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TCM- What happened?


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@DARGO:  The FALCON could care less about culture wars.  All it wants is some good quarts of oil and a groovy tune-up.  🚗 

With a '170' CID engine mated with the 2-speed Ford-O-Matic the FALCON goes from 0-60 mph in . . . hell, I don't know.  The transmission 'sticks' a bit.  It's old.  🙃

It's fun to put the car in 'L'.   Cruisin' at 29 mph down the dirt road I live on.  Yessss! 

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On 11/24/2021 at 1:53 PM, Mr. Gorman said:

@DARGO:  The FALCON could care less about culture wars.  All it wants is some good quarts of oil and a groovy tune-up.  🚗 

With a '170' CID engine mated with the 2-speed Ford-O-Matic the FALCON goes from 0-60 mph in . . . hell, I don't know.  The transmission 'sticks' a bit.  It's old.  🙃

It's fun to put the car in 'L'.   Cruisin' at 29 mph down the dirt road I live on.  Yessss! 

Reminds me of the time I was helping a friend move from flat Texas to mountainous Idaho a few years back.  We were taking turns driving, and we were heading into some mountains in Colorado.  As I crested the mountain on a twisty two-lane road, I shifted into L.  She started freaking out as the revs increased on the engine.  She said "What are you DOING?!  You're going to ruin my car!"  I explained to her about engine braking.  She had always lived in flat places.  She said she never learned what the "L" or "2" or "1" meant on automatic transmission gear selectors.

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I've passed through small towns in Texas where there are signs right by the city limits signs that say "No engine breaking". I'm such an automotive ignoramus, I don't know what that is. I asked my dad one time when he was still alive, and he kind of shrugged. Your thread is the only other time in my life I've heard the term. I would greatly appreciate it if you could elaborate on it. 

And yes, I've always owned automatic transmission cars. And I don't use the L, 2 or 1 settings, either, so I'm pretty ignorant about those. I would have to go look and see if they're even on my present car. As I was approaching getting my DL, my dad took me out to the mall parking lot and tried to give me a "crash" course (no pun intended) in gear shifting, and I was so awful at it, he said, "Well, guess we're going to have to get you a car with automatic". There were many more manual transmission cars in those days.  

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4 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:

I've passed through small towns in Texas where there are signs right by the city limits signs that say "No engine breaking". I'm such an automotive ignoramus, I don't know what that is. I asked my dad one time when he was still alive, and he kind of shrugged. Your thread is the only other time in my life I've heard the term. I would greatly appreciate it if you could elaborate on it. 

And yes, I've always owned automatic transmission cars. And I don't use the L, 2 or 1 settings, either, so I'm pretty ignorant about those. I would have to go look and see if they're even on my present car. As I was approaching getting my DL, my dad took me out to the mall parking lot and tried to give me a "crash" course (no pun intended) in gear shifting, and I was so awful at it, he said, "Well, guess we're going to have to get you a car with automatic". There were many more manual transmission cars in those days.  

Look up "jake brake."  It applies to trucks going downhill.  Slowing down by using the resistance of the engine saves the actual brakes.  This is an engine mode that is switched on and off as needed.  Downside?  It is LOUD.  In this video he switches it in with the little buttons on his dashboard at 3:00 as he starts going downhill.  So listen to the sound of the engine before that, and then after - as he takes his foot off the gas pedal, and you will probably recognize the sound.

 

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I'm thinking there's no longer a  'L'  gear shift on modern cars with automatic transmissions.  I could be wrong, of course, but I don't recall being in any late-model vehicles with 'Low' gear.  

With a 2-speed automatic (Ford-O-Matic) there is no 'Drive 1' or 'Drive 2' on the column shifter.  It's  'P  R  N  D  L'  .   Those are your options on a '64.   As basic as it gets.

However, FoMoCo decided to make a number of "under-the-hood" changes to the Falcon line for the 1965 model year.   Gone was the Ford-O-Matic in favor of the 3-speed Cruise-O-Matic automatic transmission.  That being the case FORD no longer 'mated' the '170' with a 3-speed; a buyer would get a 200 CID engine to go with the Cruise-O-Matic. 

I'm pretty sure the original '144' CID engine was no longer available on 1965 Falcons.  It had run its course due to it being  s-l-o-w!  In the early years of Ford Falcons the company would mate the '144' with the 2-speed if a buyer so desired, but the 'performance' (if you could call it that!) was very mild. →  Thinking of being a leadfoot in a 1960 Falcon with that engine/tranny combo?  Forget it!  Go too fast and the car will begin  ~~shaking~~!  (Fast meaning 65 mph, btw). 

My '64 ~shakes~ at 70 mph with its '170' and Ford-O-Matic so a driver can kiss off the notion of ~burning rubber~ in an early '60s Falcon with that equipment under the hood.   

Also:  For the 1965 model year FORD did away with manual chokes on Falcons and the accompanying 'manual choke knob' that went with it.  FoMoCo further ditched Generators (GEN) for Alternators (ALT). →  I can't tell you how many times over the past 3+ decades I've been asked if I wanted to switch out my 'GEN' for an 'ALT'.  I refused.  As long as there's nothing out of the ordinary course of 'Falcon Maintenance' that goes wrong with the generator I don't want anyone monkeying around with the engine 'stuff'.  Or the brakes.  That's why I've not had them retrofitted with a dual master-cylinder braking system; I've not had any issues with the brakes.  I keep them tuned up and fulla fluid and they work well enough.  

So the old lady who bought the Falcon I now own at the end of the 1964 Model Year -- put in to service on August 3, 1964 from Valley Motors in Hanover, Penna. -- apparently was not bothered about the fact the '64 model-year Falcons were to be outdated almost ♦immediately♦ by the introduction of the '65s.  Makes an already-primitive 1964 Falcon seen even MORE primitive . . .   

The '64 Falcon that resides in my carport:

Has a 'GEN'

Has a manual choke and knob

Has a '170'

Features a 2-speed Ford-O-Matic

No turn signal 'arrows' on the dashboard; the driver has to know which way to flip the turn 'stalk'. 

------------------------------------------

Buying a '65 Falcon?  Ok, here's what you get now should you desire an automatic transmission to go with your new car:

Has a '200' CID engine to go with your 3-speed Cruise-O-Matic

Features an 'ALT' at your service instead of a 'GEN'

No more manual 'choke' or choke knob

One thing I don't recall:  If '65 Falcons now featured 'Turn Signal' arrows on the dashboard?  Hmm . . . might have to try and Google a picture of a '65 Falcon dashboard to find out!

(And there's probably a couple of other mechanical things FoMoCo changed over from the '64 model year Falcons that I've since forgotten). 

So y'all can see that 1965 Falcons were considerably updated from their '64 predecessors. 

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My drive is currently a small 2022 SUV. The shifting is: P R N D with an option to knock it again to put into S. That stands for: "Sport" which changes the shift points from lagging late to annoyingly early. I can not wait until the vehicle becomes so popular that performance chips are offered. I know they can not rid the turbo lag but there is so much that could be done to make it a bit more peppy and fun to drive.

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53 minutes ago, Movie Collector OH said:

It applies to trucks going downhill. 

Thanks. I do remember my dad saying it had something to do with big rigs. Not sure why they would ever be used where the land is relatively flat, but as I say, every small town in Texas has a sign at the point of entry warning that they not be used .

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49 minutes ago, sewhite2000 said:

Thanks. I do remember my dad saying it had something to do with big rigs. Not sure why they would ever be used where the land is relatively flat, but as I say, every small town in Texas has a sign at the point of entry warning that they not be used .

To save the brakes.  That is the only reason.  Completely flat land is not as necessary for the survival of the truck and its brakes, so that is fair game for those signs, just to prevent the added noise in those flat land living communities.

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6 hours ago, sewhite2000 said:

Thanks. I do remember my dad saying it had something to do with big rigs. Not sure why they would ever be used where the land is relatively flat, but as I say, every small town in Texas has a sign at the point of entry warning that they not be used .

Speeds limits drop quickly on the secondary highways in Texas.  It's not unusual for the limits to drop from 70 to 30  quickly nowadays as you approach a town.  Most of the rural two lane roads in Texas have 65 or 70 mph limits these days.  Some are even 75 mph.

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On 11/19/2021 at 2:21 PM, ElCid said:

For years I have posted about the lack of Vietnam War movies shown on Veterans Day and Memorial Day.  I think there are over a hundred movies made relative to war.

TCM wants movies about us winning wars, not losing them. Lately we have lost two.

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1 hour ago, ElCid said:

Sick!

How is that comment by MM "sick"?    I assume it is accurate and libs here have made the same claim:   that on those holidays antiwar films or films where the US military doesn't look so "good" are just not cool to show on these holidays.

 

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On 11/30/2021 at 9:51 AM, txfilmfan said:

Speeds limits drop quickly on the secondary highways in Texas.  It's not unusual for the limits to drop from 70 to 30  quickly nowadays as you approach a town.  Most of the rural two lane roads in Texas have 65 or 70 mph limits these days.  Some are even 75 mph.

Mostly what I remember about Texas roads is that many of the freeway exit ramps aren't really "ramps" at all, but more like driveways.  And if you blink when coming to your exit, you've probably wound up passing it.

Sepiatone

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On 11/30/2021 at 2:18 AM, Movie Collector OH said:

Look up "jake brake."  It applies to trucks going downhill.  Slowing down by using the resistance of the engine saves the actual brakes.  This is an engine mode that is switched on and off as needed.  Downside?  It is LOUD.  In this video he switches it in with the little buttons on his dashboard at 3:00 as he starts going downhill.  So listen to the sound of the engine before that, and then after - as he takes his foot off the gas pedal, and you will probably recognize the sound.

 

Interesting.  Someone asked me once if the cruise control in my car (use it a lot) uses engine braking or actual brakes to slow down.  Have no idea.  But I have never detected an engine noise change either speeding up or slowing down.

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12 hours ago, ElCid said:

Interesting.  Someone asked me once if the cruise control in my car (use it a lot) uses engine braking or actual brakes to slow down.  Have no idea.  But I have never detected an engine noise change either speeding up or slowing down.

Completely different principle.  Diesel engines can't slow down a truck the way a gas engine can slow down a car in low gear, the truck would just run away.  So diesel trucks have this additional system on the engine.

I haven't noticed cruise control on passenger vehicles that applies braking or downshifting, but I don't use cruise control and haven't paid much attention in recent years either.  In the past I have only noticed it control the engine throttle, and by extension, automatic transmission shifting - but not persistent downshifting to slow down the car.

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On 12/1/2021 at 11:10 AM, Sepiatone said:

Mostly what I remember about Texas roads is that many of the freeway exit ramps aren't really "ramps" at all, but more like driveways.  And if you blink when coming to your exit, you've probably wound up passing it.

Having done virtually no driving in any other states ( I spent an evening seeing a concert at a casino in Oklahoma about four years ago. Before that ....???), I don't have any concept of what your reference means. That they're short? I have no reference point for comparison, but I'm willing to acknoweldge that could be true.  I can't recall ever missing an exit. There are plenty of highway signs to let you know how many miles you have until you reach one.

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My current drive has: "Adaptive Cruise Control". You set the speed as normal and it maintains it within +/- one mph when the road ahead is clear. There is an indicator which shows relative distance when coming up behind a vehicle. It slows to match the speed of that vehicle while maintaining a proper distance. It does this only by throttle control. It does not seem to brake while going downhill but there truly is no way to tell if there is a slight application. It has an eight-speed automatic transmission and shift points at the higher ranges are sufficiently gentle that one would have to be paying particular attention to notice a downshift.

Having a car cut close in front and slowing turns my drive into a panic room with all displays flashing bright red, brakes applied at maximum and crash sirens blaring. I believe the on-board computer also checks if your will is current and stands ready to notify your next of kin.

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3 minutes ago, SansFin said:

My current drive has: "Adaptive Cruise Control". You set the speed as normal and it maintains it within +/- one mph when the road ahead is clear. There is an indicator which shows relative distance when coming up behind a vehicle. It slows to match the speed of that vehicle while maintaining a proper distance.

Pretty sure my present automatic transmission has the same feature. I looked at my gear shift this morning after all the discussion about settings, but I've forgotten the letters that are present below D. Hope to report on this tomorrow or soon.

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1 hour ago, SansFin said:

My current drive has: "Adaptive Cruise Control". You set the speed as normal and it maintains it within +/- one mph when the road ahead is clear. There is an indicator which shows relative distance when coming up behind a vehicle. It slows to match the speed of that vehicle while maintaining a proper distance. It does this only by throttle control. It does not seem to brake while going downhill but there truly is no way to tell if there is a slight application. It has an eight-speed automatic transmission and shift points at the higher ranges are sufficiently gentle that one would have to be paying particular attention to notice a downshift.

Having a car cut close in front and slowing turns my drive into a panic room with all displays flashing bright red, brakes applied at maximum and crash sirens blaring. I believe the on-board computer also checks if your will is current and stands ready to notify your next of kin.

If you can't tell, then it's probably just normal automatic downshifting, to couple the engine speed to the vehicle speed.  But not persistent - if it was, you probably would have gone through the windshield a few times already.   https://moviecollectoroh.com/pics_to_hotlink_on_TCM/forum-twisted.gif   In other words, this sounds kind of dangerous.

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I just used to down shift on my '46 International and my '49 Chevy in addition to using my brakes for going down hills and when approaching right angle turns to slow the trucks down. Had to double clutch to do it, with those old four speed trannies. 

If you don't know what double clutching is,  read on. You are rolling down the road in say 4th gear, a steep grade is coming up, what you got to is step on the clutch to disengage the engine from the running gear, you are now just momentarily rolling down the road in neutral basically, then you rev the engine up while its disengaged, and then you step on the clutch again and put the tranny into 3rd gear, releasing the clutch and engaging the engine will now slow down.

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On 11/30/2021 at 2:18 AM, Movie Collector OH said:

Look up "jake brake."  It applies to trucks going downhill.  Slowing down by using the resistance of the engine saves the actual brakes.  This is an engine mode that is switched on and off as needed.  

I have only used the lower than "D" gears (1 & 2) on my automatic pick up when stuck in snow-very helpful to keep the tires from slipping or spinning. You get a bunch of people to sit in the truck bed to give it weight/traction, haha.

I've known about "downshifting" to save your breaks when going down steep hills, but have always been afraid to switch the gears while in motion.

Do you have to prepare for the automatic shift? Or as you're rolling down the hill, you just push the indicator arm to "1"? Or do you go to "2" first, then "1"?

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4 minutes ago, TikiSoo said:

I have only used the lower than "D" gears (1 & 2) on my automatic pick up when stuck in snow-very helpful to keep the tires from slipping or spinning. You get a bunch of people to sit in the truck bed to give it weight/traction, haha.

I've known about "downshifting" to save your breaks when going down steep hills, but have always been afraid to switch the gears while in motion.

Do you have to prepare for the automatic shift? Or as you're rolling down the hill, you just push the indicator arm to "1"? Or do you go to "2" first, then "1"?

With modern trannies where everything is synchronized you just push the lever or indicator.  Read your owners manual, with my Nissan Frontier I just shift the lever to go down steep hills.  

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Boy, the joke's really on us, isn't it?!  Here, I thought TCM was plotting to turn into the new AMC; but no, it's now Car Talk!  

Hey, this is great!  I'm thoroughly enjoying this turn in the road.  I've never been all that interested in automobiles, but in the last couple of years this retiree  has "discovered"  NASCAR, hot rods and drag racing, and the Mecum Auctions.  Right now the Mecum Auto Auction is going on in Kansas City, and my wife and I turn it on to watch and have as background.  It's really fascinating to hear all this new stuff about old cars.

You want a "Then meets Now" experience,  then tune into the auction!

 "Keep on truckin'!" as we used to say when I was in school.  This is great!  AndI'm having a ball reading all this.

Thanks, everyone. 

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