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I inferred that he had been in the Army for several years. In that time, he certainly should have risen to a Sergeant's rank, with all his abilities. KInd of a head case, though.

 

I agree. I think he had been in another company for several years; but after his boxing incident where he blinded his opponent, he moved to another company so he could avoid having to box again. I could have sworn it was mentioned somewhere that he took a demotion in rank just so that he could transfer companies.

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I agree. I think he had been in another company for several years; but after his boxing incident where he blinded his opponent, he moved to another company so he could avoid having to box again. I could have sworn it was mentioned somewhere that he took a demotion in rank just so that he could transfer companies.

When I was in the National Guard, I was demoted for keeping an M-16 in my locker overnight.

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I agree. I think he had been in another company for several years; but after his boxing incident where he blinded his opponent, he moved to another company so he could avoid having to box again. I could have sworn it was mentioned somewhere that he took a demotion in rank just so that he could transfer companies.

 

That didn't work out well for him.    The guy couldn't get a break.  

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Time served doesn't necessarily mean anything towards getting promoted in rank. And you can see how easily you can get demoted in rank.  How about Sgt Galovitch, who got busted all of the way down to private (and latrine duty I believe) by the new company commander.

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Time served doesn't necessarily mean anything towards getting promoted in rank. And you can see how easily you can get demoted in rank.  How about Sgt Galovitch, who got busted all of the way down to private (and latrine duty I believe) by the new company commander.

 

 It seems like the army rankings (at least in From Here to Eternity) seem to be based on how much your superior likes you.  Captain Holmes (apparently he wasn't a Major like I thought he was, I looked it up) was upset that Prewitt wouldn't help out his company in the boxing match.  When the jig was up and the Army discovered what Holmes and his cronies were doing to Prewitt, that's when Holmes was forced to resign and Galovitch was demoted quite a few ranks and had to clean the latrines (yuck!). 

 

Burt Lancaster's character seemed devoted to Holmes, until later it comes out that he didn't really like the man, he was just easy to work for because he was never at the base.  Lancaster (and Maggio) seem like the only soldiers at the base who don't care/want Prewitt to box and support his decision not to. 

 

Lancaster's character was a high ranking Sergeant I believe (or maybe he was Lieutenant?) and he was upset that Karen wanted him to become an officer.  Was it a non-commissioned officer? What is the difference between non-commissioned and commissioned? Is that related to pay? It sounds like Lancaster's character could be promoted in rank just by filling out a form? Or was the move from his position to the non-commissioned officer a lateral one?

 

I always figured the promotion in Army ranks was based on merit.  Is that how it works?

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I can't speak from personal experience (I was never in any military service)  but getting ahead in the military is a lot like civilian life. "Merit" has a lot to do with getting recognition from your superiors, and you may have to take some form of exam ,  to get a promotion.  So if your boss likes you, you can get ahead (refer to Jack Lemmon's promotion in THE APARTMENT).  That doesn't necessarily mean you merit the promotion.  Captain Holmes wanted to advance in rank, for some reason he put a lot of stock in his company having a bunch of boxing trophies.  I'm not sure how much that impressed Holmes' superiors, who would decide whether to recommend Holmes for a promotion.  Holmes' wife kind of reminds me of the storyline in AN OFFICER AND A GENTLEMAN where the gals want to hook up with a young cadet, only if he makes it to become an officer.  That doesn't speak very well of her character does it.  Burt Lancaster had advanced about as far as he could go, as a non commissioned rank of Sergeant .  To become a regular commissioned officer, starting at the rank of Lieutenant , he would have to apply, take tests, his record of service would be reviewed by superiors, etc.  If he had some friends in high places, that would help a lot too.  But Burt had no desire to become an officer and associate with those people, he was content to remain more like a regular soldier, live in the barracks, go through the daily drills, etc. A guy like Burt could identify with a guy like Prewitt who wasn't out to impress anyone else, just live his life the way he wanted.

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Time served doesn't necessarily mean anything towards getting promoted in rank. And you can see how easily you can get demoted in rank.  How about Sgt Galovitch, who got busted all of the way down to private (and latrine duty I believe) by the new company commander.

I believe that in the real Army, demotions are relatively unusual. Incidents will just forestall promotions.

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just a very short time ago, i wouldn't dare watch ANY montgomery clift movie.

i read somewhere that he was homosexual; i guess it was this belief that repelled me.

however, after seeing him in 'lonelyhearts' and 'from here to eternity', i'm beginning to warm up to the guy.

How sad that your "repulsion" by an actor's private life meant you didn't "dare" watch his films. Are your prejudices restricted to homophobia ( there are long lists of films you dare not watch then - we can probably help you out here on the board) or do they include films with alcoholics,drug addicts, womanizers, child/animal abusers, wife beaters, suspected Communists, or persons of generally morally suspect behavior? Perhaps you should be VERY careful of what you watch - one never knows WHAT those actors have been up to between films.

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In Clift's later movies he always looked to be having a bit of trouble "maintaining".  I didn't know if it was actual, or just affected for his movie character.

 

 

Sepiatone

i suspect it was a little of both.. His life was beset with personal problems - a gay actor ( at the absolute height of homophobia - see Mr.vegan's comments above) with matinee idol looks who never wanted to play the Hollywood game of shielding his true identity - nearly impossible in a business then dominated by the Hedda Hoppers and Louella Parsons and soon after the Confidential type rags. He was already a heavy drinker ( perhaps exacerbated by trying to live this dual life) when he was seriously injured in that infamous car accident during the making of Raintree County and was ever after addicted to pain (and every other kind of) pills and even more alcohol. Who knows to what extent the drugs/alcohol influenced his performances - especially the post- accident films. That his acting was as good as it was, despite these afflictions, is rather astonishing. John Huston, after working with him on "The Misfits" and then especially "Freud", declared that he suspected Clift may have been actually brain damaged in that accident. Marilyn Monroe - equally troubled - found a soul mate in Clift when they worked on The Misfits together, and later sadly declared that he was the only person she knew who was more screwed up than she was. I find his later performances touching. (and troubling) but I think he was overall one of our finest and most sensitive actors. That this slight actor was convincing in films such as Red River and From Here to Eternity is a testament

to his enormous talent.

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i suspect it was a little of both.. His life was beset with personal problems - a gay actor ( at the absolute height of homophobia - see Mr.vegan's comments above) with matinee idol looks who never wanted to play the Hollywood game of shielding his true identity - nearly impossible in a business then dominated by the Hedda Hoppers and Louella Parsons and soon after the Confidential type rags. He was already a heavy drinker ( perhaps exacerbated by trying to live this dual life) when he was seriously injured in that infamous car accident during the making of Raintree County and was ever after addicted to pain (and every other kind of) pills and even more alcohol. Who knows to what extent the drugs/alcohol influenced his performances - especially the post- accident films. That his acting was as good as it was, despite these afflictions, is rather astonishing. John Huston, after working with him on "The Misfits" and then especially "Freud", declared that he suspected Clift may have been actually brain damaged in that accident. Marilyn Monroe - equally troubled - found a soul mate in Clift when they worked on The Misfits together, and later sadly declared that he was the only person she knew who was more screwed up than she was. I find his later performances touching. (and troubling) but I think he was overall one of our finest and most sensitive actors. That this slight actor was convincing in films such as Red River and From Here to Eternity is a testament

to his enormous talent.

I was going to say something similar about Clift in response to Sepitatone's statement.  I agree that his accident and subsequent dependency issues was probably partially to blame for the change in his performances.  It is my understanding that he was never the same after the accident.  I hadn't heard the theory about his sustaining brain damage in his accident; but I wouldn't be surprised.  From all accounts I've read, the accident was pretty horrific.  In fact, people were surprised that he survived. 

 

Post-accident, Clift's performances lack some of the intensity from his performances prior; however, I think he was still capable of turning in some very sensitive and dramatic performances.  The scene in The Misfits where Clift's character telephones his mother is very emotional and poignant. 

 

I haven't seen Judgement at Nuremberg or Freud, but it is my understanding that in 'Nuremberg' Clift was having trouble delivering his lines.  Finally, the director just told Clift to forget his scripted lines and ad-lib whatever comes to mind when the other actors delivered their lines.  Clift was nominated for a Best Supporting Actor Oscar for his performance, which to me, shows that while he wasn't the Montgomery Clift of yore, he was still a good actor and could still turn in a good performance. 

 

I haven't seen all of his films; but I thought he was great in From Here to Eternity and Red River.  While I'm not a huge John Wayne fan (I don't dislike him; but he doesn't rank anywhere near my top 10 favorite actors) I really liked him and Clift together in Red River.  I've only seen the film once; but own a copy, I feel like I need to watch it again.

 

He only has I believe 17 film credits.  I've seen:

 

Red River

The Heiress

I Confess

From Here to Eternity

Suddenly Last Summer

The Misfits

 

I have Young Lions and Raintree County recorded on my DVR from when the Montgomery Clift birthday tribute aired (just a few days before I lost TCM ::sniff:: ).  I haven't watched either yet.

 

I haven't seen A Place in the Sun yet; but I want to request it from Netflix when I'm finished with my latest offering: Ace in the Hole.

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I was going to say something similar about Clift in response to Sepitatone's statement.  I agree that his accident and subsequent dependency issues was probably partially to blame for the change in his performances.  It is my understanding that he was never the same after the accident.  I hadn't heard the theory about his sustaining brain damage in his accident; but I wouldn't be surprised.  From all accounts I've read, the accident was pretty horrific.  In fact, people were surprised that he survived. 

 

Post-accident, Clift's performances lack some of the intensity from his performances prior; however, I think he was still capable of turning in some very sensitive and dramatic performances.  The scene in The Misfits where Clift's character telephones his mother is very emotional and poignant. 

 

I haven't seen Judgement at Nuremberg or Freud, but it is my understanding that in 'Nuremberg' Clift was having trouble delivering his lines.  Finally, the director just told Clift to forget his scripted lines and ad-lib whatever comes to mind when the other actors delivered their lines.  Clift was nominated for a Best Supporting Actor Oscar for his performance, which to me, shows that while he wasn't the Montgomery Clift of yore, he was still a good actor and could still turn in a good performance. 

 

I haven't seen all of his films; but I thought he was great in From Here to Eternity and Red River.  While I'm not a huge John Wayne fan (I don't dislike him; but he doesn't rank anywhere near my top 10 favorite actors) I really liked him and Clift together in Red River.  I've only seen the film once; but own a copy, I feel like I need to watch it again.

 

He only has I believe 17 film credits.  I've seen:

 

Red River

The Heiress

I Confess

From Here to Eternity

Suddenly Last Summer

The Misfits

 

I have Young Lions and Raintree County recorded on my DVR from when the Montgomery Clift birthday tribute aired (just a few days before I lost TCM ::sniff:: ).  I haven't watched either yet.

 

I haven't seen A Place in the Sun yet; but I want to request it from Netflix when I'm finished with my latest offering: Ace in the Hole.

Was it common knowledge in Hollywood that Clift was gay? How about with the public? For Hudson, it was Hollywood-Yes. Public-No.

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First let me just say that I think Montgomery Clift was a fine actor throughout his career and its most unfortunate that he died while still a relatively young man (45).  For many of the roles that  he played in the later years of his career (like JUDGMENT AT NUREMBERG) his mental state of mind helped play into his characters. The melancholy character he played in WILD RIVER reflected Clift in real life. Another actor could have played the character very differently and maybe it would have been a better film with that  actor playing a more upbeat fellow.  But Kazan cast Clift, maybe because he wanted what Clift would bring to the character and how that would set a tone for the story.

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I think Monty Clift was an excellent, incredibly expressive actor. I thought he was great in A Place in the Sun and From Here to Eternity, and very charming in The Heiress.  The only thing from his post-accident career that I've seen is Suddenly Last Summer and I wasn't as impressed, but it wasn't much of a role for him and I think he was overshadowed by the performances of Elizabeth Taylor and Katharine Hepburn.  I am shocked that he never won an Oscar; he easily deserved one for A Place in the Sun or From Here to Eternity.

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How sad that your "repulsion" by an actor's private life meant you didn't "dare" watch his films. Are your prejudices restricted to homophobia ( there are long lists of films you dare not watch then - we can probably help you out here on the board) or do they include films with alcoholics,drug addicts, womanizers, child/animal abusers, wife beaters, suspected Communists, or persons of generally morally suspect behavior? Perhaps you should be VERY careful of what you watch - one never knows WHAT those actors have been up to between films.

 

Very well said, Vertigo2. 

 

To be honest when I read mistervegan's comment I wasn't sure if it was something posted as a joke---just to upset people. 

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Very well said, Vertigo2. 

 

To be honest when I read mistervegan's comment I wasn't sure if it was something posted as a joke---just to upset people. 

 

I assumed mistervegan was just being honest but I also wondered if he was joking since most vegans I know are supportive of the LGBT community.  

 

Either way often people are raised by their parents to be prejudice.   A 50s movie that covers this topic is The Tin Star with Anthony Perkins and Henry Fonda.     The subject here is the hate of Indians and one 'half-breed' child.   The white mother of the child just doesn't understand why so many people in town hate her child and Fonda says something like they were raised to hate indians.   The way Fonda says the line makes it clear he isn't defending these folks but just providing inslight.   (Fonda's stotic persona was good at these type of lines).

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I assumed mistervegan was just being honest but I also wondered if he was joking since most vegans I know are supportive of the LGBT community.  

 

Either way often people are raised by their parents to be prejudice.   A 50s movie that covers this topic is The Tin Star with Anthony Perkins and Henry Fonda.     The subject here is the hate of Indians and one 'half-breed' child.   The white mother of the child just doesn't understand why so many people in town hate her child and Fonda says something like they were raised to hate indians.   The way Fonda says the line makes it clear he isn't defending these folks but just providing inslight.   (Fonda's stotic persona was good at these type of lines).

The level of bigotry expressed by his "Just being honest" is not really going to be accepted without a challenge. Any explanations for the roots of his prejudice don't excuse his choice to remain so in 2014, when clearly many are changing their previous held less tolerent

beliefs. That he is not among them yet is unfortunate. I can imagine the reactions here if a person went on a nearly identicalrant, but instead was a racial bigot and not a homopobe. I doubt if any would offer up excuses for his nonsense which seems to forgive it.

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I think it was Kevin McCarthy who saved Monty's life after the auto wreck; stopped Monty from choking on his own blood and a tooth that was stuck in his throat.  I may be wrong, but I thought it was KM.

 

   (Another actor who left a party a few years later and didn't survive:  Ernie Kovacs).

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The level of bigotry expressed by his "Just being honest" is not really going to be accepted without a challenge. Any explanations for the roots of his prejudice don't excuse his choice to remain so in 2014, when clearly many are changing their previous held less tolerant beliefs. That he is not among them yet is unfortunate.

 

I guess it's the popularity level of a belief that's important.

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I think it was Kevin McCarthy who saved Monty's life after the auto wreck; stopped Monty from choking on his own blood and a tooth that was stuck in his throat.  I may be wrong, but I thought it was KM.

 

   (Another actor who left a party a few years later and didn't survive:  Ernie Kovacs).

I read that.it was.Liz Taylor who had done that; she was on the scene quickly, as he was coming down the hill from her house. She would feel guilty over the accident, since she had cajoled him to attend her dinner party, which he didn't want to do; I think he had been drinking and was worried about the winding curving road.

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I read that.it was.Liz Taylor who had done that; she was on the scene quickly, as he was coming down the hill from her house. She would feel guilty over the accident, since she had cajoled him to attend her dinner party, which he didn't want to do; I think he had been drinking and was worried about the winding curving road.

Yes, it was well reported to be Ms.Tylor who was first on the scene, pulled smashed teeth on which he was choking from his throat, and cradled him until help arrived. It is hard to watch Raintree County (besides it being a mediocre movie) and seeing the incongruity of Clift's pre/post accident appearances as the film plays out, as movies, including RC are not filmed in chronological order.

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