Jump to content
 
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...

Mourning the death of TCM as we know it...


NylonLisa
 Share

Recommended Posts

Why is TCM broadcasting this 1963 Burt Lancaster film in Italian? His voice is obviously dubbed by some man who doesn't sound at all like Burt.

 

I don't speak Italian so I can't understand what he is saying. Lancaster looks like an idiot with that strange Italian voice over his own voice.

 

Is this some kind of joke? Copolla wasn't stupid enough to release THE GODFATHER to American audiences in the Italian language.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay, I guess I need to respond to a couple of posters here. Fred, TCM is showing this movie in Italian, because it's an Italian movie, and TCM is, I think, generally committed to being true to presenting a film as close as possible to how it was originally intended to appear. Thus, foreign language films on TCM are almost always presented in their original language, at least almost all the ones I've ever seen. Gonna try to read some more about this film on imdb or somewhere before I go to bed. I have to assume if Burt was cast, he knew how to speak Italian. But maybe his accent was considered too confusing for Italian audiences to understand. Yes, it's clearly not his voice, and that's unfortunate, but you seem to be under the impression that this was an English-language movie with a bad Italian overdub. It wasn't.

 

NylonLisa, Field of Dreams is being presented as part of a month-long salute to the career of Burt Lancaster. It was his final appearance in an American film and, as such, is worthy of inclusion. It was a Best Picture nominee, and it's two dozen years old, which, for younger viewers, puts it in the realm of "classic film". It's not like it was in theaters last weekend.

 

I wasn't aware of Muppets Take Manhattan being aired. I assume it's part of TCM, Jr. programming. I would prefer TCM show the original Muppet Movie, which is absolutely terrific and features cameos from a number of stars from the classic movie era. But Muppets Take Manhattan is nothing to sneeze at. It's from about the same year as Field of Dreams, I think, so it is also a quarter-century-or-so old movie. And I guarantee you the dialogue in it is a thousand times more intelligent and wittier than 99% of the crap that's marketed to kids today.

 

I'm sure you think you're saying something new and important, but believe me, you are roughly the 11 billionth poster dating back to the first day of the existence of this message board to whine that TCM is different than it used to be. I wish we could all just accept the channel is trying to be adaptable and dynamic and maybe stay fresh while not alienating its longtime viewers, either. If you don't like one movie that they show, can't you do something else for two hours of your life?

 

Frankly, I love the idea of an all-encompassing channel that can celebrate both the Muppets Take Manhattan and whatever movie you think TCM should be airing. I wish more people on this board were not so whiny and close-minded.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay, here's what I'm reading on imdb. According to a commentary track by Peter Cowie that appears on the Criterion Collection DVD, Lancaster was allowed to speak his lines in English. All the scenes without Lancaster in them were filmed in Italian and dubbed for the American release. So, if you watch the American release version, you do hear Lancaster's voice but not the actual voice of virtually anyone else in the film.

 

Since the movie was filmed in Italy with an Italian director and crew and mostly Italian cast (even if Zanuck was financing it), I think TCM feels the Italian version is the "original" one and the American version an alteration of the original. So, they showed the Italian version.

 

Also, as RO stated, the version released in America was dramatically cut. It may be that a full-length version in English doesn't exist.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

> Why is TCM broadcasting this 1963 Burt Lancaster film in Italian? His voice is obviously dubbed by some man who doesn't sound at all like Burt.

 

 

 

 

 

It's pretty obvious. It's an Italian film being shown in its original Italian version and since Burt apparently didn't speak the language they had to dub him with an Italian actor.

 

It makes a lot more sense than when they released it in an English-dubbed version, in this country. Instead of having Burt re-dub it with his own voice the producers used still another actor that didn't sound like him either..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

sewhite2000, of course the Italian version of The Leopard is the original one. It's the Italian version that won the Palme D'Or, it's the Italian version that's considered one of the greatest movies ever made, while the English version is shorter, oddly cropped, awkwardly dubbed and with washed out cinematography.

 

It's odd that one of the greatest performances ever made, by one of the greatest of American actors, is actually dubbed with another person's voice. But Lancaster's performance is truly remarkable, his mannerisms, his physical presence, his air of authority, all show a truly aristocratic character in a way no other movie does.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

>It makes a lot more sense than when they released it in an English-dubbed version, in this country. Instead of having Burt re-dub it with his own voice the producers used still another actor that didn't sound like him either.

 

Now ya see Mark, THAT'S where they made their mistake!

 

Yep, they should've gotten FRANK here for THAT job back then!

 

hqdefault.jpg

("That's right...ha, ha, ha, ha!")

 

;)

 

Edited by: Dargo2 on Nov 27, 2013 11:52 PM

 

Edited by: Dargo2 on Nov 27, 2013 11:55 PM

Link to comment
Share on other sites

>TCM is, I think, generally committed to being true to presenting a film as close as possible to how it was originally intended to appear.

 

How about just showing two English-language Warren William films in its place, and show them in their original format? Then if TCM wants to show Burt's Italian film in Italy, then they can show it in Italy in the Italian language.

 

I never heard of this turkey until it turned up on TCM. It is not a classic film. It is not famous. It is never requested. It makes no sense to show it on an American TV channel.

 

Doesn't TCM show all the Italian-made Westerns with Clint Eastwood in the English language, with all the Italian speakers dubbed in English?

 

I saw Rampage at Apache Wells (1965), made in Germany in the German language, with Stewart Granger, and it was shown on TCM as an English language dub.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Reports of the death of TCM are greatly exaggerated.

 

I think it is the only cable network that appears to put so much thought into its programming.

 

The idea that TCM goes to such great lengths to dig up movies that have been lost due to rights issues or never been shown on cable before and maybe have never been shown in the US/Canada is to be applauded. Anyone can show the next thing on the shelf.

 

These threads are getting tiresome. I know I don't have to read them anymore than anyone has to watch "Field of Dreams."

 

Where else is anyone going to get anything at all like TCM?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

>I never heard of this turkey until it turned up on TCM. It is not a classic film. It is not famous. It is never requested.

 

 

FredC,

 

I beg to differ as I think many others would. Just because you have never heard of *The Leopard* until yesterday doesn't mean that no one else has.

 

Many people who love film just as much as you consider this film a classic and an important film in Burt Lancaster's filmography. According to various accounts, it was an important film to Lancaster as well. And it was shown as part of his SOTM.

 

So, are you saying that only films you consider classic should be shown on TCM and any time TCM honors Stars of the Month it should only show films of theirs that meet the FredCDobbs classic criteria?

 

The last time I looked it wasn't the FredCDobbs channel.

 

I understand that you only want TCM to show films you like but it also helps to understand that other people watch TCM for reasons different from yours. That doesn't make them wrong in their likes and dislikes, it just makes it different from yours.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

>FCD:

>I never heard of this turkey until it turned up on TCM. It is not a classic film. It is not famous. It is never requested. It makes no sense to show it on an American TV channel.

 

It must be the most irksome thing that TCM does not conform to the standards you set up for it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think many of the hard core viewers of TCM should take about a month break and watch something else. Then maybe you might be thankful for what you have here.

 

I know its hard to believe but, there are those who have not seen Casablanca nor North by Northwest and have just found the channel. I know because I sent many of them to this channel myself !

 

I know some of you would love TCM to only air black and white melodramas 24/7 but, you are only one segment of the viewing public. TCM goes after a wide range of entertainment for a wide range of movie fans. There are no lines or boundaries in art and film is an art.

 

And since the kids are home, why not give them a day of fun programming that a parent can be comfortable with ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I had heard of The Leopard and had always wanted to see it.Frankly, I couldn't sit through it b/c I had to work the next day and if I'm going to see a BL film I want to hear his voice. Maybe some other time.

 

Re Field, I love this movie! Prior to seeing it years ago I actually didn't have a good/bad thought about BL. He was a good actor but he wasn't must see viewing. This movie changed that. I think he is amazing in it. His grace, softness of his voice and just the fact that he was an old timer on his way out (character and IRL) made me appreciate him as never before. He is now one of my favorites. His perf in Field always makes me tear up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

FCD: You've never heard of The Leopard before? Well, here is the Sight and Sound 2012 top 250 films of all time and The Leopard is tied at #57 with Touch of Evil while The Treasure of the Sierra Madre is at #377: http://explore.bfi.org.uk/sightandsoundpolls/2012/critics Meanwhile if you look at theyshootpictures.com top 1000 movies by year, you'll find The Leopard is #3 for 1963 behind 8 1/2 and Contempt.

http://theyshootpictures.com/gf1000_all1000films_byyear.htm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It has been suggested that some of us hard core types take a break, well let me tell you I have taken a break for 3 months and things have not gotten any better. Such as today's schedule, Im sorry but I don't like viewing the children's hour all day long... and evening. They could of broken it up a bit, and showed some more mature films for the grown ups in the room.

 

Now I will have to admit there have been rays of sunshine over the past few months but mostly its been boring, or the new classics or sotm that Im not particularly interested in, such as Burt (don't get me wrong he is great actor in his time, but just not my cup of tea). October we had to live through all the horror movies (sorry I'm not a big fan of those either), Vincent Price (like his early movies). An don't even get me started on "The story of film" that was incredibly hard to listen too (I tried, but the irish narrator got on my nerves) and it really was boring) Perhaps because I just watch a film for the story line not for all the camera and light angles and so forth.

 

So as others have said its all a personally preference, and film is very personal, but lately I don't feel as perhaps others might agree that something has out of TCM and I feel like I have lost a friend.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Geez! what a bore this whole subject is getting to be. Never seen so much whining and negativity. While maybe not agreeing with _all_ the views (especially in the beginning of the series) Cousins has put forth, I thoroughly appreciate his world view of cinema AND have enjoyed seeing these many rare films and learning about the many foreign filmmakers that were were certainly new to me. There really IS more to the world of film than Andy Hardy and Frank Capra!! :0

 

> I wish we could all just accept the channel is trying to be adaptable and dynamic and maybe stay fresh while not alienating its longtime viewers, either. If you don't like one movie that they show, can't you do something else for two hours of your life?

>. I wish more people on this board were not so whiny and close-minded.

 

& ditto,

thanks, 'sewhite2000'

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

© 2022 Turner Classic Movies Inc. All Rights Reserved Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Cookie Settings
×
×
  • Create New...