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yogiboo

Why No Beatles Films on TCM?

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Miss W.----How can one objectively determine the excellence of a musician?---- (Is there any way to respond to a particular user or post?

Use the 'quote' feature and this will reply to a specific post (put it also list the contents of the post which could create a lot of clutter).

 

finance,   if you read my post I give many specific examples of how one can determine the excellence of a musician.    I can provide many more.   e.g  how many chord voicings a musician knows and uses.   NOW,  this does NOT mean that musician will produce music that is more pleasing to YOUR ear.        

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It's truly incredible that that's the "long" hair so many people carried on about.

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It's truly incredible that that's the "long" hair so many people carried on about.

Five years later, the Beatles' haircuts would have been viewed as almost military haircuts.

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Use the 'quote' feature and this will reply to a specific post (put it also list the contents of the post which could create a lot of clutter).

 

finance,   if you read my post I give many specific examples of how one can determine the excellence of a musician.    I can provide many more.   e.g  how many chord voicings a musician knows and uses.   NOW,  this does NOT mean that musician will produce music that is more pleasing to YOUR ear.        

So, you listen to a rock song and say, "Wow. I love this song. I can't believe how many chord voicings the artist is using".

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So, you listen to a rock song and say, "Wow. I love this song. I can't believe how many chord voicings the artist is using".

When I PLAY a song (mostly jazz but sometimes rock),   and I have written music charts (e.g. tab) based on how the artist played the song THAT is when I notice the chord voicings OR when I see them perform live and I can see their hands well.      

 

Anyhow,  I fail to see what point your making with your comment as it relates to the fact that musicians have different levels of musicianship and that one can 'rate' this.      But again,  someone that rate higher as a musician doesn't make better sounding music,  per se. 

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Lemme try this again.  The last time I tried posting here, I was informed the thread was locked. 

 

A musician's excellence is not a matter of opinion.  An excellent musician is an excellent musician regardless of whether or not you like his work.  To wit;  Yngwie Malmsteem is an excellent musician.  I just don't like his music.  Barbara Streisand is an excellent singer.  I just don't like the type of songs she sings.

 

finance is obviously a huge Neil Young freak.  I'm not.  But I can't knock success.  Millions of people bought his recordings.  But then again, millions of people bought pet rocks, so I'll just leave it at that.

 

Sepiatone 

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When I PLAY a song (mostly jazz but sometimes rock),   and I have written music charts (e.g. tab) based on how the artist played the song THAT is when I notice the chord voicings OR when I see them perform live and I can see their hands well.      

 

Anyhow,  I fail to see what point your making with your comment as it relates to the fact that musicians have different levels of musicianship and that one can 'rate' this.      But again,  someone that rate higher as a musician doesn't make better sounding music,  per se. 

When I hear a song, either I like it or I don't. I don't analyze the musicianship first., although sometimes I notice it before I make my judgment-----e.g., the background instrumentals of Bowie's "Scary Monsters........."

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When I hear a song, either I like it or I don't. I don't analyze the musicianship first., although sometimes I notice it before I make my judgment-----e.g., the background instrumentals of Bowie's "Scary Monsters........."

I don’t think we differ much when it comes to basis musical forms like rock and blues;  When I first listen to a song or band I either like it (the beat and sound get my feet tapping etc..) or NOT.

With each repeat listening I’ll ‘hear’ the musicianship more and more (or NOT if it is lacking).    But typically that doesn’t change if I like the song or not;  very basis root type music can be just as moving as complex music.  

 

But with Jazz it is a lot different.    First if they are playing a jazz standard, I’ll often know the chord progression.   Jazz is about playing over the changes, so I’ll listen to how the soloist tackles each set of changes.     So in my head I’m following the chord progression and how the soloist approaches each chord or set of chords.    This might sound crazy but every jazz musician that listens to jazz that I know does the same thing.  

Yea, to non-jazz musicians the above might sound like too much thinking is going on but it really becomes very natural with practice (just like there are many tasks one does when driving a car but with practice these become natural and subconscious).    This is the heart of playing jazz; one enjoys playing a solo while multi-tasking keeping the rhythm, and following the harmony.     Something similar occurs when we listen to jazz as well.

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That was a terrific video to add to this thread, Vautrin!

 

Unlike so many humans, the distinctiveness and quality of Neil's voice has not changed at all from what it was in the 60's. I loved it then, I love it still. Greatest Canadian songwriter of all time (with apologies to Gordon Lightfoot).

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Lemme try this again.  The last time I tried posting here, I was informed the thread was locked. 

 

A musician's excellence is not a matter of opinion.  An excellent musician is an excellent musician regardless of whether or not you like his work.  To wit;  Yngwie Malmsteem is an excellent musician.  I just don't like his music.  Barbara Streisand is an excellent singer.  I just don't like the type of songs she sings.

 

finance is obviously a huge Neil Young freak.  I'm not.  But I can't knock success.  Millions of people bought his recordings.  But then again, millions of people bought pet rocks, so I'll just leave it at that.

 

Sepiatone 

I can picture one of the gum-chewing teens on "Bandstand". I'll give it a 95. The song had a tremendous number of chord voicings.

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@ Vautrin;  You SHOULD be apologizing to JONI MITCHELL! 

 

Out of curiosity, I started a thread on Neil Young in the Guitar Player forum in the Musicplayer forums site( TCM could do well to follow THEIR forum set-up).  The opinions there seem to be that many there like Young OK, but don't give him props as a guitarist.  Nobody yet has given Neil Young the "greatest, EVER!" credit.  Several don't like him at all.  I gave him some respect for involving his efforts in coming up with a better music file than the God-awful MP3.

 

Sepiatone

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This has clearly become a discussion thread on music in general. And, "that's...okay." (to quote Stuart Smalley)

I just kind of wonder what happened to yogiboo (I really want to call him "yogibear"), who started the thread.

It's funny how someone will initiate a thread, presumably because they have enough interest in the topic to do so, and then they're never heard from again. Do they ever lurk here and read the thread, without posting? Do they abandon the site, never to return again? Or do they go around planting thread seeds on all kinds of websites, and then sit back and watch them grow?

 

I know it doesn't really matter, I just wonder about stuff like this. 

 

Anyway. Moving on.

Sepia, I don't know who the "experts" at Guitar Player are, but as far as I'm concerned, their expertise is under question if they don't take Neil Young seriously as a major force for rock music in the world, both past and present.

I'm not even that huge a fan. I know what people mean when they say his voice annoys them, that it sounds "whiney". I used to think so too, and while I've since gotten used to it and even like it now, I do understand that complaint about him. (However, I do like him. I shouldn't say I'm not a fan.)

 

But there is no denying that this guy wrote many great songs. He has a unique, immediately identifiable style, he is known as a tremendously talented guitarist - equally adept with both electric and acoustic -, and his lyrics are thoughtful and intelligent. To semi-dismiss Neil Young , which is what you seem to be doing, seems perverse.

 

There are lots of musicians and bands that I do not personally like, whose music I don't really enjoy, but whom I have to acknowledge are talented and have made a significant contribution to music.

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To semi-dismiss Neil Young , which is what you seem to be doing, seems perverse.

 

Oh, yeah?! Well, where'd you get that hairdo, newbie.

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@ Vautrin;  You SHOULD be apologizing to JONI MITCHELL! 

 

 

Sepiatone

I think you should be referring to darkblue. He was the one who said, "With apologies to Gordon Lightfoot."

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But there is no denying that this guy wrote many great songs. He has a unique, immediately identifiable style, he is known as an tremendously talented guitarist - equally adept with both electric and acoustic -, and his lyrics are thoughtful and intelligent. To semi-dismiss Neil Young , which is what you seem to be doing, seems perverse.

 

 

I agree with what you posted above, expect the temendously talented guitarist part,  but as a guitar player I have my own method for determining how talented a guitar player is;   can I play what they are playing.    I can listen to a Young's solo and 'pull it off' after a few tries.   I can't to that with Richie Blackmore (guitar player for Deep Purple and is idoized by Guitar Player mag)  for example.    

 

As for Young's voice.   Well I learned here is that for many style trumps technical ability when it comes to singing.  Even those that love Young's singing can see the limits of his voice but that doesn't impact the emotional appeal of his voice to them.    

 

Since I love Young's songwriting my dislike for his singing doesn't impact my enjoyment of his music,  other then my wife wishing I don't play him when she is around.    She is from Italy and never heard any of Young's music.   When she heard me blasting Tell Me Why,  she said something like 'is that a demo or something,  that singing is really bad!'.       

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Oh, yeah?! Well, where'd you get that hairdo, newbie.

I'll thank you not to make derogatory insinuations about this hairdo, Mr. Blue. I happen to be very proud of it. 

 

edith-4.jpg

 

I like the way it looks like a small dark hamster has made its home on my head. (I don't have that last name for nothing, you know.)

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@ Vautrin;  You SHOULD be apologizing to JONI MITCHELL! 

 

Out of curiosity, I started a thread on Neil Young in the Guitar Player forum in the Musicplayer forums site( TCM could do well to follow THEIR forum set-up).  The opinions there seem to be that many there like Young OK, but don't give him props as a guitarist.  Nobody yet has given Neil Young the "greatest, EVER!" credit.  Several don't like him at all.  I gave him some respect for involving his efforts in coming up with a better music file than the God-awful MP3.

 

Sepiatone

I have never played a guitar in my life. I am just a layman who thinks that Young's guitar riffs sound great. Sniff all you want.

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I have never played a guitar in my life. I am just a layman who thinks that Young's guitar riffs sound great. Sniff all you want.

 

I'm surprised this discussion of Young appears to be getting to you.    No one mocked anyone for saying they feel Young's guitar playing sounds great or even if they think Young is the best sounding guitar player of all time.      But the term 'the greatest' is much different then 'my favorite'.    To me 'the greatest' is an opinion based on the skills and abilities of an artist,  and not just 'I love them'.

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