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MV5BOTMzNDI5N2YtMzM5Ni00ZmQ5LTgyNmQtYzU4

The 2018 documentary Active Measures lays out a pretty good case as to why Americans should see Donald Trump's taxes.  

After 7 bankruptcies Trump Co. managed to secure loans with Deutsche Bank and even continues to get financing from them after reneging on those very loans.  In 2017 Deutsche Bank was found guilty of laundering some $10 billion for Russian oligarchs.  Trump sold a Florida property to a Russian oligarch for $95 million, double the asking price.  He has sold Trump condo properties to Russian shell companies and has even had some of the people who are involved in these schemes living in Trump Tower.  Wilbur Ross ran the Bank of Cyprus which pre 2008 was a money laundering scheme for Russian oligarchs.  Paul Manafort was paid tens of millions by Russian oligarchs to prop up the Kremlin friendly Ukranian regime.  Tillerson was given the medal of freedom from Putin himself.  Flynn actively negotiated with the Russians to remove sanctions which would allow the oligarchs to move money freely into America.  Eric Trump boasted that the Trump's did not need the American banks as they got all their money from Russia.  It is little wonder that Donald Trump has never criticized Vladmir Putin.  For four years America has become subservient to Russia as a result and we see Putin expand his influence in Europe, assassinate his opposition and continue to interfere with Western elections.

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  • 1 month later...
 
 
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Another option I have discussed at length. Still fails as it does not prohibit states from pursuing criminal charges.
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Alvin S. Brown, IRS Tax Attorney
 
@USTaxAttorney
· 1h
The answer is that Trump cannot pardon himself because that literally puts him "above the law" and the Supreme Court, in a recent case, said the President is NOT ABOVE THE LAW. He may try to do that but it will fail. He is better off resigning and have Pence pardon him. twitter.com/MichaelCohen21…
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I already have an active lawsuit against and The Trump Organization with depositions coming within weeks. I can’t wait!!!
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Rocko Calavasi
 
@RockoCalavasi
· 8h
Replying to @MichaelCohen212 and @MeaCulpaPodcast
Michael, when Trump is out of office, do you have any plans to file a civil lawsuit against him?
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Your question is a good one and raised often. What you are introducing is the concept of a pre-pardon as he has not been charged with anything yet. Problem with doing this is you waive your 5th amendment right which could hurt others...like JR., Eric, Ivanka, Rudy or Jared.
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mike
 
@Wookapaug
· 18h
Replying to @MichaelCohen212
Will he pardon himself on the way out?
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Depositions start next week. Looking forward...
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Author Jane Flowers
 
@janeflowers22
· 1h
Replying to @MichaelCohen212 @MichaelSteele and 4 others
How's your civil lawsuit going against Donald Trump, Michael? Have you filed a lawsuit yet? I'm still trying to get an attorney for my case of breach of fiduciary with my trust.
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Right. Trump's playing for everything.
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Jonathan Ladd
 
@jonmladd
· 12h
I think, when you realize Trump doesn't have a easy path to running a cable network or getting nominated in 2024, but instead faces a serious risk of personal bankruptcy or conviction for tax evasion or bank fraud if he loses his office, you realize how dangerous he is right now.
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Donald Trump told to pay his own legal bills
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Adam Klasfeld
 
@KlasfeldReports
· 22h
Federal Judge Strikes DOJ from the Docket in E. Jean Carroll's Case Against Donald Trump https://lawandcrime.com/awkward/federal-judge-strikes-doj-from-the-docket-in-e-jean-carrolls-case-against-donald-trump/ via @lawcrimenews
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My Flynn article alludes to the coming crisis over a possible Trump self-pardon. A short thread on that possibility from yesterday ...
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David Frum
 
@davidfrum
· 18h
The Nixon pardon did not specify crimes. A Trump self-pardon may be vague too. But now imagine how that reads: "I, Donald John Trump, do pardon myself for any and all crimes I may have committed against the United States, during my presidency and before my presidency."
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1 hour ago, Bogie56 said:

Schiff has a bill that would curb the abuse of the Presidential Pardon.

This bill is a total joke since it would never get to a vote in the Senate,  and even if Congress was to pass such a bill,  President Biden would veto it.

 

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6 hours ago, Bogie56 said:

Schiff has a bill that would curb the abuse of the Presidential Pardon.

ANY Supreme Court would rule the bill unconstitutional if it even passed and got signed.  Schiff is off on another one of his publicity seeking foolish ideas.

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1 hour ago, ElCid said:

ANY Supreme Court would rule the bill unconstitutional if it even passed and got signed.  Schiff is off on another one of his publicity seeking foolish ideas.

WAIT a second here, Cid.

First, I don't think "ANY" Supreme Court in the past would have neccessaily found Schiff's proposed legislation here "unconstitutional", but you're at least right in the idea that THIS damn Supreme Court just might and probably would, and probably by what's now become the norm in THIS present damn SC...by a 5 to 4 margin.

And secondly, by YOUR use of the phrase "another one of his publicity seeks foolish ideas" it appears even YOU believe that Schiff's proposed legislation is "unconstitutional".

And so, let me ask you a question here: What the hell is "wrong" with the idea of restricting a president, ANY president from pardoning himself?  Wouldn't this ability to do so be akin to a president, ANY president once again, being able to place himself, yes, above the law? And especially by a president, ANY president, who fails to follow the "norms" of presidential conduct, and such as Fat Boy has conducted himself these past four years. HELL, even Richard Milhous NIXON didn't attempt to avail himself of this when HE might have tried.

(...sounds like a DAMN good idea to ME, anyway...and I hope you know I'm not one to be "foolish"...well, when I'm not tryin' to crack some damn witty little joke around here, anyway)

 

 

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9 hours ago, Dargo said:

WAIT a second here, Cid.

First, I don't think "ANY" Supreme Court in the past would have neccessaily found Schiff's proposed legislation here "unconstitutional", but you're at least right in the idea that THIS damn Supreme Court just might and probably would, and probably by what's now become the norm in THIS present damn SC...by a 5 to 4 margin.

And secondly, by YOUR use of the phrase "another one of his publicity seeks foolish ideas" it appears even YOU believe that Schiff's proposed legislation is "unconstitutional".

And so, let me ask you a question here: What the hell is "wrong" with the idea of restricting a president, ANY president from pardoning himself?  Wouldn't this ability to do so be akin to a president, ANY president once again, being able to place himself, yes, above the law? And especially by a president, ANY president, who fails to follow the "norms" of presidential conduct, and such as Fat Boy has conducted himself these past four years. HELL, even Richard Milhous NIXON didn't attempt to avail himself of this when HE might have tried.

(...sounds like a DAMN good idea to ME, anyway...and I hope you know I'm not one to be "foolish"...well, when I'm not tryin' to crack some damn witty little joke around here, anyway)

 

 

If they bothered to listen to Schiff it may have become clear that a President pardoning himself has never been tested.  A person cannot be the judge of themselves.  That is unconstitutional in itself.

Furthermore as Schiff points out if the pardon power is unlimited the President could commit any number of heinous crimes during the last days in office and then simply pardon himself.  He says the framers would have been appalled by that but that they did not foresee it.

Schiff was talking about the ABUSE of the pardon power and making that clearer.  Not eliminating the pardon but defining it where it is not clear.  That is why I underlined the word ABUSE.

You can but try.  And if not, what is the use of anything.  Right down the line Donald Trump has provided a roadmap of how Presidential powers can be abused.  They should ask themselves if they want to go through something like that again, or even worse by someone who is even bolder.

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I listened and didn't hear exactly what Schiff is proposing - just a lot of back and forth between them.  There is a difference between what is in the Constitution and what is in Federal law.  Schiff appears to be confusing laws vs. the Constitution.  The Constitution trumps (couldn't resist) laws.

As for as I know the theory that "a person cannot judge himself" is no where in the Constitution, but I assume is in Federal law or court cases somewhere.  There be the rub.  Schiff, et. al. are trying to rewrite the Constitution.  That requires an amendment.

Then there is the whole ex post facto provision which is in the Constitution.  Government cannot pass a law prohibiting something that has already happened.

The Constitution states that the president  "shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of impeachment."  No exceptions, no limitations.

I looked up  a couple of discussions and no one says the president cannot pardon himself, only that it has not been done and taken to the Supreme Court.  Note:  Neither Congress nor any other governmental agencies attempted to charge Richard Nixon for ANY crimes after Ford pardoned him.  And no one challenged that.

Much as I would like to see Trump in jail, it ain't going to happen.

Just like with slavery, women's right to vote, ad. infinitum, if Congress or the people want to change the Constitution, there is a process.

Schiff just needs to get over it.

 

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Sean Hannity says Trump should pardon himself and his family to avoid a ‘witch hunt.’ Experts say it’s not that simple.

By 

Dec. 1, 2020 at 6:11 a.m. EST
.....

Mark Greenberg, a professor of law and philosophy at the University of California at Los Angeles, said that experts have varying opinions on the matter since no president has actually pardoned himself.

Greenberg, through his best interpretation of the law, told The Post that the Constitution doesn’t give Trump the power to pardon himself and his family. He added that the presidential pardon clause has restrictions, just like the majority of laws in the Constitution. By potentially offering a self-pardon, Trump would violate fundamental principles of American law, which includes conflicts of interest.

“The pardon power would also have unacceptable consequences if the president could pardon himself,” Greenberg said. “He’d be able to essentially commit extremely serious crimes and immediately pardon himself, which would effectively put him above the law.”

Additionally, a president can’t use his executive powers for corrupt purposes, such as making decisions that would enrich or benefit himself and his family. If Trump pardons himself and his family, the action could fall under those categories, Greenberg said.

The president also has a duty to “take care that the laws be faithfully executed,” Greenberg said. “For him to interfere with the execution of those laws by, say, pardoning a family member seems it would clearly violate that duty,” Greenberg said.

....

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3 hours ago, Bogie56 said:

Sean Hannity says Trump should pardon himself and his family to avoid a ‘witch hunt.’ Experts say it’s not that simple.

By 

Dec. 1, 2020 at 6:11 a.m. EST
.....

Mark Greenberg, a professor of law and philosophy at the University of California at Los Angeles, said that experts have varying opinions on the matter since no president has actually pardoned himself.

Greenberg, through his best interpretation of the law, told The Post that the Constitution doesn’t give Trump the power to pardon himself and his family. He added that the presidential pardon clause has restrictions, just like the majority of laws in the Constitution. By potentially offering a self-pardon, Trump would violate fundamental principles of American law, which includes conflicts of interest.

“The pardon power would also have unacceptable consequences if the president could pardon himself,” Greenberg said. “He’d be able to essentially commit extremely serious crimes and immediately pardon himself, which would effectively put him above the law.”

Additionally, a president can’t use his executive powers for corrupt purposes, such as making decisions that would enrich or benefit himself and his family. If Trump pardons himself and his family, the action could fall under those categories, Greenberg said.

The president also has a duty to “take care that the laws be faithfully executed,” Greenberg said. “For him to interfere with the execution of those laws by, say, pardoning a family member seems it would clearly violate that duty,” Greenberg said.

....

This debate will go on until Jan 20 at Noon.  The Constitution does not place limits on the president's power to pardon, including himself.  But especially not family members.  There could be debate over self-pardoning, but there is none over pardoning family members.

Greenberg said:  “He’d be able to essentially commit extremely serious crimes and immediately pardon himself, which would effectively put him above the law.”  That is why The Constitution provides for impeachment, so the president is not above the law.

So far, all of this is various legal "scholars" opinions over the issue.  Only the Supreme Court can actually make a final determination of whether or not Trump can pardon himself.  As for his family, he can.

 

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