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The triumph of President Joe Biden and healing the nation


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8 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:

Obama was not white.

Race had nothing to do with it as far as Congress was concerned.  They just did not like his policy, when he finally brought it out.

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20 hours ago, Princess of Tap said:

Obama was not white.

Morgan Freeman: Obama Not 'First Black President'

The Academy Award-winning actor pointed to the commander in chief's mixed-race heritage as evidence "America's first black president hasn't arisen yet."

Freeman was trying to make a point that some people oppose Obama because of his race, when in fact, the actor argued, Obama is "mixed race" and not African-American.

"First thing that always pops into my head regarding our president,” he said “is that all of the people who are setting up this [racial] barrier for him ... they just conveniently forget that Barack had a mama, and she was white -- very white American, Kansas, middle of America. There was no argument about who he is or what he is. America's first black president hasn't arisen yet. He's not America's first black president, he's America's first mixed-race president."

Traditionally, Americans of mixed racial heritage are allowed to decide for themselves which, if either, of their parental communities with which to identify. Obama has self-identified as an African-American from an early age.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/morgan-freeman-obama-not-black-president-345661

 

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19 minutes ago, noah80 said:

Morgan Freeman: Obama Not 'First Black President'

The Academy Award-winning actor pointed to the commander in chief's mixed-race heritage as evidence "America's first black president hasn't arisen yet."

Freeman was trying to make a point that some people oppose Obama because of his race, when in fact, the actor argued, Obama is "mixed race" and not African-American.

"First thing that always pops into my head regarding our president,” he said “is that all of the people who are setting up this [racial] barrier for him ... they just conveniently forget that Barack had a mama, and she was white -- very white American, Kansas, middle of America. There was no argument about who he is or what he is. America's first black president hasn't arisen yet. He's not America's first black president, he's America's first mixed-race president."

Traditionally, Americans of mixed racial heritage are allowed to decide for themselves which, if either, of their parental communities with which to identify. Obama has self-identified as an African-American from an early age.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/morgan-freeman-obama-not-black-president-345661

 

I'm from Kansas so you can't tell me anything I don't already know.L O L

But kiddo, perception is 100% of everything.🤣

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14 hours ago, noah80 said:

Traditionally, Americans of mixed racial heritage are allowed to decide for themselves which, if either, of their parental communities with which to identify. Obama has self-identified as an African-American from an early age.

If one is a 50\50 (like me),  it would be offensive to self-identify with the heritage of only one of your parents.    That sounds like self-hated  (See Imitation of Life).    

I assume Obama claimed to self-identify as an African-American only for political reasons.     What he really believes and feels inside will never be known.

 

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26 minutes ago, Swithin said:

This comes up in Show Boat as well: the "One Drop Rule."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-drop_rule

 

Frankly I don't see any connection here with what I'm saying and the One Drop Rule;   The "this" was self-identification,  not how others (society) identifies a person.

Also,  I was talking about mix-race individuals the were 50\50.    This would also include anyone where at least 25% was related to one culture \ race \ ethnic group.    (which would often be one grandparent being 100%).    To me the grandparent point is key:   The culture etc.. of that grandparent can have a lot of influence.    E.g. my nephews.   While only 25% Japanese,  since grandma (my mom),  is 100%,  and has been in the lives they were influenced by Japanese culture.    This will not be the case for their children since none of them married anyone with a Japanese background;  i.e.   the Japanese influence in our family tree is almost a non-factor for that generation. 

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1 hour ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

If one is a 50\50 (like me),  it would be offense to self-identify with the heritage of only one of your parents.    That sounds like self-hated  (See Imitation of Life).    

I assume Obama claimed to self-identify as an African-American only for political reasons.     What he really believes and feels inside will never be known.

 

Intertesting what you wrote.  For Kamala Harris, the media has her as "the first African American and first Asian American vice president." (Note the "African American" before "Asian American")  Yet she was raised by her mother with hardly any contact with her father (he wasn't there at the inauguration).  So shouldn't it be "the first Asian American and first African American vice president"? Is the "African American" mentioned first for political purpose?

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On 11/7/2020 at 2:40 PM, TopBilled said:

I thought I would try to post positive news articles, at least one a day from now until the end of Biden's term.

How does that sound?

LOVELY,. My Good Sir. 👍🙏👌👍👍👍👍👍👊👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

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7 minutes ago, noah80 said:

Intertesting what you wrote.  For Kamala Harris, the media has her as "the first African American and first Asian American vice president." (Note the "African American" before "Asian American")  Yet she was raised by her mother with hardly any contact with her father (he wasn't there at the inauguration).  So shouldn't it be "the first Asian American and first African American vice president"? Is the "African American" mentioned first for political purpose?

Good question.   From a political perspective there clearly are more African-Americans than Asian Americans in the USA,  so that could be a reason for the media to frame things in this manner.    Clearly the term mixed-raced or multi-cultural (which is what I prefer),  isn't used by the media since that is too vague; It doesn't allow any one "group" to take-credit (so to speak);  to claim one as their own.     Regardless of how the media decides to label Harris,  she has a unique and interesting background that will add a different perspective to the Executive branch (especially given what we had to endure the last 4 years).

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35 minutes ago, noah80 said:

Intertesting what you wrote.  For Kamala Harris, the media has her as "the first African American and first Asian American vice president." (Note the "African American" before "Asian American")  Yet she was raised by her mother with hardly any contact with her father (he wasn't there at the inauguration).  So shouldn't it be "the first Asian American and first African American vice president"? Is the "African American" mentioned first for political purpose?

What I've heard about her upbringing that she was raised in a black neighborhood and attended a black church. Her mother participated in that kind of a cultural milieu.

Then she went to the most famous black University in America-- Howard University.

 I have to say that a person has a right to be what they want to be and who they want to be and that's not up for public debate.

Yet, I've seen her discuss her mother's culture and Country and how proud she was of her mother and her maternal heritage too.

 However, with American history and the one drop rule--well kiddo perception is 100%.

 I've already said this to you once before, I'm beginning to think you don't seem to understand American history very well.

 

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1 hour ago, Princess of Tap said:

What I've heard about her upbringing that she was raised in a black neighborhood and attended a black church. Her mother participated in that kind of a cultural milieu.

Then she went to the most famous black University in America-- Howard University.

 I have to say that a person has a right to be what they want to be and who they want to be and that's not up for public debate.

Yet, I've seen her discuss her mother's culture and Country and how proud she was of her mother and her maternal heritage too.

 However, with American history and the one drop rule--well kiddo perception is 100%.

 I've already said this to you once before, I'm beginning to think you don't seem to understand American history very well.)

If it is true "that a person has a right to be what they want to be and who they want to be and that's not up for public debate",  then perception is NOT 100%,   it is ZERO%.    I.e. public perception be dammed!     I.e. we have to change that misguided (at best),   perception that has occurred in American history.

To me the current media \ US society perception is antiquated.   While your understanding of American history is correct,   when we have these discussion,   I still get the feeling you wish for US society to continue with said perception.      Clearly the MSM does, which is why they continue to step all over themselves in how to "frame"  (categorize,  label),  mixed-raced individuals and why mixed-race individuals just concede and play-the-game as defined by that misguided historical take.   Tiger Woods clearly conceded (and he was only 1\4 African American and 50% Asian) but the media, as well as the African-American community,   tended to erased any trace of his Asian heritage.   

 PS:  I will say that with Harris it appears many in the media are starting to get-it;   When she first came on the national scene,  the term mostly used was "black".   At least how the Asian part of her background is getting mentioned.   So maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel.   

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14 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

If it is true "that a person has a right to be what they want to be and who they want to be and that's not up for public debate",  then perception is NOT 100%,   it is ZERO%.    I.e. public perception be dammed!     I.e. we have to change that misguided (at best),   perception that has occurred in American history.

To me the current media \ US society perception is antiquated.   While your understanding of American history is correct,   when we have these discussion,   I still get the feeling you wish for US society to continue with said perception.      Clearly the MSM does, which is why they continue to step all over themselves in how to "frame"  (categorize,  label),  mixed-raced individuals and why mixed-race individuals just concede and play-the-game as defined by that misguided historical take.   Tiger Woods clearly conceded (and he was only 1\4 African American and 50% Asian) but the media, as well as the African-American community,   tended to erased any trace of his Asian heritage.   

 PS:  I will say that with Harris it appears many in the media are starting to get-it;   When she first came on the national scene,  the term mostly used was "black".   At least how the Asian part of her background is getting mentioned.   So maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel.   

 Well James, I completely agree with you.  But the current reality does kick in at some point.

 And slowly things will change. But as you're walking down the street, or anybody else is walking down the street, perception will be what you look like in this country for now anyway.

 But I do think the Next Generation that's coming up has a better handle on this sort of thing than our generation had.

 It seems like you've had a long time to think about this issue and you'd be the kind of person to give a Ted Talk on it.

 

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What I'm interested in is Harris'self-identity. Maybe her relatives (including herself) prefer to see "the first Asian American and first African American vice president" in print but she must  explain to them (especially during the campaign) that this is politics and the reality is that there are more African-Americans than Asian Americans in the USA.  (translation:  more Black voters for Biden/Harris)

harris.png

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadian-aunt-uncle-kamala-harris-1.5876711

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For a very long time, Blacks were subject to the "one drop" rule, as a rather extreme method of racism.  But today, when some of those people (who have a lot more of "Black blood" than one drop) identify as Black (or African American) as a point of pride, a sort of inverted racism doesn't want them to do that. They did it to Obama; now they're trying to do it to Kamala Harris. I think it's another form of racism.

To some extent, it's related to the expectation that people from a group should act like the expected stereotypes assigned to that group. For example, in 19th century Germany, where there was anti-Semitism, people felt threatened not as much by Jewish people who wore long gabardine coats and sported side curls, but by those more assimilated Jews, who dressed and looked more like the wider community.

This all speaks to a rather primitive tribalism and means of trying to control people.

 

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1 hour ago, Bogie56 said:
KFp6mbvi_bigger.jpg
 
I'm just a Hillary Clinton voter, sitting here confirming that at no point in the last 4 years did anyone from the Trump camp, supporters or politicians alike, do anything to reach out to me in an effort to understand me, unite, or move forward.

I've been a Democrat since 1972 and frequently get contacted by Republicans.

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2 hours ago, Swithin said:

For a very long time, Blacks were subject to the "one drop" rule, as a rather extreme method of racism.  But today, when some of those people (who have a lot more of "Black blood" than one drop) identify as Black (or African American) as a point of pride, a sort of inverted racism doesn't want them to do that. They did it to Obama; now they're trying to do it to Kamala Harris. I think it's another form of racism.

To some extent, it's related to the expectation that people from a group should act like the expected stereotypes assigned to that group. For example, in 19th century Germany, where there was anti-Semitism, people felt threatened not as much by Jewish people who wore long gabardine coats and sported side curls, but by those more assimilated Jews, who dressed and looked more like the wider community.

This all speaks to a rather primitive tribalism and means of trying to control people.

 

She is actually British-Jamaican-Indian-American.  Her father was born in British Jamaica and moved to US where he married her mother, who was from India.  "Black" Jamaicans are sometimes called Afro-Caribbean.

Regardless, she is an American.

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On 1/21/2021 at 8:31 AM, ElCid said:

Race had nothing to do with it as far as Congress was concerned.  They just did not like his policy, when he finally brought it out.

If you recall, it was Obama's parents who gave the GOP an "out".

In order to avoid looking like the racists many of them are they honed in on Obama's "Hussein"  middle name and kept trying to insist he was Muslim,  a sure-fire scare tactic they figured would work in their favor.   And at the time, not far removed from 9/11,  Muslims were not exactly well thought of in this country.   Hell, I know people who STILL think and insist that Obama's a member of the Taliban!  :rolleyes:   And of course, they all wear silly red MAGA caps.  ;)

Sepiatone

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5 minutes ago, Sepiatone said:

If you recall, it was Obama's parents who gave the GOP an "out".

In order to avoid looking like the racists many of them are they honed in on Obama's "Hussein"  middle name and kept trying to insist he was Muslim,  a sure-fire scare tactic they figured would work in their favor.   And at the time, not far removed from 9/11,  Muslims were not exactly well thought of in this country.   Hell, I know people who STILL think and insist that Obama's a member of the Taliban!  :rolleyes:   And of course, they all wear silly red MAGA caps.  ;)

Sepiatone

Can't find what my original post was referencing, but I think it had to do with a specific policy of Obama's and that the GOPers would have opposed it if it come from a white man.

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3 hours ago, Swithin said:

For a very long time, Blacks were subject to the "one drop" rule, as a rather extreme method of racism.  But today, when some of those people (who have a lot more of "Black blood" than one drop) identify as Black (or African American) as a point of pride, a sort of inverted racism doesn't want them to do that. They did it to Obama; now they're trying to do it to Kamala Harris. I think it's another form of racism.

To some extent, it's related to the expectation that people from a group should act like the expected stereotypes assigned to that group. For example, in 19th century Germany, where there was anti-Semitism, people felt threatened not as much by Jewish people who wore long gabardine coats and sported side curls, but by those more assimilated Jews, who dressed and looked more like the wider community.

This all speaks to a rather primitive tribalism and means of trying to control people.

 

I disagree.  To me you're the one that is mixed-up.   Today,  the inverted racism rarely comes from whites,  but instead people in one of the other sub-groups.  In the case of Tiger Woods and Obama that was the African-American community.    These sub-groups desire (if not demand),   famous people to self-identify as their PRIMARY group their sub-group.     They will ask lame questions like "are you ashamed of being XYZ,,,, well,  if not,,, why don't you say your that instead of mixed-raced?,,".    I.e.  they use guilt to try to get one to self-declare their sub-group as being the PRIMARY sub-group.  

My mom still does this:  why don't you tell people you're Japanese????    Uh,  mom,  because I'm mixed-race.    Oh, I don't believe you,,, it is because of Pearl Harbor!

I do agree with your last line about primitive tribalism,  but since you're white,  you view this from that perspective, instead of the perspective of a mixed-raced person.

PS:  you used the term "they".   The "they" being discussed here is the media,  it appears the "they" you are discussing is the GOP \ American conservatives as it relates to Harris.

 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, ElCid said:

Can't find what my original post was referencing, but I think it had to do with a specific policy of Obama's and that the GOPers would have opposed it if it come from a white man.

Of course.  We all know the opposition was to a democrat, and not  that Obama's black.   But my point was that Obama's middle name gave them an "out"  as in they could use IT instead of his being black as a reason for disfavor.  Therefore not appearing to be as racist as many probably were anyway.

Sepiatone

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As for the one-drop-rule;   the most classic current examples don't even need one-drop;   That would be Elizabeth Warren and the white woman that grew up in an African-American household that claimed to be African-American.    There wasn't even ONE drop in the case of these two!

The point being that today, there is positive creed,  by claiming to be mixed-raced.     

PS:  Letter to the editor in today's L.A. Times:   As a Latina Jew,  there is an interesting fact that is often over-looked:  Harris' husband,  Emhoff,  is the first presidential or vice presidential spouse to be Jewish.   This is an important milestone for our nation.   Having a Jewish second gentleman deserves to be celebrated as well.

So anytime the media mentions Harris they will have to string-along,  multiple terms,,,, or someone will feel dished.    I recommend the media just says "unique"!  (ha ha).

 

 

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14 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

If one is a 50\50 (like me),  it would be offensive to self-identify with the heritage of only one of your parents.    That sounds like self-hated  (See Imitation of Life).    

I assume Obama claimed to self-identify as an African-American only for political reasons.     What he really believes and feels inside will never be known.

 

It is interesting that "Obama has self-identified as an African-American from an early age" since he was raised by his mother and maternal grandparents.

grand.jpg

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8 minutes ago, noah80 said:

It is interesting that "Obama has self-identified as an African-American from an early age" since he was raised by his mother and maternal grandparents.

My guess is that is highly influenced by how he was perceived by others \ society.     I have a younger half-brother that is half white \ African (he was born in Liberia).

He has very dark skin.    Based on that no one would perceive him as having a white father.    All the kids,  their parents, teachers etc... just assumed he was African-American.  Oh,  and when they would meet dad,,,,  he must be adopted! 

 

   

 

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