BRONXGIRL'S MOTHER, HENRY FONDA'S HIRSUTENESS, ETC.

[JackFavell]

ha ha!

 

I'm feeling guilty lately about how I've dissed Kent Smith. SOmeone told me I have to see him in The Damned Don't Cry, before I make up my mind about him... and he was good in This Land is Mine.

 

Whew. Now I feel better.

 

Mister Softee....giggle

[CineMaven]

I have no guilt about what you said about Kent Smith. (Huh?) In "THE DAMNED DON'T CRY" was he Crawford's disfigured husband and she winds up with David Brian and Steve Cochran?? Meh. Kent Smith...an Homolkan poseur.

 

SANS FIN writes: A woman thought beautiful by Rubens would not be a welcome sight at any beach today...A tall oval face was thought handsome then. A short oval and bilateral symmetry is thought handsome today.

 

Holy moly Sans Fin. I don?t know how to conjugate speaketh. I spaked? Spokededed? Je ne sais pas. I know Rubens? women were quite voluptuous. Look at Marilyn Monroe...she was no Size 2. She was kind of a big girl. Curvy no doubt...but did you see her recently in ?THE MISFITS? running onto the beach?? She looks darned good, but no Size 2 like I said. Now I?m no phrenologist, but I really like how you broke it down, broke down ?The Look? of tall oval faces being thought handsome in those early 30?s. Below are some example of The Face you described:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please note, my hypothesis is not who is handsome or not. My hypothesis is that faces looked different in films back then, than faces today. Yes, in making my point it might?ve been a bit biased b?cuz the gentlemen above are not Americans. (Is Warren an American)...and I think Europeans kind of have a different look than Americans. But these five faces above are faces that have a typically 1920's/1930?s Movie-Face (for me).

 

I blame Marlon Brando in large part for the lack of talent in stars of today. Before him a person needed to be a talented actor to become a true star of the movies. His success pushed forward the idea of 'everyman' and began the erosion of talent in favor of personality.

 

I would not lay blame with Brando or Dean or Monty. I think they changed Acting from that glossy Hollywood-type of Movie Star Acting. Probably the conversations those 30?s and 40?s actors had with their directors were different from the talks Monty or Dean had with Nicholas Ray or George Stevens (Stevens being an old-time movie director whose career spanned decades). I think Brando, Dean and Monty introduced a more natural style. Dustin Hoffman I think ushered in the Not-So-Handsome-Leading Man-Actor into "The Everyman." I have a vague memory of that being said when ?THE GRADUATE? came out in ?68. I think Brando ushered in a change in Acting Style from what might?ve been a little overblown.

 

I blame also modern movies in part because few require actors who can act. If they can remember their lines and not bump into the furniture they are thought to be good enough to fill in the spaces between explosions, fights and scenes so very dark it is hard to know what is happening.

 

I?m more WITH you here than not.

 

Men in the 1930s who looked as men thought handsome today likely had no chance of becoming a star.

 

Hmmmm...I find it hard to believe that these faces below would not be considered attractive enough to be a star back in the 30?s. Now I?m not talking about Talent. I?m talking of their looks.

 

 

 

 

 

*********

 

JACK FAVELL writes: Gabriel Byrne says that when you are acting a scene and you don't know how to play it, you should stare out to the horizon and look enigmatic. Too many actors today think this is all there is to acting. They stare at the camera like Garbo and think of nothing.

 

Say, Jackie...I wonder if Byrne?s salty sexy Irish humor was in play here. From what I?ve seen of his work on screen... he never cheated. He was always in the moment of the scenes. I?m a Garbo fan, and have read a couple of books on her and it was said that if you were on the set with her it looked like she wasn?t doing too much, but when you saw her in the rushes...saw her on the screen, the camera saw what the naked eye didn?t see. A lot of today?s young celebrities are not allowed to fail...don?t seek out theatre...so if they?re lucky enough to get a gig on the --silver screen-- multiplex screen, they?d better have a big box office on the first weekend...or their career is in jeopardy. The box office can kind of be cruel to blank stares and thoughts of nothingness. I don't want to be too mean and name names of those who are skating by on just that very route with their pretty/handsome Botoxed faces.

 

I happen to like Rod LaRocque, but I hear you kingrat...I mean, both Jimmy Cagney and Donald Woods were up and coming stars, equal in the director's eyes when they made Public Enemy. I believe they even ended up switching roles...but Cagney is magnetic, and Donald Woods...is not.

 

Magneticism. < ( Sigh ) > All sorts of variables to becoming a Star, ey? I don?t know Rod LaRocque. I saw him in one movie (I think Stanwyck?s first in 1929...and she was horribly wooden and stiff). And I know LaRocque?s name from Johnny Carson?s TeaTime Movie skits. IMHO he has the look and probably the acting style of the early 30?s leading man.

 

KINGRAT writes: For me, that's one of the drawbacks to films from this era: too many of the leading men don't make much of an impression. I can't tell the young juvenile leads apart.

 

I feel that way about many of today?s actresses. I don?t know who is who.

 

No wonder Clark Gable and Gary Cooper and Spencer Tracy became stars. They actually made an impression when they appeared on screen, and what competition did they have? Perhaps this is just me.

 

What becomes a legend most: magnetism and intensity.

 

I'm glad I live in my time. And I'm glad there is TCM and all those old retro movie theatres NYC had, to see the films and stars of the past.

[SansFin]

> CineMaven inscribed:

> I know Rubens? women were quite voluptuous. Look at Marilyn Monroe...she was no Size 2. She was kind of a big girl.

 

I do not believe Marilyn Monroe was near the size or shape of Rubens' Venus:

http://www.mezzo-mondo.com/arts/mm/rubens/RUP006.html

 

> My hypothesis is that faces looked different in films back then, than faces today.

 

I do not know how or if it could apply to faces but I have seen the difference in bodies in different years. Capuchin does digital restoration and digital enhancement of old photographs and he has done much with pornography of the Victorian Era, Edwardian Era and 1920s. When he places them side-by-side it is easy to see an evolution. I believe some of it may be explained by changes in undergarments and the effects they have on growth and formation but it does appear to go beyond what an undergarment could do. The length of the legs and the position of breasts on the ribcage are significantly different in 1930 that what they were in 1890.

 

Perhaps there has also been an evolution in faces.

[CineMaven]

I feel close to you all, so I think I can tell you this:

 

I...AM...IN...LOVE!!!

 

 

I am in love with the tall oval face of an early 1930's actor.

 

I am now in love with George Arliss.

 

I just saw him this morning in "THE WORKING MAN" (1933) and was totally impressed with him. (I think he's totally responsible for Bette Davis' career). Easy, breezy, tossed off lines in this movie. He makes me think of the natural style of Walter Huston. The movie had a great trippy plot of twists and double twists and triple twists. Yeah I know...he's no Oskar Homolka nor is he George Murphy...but just call me CineM'Arliss. He was such a joy to watch. Oh yeah, Bette Davis was in it too...blonde and twenty-five. She's still forming. Today Davis' films are the fare for TCM's "Summer Under the Stars" series. The bulk of the day will be 1930's Davis. Of course I've seen many of them before, but how can I resist Bette's transforming spinster in "NOW, VOYAGER" or the willfull spitfire of "JEZEBEL" or the lying adultress in "THE LETTER."

 

I can't.

 

Sans Fin with that digital restoration work that you mentioned Capuchin does (Whoa!) and you knowing about the sound that blood makes, I'd say you two are the modern-day Curies.

[JackFavell]

George Arliss was a revelation to me too - you think he was going to be this old, stuffy Victorian type actor, and he turns out to be funny, relaxed and bright.

 

I missed him this morning unfortunately, and I was going to try and watch all the Bette movies I hadn't seen yet, including this one and Bordertown.

 

Of course I'll be recording Juarez today, in order to get a glimpse of MY man, Joseph Calleia, and see what that sneaky fellow is up to.....

 

Here are some more oval headed leading men... I think it partly has to do with slicked down hairstyles, but not completely. I never realized there was a difference between the faces then and now.

 

Warner Baxter

 

Robert Montgomery

 

Maurice Chevalier

 

Lyle Talbot

 

Edmund Lowe

 

Edmund Lowe w/ moustache

 

Conrad Nagel

[CineMaven]

Oh Jackie...what a compendium of faces you show off here. Nice. Perfect examples. These are not faces you see in movies today. I used to get Warner Baxter and Ronald Colman mixed up. My parents were watching some documentary the other day and Hitler was on screaming and shouting. I asked my father: "When you see him, is that the man, the face you remember as a boy?" (Hitler just seems so removed...such a caricature of a Mad leader since he is soooo before my time. I can't explain it well). So my father says, "Oh yeah, I remember him. Yep, that's him. That is him."

 

Another thing you don't see anymore...there's a hand on hip gesture with palms front that all the ladies used to do back then, that you don't see anymore. But everyone in the 30's did it.

 

 

I was going to try and stretch and see all the Bettes I haven't seen but I can't...I just can't do "The Corn Is Green" "The Catered Affair" or "John Paul Jones." It will be physically impossible for me to lay my eyes on those. Wait...is Rod Taylor in "...Affair" and I mean, a lot???

 

CineM'Arliss

 

P.S. I do specifically see Frances Gifford in "STAGEDOOR." She's in the clip they show for Saturday's ESSENTIALS. Her smile is unmistakable.

[kingrat]

JF, thanks so much for posting those photos. Now I can see what SansFin means about the long oval faces. Thanks, SansFin! I also wonder how much the slicked back hair contributes to this look. I do have trouble telling some of these actors apart.

 

And CineM'Arliss, I'm with you. *DISRAELI, HOUSE OF ROTHSCHILD*, and *THE MAN WHO PLAYED GOD* are all worth seeing for Arliss, and *THE WORKING MAN* has been taped, if I didn't screw it up again. Arliss and his wife Florence, who plays Disraeli's wife, are an adorable romantic couple.

[JackFavell]

I missed Bordertown AGAIN. I think this one is jinxed for me. I missed it last time too. I came in to see the very end of Bette's scene where she goes mad. And it had Margaret Lindsey too, I thought of you when I saw her.

 

Bette's doing great here with Spencer Tracy... I can see how driven she was in this one, she's starting to come into her own here, and having Spence opposite doesn't hurt. She's got someone to play off of.

 

I never liked Juarez much, but because my Joe is in it, it's a must record movie now. I hope I don't get sidetracked again and miss the beginning. I can't wait to see him.

 

BTW, whenever I used to play in a thirties period piece in theatre, I always used that gesture, and a few others I picked up .... it pays to watch classic film!

 

 

 

Here's another good one:

 

[CineMaven]

THAT'S IT EXACTLY JACKAAAAY!!!

 

I see Myrna, Jean, Joanie, Connie and Glenda...but which one are you???

 

Kingrat, seeing Arliss in "Disraeli" scared me with those lips and the "That Girl" hairdo. I'm lucky I gave him...and me another chance.

 

Thanx for the shots Jack.

[Bronxgirl48]

Hey, guys, great discussion.

 

I didn't realize Lyle Talbot was oval-headed. If I ever thought about him at all.

 

Leading ladies of the '20's always put their hands over their chests.

(i.e. Alice Terry seeing Rudy alseep in the chair, "All I Wanna Do Is Touch You" vid)

 

 

I apologize for not getting back to Torture amd Hitch because I laid down on the couch and promptly fell asleep during

ON THE WATERFRONT. (I really wanted to see THE FORMULA, sounded bad) I'm exhausted now getting ready for a possible tropical storm headed our way, and helping my mother with her apartment because the cleaning lady was sick.

 

 

Mom talked about Jennifer Jones and MADAME "****".

 

 

I kid you not.

 

 

MAVEN, I've been in love with George Arliss since seeing THE WORKING MAN and DISRAELI a while back. (in fact, I think I either had a thread or a commentry about George, but memory does not serve)

 

 

I'm settling in with Bette all day. Did everyone notice how THEY DRIVE BY NIGHT took part of its plot from BORDERTOWN?

 

 

Anyone see SLIGHTLY FRENCH? Douglas Sirk directs Don Ameche and Dorothy Lamour, with little appreciable irony. Tippi introduced this with some sly, indirect comparison to VERTIGO, lol. Lamour was just trying too hard, and I prefer her as a sexy comic foil than a full-blown leading lady. And I like it better when she sings -- her effortless voice intoxicates, it's so sultry, lush, takes me away to romantic places.

 

 

The only thing that impressed me with SLIGHTLY FRENCH was Don's charming California estate. I wanted to live there. When the set design takes up more interest than the plot, the movie's in trouble.

 

Edited by: Bronxgirl48 on Aug 3, 2011 4:25 PM

[Bronxgirl48]

George Clooney -- please, I'm going to have dinner soon.

[CineMaven]

Okay...you can be in love with George too but you may NOT touch my Sammykins. I'm not the sharing type.

[Bronxgirl48]

So many women seem to love Clooney, but he's my bete noir. (and I do hope he's left Lake Como permanently)

 

Sammy, sweet Sammy....

 

You should catch THE CATERED AFFAIR. Bette is so believable as an Irish-American Bronx housewife! Not that I think you want to eee her in this kind of role, so resigned and well, ordinary, lol. (but watch her at the fish counter, she gets off some Bette Davis attitude with a catty neighbor) And Rod Taylor has NEVER looked sexier! To me, anyway...

 

 

Can't wait for THE LETTER and THE PETRIFIED FOREST!

 

Edited by: Bronxgirl48 on Aug 3, 2011 4:24 PM

[kingrat]

 

Now that I've stopped laughing about Bronxgirl's mom and "Madame ****"--no, I haven't stopped laughing.

 

I believe Bette Davis was offered the role in THEY DRIVE BY NIGHT but decided not to kill another husband with the same garage door opener. Hey, recycling is good, even with subplots.

 

George Arliss' "That Girl" hairdo in DISRAELI--too funny.

 

 

As for SLIGHTLY FRENCH, you can check out the irrelevant elaborate mirror shots and realize that it might have been directed by Douglas Sirk. Loved the house, too, but I'm hanging out some of the time at the SUSAN SLADE beach house in Big Sur.

 

 

[Bronxgirl48]

Jackie, that IS the most gorgeous photo of Ray I've ever seen!

[Bronxgirl48]

Rod as Ralph Halloran in THE CATERED AFFAIR.

 

[JackFavell]

Bette is superb in The Catered Affair, and it's not a comedy, it's kind of like *Marty,* but with a family.

 

I recommend it. However, Rod isn't in it nearly enough.

 

I just sat through *Juarez* - what I won't do for my sweet Joe - sit through that snooze fest. If only they had left out everyone but Joe, John and Gilbert.....who were all tremendously vital, while Muni never moved a muscle. GAK. Aherne was surprisingly effective, but still a bit of a snooze inducement.

 

 

[Bronxgirl48]

I guess Mom figured that Emma had a lot of problems with her ovaries, lol.

 

Maven gets the Arliss 'That Girl' hairdo credit.

 

Ida goes mad much more effectively than Bette, but, it's just the weaker BORDERTOWN script in this respect. Ugh, the script..."My Juanito is a good boy!"

 

My mother drools over the SUSAN SLADE house. I'm partial to Dick Powell's digs with another Susan in the title, SUSAN SLEPT HERE.

 

But I'm pining for Falcon Lair...

 

 

 

 

 

[Bronxgirl48]

Joe's looking real good in that JUAREZ photo, his eyes are so seductive and charismatic. Missed this movie, forgot he was in it, drat!!

 

 

 

 

[JackFavell]

Aren't they? You didn't miss much - most of Joe's scenes involve sitting quietly next to Muni, trying to look interested or galvanized or patriotic while Muni speaks in an agonizingly slow way. His only good scene is already posted in the TCM media room, and I posted it here some time ago.

 

Here is someone I would pay money to see sit in a chair and not move:

 

 

[CineMaven]

"With all my heart, I still love the man I killed!"

 

This line was spoken by Bette Davis in "THE LETTER" ( 1940 ) and I think it's the greatest line ever written. When you see what comes before it, what she has gone through and what she has put everyone else through...my Gawd!!

 

For me, this is The Masterwork of William Wyler. Too hyperbolic? Ohhhhhkay, let me bring it down a smidge. "The Letter" is a masterpiece among Wyler's masterpieces. And I say BRAVO to all involved in front and behind the camera.

 

When I was a guest programmer on TCM, I said to Robert Osborne that this film has the menage-a-trois of filmmaking: WILLIAM WYLER, MAX STEINER and BETTE DAVIS. Looking at it today, I still hold firm to that statement. What a threesome...what a collaboration.

 

I can taste this film.

 

**************

 

 

"Even my agony was a kind of joy."

 

From her first lie...to her final truth, Bette Davis' performance is like a vise on my emotions. She shows us three Leslies in this film and it chills me to the core. In fact, her little truths spill out through the course of the film, but you need a second viewing to spot them. Psst...and she can crochet a mean sweater too! But why you'd need one in that jungle...

 

*******************

 

 

"Those eyes like a cobra's eyes."

 

Gale Sondergaard is beautiful in this film. But it is not a soft and friendly beauty. Her beauty is cruel. Her stillness is like a deathgrip. My sympathies go with her. I swoon when she opens the beaded curtain. I think even Hope Emerson would have knelt before her. The money? Ha! She don't need no stinkin' money!

 

*********************

 

 

"Strange a man can live with a woman for ten years and not know a thing about her."

 

The tension between the two of them was soooooo deliciously torturously palpable. Oh he's "handling" it alright. He sold his soul and his ethics down the river for Leslie. He was a good guy. When the truth comes out...he'll be disbarred. He'll be ostracized from his world of privilege. And that won't even come close to the beginning of his torment.

 

********************

 

 

"He's going to forgive you."

 

What kind of man could forgive the things he's heard? His money is gone...his trust has been betrayed and shot to hell. He's been made a fool of. When he hears her final truth, that will ensure his leap into an abyss...with a bullet in his brain.

 

*********************

 

 

"...And to know that I have been of service to you and our client."

 

I love love love him. Inscrutable? Not on your life. He's a wheelin' dealin' double crossing smart guy. Every smile was a dagger in white society's heart. Will he have to give the money back when the jig is up? Naaaaah. He won't even be in town.

 

***********************

 

 

WILLIE FUNG

 

Awmigawd!!! I've got to put him in there because...because because of his laugh. Because in a tense moment where money is exchanged and Wife Meets Mistress...my man Willie is sittin' back, smokin' his pipe and laughin' at the rich folk. Willie...you kill me. You don't care how serious this situation is. You find the humour.

 

"The Letter." It is seventy-one years old. What a many layered film this is. :x

[Bronxgirl48]

Is that Gilbert Roland? He's in JUAREZ? Double-drat!

 

I loooove Leslie Howard's last kiss with Bette in THE PETRIFIED FOREST. They had great working chemistry onscreen. How many films did they make together? Four, five?

 

I can't get into THE OLD MAID. The title, too, lol.

[kingrat]

Maven, I'm with you on the greatness of *THE LETTER*. Not only does it have that fabulous line, but the opening sequence is one of the best ever, from the quick establishing shots of the moon and the distance from Singapore and the two spectacular camera movements seamlessly melded into one, ending with the white cockatoo flying away and Bette pouring lead into her lover. By then we've seen the rubber tree and the men who work on the rubber plantation for the crazy white people who own it. Wyler's biographer Jan Herman (*A TALENT FOR TROUBLE*) says that the studio was upset that Wyler had shot so little of the script, but when they saw the opening that he had created, they weren't unhappy any more.

[Bronxgirl48]

Hey, Dick Foran was very good in THE PETRIFIED FOREST as Boze!

Fine dramatic work there. And not a song on his lips.

 

I love James Stephenson's grim fascination with the enigma of Leslie in THE LETTER.

[CineMaven]

BRONXGIRL . . . . .

 

Okay...you can be in love with George too but you may NOT touch my Sammykins. I'm not the sharing type.

 

George Clooney -- please, I'm going to have dinner soon.So many women seem to love Clooney, but he's my bete noir. (and I do hope he's left Lake Como permanently)

 

GEORGE CLOONEY??? Who?s talking about George Clooney. You brought up George Clooney? George Clooney? Aye yi yi.

 

I'm settling in with Bette all day. Did everyone notice how "THEY DRIVE BY NIGHT" took part of its plot from "BORDERTOWN"?

 

I did. I did. The doors made me do it. The doors made me do it. I didn?t specifically watch it today, but I did record it.

 

Anyone see "SLIGHTLY FRENCH"? Douglas Sirk directs Don Ameche and Dorothy Lamour, with little appreciable irony.

 

I did. I did. Wait...am I hogging up the class? Sorry. I had the movie on but wasn't watching it specifically. Ugh! It was predictable and I usually go with predictability if there are movie stars I?m fond of. I was feeling a little sumthin? sumthin? for Don Ameche though. Hmmmm. He was swarthily attractive and I always liked the sound of his voice. Dorothy...she looks luscious but I think I rather just see her be ?the girl? with the boys. (Sorry Dottie). And in the dance number...I don?t even think that was Lamour. The house looked great, but I have to admit, I was paying more attention to Janis Carter. I like that actress.

 

Ida goes mad much more effectively than Bette, but, it's just the weaker BORDERTOWN script in this respect. Ugh, the script..."My Juanito is a good boy!"

 

I'll take Ida, yah yah yah. Loved Ida Lupino?s Lana Carlson. The fireworks with her and George Raft were heated and sexy. He actually looked afraid when she started telling him she put those creases in his pants. I loved when he told her: ?I?m gettin? out of here.?

 

"My Juanito is a good boy." Aye yi yi! I?m sure Mexicans who saw this in the movies were throwing tacos at the screen. Iwonder if they howled at Paul Muni's Lower East Side Borscht Belt Mexican? Couldn't they have used Ramon Novarro. Wasn't he still around in the 30's. Wasn't he Mexican?

 

I can't get into ?THE OLD MAID.? The title, too, lol.

 

CRAP!!! There goes my computer monitor!!! Spill on Aisle 5!!

 

I love James Stephenson's grim fascination with the enigma of Leslie in ?THE LETTER.?

 

Ooooh, I loved the way you put that. Nice. I?ve got to learn to use less words, sorry. I just saw James Stephenson in ?The Old Maid.? Wow! Warner Brothers...one big happy casting family.

 

Hey, Dick Foran was very good in "THE PETRIFIED FOREST" as Boze! Fine dramatic work there. And not a song on his lips.

 

I agree Boca Queen. Very believable and working with Davis who was definitely a rising star at the studio. He stood toe-to-toe with her.

 

( ASIDE: Was John Ridgely in every durned movie ever made???

 

***************

 

KING RAT.......

 

I believe Bette Davis was offered the role in "THEY DRIVE BY NIGHT" but decided not to kill another husband with the same garage door opener. Hey, recycling is good, even with subplots.

 

Oooooh! Ha! Funny, man. See you at Susan Slade?s house.

 

Maven, I'm with you on the greatness of THE LETTER. Not only does it have that fabulous line, but the opening sequence is one of the best ever, from the quick establishing shots of the moon and the distance from Singapore and the two spectacular camera movements seamlessly melded into one, ending with the white cockatoo flying away and Bette pouring lead into her lover.

 

Yes yes yes King Rat. That silky smooth tracking shot shows all we need to know about rubber plantation life without a lot of exposition. Then Bette bursts through the door spittin' lead!!! WoW! If I could only sit at Wyler?s feet. I guess I can in a way do that, by running his films with no sound and just watch...watch...watch. And learn...learn... learn.

 

ASIDE: I love that kid who runs up to Herbert Marshall in the very beginning of the movie and tells him: ?Mr. Hammond has been shot!!! Mr. Hammond is dead!!? I think he was one of the sons in ?The Good Earth.? What a good looking kid.

 

**************

JACK FAVELL . . . .

 

I just sat through "Juarez" - what I won't do for my sweet Joe - sit through that snooze fest.

 

I taped it but I haven?t watched it yet. That pix you posted of Joey C. with that goatee...hot stuff! Maybe I can fast forward to Bette going crazy, scenes.

 

Here is someone I would pay money to see sit in a chair and not move...

 

Aaaaaah Gilbert Roland. Maybe while he?s sitting there, we can all give him a lap dance? Si? Oui? No?