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Movies that are not "CLASSIC"


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Since the word "classic" is such a dirty word that gives rise to so many varied opinions why dosen't TCM just remove it? TURNER'S MOVIES is more descriptive of what the channel airs. It encompasses everything and anything, from great to toilet bowl, of any era, which is what TCM currently airs anyway. But, without that annoying word "classic", there is no longer any argument.

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You should check this out.

 

It is from a new thread created by longtime poster filmlover today, February 11th on this very topic:

 

TCM's official definition of "classic"

Posted: Feb 11, 2011 8:14 AM

 

With all this bellowing from the hilltops from a few here once again about what is classic and what does not belong on TCM, it got me searching for TCM's official definition. It was something I knew I posted here back in 2006. When someone argued here in the last day or so that TCM should remove the word "Classic" from their name, I knew it was time to reprint it.

 

This comes directly from a TCM brand notebook of that time:

 

WHAT'S CLASSIC?

Is it old?

Can it be new?

Often, a classic is the best of its kind.

Sometimes, it's the worst.

Either way, it stands out.

A classic always stands out.

Classic can mean different things to different people.

Your parents idea of classic is probably different than yours.

Your kids idea of classic is probably different, too.

Everybody has a classic.

Sometimes classic means the original,

Or the best-known,

Or the first of its kind.

Sometimes it means one of a kind.

You could argue that classic is extreme:

The saddest of the sad,

The bravest of the brave,

The gosh-darn charmingest of the charming.

Of all the things classic is, the one thing it's not is one thing.

Classic is too big to be pinned down, too universal to be selfish.

Classic belongs to everybody.

Everybody has a classic.

Is it old? Yes.

Can it be new? Yes.

So, what's classic?

Turner Classic Movies.

THAT'S CLASSIC.

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> {quote:title=fxreyman wrote:}{quote}

> You should check this out.

>

> It is from a new thread created by longtime poster filmlover today, February 11th on this very topic:

>

> TCM's official definition of "classic"

> Posted: Feb 11, 2011 8:14 AM

>

> With all this bellowing from the hilltops from a few here once again about what is classic and what does not belong on TCM, it got me searching for TCM's official definition. It was something I knew I posted here back in 2006. When someone argued here in the last day or so that TCM should remove the word "Classic" from their name, I knew it was time to reprint it.

>

> This comes directly from a TCM brand notebook of that time:

>

> WHAT'S CLASSIC?

> Is it old?

> Can it be new?

> Often, a classic is the best of its kind.

> Sometimes, it's the worst.

> Either way, it stands out.

> A classic always stands out.

> Classic can mean different things to different people.

> Your parents idea of classic is probably different than yours.

> Your kids idea of classic is probably different, too.

> Everybody has a classic.

> Sometimes classic means the original,

> Or the best-known,

> Or the first of its kind.

> Sometimes it means one of a kind.

> You could argue that classic is extreme:

> The saddest of the sad,

> The bravest of the brave,

> The gosh-darn charmingest of the charming.

> Of all the things classic is, the one thing it's not is one thing.

> Classic is too big to be pinned down, too universal to be selfish.

> Classic belongs to everybody.

> Everybody has a classic.

> Is it old? Yes.

> Can it be new? Yes.

> So, what's classic?

> Turner Classic Movies.

> THAT'S CLASSIC.

 

 

 

 

I prefer the traditional definition of the word CLASSIC. The following is from the MERRIAM-WEBSTER

ONLINE DICTIONARY

 

Definition of CLASSIC

1

a : serving as a standard of excellence : of recognized value b : traditional, enduring c : characterized by simple tailored lines in fashion year after year

2

: of or relating to the ancient Greeks and Romans or their culture : classical

3

a : historically memorable b : noted because of special literary or historical associations

4

a : authentic, authoritative b : typical

5

capitalized : of or relating to the period of highest development of Mesoamerican and especially Mayan culture about a.d. 300?900

See classic defined for English-language learners ?

 

CLASSIC may mean different things to different people, but CLASSIC in terms of ART - films, books, plays, etc. means ONE thing - A STANDARD OF EXCELLENCE, TRADITIONAL, ENDURING.

 

tcm can define the word any way they can in order to justify their lineup of films, but that does not alter the fact that they are wrong.

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> {quote:title=infinite1 wrote:}{quote}

> tcm can define the word any way they can in order to justify their lineup of films, but that does not alter the fact that they are wrong.

 

This seems to be a common thread going on around here these days. Either TCM is wrong, or Robert Osborne doesn't know what he is doing, or we should replace Ben M. or that TCM shows way too many movies made after 1960 or We should be able to celebrate Black History Month in February or........ and the list goes on and on.

 

What is it with you people anyway?

 

Everytime I turn around there is another post from someone who thinks everything TCM does is wrong or misguided. Grow up and get a life people!

 

TCM is not going to change. Especially by berating them every chance you get.

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> {quote:title=Engelman wrote:}{quote}

> I really do not like the direction I see TCM going. Let me say that I have been a TCM fan for years. I love movies from the 30's,40's, and 50's. I love 'film noir", action adventure, drama,comedy,war, detective,and, in general, most movies from the time periods mentioned. I DO NOT want to see movies from the 70's,80's. and 90's. These are NOT CLASSIC movies. Aside from the fact that they haven't earned it yet, they can also be seen on dozens of other channels. The movies from the early years can only be seen on TCM. More and more of these "garbage" movies are appearing in the TCM line-up. There hasn't been a "BOGIE", or Mitchum, or Charlie Chan, etc.,etc., movie in quite a while...

 

You are quite correct.

 

I?ve been with Turner?s old-movie channels since 1976, when WTBS first went on cable and showed a lot of old classic movies via cable. Then I watched TNT when it showed old classic movies, and I?ve been with TCM since it started in 1994. I?ve been paying extra for it on my cable and satellite bill for the past 16 years.

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You must not check the schedule often. there have been recent Mitchum films shown on TCM. And tonight we have several Bogie films on. Before you go off spouting about how bad it is on here you might to check, the next two months more than 80% of the films being shown were made before 1960.

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> {quote:title=fxreyman wrote:}{quote}

> > {quote:title=infinite1 wrote:}{quote}

> > tcm can define the word any way they can in order to justify their lineup of films, but that does not alter the fact that they are wrong.

>

> This seems to be a common thread going on around here these days. Either TCM is wrong, or Robert Osborne doesn't know what he is doing, or we should replace Ben M. or that TCM shows way too many movies made after 1960 or We should be able to celebrate Black History Month in February or........ and the list goes on and on.

>

> What is it with you people anyway?

>

> Everytime I turn around there is another post from someone who thinks everything TCM does is wrong or misguided. Grow up and get a life people!

>

> TCM is not going to change. Especially by berating them every chance you get.

 

Unfortunately for you and others we are not living in a Utopian society where everyone blindly agrees with the majority. There are always going to be differences of opinion and people who are not afraid to express them. Maybe it's you that needs to do the growing up.

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*"Unfortunately for you and others we are not living in a Utopian society where everyone blindly agrees with the majority. There are always going to be differences of opinion and people who are not afraid to express them."* - infinite1

 

Few here, if any, are Pollyannas. But we do choose not to be cynical or hold a dystopian view about the state of TCM. The channel is what it is and we enjoy it on those terms. (Or _their_ terms and how they choose to define them.)

 

Kyle In Hollywood

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Ridiculous complaint....TCM really doesn't show THAT many post-70's (or 80's for that matter) movies, so what's the problem? As others have said: People back in the era of the 30's and 40's likely wouldn't have considered movies then to be "classic.

 

Zip it and come back in 20 or 30 years or so and a lot of those movies you griped about WILL be classics from an age standpoint.

 

Sheesh! :-(

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> {quote:title=hlywdkjk wrote:}{quote}

> *"Unfortunately for you and others we are not living in a Utopian society where everyone blindly agrees with the majority. There are always going to be differences of opinion and people who are not afraid to express them."* - infinite1

>

> Few here, if any, are Pollyannas. But we do choose not to be cynical or hold a dystopian view about the state of TCM. The channel is what it is and we enjoy it on those terms. (Or _their_ terms and how they choose to define them.)

>

> Kyle In Hollywood

 

Allright, from that standpoint I agree with you. You sound, at least to me, like you realize that TCM is not perfect, but you choose to accept and enjoy it as it is, on their terms. I also enjoy it, but feel that it should be on our terms. I hope it can be better then it is. Is that so terrible?

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> {quote:title=infinite1 wrote:}{quote}

> Allright, from that standpoint I agree with you. You sound, at least to me, like you realize that TCM is not perfect, but you choose to accept and enjoy it as it is, on their terms. I also enjoy it, but feel that it should be on our terms. I hope it can be better then it is. Is that so terrible?

 

Sigh, but what is "on our terms"? Your "our terms" may be to show only films prior to 1950. Gagman's "our terms" may be to show only silent movies. Johnbabe's "our terms" may be to show only Garbo films. My terms may be to show films from all eras. So how can it be "on our terms"?

 

Some "our terms" people here may feel, "No, TCM shouldn't show anything that is on DVD".

 

Others may say (and DO say), "TCM must only play this kind of movie and you should pack up and go somewhere else if you want films from the last 40 years, too".

 

Why can't we all just enjoy what we have? I mean, do you (a general "you" to encompass all) sit in front of the TV screen 24 hours a day? Are you so slavish to a way of thinking of what only YOU want that even if you don't have the TV on, it must be playing only your films just in case always you switch it on for 20 seconds and then off again? l

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> {quote:title=FredCDobbs wrote:}{quote}

>I've been paying extra for it on my cable and satellite bill for the past 16 years.

 

Fred, for all our sakes, will you please SHUT UP about your cable bill, your satellite bill, your DVD recorder bill, etc. You bring this up about every day. You act like you are the only person out here who has to pay these!

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*Good point, Filmlover.... 'nuff said again.* :-)

 

*Just because we pay for cable service with TCM (or some people actually pay for the addition of TCM on their service) does not make TCM their channel. People in the U.K. actually pay licensing fees for their televisions (or some kind of tv tax, I think). Paying for cable (or tv) really comes down to the same thing as if you rent a movie, pay for a ticket at a movie theater, or buy a DVD...I see it as the same thing. It does not imply anyone's ownership of said movie or station....you're paying/buying for the privilege of viewing it. Nothing more.*

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Thanks.

 

I keep wondering about those who say, "We only want films from this era," - let's say, 1930-1950 - and let's say they get their way and that is all TCM runs. Now, these same people start watching that era's film but they find a female star they don't like. How far removed is it from dictating what era TCM must play to saying, "TCM, we don't want you to play any more of her films."? "By the way, just so you know who is in charge, have Robert Osborne stand on one foot while introducing the movies. Oh, and don't forget to send me over a list of films in the morning you are thinking about running next month so I can look them over and cross off the ones to skip."

 

TCM's "Suggest A Movie" (which is just that, suggesting a movie...TCM can decide if it is able to play it) is not good enough for a few here. When they don't hear from TCM or get the movie aired, these few change it to "Demand A Movie", and watch out if TCM doesn't bow under their pressure because they will light up the message board with their discontent.

 

In all my life, I have never seen any other network where the public thinks it can dictate the programs the network can run.

 

Actually, there is one thought that does make me smile about these unified few --- if they ever got enough money to go off and start their own classic movie network, as soon as it came to programming the films, they would start in fighting and each one of them would break away to start his or her own individual channel. Or else be back here demanding TCM play their movies. (LOL, maybe some of them have gone that circular route, already.)

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> {quote:title=filmlover wrote:}{quote}

> In all my life, I have never seen any other network where the public thinks it can dictate the programs the network can run.

 

All the commercial channels are like that.

 

Their managers in New York try to show films of the kind the audience will like. They pay for Nielsen Surveys to find out what the public likes and wants. They even put special boxes on the TV sets of some viewers to see what they view the most.

 

So it is the public that tells all the networks what to air.

 

If a network manager wants to show some special film that is of interest only to the manager, but not to the public, then he must be prepared to take a big financial loss for that showing.

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Hear, hear, filmlover! Well said, and just what I think about this whole brouhaha over TCM's programming. A tempest in a teacup, it seems to me, over the practically infinitesimal amount of movies from the past few decades that make it onto TCM's lineup.

 

I have only been coming to these boards for a short while and have posted just a few times, but have read threads like this in amazement and bewilderment at the stiffnecked hostility of those who are so set in their own way of thinking of how TCM should be run and what should and should not be on the channel. There are times that what airs is not particulary to my liking, but I am aware that someone, somewhere is enjoying it and that's as it should be. Something for everybody to enjoy, more often times than not.

 

I've also been with Turner from the very beginning, from back in the '70's when WTBS and WGN were my best sources for old movies, and then onto TNT and finally TCM, and I'm just happy that TCM even exists as a place to watch commercial-free movies without having to pay for it as an exclusive premium channel.

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>>Their managers in New York try to show films of the kind the audience will like. They pay for Nielsen Surveys to find out what the public likes and wants. They even put special boxes on the TV sets of some viewers to see what they view the most.

 

I worked with the results of those numbers, and other forms of quantitative and qualitative data for 30 years. All that research and the failure rate for new shows never changes. Maybe because they are less concerned with what the public wants than what they can sell to the advertisers.

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> {quote:title=filmlover wrote:}{quote}

> In all my life, I have never seen any other network where the public thinks it can dictate the programs the network can run.

 

Doesn't the TCM website have a "Suggest a Movie" section?

 

 

suggest_hdr1.jpg

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Man, this 1969 "Mr. Chips" movie is awful. The lady is unattractive. And they stop the movie every few minutes to sing! Peter O'Toole looks and sounds like Lawrence of Arabia. Is this film supposed to take place after he got out of the Army and went back to England?

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> {quote:title=filmlover wrote:}{quote}

> > {quote:title=infinite1 wrote:}{quote}

> > Allright, from that standpoint I agree with you. You sound, at least to me, like you realize that TCM is not perfect, but you choose to accept and enjoy it as it is, on their terms. I also enjoy it, but feel that it should be on our terms. I hope it can be better then it is. Is that so terrible?

>

> Sigh, but what is "on our terms"? Your "our terms" may be to show only films prior to 1950. Gagman's "our terms" may be to show only silent movies. Johnbabe's "our terms" may be to show only Garbo films. My terms may be to show films from all eras. So how can it be "on our terms"?

>

> Some "our terms" people here may feel, "No, TCM shouldn't show anything that is on DVD".

>

> Others may say (and DO say), "TCM must only play this kind of movie and you should pack up and go somewhere else if you want films from the last 40 years, too".

>

> Why can't we all just enjoy what we have? I mean, do you (a general "you" to encompass all) sit in front of the TV screen 24 hours a day? Are you so slavish to a way of thinking of what only YOU want that even if you don't have the TV on, it must be playing only your films just in case always you switch it on for 20 seconds and then off again? l

 

Actually, for me it was only films prior to 1960. But, I'm willing to compromise by allowing films from the 1960s and 1970s. But, all I'm really asking for is less repeats during the year and less modern films that ARE shown on other channels. I have yet to read comments from anyone who loves modern films agreeing that those films from the 80s, 90s, and beyond are available on channels other then TCM. I, and others, don't understand why you must have them on TCM. Are they somehow less CLASSIC to you if they are not associated with the TCM BRAND? Do you only get TCM?

 

As for the repeats, why is it necessary to show Whatever Happened to Baby Jane three months in a row? Why must films shown during 31 DAYS OF OSCAR be included in THE ESSENTIALS or SUMMER UNDER THE STARS? Why repeat films featuring Thelma Todd in the Hal Roach tribute that were recently shown during SUMMER UNDER THE STARS, most on her own day. Maybe the "inventive" ways that TCM comes up with to recycle the same films month after month fascinates you, but I am not Mr. Spock. Everything doesn't fascinate me. It takes a lot more then a bogus idea to show TO KILL A MOCKINGBIRD for the upteenth time to do the trick.

 

Yes, I get that we are getting TCM on their terms. And I suppose we have to accept it until something better comes along. But, that dosen't mean that we, who don't like it, can't complain about it. You folks that don't care one way or another can either read our complaints or ignore them, but we ain't going away. Frankly it's fascinating to me how you (a general "you" to encompass all that feel this way) can stomach so many repeats on TCM, but whine about repeat complaints on this message board. Funny how we all find something to whine about. I guess that's the one thing we all have in common.

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