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LornaHansonForbes

Anyone else get the feeling that Oscars 2019 in particular is headed for a spectacular train wreck?

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4 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

I honestly don't understand this knee-jerk negative attitude towards any movies that aren't in English (preferably American English), or that are just a bit out of the mainstream. Why are they labelled "art" movies (sounds like a term from the 1960s), and why do you assume that they're pretentious and/or boring? (Ok, to be fair you did not say they were pretentious or boring, but it's implied, and I'm pretty sure you've said that in other threads.)

..."We've stopped being able to tell them apart". Seriously?  This makes me wonder if you even watch such films, or if you just roll your eyes as soon as you hear about a foreign or "indie" film and assume the worst. 

I'm not denying that there are and always have been dreary movies that aspire to the label of "art" (Jean Luc Godard comes to mind), but to paint all foreign and "indie" films with the same brush, to the point where you say you "can't tell them apart", is just a silly statement that demonstrates a certain close-mindedness to any kind of film that isn't "mainstream" and preferably, American.

I tend to just think of all movies as movies, some in a foreign language, some made by an unknown director who maybe wants to try something different, some British, some "mainstream", some made in the 1920s -- yes, silent movies -- some made before 1960, some after that date....I realize this is becoming tedious, but my point is, I just like movies, and I don't assume I won't like a certain type of movie based on generalizations made about it. There are a lot of American, English language, so-called "mainstream" or commercial films that I love. And there are a lot of what you describe as "art indies" that I also love. I've always found it limiting to lump certain types of films into certain negative categories, and find it hard to understand why so many people do this.

Sorry, I realize all the above sounds a bit smug or self-righteous, and I loathe both qualities. But then again, you sound a bit judgmental and narrow-minded in your assessment of foreign and so-called "art" films, so I guess it all evens out.

You and me seem to be on the same page in regards to enjoying all types of cinema. I may like trashier stuff than you do (I can't recall you espousing any particular love for "grindhouse" or exploitation cinema the way I have), but I also enjoy highbrow fare, indies, art films, experimental, foreign-language, silents, popcorn blockbusters, and middle-of-the-road stuff. I'm not trying to brag, but I consider myself to have some of the most wide-ranging tastes of any of the posters on the board.

So I, too, dislike when people write off certain "types" of movies, especially when they usually admit to having never actually watching the movies in question, and basing their ill-informed opinions solely on the trailers or what they read on a website. 

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19 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

Don't the majority of members with a vote for Best Picture live in the So Cal area? 

If yes,  Roma is a shoe-in (as part of an anti-you-know-who protest).

PS:  I should have stated that I'm NOT saying the film doesn't deserve to win (I haven't seen it or any film released in 2018),  but that in a close contest (in a voter's mind) the above type of sediment could be a tie-breaker and that could push it to the top.

 

Roma is going to win Best Foreign Film. I'd put all my money on it.

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Just now, Gershwin fan said:

Roma is going to win Best Foreign Film. I'd put all my money on it.

And Best Cinematography. And Best Director. And 75% chance of Best Picture.

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4 minutes ago, LawrenceA said:

And Best Cinematography. And Best Director. And 75% chance of Best Picture.

True but Best Foreign Film I'd put as 110%. Really nominating other films is just to make it look like other films had a shot. lol

Edit: But I'd say it's not going to win Best Picture as foreign language films never win.

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1 minute ago, Gershwin fan said:

True but Best Foreign Film I'd put as 110%. Really nominating other films is just to make it look like other films had a shot. lol

I actually have heard really good things about a few other foreign language films from last year, like BurningShopliftersCold War, and The Guilty, and a couple of them have won awards even against Roma, but the Cuaron film is virtually unstoppable at this point.

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19 hours ago, CinemaInternational said:

In commeration of a tight best Actress race this year, a juicy reaction moment from three nominees who lost circa 1974 (1973 films)

Burstyn.gif

"They really hate me. They really, really hate me." 

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4 minutes ago, Gershwin fan said:

"They really hate me. They really, really hate me." 

I love that GIF. we've talked about this moment before.

I STILL can't believe BURSTYN'S face, MAN, little did she know(pre internet) how accessible that moment would some day become.

ps- i just HAVE GOT to believe that ELLEN is more shocked that GLENDA BLOODY JACKSON has won AGAIN than she is miffed that she personally lost. I mean, I cannot believe she thought she had a SNOWBALL'S CHANCE IN HELL OF WINNING for THE EXORCIST.

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49 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

I honestly don't understand this knee-jerk negative attitude towards any movies that aren't in English (preferably American English), or that are just a bit out of the mainstream. Why are they labelled "art" movies (sounds like a term from the 1960s), and why do you assume that they're pretentious and/or boring? (Ok, to be fair you did not say they were pretentious or boring, but it's implied, and I'm pretty sure you've said that in other threads.)

..."We've stopped being able to tell them apart". Seriously?  This makes me wonder if you even watch such films, or if you just roll your eyes as soon as you hear about a foreign or "indie" film and assume the worst. 

I'm not denying that there are and always have been dreary movies that aspire to the label of "art" (Jean Luc Godard comes to mind), but to paint all foreign and "indie" films with the same brush, to the point where you say you "can't tell them apart", is just a silly statement that demonstrates a certain close-mindedness to any kind of film that isn't "mainstream" and preferably, American.

I tend to just think of all movies as movies, some in a foreign language, some made by an unknown director who maybe wants to try something different, some British, some "mainstream", some made in the 1920s -- yes, silent movies -- some made before 1960, some after that date....I realize this is becoming tedious, but my point is, I just like movies, and I don't assume I won't like a certain type of movie based on generalizations made about it. There are a lot of American, English language, so-called "mainstream" or commercial films that I love. And there are a lot of what you describe as "art indies" that I also love. I've always found it limiting to lump certain types of films into certain negative categories, and find it hard to understand why so many people do this.

Sorry, I realize all the above sounds a bit smug or self-righteous, and I loathe both qualities. But then again, you sound a bit judgmental and narrow-minded in your assessment of foreign and so-called "art" films, so I guess it all evens out.

Anyone who thinks all foreign films are pretentious hasn't seen Hitler Goes Kaput. :lol: 

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5 minutes ago, LornaHansonForbes said:

ps- i just HAVE GOT to believe that ELLEN is more shocked that GLENDA BLOODY JACKSON has won AGAIN than she is miffed that she personally lost. I mean, I cannot believe she thought she had a SNOWBALL'S CHANCE IN HELL OF WINNING for THE EXORCIST.

From what I've read, Burstyn was the favorite to win that year.

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28 minutes ago, LawrenceA said:

From what I've read, Burstyn was the favorite to win that year.

Wow. 

Thats odd to me because her role is (to me) peripheral to the MAIN STORY and supporting. The other nominees were all the CENTRAL FOCUS of their films (more or less)

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7 minutes ago, LornaHansonForbes said:

Ellen kinda takes a back seat to The Devil and all....

Well you know the old saying; don't do a movie with a dog,  a cute child or the devil! 

(PS:  this was inspired by the movie on today; The Proud Rebel).

 

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4 hours ago, misswonderly3 said:

..."We've stopped being able to tell them apart". Seriously?  This makes me wonder if you even watch such films, or if you just roll your eyes as soon as you hear about a foreign or "indie" film and assume the worst. 

I'm not denying that there are and always have been dreary movies that aspire to the label of "art" (Jean Luc Godard comes to mind), but to paint all foreign and "indie" films with the same brush, to the point where you say you "can't tell them apart", is just a silly statement that demonstrates a certain close-mindedness to any kind of film that isn't "mainstream" and preferably, American.

To take example, let's just dissect the issue and say that, for one, it's getting harder and harder to tell the "Secret persecuted gay relationship" indie Picture nominees apart, after Moonlight, Carol and The Imitation Game.  Yes, every actor or filmmaker within the community feels they "have" to make one (does Ian McKellen make movies about anything else anymore?), and every, er, sympathetic voter or critic has to demand that it become forefront in our Oscar attention, but that doesn't mean a market isn't being glutted.  For any indie genre.

Before you leap on that, that's not THE issue I'm complaining about, but let's take that as one cherrypicked microcosm symptom and start there.  The one year we had Oprah championing black-empowerment and telling the public "If you don't vote for 'Selma' for Picture, you're racist!" was bad enough, but when it was compiled by Harvey Fierstein saying "If you don't vote for 'Imitation Game' for Picture, you're intolerant!", that's when Oscars' indie-obsession started getting a little too calculated and noisome.

...Remember, they can still be in British or American English and STILL be placid or overbearing enough to drive away our interest.

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34 minutes ago, EricJ said:

To take example, let's just dissect the issue and say that, for one, it's getting harder and harder to tell the "Secret persecuted gay relationship" indie Picture nominees apart, after Moonlight, Carol and The Imitation Game.  Yes, every actor or filmmaker within the community feels they "have" to make one (does Ian McKellen make movies about anything else anymore?), and every, er, sympathetic voter or critic has to demand that it become forefront in our Oscar attention, but that doesn't mean a market isn't being glutted.  For any indie genre.

Before you leap on that, that's not THE issue I'm complaining about, but let's take that as one cherrypicked microcosm symptom and start there.  The one year we had Oprah championing black-empowerment and telling the public "If you don't vote for 'Selma' for Picture, you're racist!" was bad enough, but when it was compiled by Harvey Feinstein saying "If you don't vote for 'Imitation Game' for Picture, you're intolerant!", that's when Oscars' indie-obsession started getting a little too calculated and noisome.

...Remember, they can still be in British or American English and STILL be placid or overbearing enough to drive away our interest.

Well, I certainly agree that the Oscars in recent years (or maybe for many many years), and film criticism in general has become "politicized". (can never remember how to spell "politicized", is that correct?....) I do know what you're talking about when it comes to that, and if you're saying it's a shame that movies are judged as much (or more) on their PC quotient than on their merits as a movie, again, I agree with that.

I'm not about "political correctness" when it comes to assessing/liking movies at all. I try - mostly successfully- to keep all that stuff out of the equation when I'm deciding whether I like a film or not.

I just like Roma as a movie; I didn't care whether it was Mexican, or about a working -class person, or "left-wing" or "right-wing" (I'd say it was neither), or in Spanish or about a woman who becomes a "single mom" or any of those supposedly liberal issues. That's not why I liked it. I just thought it was engaging and moving and aesthetically pleasing.

Thank you for responding respectfully to my post. I know sometimes I can be quite grouchy and disagreeable to you.

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So what will the likely Best Picture nominees be? And how will the PC/issue-driven campaigns pan out?

  • BlacKkKlansman
  • Green Book
  • Roma
  • A Star Is Born

All of the above seem like shoo-ins for nominations. The first one deals with race, the second with race & sexuality, the third (like MissW pointed out) isn't really political, but the subject matter can be see as such given the border conflict in the news all year and continuing on. The last film isn't really political, either, as far as I know.

  • Black Panther
  • Bohemian Rhapsody
  • Crazy Rich Asians
  • The Favourite
  • First Reformed
  • If Beale Street Could Talk
  • Vice

All of the above are possible nominees. Black Panther deals with race as a secondary, or even tertiary, concern; If Beale Street Could Talk heavily deals with race; Crazy Rich Asians doesn't deal with racism in its story much, but the Asian-cast-as-milestone has an identity-politics push; The Favourite and Bohemian Rhapsody deal, however heavily or sparingly, with LGBT characters; Firs Reformed looks at religious faith and environmental causes; and Vice is, well, Vice.

I've seen Black PantherBlacKkKlansmanCrazy Rich AsiansFirst Reformed, and Roma, and as such can speak on these more than the others.

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31 minutes ago, LawrenceA said:

So what will the likely Best Picture nominees be? And how will the PC/issue-driven campaigns pan out?

  • BlacKkKlansman
  • Green Book
  • Roma
  • A Star Is Born

All of the above seem like shoo-ins for nominations. The first one deals with race, the second with race & sexuality, the third (like MissW pointed out) isn't really political, but the subject matter can be see as such given the border conflict in the news all year and continuing on. The last film isn't really political, either, as far as I know.

  • Black Panther
  • Bohemian Rhapsody
  • Crazy Rich Asians
  • The Favourite
  • First Reformed
  • If Beale Street Could Talk
  • Vice

All of the above are possible nominees. Black Panther deals with race as a secondary, or even tertiary, concern; If Beale Street Could Talk heavily deals with race; Crazy Rich Asians doesn't deal with racism in its story much, but the Asian-cast-as-milestone has an identity-politics push; The Favourite and Bohemian Rhapsody deal, however heavily of sparingly, with LGBT characters; Firs Reformed looks at religious faith and environmental causes; and Vice is, well, Vice.

I've seen Black PantherBlacKkKlansmanCrazy Rich AsiansFirst Reformed, and Roma, and as such can speak on these more than the others.

What about the Ballad of Buster Scruggs. I've heard good things about that one and need to get around to seeing it.

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22 hours ago, Gershwin fan said:

What about the Ballad of Buster Scruggs. I've heard good things about that one and need to get around to seeing it.

Me too, I'd love to see it, I usually like the Coen brothers. (Hope it's not just available on Netflix, I don't get Netflix.)

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2 hours ago, Gershwin fan said:

What about the Ballad of Buster Scruggs. I've heard good things about that one and need to get around to seeing it.

I liked it, but I don't think it will get nominated. I haven't seen much mention of it on the awards thread thus far, and like most Coen brothers movies, it seems to be a love-it-or-hate-it kind of film.

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2 hours ago, misswonderly3 said:

Me too, I'd love to see it, I usually like the Coen brothers. (Hope it's not just available on Neflix, I don't get Netflix.)

 

2 hours ago, LawrenceA said:

I liked it, but I don't think it will get nominated. I haven't seen much mention of it on the awards thread thus far, and like most Coen brothers movies, it seems to be a love-it-or-hate-it kind of film.

I just saw it on Netflix. I have to say that I love it! I won't spoil anything but my favorite story was the fifth one with the woman and the dog. Very touching and sad. The film had really great cinematography too. 

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1 minute ago, Gershwin fan said:

 

I just saw it on Netflix. I have to say that I love it! I won't spoil anything but my favorite story was the fifth one with the woman and the dog. Very touching and sad. The film had really great cinematography too. 

Yes, that one was the strongest. I also loved the first one with the singing cowboy, but it was much sillier. I currently have The Ballad of Buster Scruggs as my #6 choice of my Top Ten favorites of last year.

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49 minutes ago, LawrenceA said:

Yes, that one was the strongest. I also loved the first one with the singing cowboy, but it was much sillier. I currently have The Ballad of Buster Scruggs as my #6 choice of my Top Ten favorites of last year.

Yeah, I also liked the first one. I thought it was funny when Scruggs hit the table with his shoe causing the one guy to fire on himself. :lol: 

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58 minutes ago, sewhite2000 said:

Did The Ballad of Buster Scruggs get any kind of theatrical release? If not, I assume it's ineligible. 

Yes, it had LA and NYC screenings to meet eligibility requirements.

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