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8 hours ago, laffite said:

With respect, he didn't have to do it. He offered and she accepted. Lesser folk might have not even offered, given her problematic ways. And I'm sure he knew that he would not cure her. That was not intention, my guess. He wanted to help. I feel he might have felt sorry for her a little.

I recall seeing Olivier years later on The Merv Griffin Show, he spoke about Marilyn. He said looking back now, he feels she might have been schizophrenic and working with her was "hell". Merv said "But it must have been a nice version of hell.". He replied "No... it wasn't"

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El Dorado (1966)

I recall back in 1967 debating as to which John Wayne western I would go to the show to see, El Dorado or The War Wagon. I went to the latter because it co-starred Kirk Douglas.

Last evening I watched El Dorado again, Wayne's second last film to be directed by Howard Hawks. In many respects it is a partial re-hash of Rio Bravo, and it plays, in its familiar ways, like old comfort food, I'm sure, for Wayne fans. This time the Duke is a gunslinger who decides to help sheriff-turned-drunk Robert Mitchum when he learns some hired guns will be headed to Mitchum's town after being hired by a local cattleman seeking to expand his empire.

El Dorado (1966 ) | OldMoviesaregreat

Truth is, re-hash or not, it's still quite entertaining, even if none of the action scenes are staged by Hawks with the same kind of panache he had brought to past productions. Wayne is Wayne, romancing a beautiful and spirited Charlene Holt, 31 years his junior. James Caan is fun as a dude cowboy named "Mississippi" who throws a mean knife but doesn't know anything about guns so is given a shotgun that can bring down anything that gets in front of it. Ed Asner plays the under written role of the local cattleman in a performance that fails to make an impression a few years before he did make a great impression with a wonderfully written part as Lou Grant in The Mary Tyler Moore Show. A scarface Christopher George, on the other hand, does make a smooth impression as a professional gunman who regards Wayne with respect (and wants to see, of course, how things will come out between them in a gunfight).

But best of all is Mitchum, particularly in any of his scenes as a rummy sheriff laughed at by the town. A few of Mitchum's drunk scenes are played for laughs, such as when Duke konks him over the head with a bucket and Bob stands cross eyed for a moment before collapsing. Other moments are played more realistically such as when he doubles over from withdrawal pains (or threatens to) when it's getting down to the action.

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This is the only film in which Wayne and Mitchum were co-starred (excluding the all star Longest Day, in which I can't recall if they shared any scenes) and they have great chemistry. I wish they could have worked together more often. Even in this film, made in the latter stages of their careers, particularly Wayne's, their scenes together really work.

In retrospect while I didn't make a bad decision when I picked The War Wagon over this one at the show El Dorado holds up well, maybe even a bit better. Either way Wayne fans (as well as those of Mitchum and Douglas) will probably be satisfied.

Pin on Best in the West!

3 out of 4

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15 minutes ago, TomJH said:

El Dorado or The War Wagon

I also chose The War Wagon. It remained one of my favorite films all those years until I saw it recently on TCM and sat there disappointed at the cheesiness. That terrible canyon mat job under the bridge that gets the nitro glycerin treatment. The theme song, sheesh. It impressed the hell out me at 10 years old though.

Love El Dorado and Rio Bravo. Saw The Cowboys recently and I've watched it twice so far. I think it's probably second only to True Grit for John Wayne westerns. Bruce Dern needed to smacked up side the head. . . "love me in Berkeley" . . dumb azz. 

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4 minutes ago, Moe Howard said:

I also chose The War Wagon. It remained one of my favorite films all those years until I saw it recently on TCM and sat there disappointed at the cheesiness. That terrible canyon mat job under the bridge that gets the nitro glycerin treatment. The theme song, sheesh. It impressed the hell out me at 10 years old though.

Love El Dorado and Rio Bravo. Saw The Cowboys recently and I've watched it twice so far. I think it's probably second only to True Grit for John Wayne westerns. Bruce Dern needed to smacked up side the head. . . "love me in Berkeley" . . dumb azz. 

I watched The War Wagon again last year and found it quite entertaining, primarily because of Kirk Douglas's enjoyably flashy performance. Speaking of flashing, if I recall correctly, there was a moment at the show in which Kirk showed off his butt (the joke was that he had his holster strapped on even when he had no pants) but I believe that cheeky moment on Kirk's part has since been excised, even from the DVD of the film.

You pick True Grit and The Cowboys as your two favourite Wayne westerns, do you, Moe? True Grit was another one I saw at the show when it came out but I can't call it a favourite of mine. I regard The Searchers as Wayne's greatest western, with Red River, Hondo and Rio Bravo all deserving honourable mention. I guess I should sit down to watch Stagecoach again some time, as it's been quite a while since I last viewed it.

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On 7/22/2021 at 11:25 AM, Shank Asu said:

During the Meet and Greet with the Hosts of TCM at the 2021 Classic Film Fest, I asked the hosts what is their favorite film that they could never bring themselves to watch again and Eddie answered the question with Gaspar Noe's Irreversible (2002) although he said he didn't want to bring attention to it and have people seek it out.  Two months later someone (still unknown) gifted me the DVD and I watched it last night.

Crazy that someone unknown gifted you that DVD.

Also, I remember him saying that. The Q+A  was great...wrote down several movies mentioned that I will be watching soon. Not sure if I'm ready for it, but this one is on the list.

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1 hour ago, Det Jim McLeod said:

I recall seeing Olivier years later on The Merv Griffin Show, he spoke about Marilyn. He said looking back now, he feels she might have been schizophrenic and working with her was "hell". Merv said "But it must have been a nice version of hell.". He replied "No... it wasn't"

...and yet he still helped her. The movie was done and he agreed to re-shoot scenes, despite the hell. In the video below, he says that he would have been fine just fine with the film, saying he wouldn't suffer as a director or an actor if those scenes were not re-shot, but he told her he would be willing to do it because he wanted her to the best she could be. Also, he used the term "divided personality" in a kindly sort of way that does not connote with the severity that "schizophrenia" brings.

 

 

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Moving to a different genre:

Thank God It's Friday (1978) - 👎

Much as I hate to condescend a film by calling it a "time capsule" of when it was made, I've been on a craze lately for digging up the 70's movies I either couldn't or wouldn't have seen in paying theaters, just to see what I missed at the age when sixth grade and school-night bedtimes were the center of my universe.  One particular problem is that there were not that many Disco Musicals as we commonly assume (there was the gritty Brooklyn-drama one, and Grease and Xanadu don't count), so I would estimate this was one of the only other wide-release movies to try and take on the craze in a true time-capsule sense...For good or bad.

Like most trend-movies, it tries to sell the trend to the suburban mainstream, with an interconnected Love Boat-style sitcom story of five sets of newbies taking their first "trendy" night at the local discotheque:  A pair of high-school girls sneaking in to win a dance contest, a Mary & Rhoda pair of singles trying not to look for Mr. Wrong, a suburban married couple trying something "new" on the way out of their anniversary dinner, and Donna Summer, in her first (and last) movie role as a kid looking for her big show-biz break, before saving the evening with her Oscar-winning disco hit.  This would all be cute if it had more professional actors (like a very early Jeff Goldblum as the disco's oily owner), but as it is, it tries WAY too hard to pitch itself at a borscht-belt sitcom level for us suburban folk, and a little of it goes on way too long.  The bright spot of the entire movie goes to Chick Vennera, who steals the third act as a wacky-Latin-stereotype king of the dance floor, who shows more energy in the parking lot than anything going on inside:

One of my favorite jokes in Saturday Night Fever is the scene where Tony stops at the dance studio, where the owner makes more money teaching classes of the "hottest new steps" to dopey suburban people.  But for those looking for a "70's time capsule", it's surprising how negative the movie's humor takes for granted most people's ideas of discos for the time--Everyone wanted in on the trend, but seemed to have no illusions that an actual disco was where you went to hit and be hit on, by greasy single guys in gold chains and drugged-out party girls in tinsel wigs.  (There's a funny line where the Mary & Rhoda girls give their list of Mr. Wrong warning signs--"No polyester, no pickup lines, no Zodiac symbols.")  Everyone knew NY's legendary Studio 54 was a pink snowball, and yet the police raids still took the nation by surprise, before it all came crashing down.  Today, like then, it's just best looked at from a wishful distance--We get the impression it wasn't the music that killed disco, it was the discos that killed disco.

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Yep. I think I do pick those two. Both are different in their own way.  The Searchers has to be the most beautifully shot film. Too bad it's gotten all this stink on it, usually from well intentioned types who haven't looked deeply enough into those problematic topics.  Of particular note is the rescued girls/women. There's this notion that their insane behavior is result of simply having sex with their captors. This is laughable. As if there had been some sort of courtship. I guess ritualistic slaughter of family members, burning your house to the ground before getting drug off to the teepee for some playful rape, was just the Native American version of dinner and movie, before 'consensual' sex! 

Now Stagecoach, I have to say, I like the Ann Margret version a little better because, Ann Margret!

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11 hours ago, laffite said:

With respect, he didn't have to do it. He offered and she accepted. Lesser folk might have not even offered, given her problematic ways. And I'm sure he knew that he would not cure her. That was not intention, my guess. He wanted to help. I feel he might have felt sorry for her a little.

That's very nice.  And I think it's very possible that LARRY wanted any film he appeared in to reflect well on him.  There is no doubt he was a pro. 

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1 hour ago, EricJ said:

One particular problem is that there were not that many Disco Musicals

Does it HAVE to be a disco-musical? I consider Tommy and Sargent Peppers 70s musical time capsules. 

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Finally caught up with some of last week's noir films on On Demand:

Los Tallos Amargos- read the discussion on it on the other thread and i think the murder was justified (story-wise) by the protagonist through the paranoia of dreams and voices that plagued  him.  Decent film.  Maybe not as great as Eddie thinks, but very cool to watch a former lost noir film from Argentina.

Pulp- really enjoyed this and much more than Get Carter.  The little jokes were great and i loved seeing Rooney in his role and hamming it up although it is a bit degrading to see a legend looking schlubby in his briefs.

The Shooting (1966) Little seen western starring Jack Nicholson as a hired gunslinger.  A very existential film and somewhat of an acid trip. Recommend.

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1 hour ago, Shank Asu said:

The Shooting (1966)

Apparently free on Youtube. Went looking for a trailer to refresh my memory 20 minutes in, and a short nap later, I realized it was the movie.

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1 hour ago, Shank Asu said:

Finally caught up with some of last week's noir films on On Demand:

Los Tallos Amargos- read the discussion on it on the other thread and i think the murder was justified (story-wise) by the protagonist through the paranoia of dreams and voices that plagued  him.  Decent film.  Maybe not as great as Eddie thinks, but very cool to watch a former lost noir film from Argentina.

 

What does that mean ?   How does the protagonist's   "paranoia of dreams and voices"  justify the murder?  It's the victim's fault that his murderer had bad dreams?  

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25 minutes ago, misswonderly3 said:

What does that mean ?   How does the protagonist's   "paranoia of dreams and voices"  justify the murder?  It's the victim's fault that his murderer had bad dreams?  

That's why i said story-wise it justified why the character would commit the murder, not that he was justified to kill.  Someone had made the comment that they didn't see how the protagonist would do the murder just because someone planted the idea that he was being taken advantage of.  But the film clearly shows the idea of being used affecting him mentally leading up to the murder. 

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34 minutes ago, Moe Howard said:

Apparently free on Youtube. Went looking for a trailer to refresh my memory 20 minutes in, and a short nap later, I realized it was the movie.

I watched it on HBO MAX.  Had never heard of it before that.

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8 hours ago, Moe Howard said:

Does it HAVE to be a disco-musical? I consider Tommy and Sargent Peppers 70s musical time capsules. 

Well, even they weren't disco:  Tommy was as much of The Who as survived Ken Russell, and Sgt. Pepper was as much of the Beatles as survived...the impossible.  😣 Although, yes, I realized I was forgetting Can't Stop the Music--Unquestionably the Village People fit the musical classification.

....Heck, even the Lambada got two films!

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I've never seen IRREVERSIBLE; I have no plans to do so.  I won't Lie and say I'll watch it.   I've only read about it and heard about from those who've seen it.   Just the way it sounds to me is like a '70s or '80s exploitation movie trying to be more 'important' and 'say something'.  Could it be that IRREVERSIBLE is simply self-important twaddle that's fundamentally dishonest?  Trying to be some kind of a 'serious' movie and fool viewers into thinking it's something more than  a plain ol' graphic exploitation film starring a very attractive leading lady?  I don't know . . . but the impressions I have of the movie after reading about it and chatting with some folks who've seen it has left me thinking I'll just stick with honest-to-God exploitation movies that are made to make a buck and be sleazy without any underlying pretensions of making a serious statement about Society ( or some sh!t like that).

In regards to EL DORADO I view it as "Rio Bravo With Older People"; the stars are now older and less mobile!  I like EL DORADO better than RIO BRAVO.  (I think Charlene Holt was only 21 years younger than John Wayne, tho, and not 31). 

I like THE WAR WAGON, too, but I only watch it on my 1983-issue VHS tape.  It's not in W/S, as you'd expect, but I don't need Hi•Def to watch a 1967 Western and see all the shortcomings in regards to the 'backgrounds'.  I'm surprised at how well that old tape plays.  → Even has the 'Visit Universal Studios' promo at the end with the picture of the old-time tram car.  If anyone reading this has watched old MCA or MCA/Universal tapes you'll know the promo I'm referring to. 

(ALSO:  Note there are no Kirk Buns on display on the 1st VHS release of "War Wagon".  You can tell where you'd see the 'Kirk Buns' on display but the scene cuts out right as Kirk is walking away sans robe). 

@EricJ:  In regards to late-70s "time capsules", well, shucks, I've got a list of those you can look for if you fancy some 'nostagia trips' to go along with your recent viewing of "Thank God It's Friday".     😀

Here's a few:   RECORD CITY (1978), SKATETOWN U.S.A. (1979), ROLLER BOOGIE (1979), NOCTURNA (1978) →Dig the cartoon bats, VAN NUYS BLVD. (1979), MALIBU BEACH (1978), MALIBU HIGH (1979), THE VAN (1976), SUPERVAN (1977), DISCO FEVER (1978), SWAP MEET (1979), SUNSET COVE (1978), THE POM-POM GIRLS (1976), CHEERING SECTION (1977),  SUMMER SCHOOL (1977)  [aka:  "Mag Wheels"], GUMS (1976), THE CARHOPS (1975), STARHOPS (1978) and GRAD NIGHT (1980).    

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40 minutes ago, Mr. Gorman said:

(ALSO:  Note there are no Kirk Buns on display on the 1st VHS release of "War Wagon".  You can tell where you'd see the 'Kirk Buns' on display but the scene cuts out right as Kirk is walking away sans robe). 

Are we talking actual buns here or just his "pajamas". That was the joke right? Wayne is wearing his gun over his, Douglas comes in wearing a robe, goes back to his room and removes the robe and he too is wearing a gun over his PJs. Big laugh follows.

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2 hours ago, Mr. Gorman said:

Could it be that IRREVERSIBLE is simply self-important twaddle that's fundamentally dishonest?  Trying to be some kind of a 'serious' movie and fool viewers into thinking it's something more than  a plain ol' graphic exploitation film starring a very attractive leading lady?  I don't know . . .

Our local subscription-arthouse used to recut funny trailer commercials for their annual subscription card, by resubtitling foreign films--

One, for example, had execs at a corrupt Japanese board meeting discussing getting the subscription--At one point, an assistant asks "Sir, we've had a request from one patron who wants a refund on Enter the Void."  "No deal," replies the exec, "if he goes to a Gaspar Noe film, he should have known what he was in for."  

😆

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19 hours ago, TomJH said:

True Grit was another one I saw at the show when it came out

"Saw at the show" an archaic term that dates your generation. Your parents called theaters "at the show" shortened from the earliest term "picture show". I miss hearing the term, thanks! Another poster recently said similarly archaic term, "well cryin' out loud". Haven't heard that in decades!

judy-laughing-gif.gif

18 hours ago, Allhallowsday said:

That's very nice.  And I think it's very possible that LARRY wanted any film he appeared in to reflect well on him.  There is no doubt he was a pro. 

Agreed, well stated. I also think he understood much about the fragile inner psyche of actors from his years with Vivian Leigh.

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1 hour ago, TikiSoo said:

"Saw at the show" an archaic term that dates your generation. Your parents called theaters "at the show" shortened from the earliest term "picture show". I miss hearing the term, thanks! Another poster recently said similarly archaic term, "well cryin' out loud". Haven't heard that in decades!

judy-laughing-gif.gif

 

Well for cryin' out loud, TikiSoo, I suppose that's a nice way of calling me an old fogey. Look at that, even Judy is laughing at me.

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I haven't heard that term "at the show," but I could get used to it, honestly.

As for what I watched recently, Spartacus (1960)! I saw it first about a year and a half ago...was great seeing it again especially since I've seen a few other films with Jean Simmons since. It was my wife's first...she sometimes has trouble getting through the long ones, but not with this one.

 

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On 7/23/2021 at 11:13 AM, TomJH said:

there was a moment at the show in which Kirk showed off his butt (the joke was that he had his holster strapped on even when he had no pants) but I believe that cheeky moment on Kirk's part has since been excised, even from the DVD of the film.

Violating the director's artistic visions??? RELEASE THE BUTT CUT!

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