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Say It Ain't So, Joe Manchin


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3 hours ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

Some funds should be reserved for future disasters:   Thus this budget should be trimmed by 500 billion if not more.  

I agree that this proposal is far larger than the US can afford.  I would estimate that $2 Trillion would be much more reasonable.

However, there is no "reserving" funds for future disasters as there are zero funds actually.  It is all borrowed money at this point.  The only way to reserve funds would be if other programs were cut and taxes were raised enough to have a substantial surplus.  I don't see than happening.  

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47 minutes ago, ElCid said:

I agree that this proposal is far larger than the US can afford.  I would estimate that $2 Trillion would be much more reasonable.

However, there is no "reserving" funds for future disasters as there are zero funds actually.  It is all borrowed money at this point.  The only way to reserve funds would be if other programs were cut and taxes were raised enough to have a substantial surplus.  I don't see than happening.  

Yes,  I didn't mean "reserving" funds literally,   but instead when there is a disaster that requires billions in funding,  with a lot of dollars going to repair infrastructure damaged by the disaster,  those dollars increase the debt.       Thus  we are NOT spending dollars in the near term ,  directly in this budget for such items but instead not increasing the debt so it can be increased later,  if needed (and it will of course be needed since there will be disasters and it appears more in the coming years than what we have seen historically).

  

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biden has made it easy for manchin and others by demonstrating his astonishingly gross incompetence to the whole country in afghanistan.

we are grateful....but all those women who will be brutalized by what he has done...

SHAME

:D

 

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1 hour ago, 37kitties said:

That creep don't care any more than his perverted kid cares.

Donald Trump didn’t care about Covid, except how it might affect his re-election.  The Orange Creep let over 600,000 Americans die due to his inept, incompetent and/or no -response to Covid!!  And no one is more of a pervert that Trump, self-attesting to his serial sexual accosting of women!!

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7 hours ago, NipkowDisc said:

biden has made it easy for manchin and others by demonstrating his astonishingly gross incompetence to the whole country in afghanistan.

we are grateful....but all those women who will be brutalized by what he has done...

SHAME

:D

 

You mean how he is keeping his promise, and had Americans and others flown out of Afghanistan today!?!

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A reminder that Manchin's state is 1/22 the population of California.

Biden told Joe Manchin 'you're really f***ing me' in last-ditch phone call to get senator to back his $1.9T stimulus deal

47941177-0-image-a-34_1631687172067.jpg

President Biden allegedly called Sen Joe Manchin in March 2020 a day before the Senate voted on his 'American Rescue Plan' and said if he didn't back it, 'you're really f***ing me'.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9/15/2021 at 7:39 PM, mr6666 said:

:(

Natural gas prices are expected to go up 180% this year.  Electric utilities have been converting their coal fired plants to natural gas.

Also, there will be less electricity produced by hydropower this year due to vastly lower water levels in some areas.

I am not advocating for using more coal, but .....

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supposedly a 3.5 trillion bill but some say it is more like 5 trillion which is obscene. question: the stinking lying dems can raise the debt ceiling without gop votes so why are the dems trying to bring the gop along?...

answer: because they doan wanna own raising the debt limit all by themselves.

the stinkin' two-faced cruds!

:D

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The Dems are divided between the libs and the progs. That's their problem. The progs gambled that people would want the roads and bridges bill so much they'd go for the social spending to get it. Suckers. The Republicans are just ... there.

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5 hours ago, NipkowDisc said:

supposedly a 3.5 trillion bill but some say it is more like 5 trillion which is obscene. question: the stinking lying dems can raise the debt ceiling without gop votes so why are the dems trying to bring the gop along?...

answer: because they doan wanna own raising the debt limit all by themselves.

the stinkin' two-faced cruds!

:D

Because McConnell and the GOP were threatening to filibuster.  Which means theat 60 votes are needed.  Doesn’t Fox go over this?

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4 hours ago, LuckyDan said:

The Dems are divided between the libs and the progs. That's their problem. The progs gambled that people would want the roads and bridges bill so much they'd go for the social spending to get it. Suckers. The Republicans are just ... there.

80% of the country, GOP, Dems and Independents, want what both bills have.  Two Democratic senators prefer to help the wealthiest Americans instead of the vast majority of Americans.

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11 hours ago, Arturo said:

80% of the country, GOP, Dems and Independents, want what both bills have.  Two Democratic senators prefer to help the wealthiest Americans instead of the vast majority of Americans.

Have to disagree somewhat, even as a left of center Democrat.   Have not seen any polls, but I doubt 80% of Americans want both bills.  For instance, I am 100% for the physical infrastructure bill, but am either opposed or questionable about much of the "human" infrastructure bill.

I think Manchin has made a reasonable offer to the Progressives - $1.5 Trillion for their bill.  Of course, I would need to see what is left before I decide to like it or not.  

Absolutely do not need to use reconciliation to pass either the human infrastructure bill or debt ceiling increase.

As for passing the physical infrastructure bill, Pelosi should bring the bill to the floor and pressure GOPers to vote for it.  Since they actually like most (if not all) of it, should be enough to get it passed even if Progressives do not vote for it.  If it fails, then Dems can blame the GOPers who voted against it and campaign against them in their states in 2022.  They refused to "bring home the much needed bacon" when they had a chance.

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3 hours ago, ElCid said:

Absolutely do not need to use reconciliation to pass either the human infrastructure bill

Wouldn't the Dems need 60 Senators to avoid a filibuster in order to pass the "human infrastructure bill" in the Senate?

I ask because I don't think there are 10 GOP Senators that would support this bill unless the total cost is reduced even lower than that 1.5 Trillion Manchin said he would support.

 

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59 minutes ago, JamesJazGuitar said:

Wouldn't the Dems need 60 Senators to avoid a filibuster in order to pass the "human infrastructure bill" in the Senate?

I ask because I don't think there are 10 GOP Senators that would support this bill unless the total cost is reduced even lower than that 1.5 Trillion Manchin said he would support.

 

Yes they would.   I guess if the "human" bill was palatable, I could see using the reconciliation process, but I wouldn't like it.   Nor would the voters.   Would be better if they could find something 10 GOPer senators could vote for, but that may be The Impossible Dream in today's GOP.  Fear of Trump; Fear of McConnell; Fear of the base voters.   But, if they could just find 5 Red states that could profit from it, maybe it could pass.  Here again it depends on what is in it.  There are some good things.

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