the area. If we did not, we would have to double the size of our Navy to keep a presence in the Middle East to protect US interests in the area. It is far cheaper for us to station Air Force, Marine Corps and Navy planes and personnel at land bases compared to the many aircraft carriers the Navy would require. Also, each aircraft carrier also requires a fleet of ships to service it and protect it. And as I have said, SA has a moderating influence (to US benefit) on OPEC and other Arab nations. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted December 11, 2019 Navy suspends flight training for Saudi students after Pensacola shooting https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/navy-suspends-flight-training-for-saudi-students-after-pensacola-shooting & how long before T will overturn it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bogie56 Posted December 11, 2019 Gunman in Florida base shooting may have embraced radical ideology years before arriving in U.S., Saudi report says By Missy Ryan ● Read more » Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamesjazzguitar Posted December 11, 2019 34 minutes ago, Bogie56 said: Gunman in Florida base shooting may have embraced radical ideology years before arriving in U.S., Saudi report says By Missy Ryan ● Read more » Sounds like the screening\vetting process failed big-time. Of course all such processes have an error-rate. A process-review is needed to determine what "issues" are due to the process and which are due to human-error. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted December 23, 2019 Jim Acosta @Acosta Senior Trump admin official responds to Saudi verdicts in Khashoggi case: “This is an important step in holding those responsible for this terrible crime accountable, and we encourage Saudi Arabia to continue with a fair and transparent judicial process.” 10:07 AM · Dec 23, 2019 ================================================= Ben Rhodes @brhodes · 3h The entire world knows that Trump and Jared ran interference for MBS, who was responsible. This statement only aides in a whitewashing of the truth of what happened, an aternate reality in which the rich and powerful are not accountable. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted December 24, 2019 The Saudi Sentences in Jamal Khashoggi’s Murder Case Are a Mockery of Justice ........ he trial was held in secret. The government’s evidence was never publicly released. The convicted were never named, even in the verdict. And the few diplomats allowed to attend the trial had to swear that they would not disclose any details or identities. Most strikingly, the three men widely believed to be ultimately responsible for Khashoggi’s murder—including the powerful crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman, his close adviser, Saud al-Qahtani, and the former deputy head of intelligence, Ahmed al-Assiri—got off scot-free. “This is not a surprise. It is true to form,” ............ M.B.S.’s culpability—and premeditation—was the issue implicitly on trial. The kingdom originally lied, saying that Khashoggi had walked out of the consulate shortly after he’d arrived. It took three weeks for the government to admit that he’d been murdered; it claimed that the execution was a rogue operation, despite the extraordinary planning required for a sophisticated covert operation on foreign soil. ......... “Given that the chief architects of this murder were not even investigated or indicted—and I mean Qahtani and M.B.S.—there is no doubt that this trial was merely a mechanism to offer a theatre of process devoid of substance.” ....... https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-saudi-sentences-in-jamal-khashoggis-murder-case-are-a-mockery-of-justice?mbid=social_twitter&utm_source=twitter&utm_brand=tny&utm_medium=social&utm_social-type=owned 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bogie56 Posted December 24, 2019 2 hours ago, mr6666 said: Jim Acosta @Acosta Senior Trump admin official responds to Saudi verdicts in Khashoggi case: “This is an important step in holding those responsible for this terrible crime accountable, and we encourage Saudi Arabia to continue with a fair and transparent judicial process.” 10:07 AM · Dec 23, 2019 ================================================= Ben Rhodes @brhodes · 3h The entire world knows that Trump and Jared ran interference for MBS, who was responsible. This statement only aides in a whitewashing of the truth of what happened, an aternate reality in which the rich and powerful are not accountable. Again, Donald Trump embraces evil. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted January 17 On 12/10/2019 at 6:43 PM, mr6666 said: Navy suspends flight training for Saudi students after Pensacola shooting https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/navy-suspends-flight-training-for-saudi-students-after-pensacola-shooting & how long before T will overturn it? Pentagon to soon resume Saudi training halted after base shooting The US military grounded Saudi pilots and restricted some 850 military students to classroom training. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/01/pentagon-resume-saudi-training-halted-base-shooting-200116181859938.html?taid=5e20f597df714f0001b4c72a&utm_campaign=trueAnthem%3A+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter -I guess that answers THAT............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted January 18 Shane D. Kavanaugh @shanedkavanaugh BIG NEWS: Formerly classified FBI documents say the Saudi Arabian government "almost certainly" assists its citizens accused of serious crimes in US flee the country. FBI believes Saudi officials will continue unless US "directly addresses this issue." https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2020/01/fbi-saudi-government-almost-certainly-helps-its-citizens-escape-prosecution-in-us-for-serious-crimes.html 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted January 21 Saudi Arabia Helps Violent Fugitives Flee U.S. Justice System, FBI Says Some of the Saudi citizens who have received help from the kingdom face rape, child pornography and manslaughter charges. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/fbi-saudi-arabia-citizens-flee_n_5e25b7e4c5b673621f79b908?ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamesjazzguitar Posted January 21 52 minutes ago, mr6666 said: Saudi Arabia Helps Violent Fugitives Flee U.S. Justice System, FBI Says Some of the Saudi citizens who have received help from the kingdom face rape, child pornography and manslaughter charges. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/fbi-saudi-arabia-citizens-flee_n_5e25b7e4c5b673621f79b908?ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067 Yea, read this in the L.A. Times today. I better not show this some of my friends that came from Iran. They are legitimacy miffed (angry might be a better term), why the USA is an ally of Saudi Arabia and calls Iran an enemy. (but they sometimes go nuts; e.g. that it was Saudi Arabia that shot that plane down!). 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bogie56 Posted January 22 Saudi crown prince implicated in hack of Jeff Bezos’s phone, U.N. report will say Data was reportedly taken from the phone not long after Bezos got a WhatsApp message from the prince. Marc Fisher and Steven Zeitchik Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted January 22 UN links alleged Saudi hacking to effort to silence Washington Post .......The UN’s statement comes a day after The Guardian first reported that Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman gained access to Bezos’s phone via a Whatsapp message. "The information we have received suggests the possible involvement of the crown prince in surveillance of Mr. Bezos, in an effort to influence, if not silence, The Washington Post's reporting on Saudi Arabia,” the two human rights experts said in a statement on Wednesday. The two tied the hacking to the 2018 murder of Jamal Khashoggi, which multiple international and American intelligence organizations have pinned on Saudi Arabia. Khashoggi was a journalist at the Post. ........ he UN experts also cited concerns around the use of spyware and how this played into the alleged surveillance of Bezos, arguing that “surveillance through digital means must be subjected to the most rigorous control.” They also called on U.S. authorities to further investigate Bin Salman’s involvement in the killing of Khashoggi in 2018, saying that the hacking and surveillance of Bezos “strengthen support” for allegations that the crown prince was involved in the death of Khashoggi. Saudi authorities in December gave five people connected to the killing death sentences, and jail sentences totaling 24 years for three other people. The yearlong trial was closed to the public.......... https://thehill.com/policy/technology/479332-un-calls-for-probe-into-alleged-hack-of-bezoss-phone-by-saudi-arabia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted January 22 Will Bunch @Will_Bunch 2. ...what did the president know and when did he know it about Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince Mohammad Bin Salman (MBS), the 2018 murder of Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi, and MBS' hacking of Post owner Jeff Bezos' phone...... 3. There's so much to unpack here I thought a timeline was important. Read this and I think you'll agree that the House needs to immediately launch a probe of MBS, his ties to Trump and Jared Kushner, and our military and nuclear support for the Saudi monarchy. So here goes........ https://twitter.com/Will_Bunch/status/1220028653909823488 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr6666 Posted January 22 McConnell’s Impeachment Plan Is to Make Us All Give Up The senator’s just-released trial rules are designed to exhaust the public into losing focus—and hope. ..........A key part of Trump’s survival, thus far, has been his ability to exhaust an unserious media and easily distracted public with a constant stream of nonsense. No one crime, no one violation, no one example of racism or misogyny sticks to him too long, because he’s always on to the next crime or violation or bigotry. The media can’t keep up, his Republicans furrow their brows at “Trump being Trumpy,” and the general public adopts a defeated fatalism that assumes “ain’t nothing gonna happen.” Trump and the Republicans clearly want to make impeachment come and go as quietly as possible. They know that if the American public pays too much attention, if they’re forced to listen to the facts and the evidence against Donald Trump, it will become almost impossible for the Senate to acquit him. As we head into the trial, 51 percent of Americans already think Trump should be removed. Nearly 70 percent think additional witnesses should be called to testify to Trump’s behavior. Trump is losing the impeachment fight; McConnell’s goal is to declare Trump the winner before the loss becomes unavoidable....... After the 24 hours of argument, there are to be 16 hours of questions from the Senators, divided equally between Democrats and Republicans. I predict at least eight of these hours will represent the nadir of the United States Senate as an institution deserving of respect. These hours will be the moment when the so-called “greatest deliberative body in the world” is forced to sit through extended speechifying from Republican cowards who are desperate to avoid getting tweeted at by the president. It will be sad, it will be shameful, and by the time the Senate is done with their “questions,” people will be wondering why Kamala Harris isn’t running for president and whether we can take a bulldozer to the entire chamber and start over. ........ https://www.thenation.com/article/impeachment-rules-mcconnell/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
