Jump to content
 
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...

Gone With The Wind


smitty1931
 Share

Recommended Posts

Hi.

 

In a nearly perfect film, I have trouble imagining any other people in it. The people in it now are a great part of what makes a film perfect. 

 

It's like, I couldn't imagine any pre-Brando, old-time classic actor, or post-Brando modern actor playing his role in A STREETCAR NAMED DESIRE or ON THE WATERFRONT.

 

Who would you get for that? I can't think of anyone either before or after Brando who could play those two roles as well as he did.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is on tonight at 8. Is it Hollywoods crowning achievement? Who today would you cast in the 4 leads?  George Clooney has the same sly charm that Gable had, but I can't think of a good Scarlett.

 

Well I don't rank it as one of my top 50 favorite films.   Great production values and acting but the silly, junior high school type, love triangle is really weak.     But the parts of the movie that don’t focus on the love triangle are very good.  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think I could have easily envisioned a younger Harrison Ford as Rhett, if say a remake had been done some 20 years back, as many of the film characters with which Ford is most associated in his career have many a common trait with Butler...irreverence probably being chief among them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Although a good actor, Leslie Howard is really miscast as Ashley. I think he really did not want to do the part as Clark Gable was reluctant to play Rhett Butler.

 

It is interesting that Gable refused to speak with a Southern accent in the movie. You can hear Leslie Howard attempting it a few times but for most of the movie he speaks with his own very clipped English accent.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find it unfortunate that some of the more interesting characters and romances from the book were left out of the movie but even at nearly four hours you couldn't have packed them all in.  

 

One involves Scarlett's friend Cathleen Calvert and how the war's effect on her family causes her strange marriage choice.  Also the youngest and truly innocent O'Hara sister, Carreen, figures much more in the book as she's on the losing end of two love stories.  In the first, she gets one of Scarlett's rejected Tarleton twins only to lose him at Gettysburg.  Later she falls for a new foreman at Tara, who also loves her, but the weird mores of the time cause him to marry the nasty Suellen instead.  Her final resolution is both sad and happy but she is true to herself.

 

On the plus side there is Maybelle Merriweather and her Creole husband who while not exactly a Prince Charming restores the family fortunes with his flair for business.    

 

These stories tell us more about Southern life both before and after the war and and keep you turning the page.

If you've never read the book try it as you're in for a treat.  Yes,  it's long but never boring and no more racist than the movie's plot.  It took me years to break down and do it-before I saw the movie-but worth it.        

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find it unfortunate that some of the more interesting characters and romances from the book were left out of the movie but even at nearly four hours you couldn't have packed them all in.  

 

One involves Scarlett's friend Cathleen Calvert and how the war's effect on her family causes her strange marriage choice.  Also the youngest and truly innocent O'Hara sister, Carreen, figures much more in the book as she's on the losing end of two love stories.  In the first, she gets one of Scarlett's rejected Tarleton twins only to lose him at Gettysburg.  Later she falls for a new foreman at Tara, who also loves her, but the weird mores of the time cause him to marry the nasty Suellen instead.  Her final resolution is both sad and happy but she is true to herself.

 

On the plus side there is Maybelle Merriweather and her Creole husband who while not exactly a Prince Charming restores the family fortunes with his flair for business.    

 

These stories tell us more about Southern life both before and after the war and and keep you turning the page.

If you've never read the book try it as you're in for a treat.  Yes,  it's long but never boring and no more racist than the movie's plot.  It took me years to break down and do it-before I saw the movie-but worth it.        

 

These plot lines from the book that were NOT in the movie do sound more interesting then the silly Scarlett love triangle that the movie was so focused on.      

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have never ever thought Leslie Howard was miscast in GWTW.  My opinion is that he was brilliant in the role as the ever saddened ever lost ever not-sure-who-he-was Leslie. 

Leslie Howard was too old for the role of Ashley. He was in his mid-40s when the movie was filmed. Ashley is supposed to be in his 20s, younger than Rhett Butler, but in the movie Leslie Howard looks older than Clark Gable. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've thought about this sort of thing over several years.  The "replacements" change as the years go by.  At one point, I thought TOMMY LEE JONES would be a good Rhett.  In recent years, CLOONEY came to mind.

 

I've never been able to settle on the rest of the cast.

 

A MUPPETS GWTW?  LOVE the idea!

 

As for Brando, I can't say for sure about "Streetcar".  I know for a TV movie version, they tried TREAT WILLIAMS, who didn't fly for me.  But I was thinking a late '80's NICHOLAS CAGE might be a good TERRY MALLOY in a remake of "WATERFRONT.

 

But, mentioning Brando, his sister JOYCELYN was seen last night back-to-back on METV in both an "Alfred Hitchcock Presents" episode, and an episode of "Thriller".

 

Sepiatone

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Leslie Howard was too old for the role of Ashley. He was in his mid-40s when the movie was filmed. Ashley is supposed to be in his 20s, younger than Rhett Butler, but in the movie Leslie Howard looks older than Clark Gable. 

 

I agree that Howard was too old but Roverock makes a good point related to Howard's screen persona fitting the character of Ashley.

 

But yea,  too old and too english don't make the grade.   Note that Leslie Howard is my favorite actor but I have always wondered why Selznick was so set on hiring Howard for the role  (but at least it lead to Intermezzo a very good movie).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I watched GWTW the other night...it's been many years.  The first time I saw it was at the theater in the '60s or early '70s.  I read the book years ago after seeing the movie...the one thing I remember is Scarlet had 3 children from her various husbands.  Now watching it again I do see how old Leslie Howard & Clark Gable seemed to young Scarlet, but it is a classic film that can never be redone (I'm not a big fan of contemporary remade classics).  Vivien Leigh was perfectly cast 'tho...and many of the other characters.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

.. Note that Leslie Howard is my favorite actor but I have always wondered why Selznick was so set on hiring Howard for the role  (but at least it lead to Intermenzo a very good movie).

Perhaps due to his being at his peak, filmwise, with Of Human Bondage, The Scarlet Pimpernel, The Petrified Forest, Pygmalion and Intermezzo. That's an impressive resume' to say the least. I haven't read any "official" books on the subject, so who knows, eh?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Perhaps due to his being at his peak, filmwise, with Of Human Bondage, The Scarlet Pimpernel, The Petrified Forest, Pygmalion and Intermezzo. That's an impressive resume' to say the least. I haven't read any "official" books on the subject, so who knows, eh?

 

AND perhaps because, save his turn as the heroic title character in "The Scarlet Pimpernel" on the aforementioned list, Howard by the time Selznick secured the films rights to Mitchell's novel, had established his screen persona as pretty much the ultimate "introspective, intellectual, often vacillating and gentlemanly" type, which fit the Wilkes character to a tee.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I watched GWTW the other night...it's been many years.   Now watching it again I do see how old Leslie Howard & Clark Gable seemed to young Scarlet

 

It's interesting that a point was made in the movie about Scarlett O'Hara marrying the much older Frank Kennedy (who had been her younger sister's boyfriend), but the actor who played Frank looked younger and was younger than Leslie Howard.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's interesting that a point was made in the movie about Scarlett O'Hara marrying the much older Frank Kennedy (who had been her younger sister's boyfriend), but the actor who played Frank looked younger and was younger than Leslie Howard.  

As a side note: The War of Northern Aggression killed off many of the South's finest men who were in 

their prime. Many young Southern women, to survive and move on, married men who were much older

than they were.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The sequel to GWTW was certainly terrible, or at least the book was--I refused to watch the movie.  It starred Timothy Dalton as Rhett and Joann Whaley-Kilmer (with dark hair) as Scarlett.

If you are at all interested and don't care about spoilers, read on...

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

It starts off ok, with Scarlett scheming to win Rhett back by first tricking him into coming back to Tara for Mammy's funeral (she has Will Benteen send the telegram so that Rhett will think she isn't going to be there and the fact that Rhett falls for this is just ridiculous) then by going to Charleston to ingratiate herself with Rhett's family. Rhett does succumb to Scarlett's charms (briefly) but leaves her again. She goes to Savannah to visit her mother's relatives, then then completely jumps the shark by going off to be with her O'Hara relatives, sailing with her cousin  to Ireland (!) where, when she hears Rhett has re-married, turns over Tara to her son Wade (from her first marriage) and decides to stay in Ireland amongst her O'Hara relatives.  

She buys the old O'Hara family homestead,  has Rhett's baby by a totally improbably c-section, gets involved with Irish terrorists and eventually wins Rhett back.

 

In the movie, Scarlett becomes the victim of a rich serial rapist (who is also courting her--what? and also can you picture Scarlett as anyone's victim?) Rhett must save her from being tried for the man's murder before they be reunited.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting sidebar:

 

Ben Hecht, in his memoir A Child of the Century, describes his involvement with the script.  IMBd lists Mr. Hecht as "contributing writer (uncredited.)"   He had never read the book, only the script work that had been done already.  He relates that there was this character named Leslie Wilkes that kept gumming up the post-war aspects of the story.  He wanted to just get rid of the guy by having him die, and not return from the war.  The bosses wouldn't let Mr. Hecht do that.

 

As for sequels, etc. seek out the 2001 novel The Wind Done Gone by Alice Randall.  POV from the slave quarters.  The central character is a contemporary of Scarlett, offspring of Gerald O'Hara and Mammy.  Occasional consort of Rhett Butler.  Interesting.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Y'know, what I find amusing is that in earier threads about this movie( and not so long ago!), people were raking GWTW over th coals because of it's representation of slavery, miscasting, cliched filming and acting techniques, and it's "sanitized" display of both Antebellum and post-war South.  NOW, everbody seems to be on board!

 

Funny, I don't recall getting MY Dixie cup full of Kool-Ade.

 

Sepiatone

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Y'know, what I find amusing is that in earier threads about this movie( and not so long ago!), people were raking GWTW over th coals because of it's representation of slavery, miscasting, cliched filming and acting techniques, and it's "sanitized" display of both Antebellum and post-war South.  NOW, everbody seems to be on board!

 

Funny, I don't recall getting MY Dixie cup full of Kool-Ade.

 

Sepiatone

 

Well the OP was about if a remake was done what the cast for the leads might look like.    But yea,  some of those flaws you mention are there IMO.    Again, it is a good movie but not listed in my top 50 mostly because of the silly love triangle.   Really that part reminds me of some of the current teen TV shows on today.      

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Again, it is a good movie but not listed in my top 50 mostly because of the silly love triangle.   Really that part reminds me of some of the current teen TV shows on today.      

 

I have never personally witnessed a LOVE TRIANGLE between grown adults that was not as SILLY as any love triangle between teenagers. I've seen adults crying, fist fights, threats, runaways, hiding out, saying nasty things to each other, threats of murder, and even murder.... it's just like what the teens do. It is a universal human nature, in my opinion, except I think the teens resort to murder less often than adults do. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Y'know, what I find amusing is that in earier threads about this movie( and not so long ago!), people were raking GWTW over th coals because of it's representation of slavery, miscasting, cliched filming and acting techniques, and it's "sanitized" display of both Antebellum and post-war South.  NOW, everbody seems to be on board!

 

Funny, I don't recall getting MY Dixie cup full of Kool-Ade.

 

Sepiatone

 

 

 

As far as the portrayal of slavery goes in GONE WITH THE WIND, there are plenty of famous movies that have similar ingredients that we usually overlook, such as the comedy movies about pirates. Pirates were bad killers and vicious thugs, yet there are several movies in which we see pirates kidnapping local girls from some port town and carry them off to their ships as slaves. In some movies, we laugh at this and think its funny when we see the girls kicking and screaming.

 

We laugh at comedy movies involving prostitutes, as if this profession is funny for the girls, rather than sad and tragic.

 

We laugh at drunks and alcoholics who we should pity and feel sorry for.

 

We enjoy major sword fights when men get their arms and head chopped off, and the more people the hero kills, the more we like the movie.

 

We laugh at poor poverty stricken hillbillies and mentally **** people, such as in TOBACCO ROAD.

 

One time I saw a Civil War movie in a theater in the South when I was a kid, and the heroes were the Yankees rather than the Rebs. Several of the Yankee men and women were portrayed as heroes and wonderful people, and the Rebs were scum. To my surprise, the audience kept cheering whenever the Yankees won a battle. These were 100% Reb audience members, cheering the Yankees!

 

Hey, it’s just a movie, and the classic old Hollywood movie makers knew how to manipulate their audiences. Consequently, I see the slaves in GONE WITH THE WIND as being lucky for having good jobs with a good family. They even stayed with that family after the War. And again, it’s just a movie. A wonderful one, but a movie.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have never personally witnessed a LOVE TRIANGLE between grown adults that was not as SILLY as any love triangle between teenagers. I've seen adults crying, fist fights, threats, runaways, hiding out, saying nasty things to each other, threats of murder, and even murder.... it's just like what the teens do. It is a universal human nature, in my opinion, except I think the teens resort to murder less often than adults do. :)

 

Well wasn't Rhett supposed to be some type of ‘man’s man’?    No guy with any sense of pride or backbone would have put up with the antics of Scarlett.    Oh, he might try to bed her but fall in love with her and marry her when he knew she was in love with another man?   When she is willing to have sex with him only when he forces her to?    (Rhett didn’t mind paying for it so why would he put up with that for one second).

 

Sorry but that part of the storyline just doesn’t add up.    Also even if most adults in a love triangle often act just like teenagers (a point I can accept),   this type storyline gets really tiresome if it goes on too long.    Yes this is often used in comedies (e.g.  My Favorite Wife), but again, those are comedies.     In GWTW this silly store line dominates the picture and continues throughout the entire picture except when Rhett finally wakes up (which is something a man that acts like Rhett in scenes NOT involving the love triangle would have done in 30 minutes into the film).

 

GWTW has a lot going for it; fine actors, great production values, many well craft scenes related to the changing of the south and the civil war and the aftermath.   But I can’t rank GWTW as one of the greatest movies from the American studio-era due to that silliness.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

© 2022 Turner Classic Movies Inc. All Rights Reserved Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Cookie Settings
×
×
  • Create New...