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Moguls and Movie Stars debunking John Wayne


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One poster mentioned that Errol Flynn and Humphrey Bogart made numerous WWII films--just in case anybody wonders why they weren't in the real war: Flynn, despite his fit appearance, had numerous health problems--probably caused by his drinking and drugging--that disqualified him from service. Bogart had joined the Navy during the previous World War--born in 1899, he was about a decade older than Wayne or Flynn--but he didn't see service until after the Armistice was signed. He did, however, volunteer with the Coast Guard Auxiliary in WWII, patrolling the California coast once a week--reasonably easy duty, and it gave him an opportunity for clandestine meetings with then-lover Lauren Bacall, but it was a patriotic chore just the same; there was a real fear that California would be invaded.

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John Wayne is not one of my favorite actors but he made some of my favorite movies: *Hatari* (1962), *Blood Alley* (1955) and *Hellfighters* (1968).

 

When I was growing up he was deemed to be very much the face of America and so the government did much to discredit him and his movies. I do not remember it ever being said that he was coward in real life or that he refused to perform military service. Those would have been very powerful accusations and would have affected many people's view of him.

 

Because the government did not make such statements against him makes me believe very strongly that there were no facts to support them.

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As hard as it is to believe, maybe the Hollywood flacks did their agitprop better

than their counterparts in the Soviet bloc, at least in this case.

 

I wonder if Bogie brought along a bottle too. That way he could use his Johnnie Walker

"scope" while watching the submarine races with Betty. Actually, this might make an

interesting little movie.

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Since I dislike John Wayne, I am eminently qualified to render an opinion on which are his best films... ;)

 

They are:

 

*The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance*

*Red River*

*The Searchers*

*Legend of the Lost*

*Reap the Wild Wind*

*The Big Trail*

 

:)

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The information that John Wayne was never in a real war is about as revelatory as the fact that Harry Cohn was (shudder!) not Mr. Congeniality.

 

I have to admit that I have something of a larger issue with the moguls and moviestars doc which is:

 

_IT HAS NOTHING NEW TO SAY PERIOD._

 

and sadly, it seems, very few people left to say much at all. I've not seen all of every episode, but what I have watched seems to be a lukewarm rehash of old, old, old info which us Classic Film freaks so already know: OIivia DeHavilland's lawsuit with WB, Cary Grant's insecurity, the whole damn Joan Crawford re-invention in Mildred Pierce thing and Jack Warner's usurping Hal Wallis' Oscar for Casablanca Yawn. We know. Give us something new.

 

All this plus the tired Chuck-and-Dottie-Workman-like snippets of films played out of sequence to maudlin music and sepia-tinted footage...I just wondered why they bothered.

 

There. I said it.

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> {quote:title=JonnyGeetar wrote:}{quote}

> _IT HAS NOTHING NEW TO SAY PERIOD._

> There. I said it.

 

And I'm glad you did. I pretty much know what they're going to show, or Chistopher Plummer is going to say before it's shown or said. There's not been an episode, yet, that hasn't literally put me to sleep.

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The people on these boards probably represent the top 2%, in terms of knowledge of film history, of all potential viewers. The series is directed at those with an interest in learning more about film history, but somewhat less knowledge than the people on these boards.

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> {quote:title=finance wrote:}{quote}

> The people on these boards probably represent the top 2%, in terms of knowledge of film history, of all potential viewers. The series is directed at those with an interest in learning more about film history, but somewhat less knowledge than the people on these boards.

 

 

I don't know that I'd give all of us posting that much credit...But thanks.

 

I still gots to beef that everything in the MAMS doc has been said before, in many cases numerous times, in many other documentaries...Which makes me wish that TCM would work some of said docs into their schedule as opposed to spending good money to produce a rather superfluous and bloated rehash...

 

Or maybe they could use the dough to show something other than the 120 titles they seem to put into heavy rotation 24-7.

 

Oh look: The Devil and Miss Jones is on..,.again.

 

ps- I like The Devil and Miss Jones

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To try and be clear on the issue of Clark Gable?s wartime service, it turned out to be more of a publicity ploy; at least on the part of MGM. Clark did want to serve, despite his being considered too old, but was obviously given special consideration. His induction ceremony was staged before the newsreel cameras and created a bit of a sensation wherever the film was shown! By the time Clark made it to the European theater of war, he had little, if any, active service in the Air Force, becoming more a symbolic, heroic figure to the allied forces. Everywhere Clark went, in uniform throughout the war, he became one of the biggest of all PR items for the U.S. war effort. Most of the stars that went into military service appeared in training films and toured the various bases in the U.S. and abroad, uplifting the spirit of the troops.

 

As far as Duke Wayne is concern, his background to this time in history has always been a bit murky. The information that has been available over what has now become something of a controversy has been contradicted time and time again. What we do know is that he was granted a technical deferral for a period of time, until a situation erupted questioning the validity of his suspension from military service. Somehow, there was little in the way of any publicity over this event that didn?t seem to affect Wayne?s career or standing in Hollywood. There was at the time, simply too many other distractions that in a sense protected Wayne?s movie star status. He was simply able to continue on working with little fuss over why he hadn?t enrolled or sought some sort of active war service.

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Well my wife really enjoyed the series and she learned a lot. So while I'm part of that so called 2% and was aware of most of the events in the series (especially the later years), it was useful for her to get knowledge. After she saw it I point to the 40 or so books I have on movies and actors and said 'well if your more interested,,,'.

 

So the bottom line was we now have more in common. That typically is a good thing (ha ha).

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*I have to admit that I have something of a larger issue with the moguls and moviestars doc which is:*

 

*_IT HAS NOTHING NEW TO SAY PERIOD._*

Afraid I'm in agreement on that. In fact a few minutes after the end of the first episode a friend (and fellow writer on movies) rang me up from North Carolina and just about the first thing he said was, "Did they say _anything_ new?" Now, there's nothing wrong with a FILM HISTORY 101 approach but for the sake of those of us who know quite a bit about older films (and I dare say that is a goodly portion of the TCM audience), it would have been nice if some more obscure facts or personalities had been touched on.

Or else they could have just acquired the rights to rerun HOLLYWOOD AND THE STARS...

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