Jump to content
 
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...

Why do you think there are so many of the same movies repeated so often recently?


vic12
 Share

Recommended Posts

It's his, HelenBABY and I prefer my ilk as opposed to the "I couldn't care less for the most part" or "go with the flow" variety that always stand on the sidelines with a blank look on their faces.

 

Yes, that's me. Just a big old blank. Thanks for the compliment. I'm too old to give a rip.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

James,

 

I'm not asking for all the nitty gritty such as copies of their lease agreements. I don't see what the harm would be in TCM making a general ON AIR comment to their loyal fans regarding the fact that TCM needs to lease films, period. It has been explained very simply by Rey and others on these threads for years without getting into too much financial detail. We don't have to know that. All I want is for TCM to admit that there is no library of films, that all films have to be leased and are tied to certain rental agreements, and TCM does not have the capital required to obtain all the films that people request. Perhaps if people heard it from Robert OR Ben they'd stop asking for something they now know, for a fact, they will never get. It's not rocket science, it's called leveling with the folks who watch the channel, buy their products, and pay their bills. 

 

I don't see the value with TCM making an 'on air' comment (something that you really stress).     The problem with an on-air comment is that TCM doesn't really have a fixed prime time to make such a comment so that a majority of TCM viewers would see such a comment.       e.g.  unlike a network, TCM can't use the time before their highest rated show to make such a comment so it reaches the most viewers.    

 

Yea,  TCM could do so at 8:00 EDT but that isn't prime time for those,  like me,  on the west coast.   

 

I guess TCM could make such a comment during the intros of the Essentials.     But otherwise since TCM's programming is all over the place TCM would have to have this comment played multiple times per day for a few weeks and that could get old real quick.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There could be very solid reasons why TCM doesn't disclose more information about how they lease movies.   e.g.  the lease may have restrictions related to the disclosure of price,  how often one has to show a film during the lease period,  if one has to show all movies leases as part of a bundle etc...

 

NOW:  I would love to know more about such things.

 

I have a feeling it is all very complicated, with a lot of business secrets, so not all companies know what other companies are doing, and with a lot of complex negotiations going on all the time.

 

Big business can be very complex, with the goal in mind to save money and get the best deal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the use of the term "library" is largely a matter of semantics. Here's something interesting I heard Robert Osborne say when interviewed for Gilbert Gottfried's podcast. He was referencing, as I recall, a Paramount film - sorry, can't remember which one - and he said, "I'm very pleased that we now have it in the TCM library ... at least, for a while."

 

To me, that indicated that to an employee of TCM, the "library" simply means whatever films TCM has the right to show at any given moment. Corporations are full of buzzwords that get applied within the corporation with a meaning completely unrelated to how they are used in real life. I used to work for a bookstore where every time you broke for a meal, it was called "lunch", no matter the time of day. Occasionally, I would say I was breaking for "dinner", you know, if it was nighttime, and every employee at the store would look at me like I was speaking Martian. Literally, they couldn't comprehend what I was saying. I would have to correct myself and say "lunch" before they understood what I meant. I was never good at getting with the corporate lingo bit. I suspect that in a similar manner, TCM employees say "library" in a corporate-speak way that makes sense to them and not necessarily to the rest of humanity.

 

I get why people find the term misleading. But a lot of anger and wringing of hands over the idea that there's some sort of library conspiracy or that TCM is deliberately lying to us doesn't seem very productive to me.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

i'm replying before i read the posts below, but if memory serves me correctly (and it rarely does) December is often a weak month schedule-wise. Honestly, I think it's because the budget done run out 

 

There were enough new acquisitions and a fair variety for the most part in 2014, so if they gotta show The Yearling a couple of times to cut corners at the end of the annum, so be it. 

 

ps- I also kind of think the whole "Cary Grant as SOTM" idea was because his credits include a fair amount of public domain titles and...I dunno, they may not have a Library anymore, but i daresay they got easy access to the MGM/RKO titles for sure because they do show up so often.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the use of the term "library" is largely a matter of semantics. Here's something interesting I heard Robert Osborne say when interviewed for Gilbert Gottfried's podcast. He was referencing, as I recall, a Paramount film - sorry, can't remember which one - and he said, "I'm very pleased that we now have it in the TCM library ... at least, for a while."

 

To me, that indicated that to an employee of TCM, the "library" simply means whatever films TCM has the right to show at any given moment. Corporations are full of buzzwords that get applied within the corporation with a meaning completely unrelated to how they are used in real life. I used to work for a bookstore where every time you broke for a meal, it was called "lunch", no matter the time of day. Occasionally, I would say I was breaking for "dinner", you know, if it was nighttime, and every employee at the store would look at me like I was speaking Martian. Literally, they couldn't comprehend what I was saying. I would have to correct myself and say "lunch" before they understood what I meant. I was never good at getting with the corporate lingo bit. I suspect that in a similar manner, TCM employees say "library" in a corporate-speak way that makes sense to them and not necessarily to the rest of humanity.

 

I get why people find the term misleading. But a lot of anger and wringing of hands over the idea that there's some sort of library conspiracy or that TCM is deliberately lying to us doesn't seem very productive to me.

Thanks for mentioning that. So it proves there is a 'library' in some definable way, especially if Osborne keeps saying it. And of course they do have a library of films, just like we all have a library of films in our homes. It's like going into a restaurant. You wouldn't go in and eat at a place where they have no refrigerator and no food in their kitchen. :)

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 i daresay they got easy access to the MGM/RKO titles for sure because they do show up so often.

Exactly. They wouldn't have gone into the cable business if they didn't have a guaranteed group of films at their disposal. There's a reason the MGM, RKO, WB, and UA films show up so often. You need to be in possession of product if you are going to stay in business and sell something to the public. Common sense.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's hard to imagine a member who has less of value to say on these boards than does infinite1, so a rip would be far too great a response anyway.

Funny, darkblue, I often feel the same way about you, but I respect your right to be irrelevant. Wish you could show the same respect to someone you imagine to be on your level.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Funny, darkblue, I often feel the same way about you, but I respect your right to be irrelevant. Wish you could show the same respect to someone you imagine to be on your level.

This thread is turning quite vicious. Play nice people. Everyone, not just the above poster or the other poster mentioned in what I quoted, needs to stop throwing those little digs in at each other and use the ignore feature correctly. 

 

This board is a place to discuss film, it is not a place to get your jollies belittling other people whose opinions you cannot obviously tolerate or respect.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for mentioning that. So it proves there is a 'library' in some definable way, especially if Osborne keeps saying it. And of course they do have a library of films, just like we all have a library of films in our homes. It's like going into a restaurant. You wouldn't go in and eat at a place where they have no refrigerator and no food in their kitchen. :)

 

Of course TCM has a library of films if the term is used to mean:  the films TCM currently has under lease.   But many members here use the term to indicate all the films that are owned by Time Warner.     So we are still left with the question of;  can TCM show all the films TW owns?    I assume the answer is NO  (again, stressing ALL films).     E.g.  if TW provides an exclusive lease to another station TW couldn't lease that film to TCM.     Also, TW may wish to sell DVD of films and NOT lease those films to TCM until the market sales for the DVD have peeked.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Of course TCM has a library of films if the term is used to mean:  the films TCM currently has under lease.   But many members here use the term to indicate all the films that are owned by Time Warner.     So we are still left with the question of;  can TCM show all the films TW owns?    I assume the answer is NO  (again, stressing ALL films).     E.g.  if TW provides an exclusive lease to another station TW couldn't lease that film to TCM.     Also, TW may wish to sell DVD of films and NOT lease those films to TCM until the market sales for the DVD have peeked.

Agreed. But one of the points of the business model is to use showings on the network to stimulate home video sales. So they do have to show some titles right as they are being released on DVD, and rereleased on Blu-ray. Also, they have to show films that are in those books they are promoting in those tie-in deals with others. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Agreed. But one of the points of the business model is to use showings on the network to stimulate home video sales. So they do have to show some titles right as they are being released on DVD, and rereleased on Blu-ray. Also, they have to show films that are in those books they are promoting in those tie-in deals with others. 

 

I always wondered about that part of TCM's business model.    My natural assumption is that showing the movie reduces the odds someone will purchase the DVD, especially since one can record the film.    But those in the marketing department must assume that showing the movie promotes the movie and increases the odds that someone will purchase the DVD,  even after seeing the movie on TCM (e.g. one likes the movie so much they want the DVD).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I always wondered about that part of TCM's business model.    My natural assumption is that showing the movie reduces the odds someone will purchase the DVD, especially since one can record the film.    But those in the marketing department must assume that showing the movie promotes the movie and increases the odds that someone will purchase the DVD,  even after seeing the movie on TCM (e.g. one likes the movie so much they want the DVD).

I think it's about how many times they show it. Obviously, if it is on every month, then nobody will need to buy it. Right? But if they air it once and people don't see it again-- they may go buy it, to get a clear copy and extra DVD features. 

 

Those books though are the latest big thing. That mother's day book, and all those ads, drove me almost insane. LOL I thought okay, one more showing of MILDRED PIERCE so they can sell another 20,000 copies of that damned thing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Exactly. They wouldn't have gone into the cable business if they didn't have a guaranteed group of films at their disposal. There's a reason the MGM, RKO, WB, and UA films show up so often. You need to be in possession of product if you are going to stay in business and sell something to the public. Common sense.

 

But, that's just the point. They don't have a guaranteed group of films at their disposal, that is if you believe some of the people who have indicated as much in this thread. Or are you saying some of the people here lack common sense? And if TCM doesn't have a library or a guaranteed group of films at their disposal, just what is it that TCM is selling to the public by constantly repeating that they do? You tell me. They are not speaking to co-workers, they are speaking to an audience of average folks who know nothing about TCM's business practices. TCM(REPRESENTED BY BOB OSBORNE) is called on to give interviews to magazines that aren't savy enough to challenge what they are told. TCM is continuing to perpetuate an image that does not exist in reality. So, maybe that helps TCM to sell tickets to film festivals and boat trips, and maybe MOST folks HERE feel that makes it all right. But I don't. A lie is a lie is a lie, even if it is unintentional and it is not corrected by the ones spreading it. And if, for some reason, they are bound by some company policy not to divulge how they conduct their true business practices, hence the conspiracy theory, why don't they just keep their mouths shut, talk about the film in question, and stop saying anything about a library at all? Answer, it sounds good and it's too good to resist blabbing about.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A few years ago one of the librarians of the local Atlanta TCM film library was a guest programmer, and he said that the reason they can so quickly put together a "salute" to a star who recently died is because they can use films they have in Atlanta in their own TCM film library. They might have to pay for their use, but there is an Atlanta TCM film library, plus all the other sources outside of Atlanta, such as other film libraries and distributors that TCM obtains films from.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

But, that's just the point. They don't have a guaranteed group of films at their disposal, that is if you believe some of the people who have indicated as much in this thread. Or are you saying some of the people here lack common sense? And if TCM doesn't have a library or a guaranteed group of films at their disposal, just what is it that TCM is selling to the public by constantly repeating that they do? You tell me. They are not speaking to co-workers, they are speaking to an audience of average folks who know nothing about TCM's business practices. TCM(REPRESENTED BY BOB OSBORNE) is called on to give interviews to magazines that aren't savy enough to challenge what they are told. TCM is continuing to perpetuate an image that does not exist in reality. So, maybe that helps TCM to sell tickets to film festivals and boat trips, and maybe MOST folks HERE feel that makes it all right. But I don't. A lie is a lie is a lie, even if it is unintentional and it is not corrected by the ones spreading it. And if, for some reason, they are bound by some company policy not to divulge how they conduct their true business practices, hence the conspiracy theory, why don't they just keep their mouths shut, talk about the film in question, and stop saying anything about a library at all? Answer, it sounds good and it's too good to resist blabbing about.

You're right about the festival and boat trips. I think that part of the business model is a glorified pyramid scheme-- they are using these movies to get people to build lifestyle choices through the network which is very odd to me. Next thing you know they will have TCM time share condos, and people will go ga-ga over that. 

 

But I think your views about the library-- does it exist, does it not exist-- almost plays like an Oliver Stone conspiracy theory. Obviously, they have access to a bunch of films. They can't not have films to show. I think it's safe to say they, TCM, Ted Turner's cable TV descendants, own GONE WITH THE WIND. Someone up there in Turner Media Heaven owns that movie. It doesn't just float in the clouds waiting for someone to rent it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

about the library-- does it exist, does it not exist-- almost plays like an Oliver Stone conspiracy theory. Obviously, they have access to a bunch of films.

I think it is probably somewhat complicated. The way big companies are today, there are several companies with "Time" "Warner" and "Turner" in their names.

 

If I understand it correctly, there is a film (now video) library in Atlanta.... i.e. a room filled with films that are in the right electronic format and ready to grab and show. You walk down the hallway, open a door, and there is the TURNER FILM LIBRARY. Although Turner might have to pay a "rental" fee to some other branch of the "Time" or "Warner" or "Turner" conglomerate group of sister/brother companies.

 

And also, I'll bet that TCM has -- on file -- copies of films owned by other companies that they can store in their library but that are owned by those other companies, yet tied to TCM by contracts that let TCM decide if and when they want or need to show the films, such as when some famous actor dies.

 

There was a Turner lawyer who was on the air as a guest programmer a few years ago, and he said he was actually employed by Time-Warner (or one of the other TCM-related companies), but as such, he was able to also be a lawyer for TCM. Doh?

 

And also, some on-air people at TCM might call ALL the films they have, rent, use, buy, borrow, etc as an overall "vast" film library "cloud", with the physical location of the films being some in Atlanta, some in New York, some in Hollywood, and some in a Salt Mine storage facility in Kansas.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think it is probably somewhat complicated. The way big companies are today, there are several companies with "Time" "Warner" and "Turner" in their names.

 

If I understand it correctly, there is a film (now video) library in Atlanta.... i.e. a room filled with films that are in the right electronic format and ready to grab and show. You walk down the hallway, open a door, and there is the TURNER FILM LIBRARY. Although Turner might have to pay a "rental" fee to some other branch of the "Time" or "Warner" or "Turner" conglomerate group of sister/brother companies.

 

And also, I'll bet that TCM has -- on file -- copies of films owned by other companies that they can store in their library but that are owned by those other companies, yet tied to TCM by contracts that let TCM decide if and when they want or need to show the films, such as when some famous actor dies.

 

There was a Turner lawyer who was on the air as a guest programmer a few years ago, and he said he was actually employed by Time-Warner (or one of the other TCM-related companies), but as such, he was able to also be a lawyer for TCM. Doh?

 

And also, some on-air people at TCM might call ALL the films they have, rent, use, buy, borrow, etc as an overall "vast" film library "cloud", with the physical location of the films being some in Atlanta, some in New York, some in Hollywood, and some in a Salt Mine storage facility in Kansas.

Yes, I think that's it. But for some who like to keep re-running those Tabesh quotes, they are going to find fault with you because Mr. T did not explain it that way. 

 

I think the biggest thing here is that several times Osborne has said library, and he keeps saying it. Ben has also said library during a wraparound in the past year. So if these two faces of TCM are saying library, then there is a library of some kind, no matter what we keep attributing to Tabesh. Personally, I think Tabesh tells some tall tales, because he doesn't want to give away too much about the inner-workings of their negotiations and deals. 

Edited by TCMModerator1
Insults
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

But, that's just the point. They don't have a guaranteed group of films at their disposal, that is if you believe some of the people who have indicated as much in this thread. Or are you saying some of the people here lack common sense? And if TCM doesn't have a library or a guaranteed group of films at their disposal, just what is it that TCM is selling to the public by constantly repeating that they do? You tell me. They are not speaking to co-workers, they are speaking to an audience of average folks who know nothing about TCM's business practices. TCM(REPRESENTED BY BOB OSBORNE) is called on to give interviews to magazines that aren't savy enough to challenge what they are told. TCM is continuing to perpetuate an image that does not exist in reality. So, maybe that helps TCM to sell tickets to film festivals and boat trips, and maybe MOST folks HERE feel that makes it all right. But I don't. A lie is a lie is a lie, even if it is unintentional and it is not corrected by the ones spreading it. And if, for some reason, they are bound by some company policy not to divulge how they conduct their true business practices, hence the conspiracy theory, why don't they just keep their mouths shut, talk about the film in question, and stop saying anything about a library at all? Answer, it sounds good and it's too good to resist blabbing about.

 

What lie is TCM telling?   The library of films TCM has is the films they currently have under lease.   Do you have any evidence RO or any other representative of TCM has said otherwise?      Again,  I wish TCM would show way less repeats.   e.g.  I was looking at the book The Films of Bette Davis and there are a lot of Warner Brother less known Davis films that TCM does NOT show.    Time Warner owns the rights to these films.   So why doesn't TCM lease these from the other TW company?     I would love to know the reason.    BUT the reason maybe as simple as the programmers don't feel TCM viewers are interested in these lesser known Davis films, so they show Now Voyager,  Dark Victory,  etc..   instead.  

 

I think you have seen the Stone movie JFK once to often!  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What lie is TCM telling?   The library of films TCM has is the films they currently have under lease.   Do you have any evidence RO or any other representative of TCM has said otherwise?      Again,  I wish TCM would show way less repeats.   e.g.  I was looking at the book The Films of Bette Davis and there are a lot of Warner Brother less known Davis films that TCM does NOT show.    Time Warner owns the rights to these films.   So why doesn't TCM lease these from the other TW company?     I would love to know the reason.    BUT the reason maybe as simple as the programmers don't feel TCM viewers are interested in these lesser known Davis films, so they show Now Voyager,  Dark Victory,  etc..   instead.  

 

I think you have seen the Stone movie JFK once to often!  

 

 

James,

 

As the staff have indicated in various interviews over the years, TCM does try to rent more films from the Warner Brothers film library. However, there are restrictions on certain films such as those released through the Warner Archives. Warner Archive releases have at least a one year moratorium on them before they can be made available to TCM. 

 

The other hitch is that though TCM is a division of Time Warner, they do not get the films for free nor do they get a a price break on the films in the Warner film library. They have to pay the going rate as any other channel. This includes film titles that they used to own before Ted Turner merged his company with Time Warner back in the mid-1990s.

 

So, as much as they would love more access to more Warner films, there are budgetary constraints they have to consider as their monthly budget is only so large and with the cuts that Time Warner (especially the Turner empire) has gone through the last four months, the TCM budget for leasing/renting films may have been reduced.

 

We will likely find out more about this at the TCM Film Festival this spring until then, I recommend reading Will McKinley's "Cinematically Insane" column as he often interviews TCM staffers about various subjects: http://willmckinley.wordpress.com/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

James,

 

As the staff have indicated in various interviews over the years, TCM does try to rent more films from the Warner Brothers film library. However, there are restrictions on certain films such as those released through the Warner Archives. Warner Archive releases have at least a one year moratorium on them before they can be made available to TCM. 

 

The other hitch is that though TCM is a division of Time Warner, they do not get the films for free nor do they get a a price break on the films in the Warner film library. They have to pay the going rate as any other channel. This includes film titles that they used to own before Ted Turner merged his company with Time Warner back in the mid-1990s.

 

So, as much as they would love more access to more Warner films, there are budgetary constraints they have to consider as their monthly budget is only so large and with the cuts that Time Warner (especially the Turner empire) has gone through the last four months, the TCM budget for leasing/renting films may have been reduced.

 

We will likely find out more about this at the TCM Film Festival this spring until then, I recommend reading Will McKinley's "Cinematically Insane" column as he often interviews TCM staffers about various subjects: http://willmckinley.wordpress.com/

 

So, James, TopBilled, and Fred, what do you think of Izcutter's explanation? Sort of kills the idea of a TCM film library doesn't it? James, if what Izcutter is saying is true, then why would this not rise to the level of a lie on the part of TCM to keep maintaining on air that they still have a library? And if it's just a matter of semantics as some suggest, and TCM's definition of a TCM library means something entirely different from what any normal individual, who has no access to message board info, film festivals, or mind reading abilities, would construe from the words "TCM library", then I don't understand the problem with a simple explanation on air from TCM explaining just what the heck they mean by "TCM library". You folks keep telling me they don't have to, it's their channel, and it's their right to keep giving out misleading information on air. I want to know what's the harm in them explaining the truth? Would it be damaging to their brand and their reputation to admit on air that they have to rent films like anyone else. Izcutter doesn't think so.      

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, James, TopBilled, and Fred, what do you think of Izcutter's explanation? Sort of kills the idea of a TCM film library doesn't it? James, if what Izcutter is saying is true, then why would this not rise to the level of a lie on the part of TCM to keep maintaining on air that they still have a library? And if it's just a matter of semantics as some suggest, and TCM's definition of a TCM library means something entirely different from what any normal individual, who has no access to message board info, film festivals, or mind reading abilities, would construe from the words "TCM library", then I don't understand the problem with a simple explanation on air from TCM explaining just what the heck they mean by "TCM library". You folks keep telling me they don't have to, it's their channel, and it's their right to keep giving out misleading information on air. I want to know what's the harm in them explaining the truth? Would it be damaging to their brand and their reputation to admit on air that they have to rent films like anyone else. Izcutter doesn't think so.      

 

Again,  show me an actual statement RO or another representative of TCM made that implied TCM has access to ALL the films in the Warner Film 'library'.    I really don't recall such a statement being made.

 

The fact Lzcutter has said what he said implies (at least to me),  that TCM is NOT trying to hide anything.  

 

But clearly you goal here wasn't the same as mine;  My goal was to get a better understanding related to TCM ability to access the films in the TW library.    That goal has been meet.

 

Your goal is to play a 'got ya' game.   If saying 'I got them,  I win',  makes your day,   go for it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

© 2022 Turner Classic Movies Inc. All Rights Reserved Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Cookie Settings
×
×
  • Create New...