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Bogart Vs. Cagney Vs. Robinson


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Rich Little, I believe is from Ottowa, Canada's Capital.

I saw him perform once. There are many Stars from Canada, especially Stars from back in the day, like James Mason, Raymond Burr and even America's Sweetheart, Mary Pickford was from Toronto !

 

My fave, even though he wasn't exactly a star, was Peter Jennings.

He was so Handsome ! :)

 

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Hello, jimred; nice to see a new poster here. Hope you stick around.

 

You recently wrote this comment:

 

"...Thanks for posting that article mrroberts. Anyway, Canada looks beautiful! Twinkeee it must be beautiful where you live also. "

 

That was a friendly and pleasant post, and it's always nice to hear when Americans or other non-Canadians say positive things about Canada.

However, just to clarify...there is a bit of a stereotype about Canada that it's all pristine rivers and spectacular wilderness scenery.

It would be nice if my country was as "unspoiled" and beautiful as many seem to think it is, but the fact is, unfortunately, that there are many ugly places in Canada.

My hometown, Toronto, has undergone a kind of epidemic of development over the past 10 years or so, mostly very ugly and cheaply built condominiums and high rise buildings.

Our once lovely harbourfront (Toronto's on Lake Ontario) is now barely visible from its southernmost streets. The shoreline is obscured by a rash of hideous new buildings, mostly expensive condos (yup, there are expensive ones and there are cheap ones, but they're all ugly, in my opinion.) Plus, the city authorities seem to have no sense of history, and have allowed many many old buildings, some of historical significance, to be destroyed or altered beyond recognition.

 

Ok, sorry, that was quite a rant. And how off-topic have I been here? I can't really connect my rant in any way to Humphrey Bogart, James Cagney, or Edward G. Robinson !

 

I guess I just wanted to dispel a stereotype many people have of Canada, that it's this huge expanse of breath-takingly lovely pure scenery. Although it would be nice if that were the case, unfortunately, it is not.

Mind you, there are many beautiful places in Canada. A mix of good and bad, like most countries, I guess.

 

Sorry for the tangent.

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misswonderly, Thanks for the welcome! My hometown of Brooklyn and where I live now Staten Island is going through the same thing your hometown is going through. Little by little they are taking away all the beauty. I don't like seeing so many condominiums around. It's too congested now. I would love to move one day. I don't know where, maybe Florida. Miss, you are not that off topic. Cagney was always trying to save the environment. He hated the paving of so many tar roads. He loved nature and living on a farm. Anyway, I guess every place has there ugly sections but little by little the beauty is being taken away in a lot of places. Also, there is a stereotype about New York that there is no beauty and no nice people which is far from the truth.

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Couple of interesting points about *Captains Of The Clouds* ; The Canadian government pushed Hollywood for a movie to help inspire the public (Canada's) for the war effort , and remember in 1941 the U.S. was still supposed to be a "neutral " country. Of course by the end of the year that changed, and the movie was just about to be released (good timing, eh?) Cagney initially balked at doing the film (playing that same old "Cagney" type of character). The location filming in and around North Bay, Ontario was very remote in those days, apparently you had to fly in and out, no decent roads (not the case today but its still a long drive). The film did very good box office even in the U.S.

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Misswonderly, don't sell your country short. I spent some time exploring Toronto, Hamilton, and other cities and while they have their issues they pale in comparison to a typical American city that has a lot of run down areas, abandoned building and industrial sites, etc. I think the biggest concern for the Canadian public has to be the remote wilderness areas that are being ravaged for the natural resources (oil, mining, timber, etc) , very little government management there. I believe a lot of the area near North Bay was and still is very big mining country. On a positive note, lets not forget the great musical talent that has come out of Canada.

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Thanks for the Captains of the Clouds tidbits, mrroberts, as well as that link you provided earlier on the making of the film.

 

Cagney had the following anecdote about the making of the film:

 

"One day we had just finished a scene - Alan Hale, Dennis Morgan and I - in which we had to bring in a plane, jump out of a cockpit onto the tarmac, then sprint fifty or sixty feet to get out of camera range. And this we did all day. The first take, the plane wasn't where it should have been; the second take, we weren't where we should have been, and so on down the line. Nothing right, just one miss after another. We wore out three sets of cadets, and all they had to do was walk between us and the camera as the plane taxied in. When we left the set at day's end, the three of us were bone tired.

 

We went to the hotel, showered and sat around in the room talking and trying to relax. There was a knock and I opened the door to find a young fellow who asked if Alan was there. Thinking he knew Alan I invited him in, and Alan and Denny assumed that the fella knew me. As it turned out, nobody knew who the hell he was. But he made himself at home immediately, grinning from ear to ear, at his ease. Finally this genial character turned to Denny and me and said, 'Now tell me, is there any work to do at all, or is it all play?'

 

Here we were, hardly a leg under us from this day of jumping in and out of planes onto the tarmac, weary all the way through - and we get a query like this. I looked at the fellas, they looked at me. Then Alan Hale, who was a big, pleasant, wonderful guy, looked at the stranger and said to him, 'Get out of here, you stupid son-of-a-****,' and threw him out."

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Hey, to get back to the thread subject matter here (enough of this Canada stuff, eh ;) ) my favorite Edward G Robinson film *The Sea Wolf* is scheduled on Sept 14th, 8am, est. Sometime ago there was talk about this film being completely restored (maybe some deleted footage being put back in?) and a DVD being put out. I hope that's in the not to distant future. This is definitely one of Eddie's very best films (and that's saying a lot considering he's almost always giving a home run performance), plus there's a great supporting cast here as well.

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Sorry to pull it back to talk of Canada again for second Mr,R, but I wanna say your Gordon Lightfoot pick there was an excellent one, and of course much more apropos than the Tim Hicks one I posted in jest.

 

And just one more note here about Mr. Lightfoot., One of my favorites of his was always "Carefree Highway", which was reporting inspired by his once traveling along the Carefree Highway located not far from me here in Arizona.

 

(...okay, and now back to Bogie, Jimmy and Eddie without further adieu)

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mrroberts, I've seen some loose talk of a restored Sea Wolf going back a few years ago. To the best of my knowledge, however, it's still just that - talk.

 

I believe that when The Sea Wolf was reissued in 1947 it was cut back from the original length of 97 minutes or so to the 86 or 87 minute version that has, I believe, always been on television.

 

Warners came across a 16 mm version with the missing footage from the personal print owned by John Garfield, and that was a few years ago. If they can't find a 32 mm version of the same footage, quite frankly, I just wish they would release a version with the 16 mm stuff. Lesser quality is better than none.

 

Sea Wolf is probably my favourite Eddie Robinson film and performance.

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Yes, I'm new here. Always been a classic movie fan. My name is Jim and I have red hair.When i was a young boy in Brooklyn they nicknamed me Red not to mix me up with the other Jim in our group. I guess I have those 2 things in common with James Cagney, the name and the hair. Cagney is one of my many favorites.

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Welcome to the boards, Jim. Not only do you have the name and hair colour in common with Cagney but also your NYC backdrop, of course.

 

And when Captains of the Clouds comes on TCM this week you'll have a chance to see that Cagney red hair in Technicolor for the first time in the actor's career.

 

Here's a link to a 2003 article about what happened to the Norseman plane used by "bush pilot" Cagney in that film:

 

http://www.pastforward.ca/perspectives/sept_052003.htm

 

Captains_of_the_Clouds-_.jpg

 

Gotta admit, Jimmy looks more like a brunette in this shot than a red head.

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< Gotta admit, Jimmy looks more like a brunette in this shot than a red head. >

 

Could be the lighting or the quality of the film !

I'm sure we will get a good look of his red hair in CAPTAINS OF THE CLOUDS this Wednesday! :)

 

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I think we've had a sufficient amount of side tracking on this thread about Canada. I know that it's easy to get caught up in this kind of thing but I would appreciate it if future comments by any posters would be in regard to the three actors for which the thread was originally created.

 

Thanks for understanding and your cooperation.

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You have to remember Tom, the reason Canada came up in the First place is because of Cagney's upcoming movie CAPTAINS OF THE CLOUDS was Filmed in CANADA and therefor the connection. It would also not be the first time a thread gets somewhat sidetracked as it happens more often then not,.. true?

Thanks

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Yes, twinkeee, I'm aware of the Canadian connection to a fun Cagney film and, no, it most certainly would not be the first or second or thousandth thread to get sidetracked in that manner.

 

That's why I decided to say something before a good thread devoted to three great actors got sidetracked any more.

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To get back to the comparison of these 3 mugs, I mean 3 great actors. Robinson had the most experience as a stage actor and that served him very well in playing characters in certain films. I'm thinking of his roles in films like *Double Indemnity* , *All My Sons* , *Five Star Final* , etc. I don't think Cagney or ,maybe Bogart, could have done those parts as well as Eddie G. Most if not all of the scenes in those films were like scenes from a play. Eddie could really make the most of those moments where his character would go into a little sermon . His ending in the film *Two Seconds* , that's incredible stuff. His talking about "types of suicide" in *Double Indemnity* , His exchanges with Bogie and Lionel Barrymore in *Key Largo* , etc --- PS, I put the "maybe Bogart" in because I know he also had quite a bit of stage experience early in his career

 

Edited by: mrroberts on Sep 1, 2013 7:26 PM

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Well anyone that claims to be an actor should be able to play the parts you mention (well according to Sir Laurence, ha ha) , but your post got be thinking about which actor was best able to drop their screen persona and take on a character that was a lot different than their persona.

 

Out of the 3 I would say Robinson had the least screen persona, especially after the 30s. (or to put it another way he was able to drop whatever persona he had and play very different characters in movie after movie).

 

Bogie didn't do that much until the last 40 and especially his post WB years.

 

Cagney; To me he had the strongest screen persona but in some ways that was also a handicap. So I don?t see Cagney playing roles like E.G. in All My Sons or Bogie in African Queen or In A Lonely Place.

 

Even in his non gangster roles like Biff in The Strawberry Blonde Cagney is still a ?take no guff from anyone? type of tough guy.

 

Of course maybe audience expectations are also a driving factor. Audiences had no problem accepting Robinson as a meek man in noir films like Scarlett Street, but Bogie or Cagney in that role would be way too out of place and viewed as miscasting (even if they pulled it off acting wise).

 

Cagney went back to WB and White Heat because audiences didn?t love the post WB, independent Cagney much.

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