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A Walk on the Noir Side


rohanaka

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> Not sure myself.. I went fishing for it and found pretty much where we started.. have not had time to go too deep into what all we said..but I do remember it was a FUN "walk on the noir side" (though a bit "swiss cheese ridden" from time to time). :D

>

> http://forums.tcm.com/jive/tcm/thread.jspa?threadID=147635&start=1935&tstart=0

>

 

I see what you mean about the swiss cheese. And I didn't have anything to say about it...I may not have re-watched it at that time.

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Well bring it back up again sometime then, little gal. I see that Mr. Movieman says he is up for a chat on it too.. I am sure another good "amble" on this one is long overdue. It is a VERY "Walk Worthy" movie for sure!

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Good! I think CinemAva just saw it for the first time.

 

By the way, Dudley Nichols won an Oscar for the screenplay to *The Informer*. He also wrote Ford's *Plough and the Stars*, *Steamboat Round the Bend*, *The Hurricane*, *Mary of Scotland*, *Judge Priest*, *The Fugitive* and *The Long Voyage Home*, in addition to *Man Hunt*, *Mr Lucky*, *The Tin Star*, *Gunga Din* and *Bringing Up Baby*.

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Good! I think CinemAva just saw it for the first time

 

Yee haw!

 

Dudley Nichols won an Oscar for the screenplay to The Informer. He also wrote Ford's Plough and the Stars, Steamboat Round the Bend, The Hurricane, Mary of Scotland, Judge Priest, The Fugitive and The Long Voyage Home, in addition to Man Hunt, Mr Lucky, The Tin Star, Gunga Din and Bringing Up Baby.

 

Oh for goodness sake, ha. I had NO idea. So many of these are films I have enjoyed a LOT. The Informer is probably my most Fave on the list you have here.(but of course I would put Stagecoach ahead of it, ha) As for the other titles.. I LOVE The Hurricane.. and I recently got to see TLVH... WHAT a story. I have only seen part of The Tin Star, but I remember liking what I saw of it. Bringing Up Baby is a laugh riot... and OH my golly.. Gunga Din!!! ( And as for the rest.. judging from all this, I am SURE I would like them but I have not SEEN them yet, ha)

 

Gee.. I love hanging out around here with you.. ha. I learn so much cool new stuff all the time. :D

 

Gotta hit the hay, little missy. Us old fogey folks need their rest, ha. It's been fun chatting with you for a while. I miss getting to hang out here more often.

 

Edited by: rohanaka on Feb 3, 2011 12:16 AM

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Dudley Nichols was one of the great ones. He also did "The Lost Patrol: for Ford in 1934. A few others { not for Ford } were "For Whom the Bell Tolls", "And Then there were None" and "Morning Becomes Electra" which he directed. He was the first artist to turn down an Oscar. He refused it for the screenplay for "The Informer" because of union problems within the industry....

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What's the word, Miss Gun for Hire -- Anyone get a chance to watch the John Payne films noir on Friday night?

 

Now I have. I finally watched Kansas City Confidential. It's a real good one. And John Payne was terrific in both Kansas City Confidential and 99 River Street. He's as good as I've seen, actually.

 

I didn't like the hairstyles worn by Evelyn Keyes and Colleen Grey, but I really

liked Grey's character in Kansas City Confidential. She starts out silly/flirtatious

and turns smart and shrewd on a dime.

 

I like and liked Coleen Gray in Kansas City Confidential, although her character was lacking. Still, I loved her energy and her playful forwardness. She was full of life. I found her to be very inviting. I liked her emotions, especially her "hurt."

 

But I do agree with you, I much prefer her look in Nightmare Alley to Kansas City Confidential. She looks terrific with long hair. She looked so young in Nightmare Alley. She looks more like Anne Baxter in Kansas City Confidential. She's on the "cute" side.

 

And Preston Foster was grand, one of my favorite turns by him, here.

 

Oh, he was sensational. I loved his performance. I liked his fishing get-up. Loved his character arc, too. Terrific.

 

Payne was excellent. He's convincingly "average" enough to seem ilke an innocent chump, minding his own business, who gets mixed up in a dangerous situation---yet he also can project enough toughness to make you believe he could have made some mistakes in his past (like an ex-con), without sacrificing your sympathy for him. He also projects pain really well, which may be why he's always getting so beat up in his movies! :D I feel terrible because with each of his noirs, I just know there will be at least one throw-down that's going to be brutal to watch.

 

That's an exceptional description of what I've seen of John Payne in these two films noir. He was brilliant in both. There's a seriousness to Payne. You really do get the feeling he's a man who's been pushed into a corner and he's gonna slug his way out. His physicality is the best I've seen.

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> Now I have. I finally watched Kansas City Confidential. It's a real good one. And John Payne was terrific in both Kansas City Confidential and 99 River Street. He's as good as I've seen, actually.

>

 

I was very impressed, too. I'd seen KCC and a couple of others but that night's line-up really sold me more than ever on his place in dramatic movies. He drew me in, and he's very warm underneath even the most churlish characters.

 

> But I do agree with you, I much prefer her look in Nightmare Alley to Kansas City Confidential. She looks terrific with long hair. She looked so young in Nightmare Alley. She looks more like Anne Baxter in Kansas City Confidential. She's on the "cute" side.

>

 

Anne Baxter is who I was thinking of, too.

 

> Oh, he was sensational. I loved his performance. I liked his fishing get-up. Loved his character arc, too. Terrific.

>

 

He seemed like a character in a modern movie to me. The bitter ex-police captain hiding under the affable retiree.

 

>

> That's an exceptional description of what I've seen of John Payne in these two films noir. He was brilliant in both. There's a seriousness to Payne. You really do get the feeling he's a man who's been pushed into a corner and he's gonna slug his way out. His physicality is the best I've seen.

He's like a dark Jimmy Stewart in the body of Robert Mitchum.

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> {quote:title=CineMaven wrote:}{quote}

> "He's like a dark Jimmy Stewart in the body of Robert Mitchum."

>

> WHOA!!! That imagery gave me a quick jolt in the morning!! John Payne...who knew?

 

:D I hope it made sense, lol. It's early yet, but that's the image I suddenly had of him. So affable and warm and "nice" in that Middle American way, but submerged in the form of a belting bruiser pummelling his way out of a dark hole.

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John Payne and Dick Powell are just about interchangeable to me, and their beginnings as song-and-dance men still is amazing. Although, I guess, no more than seeing Irene Dunn perform in THEODORA GOES WILD, where singing was her original claim-to-fame.

 

These folks are more reasons why I believe every film-fan will gravitate into cinema history and will not *just spend* dollars on contemporary films. The DVD and rightsholders continue to argue the contrary, denying access by burying classics instead of using them to form a consumer-foundation that rewards film-fans for their eventual interest in films and filmmakers.

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> {quote:title=Ollie_T wrote:}{quote}

> John Payne and Dick Powell are just about interchangeable to me, and their beginnings as song-and-dance men still is amazing. Although, I guess, no more than seeing Irene Dunn perform in THEODORA GOES WILD, where singing was her original claim-to-fame.

>

 

They are strikingly similar in their career paths. I think Payne was the warmer presence, and Powell had the sharp way with dialogue.

 

 

> These folks are more reasons why I believe every film-fan will gravitate into cinema history and will not *just spend* dollars on contemporary films. The DVD and rightsholders continue to argue the contrary, denying access by burying classics instead of using them to form a consumer-foundation that rewards film-fans for their eventual interest in films and filmmakers.

 

Excellent points. I do think there are unexploited potentials, but this is a "now" society. Anything older than ten minutes seems to be forgotten.

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Ciao, Miss Gun for Hire -- I was very impressed, too. I'd seen KCC and a couple of others but that night's line-up really sold me more than ever on his place in dramatic movies.

 

John Payne wasn't even on my radar until I watched 99 River Street and now Kansas City Confidential. Now I'm very interested in him. Why do I feel like these are his two best?

 

He drew me in, and he's very warm underneath even the most churlish characters.

 

I agree. Payne has such great "explosion" but then he calms down and you find a real human with feelings. That's Payne's acting. Some performers can project such feelings while others just can't. Payne also plays "sweaty" extremely well. He's also an excellent "cornered animal." I like his voice for film noir.

 

He seemed like a character in a modern movie to me. The bitter ex-police captain hiding under the affable retiree.

 

Very much so. It was a thrilling twist.

 

He's like a dark Jimmy Stewart in the body of Robert Mitchum.

 

That's pretty good. I definitely see the "Jimmy Stewart." Jimmy is very good at the "explosion." I guess the "Robert Mitchum" is Payne's roughness and physicality. Mitch seems so doggone cool, even when he's in too deep. Payne is the opposite. He's a sweaty mess. They list Payne as being 6-foot-2. He looks stocky on film. He plays like a bulldog.

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> That's pretty good. I definitely see the "Jimmy Stewart." Jimmy is very good at the "explosion." I guess the "Robert Mitchum" is Payne's roughness and physicality. Mitch seems so doggone cool, even when he's in too deep. Payne is the opposite. He's a sweaty mess. They list Payne as being 6-foot-2. He looks stocky on film. He plays like a bulldog.

 

Mitchum was pretty "messy" in *His Kind of Woman*. I was really comparing their builds not personas.

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Grimesy, I'd give a strong vote for Payne's THE CROOKED WAY (1949) as part of his top-performance lists.

 

And then I always put in a nudge toward the earlier SOMEWHERE IN THE NIGHT (1946) with John Hodiak. The same-themed tale keeps the first halves of each film on-track, and then they diverge. Hodiak stayed on the dark side for a few films (the most excellent ARNELO AFFAIR and then DESERT FURY). Hodiak did his own Lightweight & Song & Dance soir?e in THE HARVEY GIRLS, along with a couple of MAISIE films and Skelton's I DOOD IT. Then LIFEBOAT probably got him started toward the noir side.

 

Hodiak, I suspect, was much more of a 'competitive face' to Tyrone and Robt Taylor, though. All those Boston-**** mustaches... Thank you, Ronald Colman and Warren William!

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Hola, CineBabe -- Roll out the barrel. And we'll have a barrel of fun...

 

You got a laugh out of me!

 

Hey there, Ollie -- Grimesy, I'd give a strong vote for Payne's THE CROOKED WAY (1949) as part of his top-performance lists.

 

Thank you for that recommendation. I did record the film when it aired, so I have it to watch. I may have to check it out.

 

And then I always put in a nudge toward the earlier SOMEWHERE IN THE NIGHT (1946) with John Hodiak. The same-themed tale keeps the first halves of each film on-track, and then they diverge.

 

I've seen that one. I like it. I feel it's very underrated. What shocks me the most about the film is that it's Joseph L. Mankiewicz.

 

Hodiak stayed on the dark side for a few films (the most excellent ARNELO AFFAIR and then DESERT FURY). Hodiak did his own Lightweight & Song & Dance soir?e in THE HARVEY GIRLS, along with a couple of MAISIE films and Skelton's I DOOD IT. Then LIFEBOAT probably got him started toward the noir side.

 

The gals have mentioned Desert Fury a few times on this board. I've yet to see it.

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"The gals have mentioned Desert Fury a few times on this board. I've yet to see it."

 

Oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy...if you EVER do see it, please let me know. Lizabeth Scott, Burt Lancaster, John Hodiak, Wendell Corey and the great Mary Astor.Oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy!!!

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Hope some of you saw or recorded THE HOUSE ON 92nd STREET. Gorgeous, breathtaking, sensational--supply your own adjective to the cinematography. The version TCM showed could not have looked better. Much of the film is brightly lit, and those shots look just as stunning as the all-out noir shadows of the climactic scenes.

 

All this, and the truth about 1940s helmet hair. I won't explain, but when you see the film, you'll understand.

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