Jump to content
 
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...

Ukrainian soldiers topple statue of Anti-Nazi MARTYR - CBS news


Sukhov
 Share

Recommended Posts

Compare the mass media's reporting on Neo-Nazis inside the US with stuff like this which is just supposed to quietly be accepted because "the ends justify the means." There is a clear agenda at work to push certain narratives and hide others because the cause is viewed as overall beneficial.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ukraine is at war with Russia with some Ukrainians absorbing, according to news reports, tortures from Russian soldiers. Ukraine may very well wind up losing the war. Certainly there will be many more, perhaps thousands, of Ukrainian deaths in the future.

For a Ukrainian soldiers to, in return, pull down the statue of a Russian hero is hardly a surprise, even if she was a victim of Nazi atrocities during the war.  The soldier's reaction to the statue is undoubtedly in response to what is happening to his nation today.   I don't understand why you are so "sickened" by his action. This is the least of what can happen at a time of war.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, TomJH said:

Ukraine is at war with Russia with some Ukrainians absorbing, according to news reports, tortures from Russian soldiers. Ukraine may very well wind up losing the war. Certainly there will be many more, perhaps thousands, of Ukrainian deaths in the future.

For a Ukrainian soldiers to, in return, pull down the statue of a Russian hero is hardly a surprise, even if she was a victim of Nazi atrocities during the war.  The soldier's reaction to the statue is undoubtedly in response to what is happening to his nation today.   I don't understand why you are so "sickened" by his action. This is the least of what can happen at a time of war.

This is a good example of what I feel is downplaying it. They are humiliating an Anne Frank type woman who gave her life for THEIR freedom. Imagine Charlottesville guys toppling an Anne Frank statue and humiliating it. There is no justification for that or for many of the soldiers having Nazi tattoos and spouting racial slogans. If this kind of stuff were happening inside the US I really feel the coverage would be much different. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Sukhov said:

This is a good example of what I feel is downplaying it. They are humiliating an Anne Frank type woman who gave her life for THEIR freedom. Imagine Charlottesville guys toppling an Anne Frank statue and humiliating it. There is no justification for that or for many of the soldiers having Nazi tattoos and spouting racial slogans. If this kind of stuff were happening inside the US I really feel the coverage would be much different. 

Sure it would be different in the U.S. today. But the U.S. isn't at war.

What has that got to do with the emotions of some Ukrainians who despise their Russian invaders and are venting it upon a statue? I strongly suspect the tragic story of the girl was not on their minds so much as the on-going atrocities done to their own countrymen and women.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, TomJH said:

Sure it would be different in the U.S. today. But the U.S. isn't at war.

What has that got to do with the emotions of some Ukrainians who despise their Russian invaders and are venting it upon a statue? I strongly suspect the tragic story of the girl was not on their minds so much as the on-going atrocities done to their own countrymen and women.

They hanged and humiliated the statue in a way that was specifically supposed to reflect how she was hanged by Nazis. That’s not a silly coincidence but a specific attempt to humiliate the girl’s memory and her death at the hands of Fascists. Many of the soldiers in the Ukrainian army are outright Fascists and have the symbols tattooed on them which is really hard to justify.

https://thegrayzone.com/2022/08/31/jon-stewart-pentagon-ukrainian-nazi-disney/

I am not saying I think Zelensky is HIMSELF a Nazi or that the US is a Nazi state but I feel both are intentionally downplaying and avoiding stuff like this in their own ranks because they feel they can use the Nazis for the greater good against Putin. IF people feel that way then it is their choice but I am just saying I do not think it is okay. You can’t look at people wearing Nazi tattoos and humiliating freedom fighters and go “oh they aren’t ACTUALLY Nazis. They are just worked up at Russia.”

Link to comment
Share on other sites

51 minutes ago, hamradio said:

Zoya is Russian so the Ukrainians are targeting ANYTHING that is a symbol in their derussification campaign. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derussification_in_Ukraine

The Ukrainian anger is justifiable, so this doesn't make them Fascists just want revenge / retribution for the invasion.  You're crying over a statue?

Photo of Zoya

Zoya_Kosmodemyanskaya,_1941.png

You are actually a supporter of the proud boys and the Charlottesville protests iirc so I am not surprised you would feel this way. The funny thing is Conservatives wanted anti-CONFEDERATE statue protestors in Charlotesville and other cities dealt with force but do not give a hoot about anti-Nazi statues in other countries. Also it isn’t about the statue itself but what the men toppling it believe in just like the guys sun cross tattoo isn’t bad because it is a sun but because it symbolizes neonazis.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The two faced way so called conservatives will say “it’s only a statue” and then support beating protestors for trying to remove a Johnny Rebel statue is just saddening. It shows their true colors.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Sukhov said:

Compare the mass media's reporting on Neo-Nazis inside the US with stuff like this which is just supposed to quietly be accepted because "the ends justify the means." There is a clear agenda at work to push certain narratives and hide others because the cause is viewed as overall beneficial.

So Sukhov, if your point here was an attempt to make some sort of comment on "the mass media hiding stories such as this because of an agenda that it has", then why would you decide to post this video in support of this point on which I can clearly see is emblazened with its logo and name "CBS News" upon it?

Seems to me that this right here pretty much undercuts what you are positing here, wouldn't you say?!

OR, might it be MORE the idea that perhaps this might not have been shown being reported during the 22 remaining minutes allotted for real actual news on "The CBS Evening News" and when there aren't pharmaceutical commercials being shown interspersed throughout that same half hour?

(...AND, which would seem to ME at least to be an even BIGGER "crime" against the whole idea of "journalistic integrity" and with the idea that network news and the "mass media" presently being relegated to merely being a money making enterprise, than was and is the possible lack of reporting this incident of the destroying of this statue!)

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, hamradio said:

Zoya is Russian so the Ukrainians are targeting ANYTHING that is a symbol in their derussification campaign. 

I've heard this was going on a while with living Russians. That's one of the reasons Putin claimed he invaded that those with Russian sympathies were being tortured and killed. I wonder when all the facts are in how history will see it.Everybody seems to admit Ukraine was corrupt but the Clintons and Bidens and others were involved in Ukraine at that time.

  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have a difficult time not thinking that you are reading too much into this incident, Sukhov. For starters this statue was toppled last April. Why talk about it now? Secondly, and more importantly, toppling Soviet statues is a practise taking place in various former eastern block nations now, especially since the invasion of Ukraine.

 

War protest: Statues fall as Europe purges Soviet monuments

Russia’s war on Ukraine has given a renewed push to topple the last remaining Soviet monuments in nations that regained their sovereignty from Moscow more than three decades ago. These countries now belong to NATO and the European Union and are staunch supporters of Ukraine.

At the end of the communist era, when Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia regained their independence from the Soviet Union and Poland and its neighbors rejected Moscow-backed communism, those nations began renaming streets and purging the most hated symbols, including statues of Soviet founder Vladimir Lenin and other communist bosses. Many of these relics are now housed in museums.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-entertainment-poland-estonia-germany-7006f8a43f6e7e0707ae752538e26ef3

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Marysara1 said:

Everybody seems to admit Ukraine was corrupt but the Clintons and Bidens and others were involved in Ukraine at that time.

Can you help me understand MAGA's very subtly voiced dislike for Zelensky? To say, "Ukraine is corrupt" doesn't seem enough to me because it implies Russia is somehow pure. You must know it isn't. Since March I've sensed from MAGA an unspoken wish that Putin would just crush Ukraine so we can move on. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, LuckyDan said:

Can you help me understand MAGA's very subtly voiced dislike for Zelensky? To say, "Ukraine is corrupt" doesn't seem enough to me because it implies Russia is somehow pure. You must know it isn't. Since March I've sensed from MAGA an unspoken wish that Putin would just crush Ukraine so we can move on. 

Well, if you'd like my take on this Dan, then I've some to the conclusion that the saying, "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" plays a lot into this sort of thing.

And by this I mean that the MAGA crowd have come to hate and despise their domestic political foes SO much so that they've even come to embrace a Russian dictator over their fellow Americans while in pursuit of their goals to politically weaken them. And so, all this really has little at all to do with the idea of any relative level of corruption within and between the countries of Russia and the Ukraine.

(...and which now also calls to mind another saying which Sukhov stated in his OP and that being, "The ends justify the means")

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Dargo said:

Well, if you'd like my take on this Dan, then I've some to the conclusion that the saying, "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" plays a lot into this sort of thing.

And by this I mean that the MAGA crowd have come to hate and despise their domestic political foes SO much so that they've even come to embrace a Russian dictator over their fellow Americans while in pursuit of their goals to politically weaken them. And so, all this really has little at all to do with the idea of any relative level of corruption within and between the countries of Russia and the Ukraine.

(...and which now also calls to mind another saying which Sukhov stated in his OP and that being, "The ends justify the means")

You don't see Trump supporters criticizing Putin or Russia on these threads much, if at all, do you?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, TomJH said:

You don't see Trump supporters criticizing Putin or Russia on these threads much, if at all, do you?

They're waiting for Trump to tell them what to do and think.😀

  • Thanks 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, ElCid said:

They're waiting for Trump to tell them what to do and think.😀

Seriously, these MAGA fanatics spend so much time attacking Biden and the Democrats with glee but have no time to critique a Russian invasion of Ukraine. And their support of Ukraine is tepid, at best. Take at look, for example, at Jake's threads criticizing American money being spent to supply Ukraine with arms.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, TomJH said:

Seriously, these MAGA fanatics spend so much time attacking Biden and the Democrats with glee but have no time to critique a Russian invasion of Ukraine. And their support of Ukraine is tepid, at best. Take at look, for example, at Jake's threads criticizing American money being spent to supply Ukraine with arms.

Jake was the first person I placed on ignore many years ago.  Have no desire to read anything he says or posts.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, TomJH said:

You don't see Trump supporters criticizing Putin or Russia on these threads much, if at all, do you?

Well Tom, if the point of this comment of yours was to in effect tell me that you thought what I had stated might have been an accurate portrayal and assessment of the mindset of those who frequent this website and who somehow believe any of the nonsense that comes out of Fat Boy Donny's mouth, then OF COURSE I'm going to agree with with you here, dude!  ;) 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, ElCid said:

They're waiting for Trump to tell them what to do and think.😀

And with perhaps the saddest aspect to this being that in so many cases these people do NOT lack for the ability to think for themselves, but instead have allowed their emotions (and particularly the emotion of fear) to overide their use of such a mental tool.

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, TomJH said:

You don't see Trump supporters criticizing Putin or Russia on these threads much, if at all, do you?

This thread is about what Ukraine did. So why should this thread criticize Putin or Russia that would be whataboutism. Do we blame all Muslim's for 9/11? It's the democrats who are removing statues just like in Animal Farm (guess who the bad guys were)? Humans are imperfect. Biden himself said Ukraine wasn't ready for NATO because of corruption. Because of the laptop Biden's motives are questionable.

  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, ElCid said:

Jake was the first person I placed on ignore many years ago.  Have no desire to read anything he says or posts.  

But...but, CID! Don't you realize that by doing this, you have in effect been depriving yourself of reading the approximately 10% of all that he posts around here and where he actually hits the mark about something?!

(...you know, like when he talks Sports in that thread of his)  ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, Marysara1 said:

This thread is about what Ukraine did. So why should this thread criticize Putin or Russia that would be whataboutism. Do we blame all Muslim's for 9/11? It's the democrats who are removing statues just like in Animal Farm (guess who the bad guys were)? Humans are imperfect. Biden himself said Ukraine wasn't ready for NATO because of corruption. Because of the laptop Biden's motives are questionable.

Nope, ACTUALLY here Marysara, and as I came to realize the very minute that I first read Suhkov's OP here, this thread is NOT really about that statue, but was instead posted by him in order to press his point about how he feels the mass media has an agenda to push.

(...does not his topic heading clearly read "CBS News" at the end of it, and to say nothing about the content within the body of his OP and his next few subsequent postings?!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, Dargo said:

But...but, CID! Don't you realize that by doing this, you have in effect been depriving yourself of reading the approximately 10% of all that he posts around here and where he actually hits the mark about something?!

(...you know, like when he talks Sports in that thread of his)  ;)

Don't care about sports.  😀

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, ElCid said:

Don't care about sports.  😀

Aaah, so THAT 'splains this here then, EH?!  ;) 

Then I suppose it's probably a good thing that Jake never copies and pastes anything about "Cars" in slayton's thread about that subject then, huh.

(...'cause he might actually get somethin' right in that thread TOO on occasion, and then you'd miss seein' THAT as well, huh)

LOL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

© 2022 Turner Classic Movies Inc. All Rights Reserved Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Cookie Settings
×
×
  • Create New...