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RMeingast

Boycotting Woody Allen Films??

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Yeah, well, I think we all know those pointy-headed wordsmiths have never gotten the due they're deserved...in Hollywood NOR Peoria, right?! ;)

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And...yeah, well, Andy. Again as I think we all know, the phrase "stretching as an actor" was never Big Duke's bag.

 

(...well, I suppose if you don't count that time he played that mongol opposite Susan Hayward, anyway!) ;)

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Screenwriters tend to be an overlooked group. Not only have they had to step aside while movie stars get all the glory, they also have had to contend with film theorists that give directors most of the credit.

 

It is interesting that we are discussing this here, because THE FRONT is about a screenwriter who is unable to take credit for 'his' story. As a screenwriter himself, Woody Allen would have had a special connection with the character he played.

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>Any "wanted man" like Richard Kimble may also be a little envious of someone who is notwanted

 

I agree, Spike Lee is not wanted

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>The unforgettable and truly funny scene where Alvy and Annie are getting to know each other, they're hanging out on Woody's balcony and sipping white wine (this is the '70s). *Allen the director* does something so clever and original, he gives us each character's inner thoughts about what's going on with voice-overs.

 

That's writing, not directing

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But Stanwyck ONLY acted, so when you say a "Stanwyck" movie, you know she only acts.......But saying a "Woody Allen movie" for a movie in which he only acts is misleading, because in 95% of the films in which he appears, he does a lot more than just act.

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Me:

>The unforgettable and truly funny scene where Alvy and Annie are getting to know each other, they're hanging out on Woody's balcony and sipping white wine (this is the '70s). Allen the director does something so clever and original, he gives us each character's inner thoughts about what's going on with voice-overs.

 

Mr. Kimble:

>That's writing, not directing.

 

And your point is...?

 

All of Woody Allen's films - that is, the films he directed - were also written by him. The writing and the direction are almost inseparable, they are both Woody's ideas and talent and sensibility.

In any case, I believe you are splitting hairs. Call it direction, or call it his writing, either way, *Annie Hall* is bursting with original, funny, and inventive touches I'd never seen any other director (or screenwriter!) use up to that time.

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"Splitting hairs" is what this thread seems to have become about today. I think it's what people do when they're in the mood to argue but can't think of anything significant to argue about.

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With the admiration being expressed here (by some, at least) about Annie Hall, did anyone see TCM's recent broadcast of Johnny Carson when he interviewed Diane Keaton sometime in the early '70s?

 

In any event, it was pre-Annie Hall but it was almost as if Carson was interviewing the insecure character that she played in the first half of that film. Keaton didn't say, "Well, la-de-da" to Carson but might just as well have. Woody Allen really wrote a wonderful screenplay that, inventive as it was in some scenes, as already pointed out, was also such an ideal showcase for the personality of his girlfriend.

 

You have to wonder, to what degree was Keaton just being herself in that film, as opposed to another effort of her's, such as The Godfather. This is not a knock on Keaton's performance. She's marvelous in Annie Hall, with Woody providing material that was truly ideal for her, and helped her to charm and shine her way to an Academy Award.

 

Certainly her character in Annie Hall is a real contrast to the pretentious one that she would later play in Manhattan (though that character, too, had its insecurities).

 

So who is closest to the real Diane Keaton? Annie Hall? Bingo!, at least, based on that Carson interview.

 

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!

 

So will the real Annie Hall please stand up?

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>Tom said: You have to wonder, to what degree was Keaton just being herself in that film, as opposed to another effort of her's, such as The Godfather. This is not a knock on Keaton's performance. She's marvelous in Annie Hall, with Woody providing material that was truly ideal for her, and helped her to charm and shine her way to an Academy Award.

 

I absolutely believe Annie is Keaton. Or maybe Allen's view of Diane Hall, (her real name)

Read her book, THEN AGAIN and it sounds like Annie's talking. All that is lighthearted and whimsical about A.H. is part of Keaton's true personality.

 

I find her an endearing personality and am glad Woody Allen made ANNIE HALL.

 

>That's writing, not directing

 

"That's not writing, that's TYPING"

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTVr8XzaHtHHsfM_JVYzkW

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Anyone who doesn't love Diane Keaton in Annie Hall doesn't love life. There are some female characters that are (or should be) plain irresistible to any sentient male, and Keaton's Annie Hall has got to be high up on such a list.

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Yea, I'm also leaning towards Annie Hall not being the type of gal I would want as a girlfriend. While there are many things to love about her she comes off as kind of annoying. So I don't know how much of that side of her I could take day after day.

 

So here we have yet another case of someone (Andy), assuming a consensus when one doesn't actually exist. I learned this lesson in the June Alyson thread!

 

hey, and I watched The Three Musketeers last night; I think June looks nice in this movie as do all the gals look nice in the movie (MGM really went all out as it relates to costumes and make-up. But out of all the actresses June was the least attractive to me.

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Uh huh. Andy's assertion left me a little speechless - so all I could come up with was "umm.....".

 

I suppose this male was rendered temporarily non-sentient.

 

I find many women to be torturously attractive, but Diane Keaton has just never done it for me.

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So here we have yet another case of someone (Andy), assuming a consensus when one doesn't actually exist. I learned this lesson in the June Alyson thread!

 

Tell you what: Here's a week's supply of emoticons to be used whenever it seems appropriate. Sorry I didn't use one when I made that remark about not loving life.

 

;);););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););););)

 

Don't get me wrong. I love Keaton in Annie Hall, but I'm enough attached to Earth to know that most men gravitate towards the bimbos.

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Bimbos? Like who? A contemporary of Keaton at the time of 'Annie Hall' was Cristina Raines - who I found to be very attractive. Would she be a bimbo?

 

How about Jessica Harper (another actress I found to be very attractive) - also a bimbo?

 

Kathleen Quinlan? Theresa Russell? Anne Archer?

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So Andy. after that "most men prefer bimbos" line of yours, does this mean you're now down one more of that supply of little winky emoticons of yours???

 

'Cause I HOPE you once again just forgot to use one of 'em, 'cause I HOPE you know that that latest statement of yours was about as overblown as that previous one about Diane Keaton and "not loving life"! ;)

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Bimbos? Like who? A contemporary of Keaton at the time of 'Annie Hall' was Cristina Raines - who I found to be very attractive. Would she be a bimbo?

 

How about Jessica Harper (another actress I found to be very attractive) - also a bimbo?

 

Kathleen Quinlan? Theresa Russell? Anne Archer?

 

Never even heard of any of them except for Jessica Harper, and I couldn't pick her out of a police lineup. But as a general point, I'm talking about screen personae, not real life. For all I know, the real Marilyn Monroe was every bit as much of a genius as some of her posthumous critics want to make her out to be.

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So Andy. after that "most men prefer bimbos" line of yours, does this mean you're now down one more of that supply of little winky emoticons of yours???

 

'Cause I HOPE you once again just forgot to use one of 'em, 'cause I HOPE you know that that latest statement of yours was about as overblown as that previous one about Diane Keaton and "not loving life"! ;)

 

Let's just say I've always found the *screen personae* of the Diane Keatons (in Annie Hall, at least) and the Ida Lupinos and the Liv Ulmanns and the Judy Davises a lot more appealing than those of the Marilyn Monroes and the interchangeable Playboy centerfold clones. Obviously this is simply a matter of taste, and not some sort of moral judgment, and equally obviously this has a lot to do with the quality of the movies they're cast in. I'm not trying to play St. Peter here.

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> I'm talking about screen personae

 

And you hold a tongue-tied neurotic who dresses pretty weird (not to mention asexually) as some sort of everyman's ideal?

 

As for not knowing who those actresses are, I guess movies of the 70's are not your thing - except the ones with Diane Keaton of course.

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And you hold a tongue-tied neurotic who dresses pretty weird (not to mention asexually) as some sort of everyman's ideal?

 

As for not knowing who those actresses are, I guess movies of the 70's are not your thing - except the ones with Diane Keaton of course.

 

Wrong on all counts, but who am I to ruin a good narrative? :)

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Most men are ATTRACTED to bimbos, like kids are to candy. But they couldn't live on a steady DIET of them. Which is why I always thought Paul Newman was eventually attracted to Joanne Woodward.

 

Sepiatone

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