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You also forgot Fraser Crane and the great Bebe Newirth (sp?) as Lillith.  We had how juvenile they sometimes got - their legendary competitions with Gary.  Carla and Dan Hedaya as Nick Tortelli.  Kirstie Alley kept getting duped by the wealthy Roger Rees.  I don't think the actors were unhappy when Shelly Long left - Kirstie Alley wasn't so snooty (Rebecca character).  Sam was an alcoholic who ran a bar.  He was Mayday Malone and his drinking probably ruined his career.  Your comment about Moonlighting is spot on for me.  On NCIS (original), it was never stated that Tony and Ziva were an item until she resigned and returned to Israel.  And SVU has made a point of Olivia and Stabler never being an item.

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1 hour ago, EricJ said:

Yes, we remember.  😑

Basically, Rebecca would never have survived as Predatory 80's Corporate Female, or been likable unless Sam got control of his bar back, and the stressed-out cracks in Rebecca's armor made her the same lovable oddball that the other bar regulars were.

(And let's not forget Woody Harrelson, who managed to be a worthy successor even for those who did remember Nicholas Colasanto's Coach, and take his dim-bulbery into whole new frontiers.)

Yes, I loved the exchange between Woody and Rebecca after her boyfriend got nailed for securities fraud and insider trading that involved Rebecca's company.

Woody told Rebecca that her company called and they had fired her.

Rebecca said something to the effect of "Oh, they blame me for Robin's (her boyfriend's) fraud."

Woody's reply - No, they just said they don't care much for your work.

Which was much more cutting because she was being let go because she was a mediocrity. Not because of some scandal. 

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On 8/7/2021 at 5:18 PM, Moe Howard said:

I recall a discussion between myself and my mom on the subject. Samantha Stevens was one of the early ideals that I measured available girls in class by. I had become conditioned to accept the first Dick, there was no way after clearing him out I was going to accept a second Dick. 

My mother gently pointed out we were just accustomed to the previous Dick, maybe we just don't like the new Dick because we are used to the old one. The guilt worked, I felt bad about not being welcoming to the new Dick. After a few months I decided new Dick wasn't worthy after all, of Samantha or me, so Ann Margret became the new ideal. The best part, no Dick-s to deal with!

Dick Sargent grew into the role of Darrin Stephens, especially after the writers began writing more to his interpretation ------ with   his more sarcastic responses to Samantha's relatives compared to Dick York's physical  freak outs and screaming.

I've seen all episodes of BEWITCHED two or more times.  Some episodes I've seen  ten or more times.  It's one of my favorite TV series of all time since I discovered it on Nick at Nite.  I think both the first Dick and the  second Dick  are worthy.  And I think Samantha clicked with both Dick 1 and Dick 2

PS.  I also love Ann-Margret!

 

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2 hours ago, HoldenIsHere said:

I've seen all episodes of BEWITCHED two or more times.  Some episodes I've seen  ten or more times.  It's one of my favorite TV series of all time since I discovered it on Nick at Nite.  I think both the first Dick and the  second Dick  are worthy.  And I think Samantha clicked with both Dick 1 and Dick 2.

I gravitated more to the Jeannie & Major Nelson half of the rivalry, but I will concede that no fan approves of Wayne Rogers replacing Larry Hagman in the revival TV-movies:  😤

s-l400.jpg

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Looks like she was finally allowed to show her belly button 15 years later.

The appearance of Wayne Rogers makes me think of his departure from M*A*S*H and his replacement by Mike Farrell. This was in fact a show full of actors levaving and being replaced and in my opinion continuing on unabated in quality.

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Why Dick York left is still a mystery - I still prefer him and I hope people didn't hold Dick Sargent's sexual orientation against him.  I remember Elizabeth Montgomery and Robert Foxworth riding in a Gay and Lesbian parade.  I am one person who thinks that the movie MASH was better than the original.

I like the early B&W Bewitched - and Sam and Darren still remind me of Don Draper and Betsy on Mad Men.

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They addressed this sort of thing on an episode of ROSEANNE (yeah, I used to watch it for a few years.  So what?)  .

After a couple or so seasons they changed the young actress who played the older daughter Becky.  And on her debut episode, it ended showing them all sitting in the living room watching TV.  By the sound coming from the "TV set" it was clear they were watching an old episode of BEWITCHED.  The younger daughter (Darlene) asked,  "What made them think they could change Darrins and that nobody would notice?"   And Roseanne answered, "Well, it was a hit show.  They probably thought they could get away with it."  Then there was some talk about how some said they liked the "old Darrin" better.  Then the camera had a close-up on the older daughter now being played by a different actress than originally, who, with a slight grin said, "I like the new Darrin."    ;) 

Sepiatone

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16 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:

Looks like she was finally allowed to show her belly button 15 years later.

The appearance of Wayne Rogers makes me think of his departure from M*A*S*H and his replacement by Mike Farrell. This was in fact a show full of actors levaving and being replaced and in my opinion continuing on unabated in quality.

I'll go a step farther here, sewhite.

When Larry Linville's cartoonish Frank Burns character got his transfer papers out of the 4077th and was replaced by David Ogden Stiers' Charles Winchester character, the show's quality actually increased.

(...ya know, when ANY TV series replaces a TWO-dimensional character with a THREE-dimensional character, it's always a good thing, don't ya)

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1 hour ago, Dargo said:

I'll go a step farther here, sewhite.

When Larry Linville's cartoonish Frank Burns character got his transfer papers out of the 4077th and was replaced by David Ogden Stiers' Charles Winchester character, the show's quality actually increased.

(...ya know, when ANY TV series replaces a TWO-dimensional character with a THREE-dimensional character, it's always a good thing, don't ya)

I can agree with that.  I liked Frank Burns but they'd taken the character about as far as they could. 

I also preferred Harry Morgan's Col. Potter to McLean Stevenson's Lt. Col. Blake. Blake was good but they seemed to flesh out Potter's character more.

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@chaya:  DICK YORK had all kinds of problems related to his back injury; think he was hooked on painkillers and had to leave the show for health reasons.  I believe he collapsed on-set one day and that was the end of his tenure on "Bewitched".  I don't think he would've left voluntarily, but he was in bad shape by 1969.   

ALSO:  I concur that DAVID OGDEN STIERS replacing LARRY LINVILLE on M*A*S*H was no loss of quality.  I remember reading that Larry Linville knew his M*A*S*H character had reached its endpoint . . . and so he left. 

→ Remember back in 1981 when Marla Gibbs was tried out for a 'spin-off' show of "The Jeffersons" called CHECKING IN.  There was one of those obvious set-up episodes of "The Jeffersons" to introduce 'Florence' to her new job at a hotel.  (I forgot exactly what Florence's new job was supposed to be; I think she was supposed to be a manager of some kind).  Anyway, on this 'Jeffersons/New Pilot/Set-Up' episode Larry Linville shows up playing the same kind of snarky Frank Burns-ish character he played in M*A*S*H.  And Nedra Volz showed up, too, as a hotel maid.  CHECKING IN did not last long, though, and Marla Gibbs returned to "The Jeffersons" saying her job -- and the hotel itself -- had burned to the ground.  Like McLean Stevenson, Larry Linville never appeared in another hit show after he left M*A*S*H. 

Speaking of changes, I recall being displeased when Clive Anderson was replaced by Drew Carey on WHOSE LINE IS IT ANYWAY?  Carey was awful.  The host cannot be part of the antics.  He has to be "the straight man" like Clive Anderson was.  But, no, Carey wanted to be part of the comic antics too and it made the show considerably less enjoyable for me.  Ugh! 

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1 hour ago, Mr. Gorman said:

ALSO:  I concur that DAVID OGDEN STIERS replacing LARRY LINVILLE on M*A*S*H was no loss of quality.  I remember reading that Larry Linville knew his M*A*S*H character had reached its endpoint . . . and so he left. 

The TV-canon Burns' only connection to the movie's one was his "secret" affair with Hot Lips, and once Maj. Houlihan had married her dream guy, there was pretty much nowhere for the TV character to go.

Col. Blake also tolerated Cpl. Klinger's one-joke "dress" gag, which was just supposed to be a throwaway gag in the pilot, but Col. Potter was a sharper and no-nonsense foil, and Klinger's new gag had to be coming up with new Section 8 ideas in regular uniform, which smoothed over a few nagging audience wonders about the character.

1 hour ago, Mr. Gorman said:

Speaking of changes, I recall being displeased when Clive Anderson was replaced by Drew Carey on WHOSE LINE IS IT ANYWAY?  Carey was awful.  The host cannot be part of the antics.  He has to be "the straight man" like Clive Anderson was.  But, no, Carey wanted to be part of the comic antics too and it made the show considerably less enjoyable for me.  Ugh! 

Clive was from the UK show, Carey produced the licensed US version just to play in the sandbox himself.  They may have shared the occasional Greg Proops, but we never got Stephen Frost, Josie Lawrence or Mike McShane in the Americanized version.  😕

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Besides both of them working in the advertisement biz, I never saw much of a similarity between

Darrin Stevens and Don Draper ( or their spouses either). Draper was a sleazebag serial adulterer,

though sometimes a charming one, while Darrin hued to the straight and narrow. It's funny is see

how corny most of Darrin's ideas for ads are, but that was likely the way things were in the 1960s.

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5 hours ago, chaya bat woof woof said:

I like the early B&W Bewitched - and Sam and Darren still remind me of Don Draper and Betsy on Mad Men.

In interviews, Matt Weiner creator of Mad Men, said that Bewitched was one of the inspirations for Don and Betty and I've always thought that Roger was probably inspired by Larry. Don, Betty. Roger, etc of course are an exageration of those characters, those clean cut restrictions for a comedy series in the 1960's obviously are different than the plot lines in Mad Men.  Mad Men gave us a more realistic picture of men working on Madison Aveue in that time period. The womanizing, the drinking were realities..

I worked for a time in the early 1970's on Madison Avenue,  some of Don's and Roger's and Pete's, etc. attitude towards women and their  behavior are not total exagerations of the behavior I saw there.

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11 minutes ago, Mr. Gorman said:

@lavenderblue19:  Don't forget about the 1962 movie MADISON AVENUE starring Dana Andrews.  

I was just addressing the 2 comments about Bewitched and the influence  the tv show had on Matt Weiner creator of Mad Men.Very true about the movie Madison Avenue and that's a good point :) and that probably also played a role in the creation of the characters.

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5 hours ago, Citizen Ed said:

  I liked Frank Burns but they'd taken the character about as far as they could.

I liked Larrry Linville's final episode, which is also the one where Margaret gets married. He is oddly sympathetic, almost bonding with Hawkeye and **** and then quietly and full of dignity saying "Goodbye, my Margaret" to himself as he strolls away.

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51 minutes ago, sewhite2000 said:

Woops, can't say the other character's name.

Beedge? You must have typed ****. 

Edit - yep. You typed ****. I wonder if we can say ****?

Edit 2 - nope. The software speaks Italian!

 

 

 

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I liked the first Marilyn, played by Beverly Owen, on The Munsters better than Pat Priest. Beverly was unhappy in the situation because she had to be away from her boyfriend or something. She seemed more innocent. More naive and looked more like Marilyn Monroe than did Pat, who just seemed more like the family servant than the ghost of MM. 

I also prefer Elinor Donahue as Andy's girlfriend on TAGS.  She left because she felt like she didn't fit in with the rest of the ensemble. 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, LuckyDan said:

I liked the first Marilyn, played by Beverly Owen, on The Munsters better than Pat Priest. Beverly was unhappy in the situation because she had to be away from her boyfriend or something. She seemed more innocent. More naive and looked more like Marilyn Monroe than did Pat, who just seemed more like the family servant than the ghost of MM. 

She wasn't "supposed" to be MM, or any movie icon, she was just the "black sheep" of the family, whom Herman was always apologizing for not being as, um, attractive as the rest of her relatives.

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     I enjoy watching the old reruns of "Dennis The Menace" on Antenna TV and I definitely prefer Joseph Kearns as Mr. Wilson vs. Gale Gordon.  Apparently the viewers at the time also preferred Kearns as ratings plummeted after Kearns died and Gordon took over the role.

 

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5 hours ago, lavenderblue19 said:

In interviews, Matt Weiner creator of Mad Men, said that Bewitched was one of the inspirations for Don and Betty and I've always thought that Roger was probably inspired by Larry. Don, Betty. Roger, etc of course are an exageration of those characters, those clean cut restrictions for a comedy series in the 1960's obviously are different than the plot lines in Mad Men.  Mad Men gave us a more realistic picture of men working on Madison Aveue in that time period. The womanizing, the drinking were realities..

I worked for a time in the early 1970's on Madison Avenue,  some of Don's and Roger's and Pete's, etc. attitude towards women and their  behavior are not total exagerations of the behavior I saw there.

Yes, MAD MEN creator Matt Weiner has said a few times that BEWITCHED was one of his inspirations for MAD MEN. 

There were also a few BEWITCHED references on actual  MAD MEN episodes. On the episode "The Good News" from Season 4, Harry Crane suggests to Don Draper that he should look for Bill Asher at the Brown Derby during his Los Angeles layover on his way to Acapulco. "He'll probably cast you, "Harry tells Don.  This is a reference to William Asher, the producer of BEWITCHED and Elizabeth Montgomery's husband during the run of the show.   On "Hands and Knees"(also from Season 4), Roger Sterling calls one of his contacts named Larry on the phone and speaks to his wife Louise.  This is a reference to Larry Tate (president of McMann & Tate, the Madison Avenue advertising firm that Darrin Stephens works for) and his wife Louise.  

My sister and I used to comment on how much drinking there was on BEWITCHED.  Samantha was always making "doubles" for Darrin.  On one episode Louise referred to booze as Larry's medicine! 

I’m surprised that BEWITCHED didn't have a competitive recurring character like MAD MEN’s Pete Campbell.

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