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23 minutes ago, jamesjazzguitar said:

Woody pays homage to other filmmakers by sometimes plagiarizing some of their work.      

 

 

 

No. Did you even read the post I wrote about that accusation?

I think you and Eric have an incorrect idea of what the word "plagiarize" means. Here's the first on-line definition I found:

 
 
  1. take (the work or an idea of someone else) and pass it off as one's own.
     
     
     
Woody definitely does not try to pass off other filmmakers' work as his own. Do you and Eric even know the difference between "plagiarize" and "tribute"? Woody Allen assumes that his viewers are familiar with those earlier films by people like Ingmar Bergman and Federico Fellini; it's like a joke that we're all in on, Allen and his audience. 

All art is built upon what has gone before it.  (gawk, that sounds awfully pretentious. But it's true.)

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On 2/8/2020 at 9:06 AM, TomJH said:

Cooper's character, McGregor, is identified as Scotch Canadian

Scotch is a delicious drink, the people are Scottish.🤷‍♂️

Miss Wonderly said: There is such a thing as sincere "homage" 

Beautifully & clearly explained in your post.

While I very much enjoy Woody Allen's nod to films that influenced him, I absolutely hate when a movie inserts old movie quotes or scenes just to get a "laugh". I see this most often in kids movies, whom have never seen the original movie (like Casablanca) Presumably, these cheap shots are put in as a joke for the parents, but they only know the "line",  usually not the movie or it's context.

How often do you hear someone yell, "Stella!" or "This is the beginning of a beautiful friendship" or "You're tearing me apart!" inappropriately?

I was once horrified by a 12 year old girl who when offered a gift, said; "I've always depended on the kindness of strangers" and had to explain the context of the quote to the parent. Oy!

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1 hour ago, TikiSoo said:

Scotch is a delicious drink, the people are Scottish.🤷‍♂️

 

Well I'm aware of the difference between the drink and the people, TikiSoo. I  used the terminology used in the film itself to describe Cooper's background. In listening to the film today, however, I find it a little difficult to tell (the soundtrack is a little muffled) and Gary Cooper either says "I'm Scotch Canadian myself" or "I'm Scott Canadian myself." Take your pick. It may be that he used the correct terminology. Oh, well, to quote Mr. Shakespeare, "Much ado  . . ." Well, you know the rest.

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13 hours ago, misswonderly3 said:

No. Did you even read the post I wrote about that accusation?

I think you and Eric have an incorrect idea of what the word "plagiarize" means. Here's the first on-line definition I found:

 
 
  1. take (the work or an idea of someone else) and pass it off as one's own.
     
     
     
Woody definitely does not try to pass off other filmmakers' work as his own. Do you and Eric even know the difference between "plagiarize" and "tribute"? Woody Allen assumes that his viewers are familiar with those earlier films by people like Ingmar Bergman and Federico Fellini; it's like a joke that we're all in on, Allen and his audience. 

All art is built upon what has gone before it.  (gawk, that sounds awfully pretentious. But it's true.)

In school I wrote an essay about Hamlet based on Coles Notes (forgetting, like a dummy, to list them in any footnotes). The professor was not pleased with me when he found out, dropping my essay "A" to an "F." I was hoping he might see my essay as a homage to the insights of Coles but he viewed it quite another way, especially when he found that my essay was close to a word for word reprise of what the notes had said.

Woody Allen, while influenced at times by some filmmakers he admires, never stole from them the way I did from Coles. He is definitely paying homage.

I, in turn, see the influence that some of Woody's films may have had on other filmmakers. When I watched Rob Reiner's When Harry Met Sally a year ago I kept thinking of Woody. There's undoubtedly better illustrations of the Woody influence than that but I can't think of any at the moment. The point is I still see the film as Reiner's work but with a nod to Woody in the process.

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On 2/8/2020 at 1:44 PM, LornaHansonForbes said:

it's a TERRIBLE SHAME this one doesn't work, because STANWYCK and BOGART has ALL TIME POTENTIAL just as BOGART and HEPBURN (KATHARINE) did.

But the souffle don't rise on this one and I don't know who to blame other than The Director.

There is no shame as far as I'm concerned. I liked it. One of Bogie's best. I thought it was suspenseful. The Wikipedia page issues some pretty harsh criticisms in a single paragraph that is scathing. Take every point and I disagree with every one of them. I liked Bogart expressiveness at the end. And of  course, knowing myself, it's no surprise I liked the English element although it got bad reviews from over there at the time. I loved ole Bogie crashing through the window. Babs was great and unlike the Wicki page I thought she excelled in the latter half of the film. The second Mrs Carroll was under duress at this time and Babs was strikingly more beautiful to boot with all that distress. I like precocious little girls (in a proper way). I can't stand Nigel Bruce and so that had to be endured. I would have enjoyed this movie a lot more if Ben had not issued the most disgusting spoiler in the intro I have ever heard. These things happen from time to time but this was particularly egregious and he should have known better. I am back to TCM after a long drought and therefore unaccustomed to the wraparound (is that what they call them?) and am having a lot of trouble with Mank. Way, way, way too much about the character and mental state of Mr Carrol and totally gratuitous. Not satisfied with his original idiocy he gave away another movie in the outro. Mark it as I set it down. I shall not allow myself to listen to single utterance more from him, and I have a DVR to accomplish it. I don't care about prefatory remarks anyway, no matter who it is (though I never found myself agitated with Mr O). It will be nice to shield myself from any further asinine comments from Mr M.  Now that I've got this down, I see my glass of milk has arrived. My gracious "hostess" has been so kind to bring it to me, although she has been acting a strangely lately. There was a certain gleam in her eye when she brought the milk, but I think that was from simply getting over my offensive remark earlier this afternoon. I'm sure she has forgiven me.

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MV5BNzVjOTk2NDMtYWQyNi00MmJlLWIzYjEtYWI3

On page 310 of this thread I posted about seeing La Otre a 1946 Mexican noir starring Dolores Del Rio.  I wasn't long into it when I had the feeling that this would make a good Bette Davis film.  It then twigged that this was indeed remade with Bette Davis as Dead Ringer (1964).

Stolen-Life-1939-film-images-51250ec2-88

Last night at the BFI Southbank I saw Stolen Life (1939) by Paul Czinner for British Paramount Pictures.  It stars Elisabeth Bergner and Michael Redgrave.  This is another twin sister film that was remade with Bette Davis.  In this case as A Stolen Life (1946).

The Bergner/Redgrave original was an enjoyable melodrama.  No more no less.   The BFI screens at least one film a month from their archive that cannot be found on dvd or television.  The curator pointed out that this film is ripe for restoration (the print was excellent) but the fly in the ointment is Paramount who want a fortune for the rights to do so.  As most collectors know good copies of early Paramount films are very hard to come by.  I saw another Bergner/Czinner film at Southbank a few years ago called Escape Me Never (1935) for which Bergner garnered an Oscar nomination.  That was later remade with Errol Flynn.  Again, the film print that was screened was really good but any copy that I have seen on the internet is barely watchable.

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I wasn't sure the proper place to post this-sorry if this is a faux pas:

I just saw this great short piece on CBS Sunday Morning about vintage Hollywood back drop paintings:

Any one of us classic film fans could ID those paintings in a second-esp the Singin In The Rain one!

I am so glad JC Backings is still a viable family owned business.

I absolutely prefer paintings to photos-the human eye "sees" a certain way and paintings just work better on film. Bright lit photos are too crisp and hard, seeming one dimensional. Although I was impressed with the modern day/night picture.

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9 hours ago, Bogie56 said:

MV5BNzVjOTk2NDMtYWQyNi00MmJlLWIzYjEtYWI3

On page 310 of this thread I posted about seeing La Otre a 1946 Mexican noir starring Dolores Del Rio.  I wasn't long into it when I had the feeling that this would make a good Bette Davis film.  It then twigged that this was indeed remade with Bette Davis as Dead Ringer (1964).

Stolen-Life-1939-film-images-51250ec2-88

Last night at the BFI Southbank I saw Stolen Life (1939) by Paul Czinner for British Paramount Pictures.  It stars Elisabeth Bergner and Michael Redgrave.  This is another twin sister film that was remade with Bette Davis.  In this case as A Stolen Life (1946).

The Bergner/Redgrave original was an enjoyable melodrama.  No more no less.   The BFI screens at least one film a month from their archive that cannot be found on dvd or television.  The curator pointed out that this film is ripe for restoration (the print was excellent) but the fly in the ointment is Paramount who want a fortune for the rights to do so.  As most collectors know good copies of early Paramount films are very hard to come by.  I saw another Bergner/Czinner film at Southbank a few years ago called Escape Me Never (1935) for which Bergner garnered an Oscar nomination.  That was later remade with Errol Flynn.  Again, the film print that was screened was really good but any copy that I have seen on the internet is barely watchable.

LOL! I wish TCM would run La Otra. I've been wanting to see the film for so long.......

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12 hours ago, laffite said:

IN RE: THE TWO MRS CARROLLS: There is no shame as far as I'm concerned. I liked it. One of Bogie's best. I thought it was suspenseful. The Wikipedia page issues some pretty harsh criticisms in a single paragraph that is scathing. Take every point and I disagree with every one of them. I liked Bogart expressiveness at the end. And of  course, knowing myself, it's no surprise I liked the English element although it got bad reviews from over there at the time. I loved ole Bogie crashing through the window. Babs was great and unlike the Wicki page I thought she excelled in the latter half of the film. The second Mrs Carroll was under duress at this time and Babs was strikingly more beautiful to boot with all that distress. I like precocious little girls (in a proper way). I can't stand Nigel Bruce and so that had to be endured. I would have enjoyed this movie a lot more if Ben had not issued the most disgusting spoiler in the intro I have ever heard. These things happen from time to time but this was particularly egregious and he should have known better. I am back to TCM after a long drought and therefore unaccustomed to the wraparound (is that what they call them?) and am having a lot of trouble with Mank. Way, way, way too much about the character and mental state of Mr Carrol and totally gratuitous. Not satisfied with his original idiocy he gave away another movie in the outro. Mark it as I set it down. I shall not allow myself to listen to single utterance more from him, and I have a DVR to accomplish it. I don't care about prefatory remarks anyway, no matter who it is (though I never found myself agitated with Mr O). It will be nice to shield myself from any further asinine comments from Mr M.  Now that I've got this down, I see my glass of milk has arrived. My gracious "hostess" has been so kind to bring it to me, although she has been acting a strangely lately. There was a certain gleam in her eye when she brought the milk, but I think that was from simply getting over my offensive remark earlier this afternoon. I'm sure she has forgiven me.

ONE OF THE only things I enjoy more than when we are giving a movie a hard time is when we collectively giving a movie a hard time and someone has THE GUTS to  say "well, I liked it." I actually went and watched SOME of THE TWO MRS. CARROLLS on HULU because nothing in the past or coming days holds any interest for me. i started it late, and while i still say the film has weaknesses, THERE IS SOMETHING DELICIOUSLY OFF ABOUT SOME OF THE ELEMENTS ESPECIALLY THAT CREEPY AS HELL LITTLE GIRL WHO- HONESTLY- I CAME TO LOVE AS IF SHE WERE MY OWN UNGODLY PSYCHIC SPOOKY CHILD VERSION OF JOAN GREENWOOD. 

The accents are a puzzle, everyone seems to be American and it is in ENGLAND??? and even if the characters are OFF, at least they made them RICH and we can watch them in their SUMPTUOUSNESS. 

i'M WITH YOU ON NIGEL BRUCE. HE IS A BORE.

I can't help but LOVE SOMETHING about a movie where BARBARA STANWYCK calls the NEIGHBORING ESTATE to ask their HOT HOUSE GARDENER to send over some roses for the table. "YES, 'MEDALLION' WILL DO JUST FINE" ie DON'T YOU DARE SEND ME ANY ICEBERGS OR ANGEL FACE' UNLESS YOU WISH A STERN LETTER BE SENT TO LADY GREENWOOD.

The-Two-Mrs.-Carrolls-1947-2.jpg

BOGART was AWFULLY clean and BUTTONED UP for an artist.

the sets were fabulous.

I wish they had made a third CAT PEOPLE movie with ALEXIS SMITH.

the-two-mrs-carrolls-1.jpg

i don't always like it when WARNER BROS decided to be all MGM STYLE HOITY-TOITY IN THE FORTIES but at the same time, there is some PRETTY GRAPHIC VIOLENCE in this movie!

better direction was still needed. such an outlandish story needed more interesting editing, camera movement and shot lengths, this was shot without  an eye. EDIT- ON LOOKING IT UP, I SEE it was directed by the same guy who directed CRY WOLF, which this film reminded me of, and which also did not impress me entirely.

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12 hours ago, laffite said:

There is no shame as far as I'm concerned. I liked it. One of Bogie's best. I thought it was suspenseful.

The Two Mrs. Carrolls has it good points as well as 'misses'.     I assume one reason for what comes off as overly harsh  criticism is one's expectation given the film legacies of the two stars.     Yea,  it should have been better (but that doesn't make it "bad" ).      LorraHF does outline some of the areas that didn't work so well,  like Bogie as an artist being too much like an accountant.      Better direction and editing. 

The film does have one of the best women cat-fight-without-a-fight scenes;   the lunch -  Alexis Smith and Barbara trade barbs and I just love that (for me only Ann Sheridan and Helen Vinson top that in Torid Zone 1940).

 For fans of the stars the film is worth seeing as long as one isn't expecting The Big Double Indemnity.

 

 

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STANWYCK AND BOGART IN SORRY, WRONG NUMBER, with a rewrite to make it a 50/50 SPLIT...NOW THAT COULD HAVE BEEN ONE HELL OF A MOVIE!**

ALSO MY REPUTATION- No disrespect to MR. BRENT!)

 

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Did two dives through Amazon Prime.

The Earthling (1980) was the next to last film for William Holden (a bit of a shock though that it was done at Filmways Pictures, formerly American International Pictures). He plays a dying man who helps young Ricky Schroeder through the dense jungles of Australia after Schroeder's parents die in a freak accident off the side of a cliff. It's a bit of an unusual film, since it is seemingly meant for kids, but its rather grim for that standard (Schroeder goes through more adversity here then he had in the remake of The Champ a year earlier), but it benefits from striking Australian photography and utmost sincerity. And then of course there is Holden. There are certain scenes, especially toward the end where he gets close-ups that register a mix of regret and pain, and the way he says the words brings great gravitas to them. There is great poignancy in these scenes, and they truly show a legend at work.  He is the glue that holds the film together.

Sinful Davey (1969) was a romp of a crime comedy that was ultimately dismissed by some of its makers, but seen today, it's an enjoyable lark, with a tongue-in-cheek leading performance from a young John Hurt and a fetching performance from the undervalued Pamela Franklin. The wonderful Robert Morley also turns up in an entertaining role late in the film. I actually think its a bit better than Tom Jones, the film that it is somewhat patterned after. Nice irish scenery too (standing in for Scotland). Supposedly, Anjelica huston and Brenda Fricker are extras in this but I couldn't find them.

Also starting in before bed last night on a film I will finish up tomorrow, the mammoth 1992 saga, Malcolm X, which is very strong so far.

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1 hour ago, LornaHansonForbes said:

ONE OF THE only things I enjoy more than when we are giving a movie a hard time is when we collectively giving a movie a hard time and someone has THE GUTS to  say "well, I liked it." I actually went and watched SOME of THE TWO MRS. CARROLLS on HULU because nothing in the past or coming days holds any interest for me. i started it late, and while i still say the film has weaknesses, THERE IS SOMETHING DELICIOUSLY OFF ABOUT SOME OF THE ELEMENTS ESPECIALLY THAT CREEPY AS HELL LITTLE GIRL WHO- HONESTLY- I CAME TO LOVE AS IF SHE WERE MY OWN UNGODLY PSYCHIC SPOOKY CHILD VERSION OF JOAN GREENWOOD. 

The accents are a puzzle, everyone seems to be American and it is in ENGLAND??? and even if the characters are OFF, at least they made them RICH and we can watch them in their SUMPTUOUSNESS. 

i'M WITH YOU ON NIGEL BRUCE. HE IS A BORE.

I can't help but LOVE SOMETHING about a movie where BARBARA STANWYCK calls the NEIGHBORING ESTATE to ask their HOT HOUSE GARDENER to send over some roses for the table. "YES, 'MEDALLION' WILL DO JUST FINE" ie DON'T YOU DARE SEND ME ANY ICEBERGS OR ANGEL FACE' UNLESS YOU WISH A STERN LETTER BE SENT TO LADY GREENWOOD.

BOGART was AWFULLY clean and BUTTONED UP for an artist.

the sets were fabulous.

I wish they had made a third CAT PEOPLE movie with ALEXIS SMITH.

i don't always like it when WARNER BROS decided to be all MGM STYLE HOITY-TOITY IN THE FORTIES but at the same time, there is some PRETTY GRAPHIC VIOLENCE in this movie!

better direction was still needed. such an outlandish story needed more interesting editing, camera movement and shot lengths, this was shot without  an eye. EDIT- ON LOOKING IT UP, I SEE it was directed by the same guy who directed CRY WOLF, which this film reminded me of, and which also did not impress me entirely.

I said I liked The Two Mrs. Carrolls a few posts prior.  I didn't like the little girl though,  she was getting on my nerves. She being the only character with an English accent was weird.  She reminded me of The Simpsons when the children of Springfield decide to start telling all the adults' secrets and start speaking with faux British accents. 

I also liked Cry Wolf because it has my love, Errol Flynn playing a villain-esque type character, which he doesn't play often.  

I actually think that if Flynn and Bogart traded places in The Two Mrs. Carrolls and Cry Wolf, both films would be better.  The only issue I see with Cry Wolf is that Flynn seems too young to be Babs' uncle! Unless her dad was really old and Flynn was a much younger sibling. 

I also agree that a third Cat People with Alexis Smith would have been excellent.  She could re-team with Ann Carter (aka the faux British child) who was in the first film. 

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Atlantic City (1980) with Burt Lancaster and Susan Sarandon

I generally loathe films from this era and had no intention of watching this until I started reading the accompanying article that TCM provides. In fact, I read it twice. Sometimes I decide to ignore the essential films that you’re supposed to watch and just pick something that catches my eye. The film is over an hour and 40 minutes, but felt like an hour, because the story and acting pulled me in. I can see why Lancaster and Sarandon received Oscar nominations for their performances. 

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20 minutes ago, speedracer5 said:

I actually think that if Flynn and Bogart traded places in The Two Mrs. Carrolls and Cry Wolf, both films would be better.  The only issue I see with Cry Wolf is that Flynn seems too young to be Babs' uncle! Unless her dad was really old and Flynn was a much younger sibling. 

I also agree that a third Cat People with Alexis Smith would have been excellent.  She could re-team with Ann Carter (aka the faux British child) who was in the first film. 

YES!

and

YES! ESPECIALLY IF SHE SICS CAT-ALEXIS ON THOSE B****Y NEIGHBORHOOD GIRLS WITH THE JUMROPE!

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1 minute ago, LornaHansonForbes said:

YES!

and

YES! ESPECIALLY IF SHE SICS CAT-ALEXIS ON THOSE B****Y NEIGHBORHOOD GIRLS WITH THE JUMROPE!

Terrorizing horrible children is almost always a highlight in any film.

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8 minutes ago, speedracer5 said:

Terrorizing horrible children is almost always a highlight in any film.

I really can't remember most badly behaved children in movies, but I can definitely recall one in a 60s film. Ruthie in Two for the Road, the girl who insults Audrey Hepburn and Albert Finney by telling them that her parents really can't stand them despite giving them a lift.

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14 minutes ago, CinemaInternational said:

I really can't remember most badly behaved children in movies, but I can definitely recall one in a 60s film. Ruthie in Two for the Road, the girl who insults Audrey Hepburn and Albert Finney by telling them that her parents really can't stand them despite giving them a lift.

There are also really bad children like Veda Pierce in Mildred Pierce.  But she's so awesome, she's the highlight of the film for me. There's a fine line between horrible snotty children and awesome horrible children, apparently.

Bonita Granville's character in These Three is a horrible little girl. Or Rhoda in The Bad Seed is awful.

There are also really irritating children in movies that I enjoy seeing terrorized.  Case in point: the annoying playground song that the children sing in The Birds.  I like to think that the birds are attacking these children because they couldn't stand the song any longer. 

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On 2/11/2020 at 6:34 AM, TikiSoo said:

Scotch is a delicious drink, the people are Scottish.🤷‍♂️

Or Scots, right?

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3 hours ago, LornaHansonForbes said:

ONE OF THE only things I enjoy more than when we are giving a movie a hard time is when we collectively giving a movie a hard time and someone has THE GUTS to  say "well, I liked it." I actually went and watched SOME of THE TWO MRS. CARROLLS on HULU because nothing in the past or coming days holds any interest for me. i started it late, and while i still say the film has weaknesses, THERE IS SOMETHING DELICIOUSLY OFF ABOUT SOME OF THE ELEMENTS ESPECIALLY THAT CREEPY AS HELL LITTLE GIRL WHO- HONESTLY- I CAME TO LOVE AS IF SHE WERE MY OWN UNGODLY PSYCHIC SPOOKY CHILD VERSION OF JOAN GREENWOOD. 

The accents are a puzzle, everyone seems to be American and it is in ENGLAND??? and even if the characters are OFF, at least they made them RICH and we can watch them in their SUMPTUOUSNESS. 

i'M WITH YOU ON NIGEL BRUCE. HE IS A BORE.

I can't help but LOVE SOMETHING about a movie where BARBARA STANWYCK calls the NEIGHBORING ESTATE to ask their HOT HOUSE GARDENER to send over some roses for the table. "YES, 'MEDALLION' WILL DO JUST FINE" ie DON'T YOU DARE SEND ME ANY ICEBERGS OR ANGEL FACE' UNLESS YOU WISH A STERN LETTER BE SENT TO LADY GREENWOOD.

The-Two-Mrs.-Carrolls-1947-2.jpg

BOGART was AWFULLY clean and BUTTONED UP for an artist.

the sets were fabulous.

I wish they had made a third CAT PEOPLE movie with ALEXIS SMITH.

the-two-mrs-carrolls-1.jpg

i don't always like it when WARNER BROS decided to be all MGM STYLE HOITY-TOITY IN THE FORTIES but at the same time, there is some PRETTY GRAPHIC VIOLENCE in this movie!

better direction was still needed. such an outlandish story needed more interesting editing, camera movement and shot lengths, this was shot without  an eye. EDIT- ON LOOKING IT UP, I SEE it was directed by the same guy who directed CRY WOLF, which this film reminded me of, and which also did not impress me entirely.

YES! Another disappointing damsel in distress vehicle by BABS from the same time period. She was right to ask WB to end her contract. Losing The Fountainhead was the last straw and I don't blame her!

What is it with Alexis Smith at WB? She's always the other woman (sometimes nice; sometimes nasty) She played the same type of part in that other Bogie Noir a few years earlier (I forget the title) which was a little better than this one. I agree she would've been a good fit in Cat People in Simone's part........

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9 minutes ago, Hibi said:

What is it with Alexis Smith at WB? She's always the other woman (sometimes nice; sometimes nasty) She played the same type of part in that other Bogie Noir a few years earlier (I forget the title) which was a little better than this one. I agree she would've been a good fit in Cat People in Simone's part........

Gotta do what Mr. Warner says or you'll get suspended.  She did have success on the stage, winning a Tony for Follies in 1972 (her Broadway debut).

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