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The End Is Near


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Fred -


Imagine the disappointment! When I saw a thread called "The End is Near," I quite naturally assumed it had to do with Jon Stewart emceeing the Academy Awards. And shucks, it turns out to be just another debate on the merits or shortcomings of TCM. While I am as concerned as anyone as to the future of TCM, this surely pales when faced with the upcoming Oscar ceremonies and Jon Stewart's participation. This may well be the end of civilization as we know it!


Where is the outrage here? Where are the voices clamoring in the wilderness? Who is responsible for this? Doesn't anybody care - am I out on this limb all by myself - again?


Has Jon Stewart ever been to Hollywood? On a Universal Tour? Did he buy a Map of the Stars homes? Eat at Chasen's? Sing-along at the Hollywood Bowl?


Every one of us can think of someone who would be a much better host than Mr. Stewart. He (and his 27 back-up writers) will come up with a few smarmy semitic jokes, a snide "Brokeback Mountain" reference, and probably a juvenile mention of some Danish newspaper cartoons - with an acerbic aside to President Bush. All in good fun, of course. Nothing new, nothing too edgy, let's not push that envelope too far. Certainly nothing Billy or Steve or Whoopi hasn't done before. I know, I'm reviewing the show before it's even aired - I'm in my Jean Dixon mode right now ("Predictions-R-Us"). I've seen Jon Stewart's schtick on CNN a couple of times - he's on Saturday nights over here (and they just cancelled Diplomatic License) - go figure. Still looking for that yuppie demographic, yes?


Where are you Liz - don't you give a damn? Mongo, Larry, Feaito, Vallo - attention must be paid! Helenwheels - have you gone over to the other side? DOSFAN - what's the story?


And you Fred - you have an opinion on everything. Why haven't you brought this up before. For shame!!!


Do you think I am over-reacting - maybe just a little? Well, forewarned is forearmed and don't say I didn't warn you. There's another thread on here called something like "I Knew I Should Have Hit The Eject Button When . . .". Miss Dixon and I predict it will be when Jon Stewart makes his initial appearance.


Hooray for Hollywood!



(who has too much time on his hands and needs to get a life)

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Ralph, Yes.. I think it's time for Happy-Dale. The Oscars never really had a great host, and yes, Jon Stewart is all wrong for the Oscars, But so was Billy Crystal, David Letterman, Don't ever get me started on Whoopie Goldberg. Years ago the nominees had a dinner and gave out the awards,maybe that was better having real stars give out their Oscars for a body of work. I for one think that if these awards are for Actors and Actress's, Not TV personalities. I don't care who's with whom or who's wearing what. Oscar telecast did lose it's luster,but we watch if only to be in with the conversation at the water-cooler come Tuesday morning. And thanks for the warning. But I don't think a couple of posters will add up to hill of beans .Bottom line: it's all about the ratings.....(sigh)


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Ralph, I believe our Oscar maven Spencer has already alerted us to the fact that Jon Stewart was elected to host the Academy Awards , somewhere on the boards.

Although he was asked, ace host Billy Crystal was involved in other ventures, and had to say no. There is just nothing we can do about it.


And I doubt very much that some members on this thread give a hoot about the Oscars, even if Bob Hope or Johnny Carson came back from the dead to host the show, since they don't care at all about the 'modern' films and stars, as has been specified here.

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The fate of TCM---the original thread is important. I have stopped subscribing to cable and satellite services and no longer have a TV. The reason-the only reason- I had it was to watch TCM and PBS. Now that TCM has become more and more like AMC, and probably will have commercials any day now, I decided it wasn't worth the price of admission. Now that PBS has become a propaganda arm of the Republican party (and NPR has been castrated by fear of the Christian right wing) I find it easier to do without TV and radio. I shall only have distant memories of the classic films that younger generations will know nothing of...


As for the Oscars...who cares...John Stewart IS a member of the Screen Actors Guild and actually has been in a few films (albeit awful ones! Death to Smoochie-yikes!) And he will do a great job hosting the Oscars. What can you say about an industry where Jim Carey and Adam Sandler can waste hours and hours of film and great actors can't get a decent film every ten years. The meaninglessness and vacuousness of the Oscars is only a tip of the iceberg! THE END IS NEAR!!! Thank God!

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The two are connected, because it is the baby boomer turned 60 that thinks the end is near, Jon Stewart, anime and any film made after 1960 is crap. The Gen-X crowd looks upon baby boomers as a bunch of spoiled, whining, self centered group that has always gotten what they wanted and when they didn't get it they would just throw a fit. Jon Stewart plays to all this saying what the Gen-X Generation believes to be true. After all The Daily Show With Jon Stewart is where they get their news.

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I'm not baby boomer generation,and I'm one of the ones who thinks modern movies are crap. I watch hardly anything made after the end of the studio system,very few movies of the Seventies(mainly "Jaws")-I hate those navel-gazing movies from the Seventies,especially anything with Alan Alda,or with the lead actress leaving her family(shucking her responsibilities) to go "find herself". They make me gag. I haven't been in a movie theater in ages,and I don't go to Blockbuster,as they mostly have new and recent releases. I buy the few movies,relatively speaking,that have been released from Hollywood's Golden era,and silent era. I hate hate hate modern movies,and much of modern culture for that matter.








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I think it may actually be the opposite. The gen-Xers being the ones who are most vocal in their dislike of movies post 1960.


Those of us who grew up with films of the 1960s and 1970s are more likely to be supportive of those films and consider many of them, rightly or wrongly, classics. Some of the films of those eras broke new ground in many different ways.


As for the debate about this thread, noone's opinion is going to be swayed one way or another about what should or shouldn't be shown on TCM. All we seem to do on this thread is find different words to use to keep the debate going without really saying anything new or really persuading anyone on the opposite side of our arguments.


Call me a cheerleader, but when you read this thread and others of similar vein, it truly shows what a tough job programming is for this channel as it is next to impossible to keep all the viewers happy even some of the time with the choices to be made.


No matter what is programmed in any given month someone will be vocal in their dislike of the choices of the films selected.


As for the "Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore" movies of the 1970s, at the time they were reflecting the conflict many women felt over the role of women in society. Not that long before the 1970s, a woman couldn't have a bank account in her name, couldn't own property, was only identified through her role as wife and mother and not thought of as her own person. Many women wanted to be thought of for who they were and not for who they were married to. Those movies, while they may seem quaint or maddening now, depict a time and place when society and American culture were very different from today and the choices to be made had rippling effects that were felt throughout their lives.

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Yikes indeed! I'm currently pushing 60 and think the choice of Jon Stewart is fine, thanks. In fact, I'm far more likely to watch the show because of Jon Stewart, who may not have a star on the Walk of Fame but, by God, he's funny. TCM is fine, too, despite the nay sayers who haven't paid attention to anything since 1960; I like anime and have seen a few recent films (like Good Night and Good Luck) that will be (already are) as classic as anything from MGM of the 40's or Warner Brothers of the 30's. When I'm 70, I expect to tune in TCM and see Brokeback Mountain uncut and uninterupted and in its proper aspect ratio.

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Ah well, they pulled me back in.


I'm a baby boomer, dislike most movies made after 1955, wish I were born in 1930, love Pink Floyd, like South Park, and got all (okay, most of) my election results from Jon Stewart. He may or may not believe what he spouts...he IS in it for the money, no?...but he's a damned sight better than the suck up sorry I'm not listening to the answer to my questions Larry King.


Then again, I grew up with Tom Snyder, Allan Burke, David Susskind, and all sorts of offbeat interviewers, and I hold absolutely nothing sacred, so Stewart is fine with me.


Bottom line, as I said a few days ago, we who hate Anime Alley are not going to change the minds of those who love Anime Alley, and so be it. As long as TCM still plays the occasional b/w movie, and maybe someday shows a block of film noir, as has been suggested elsewhere, I'll tune in and tape away.


However, as I expected, they are becoming more and more each day like AMC, so my instinct was good in Jan. 2004 when the idiot Cablevision finally scheduled TCM and I decided I wasn't going to get skunked like I did by AMC. I have taped most of the movies I want, and can gleefully change the channel when I see Karate Kid...Karate KID, tcmprogrammer???...being programmed.

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Well, I do admit to liking a couple of movies from the Seventies-just a couple,LOL-"Smokey And The Bandit"(especially for the music,I love driving on a long trip to "Eastbound And Down"-and it's the ONLY movie I can tolerate Sally Field in),and I like "Saturday Night Fever-again,mostly for some of the music,and of course for the dancing-I love good dancing-but those clothes have got to go,LOL!





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To all,


One of the problems with showing modern movies on TCM is that everyone will disagree about which modern movies they like the most, and what will ultimately result is the showing of more and more modern movies, in an attempt to please everyone and to get a maximum audience, and in the meantime all our classic old films will be shoved back on the shelf, never to be seen again, and then TCM will be exactly like TBS, TNT, AMC, and all the other modern-movie channels on TV. Once it degrades that far, THEN they will start inserting commercials in the movies, and there will be no more old classic movie channel on TV.


My suggestion is that if modern movies we might like are available on the other channels, and are available for sale and available at the tape rental stores, we who like old classic movies need to lobby TCM to keep these easily-available films OFF of TCM.


Why should I lobby TCM to show these modern films that I like: ?Wag the Dog,? ?Romy and Michele's High School Reunion?, and ?Selena?, if most other old-movie fans might not like those movies and when I can see them on other channels and I can rent them at Blockbuster or buy them at Wal-Mart for $5?


It would be different if all the rare old classics were available on tape and DVD for rent or were shown on a lot of other channels, but they aren?t.


Classic noir films like ?Stranger on the Third Floor? might be shown on TCM only once every 5 years, and if modern films are shown more, that means the old classics might never be shown again or maybe shown only once every ten years.


There are a few modern films I watch on the other channels, but I would NOT like to see them shown on TCM because they have no historical value, they are NOT classic films in any way, and they most likely will not be liked by most old-movie fans.


If some people like the modern ?Titanic? film (I do), they can get it from many sources other than TCM. But some people might like many old classics that are ONLY available from TCM. So I say let?s keep the modern films off of TCM since they are available elsewhere, and let TCM stick to showing older classics.

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Oh, I totally agree with you about that. There are only a very few movies post-studio system that I like,and I don't want to see even those few on TCM. That's not what I watch TCM for. As you say,I can see those movies many places,or rent/buy them easily. TCM is for all the classic Hollywood-the classic era of Hollywood,I mean-movies,especially those that aren't available anywhere else. I didn't mean that I'd like to see the couple of post-Hollywood Golden era movies that I like,on TCM. Not at all!






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FredCDobbs, I agree with what you state. I was supposed to fly back home today but there is a snow storm here, so I have to stay in and watch movies. So far I was not at all impressed with the VIP's and Darling Lili. Tonight will suck as bad as last night did unfortunately. Luckily I have DVD's recorded from TCM's good times so I will be watching those.

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I don't think there are too many people here arguing for TCM to show more modern films (which I consider to be 1980s-today for what it's worth). While I wouldn't have a problem with "O, Brother" being shown in a night of films and their inspiration or a night of chain gang films through the years. But "O, Brother" is the exception to the norm of films being made today that have its roots in films of the bygone era.


I would hope that those of us who appreciate the films from the 1960s and 1970s want TCM to keep showing us films from the 1910s-1950s. I personally love the older films and love the chance to see them every day. Like you, when I was a kid the only way to see them was on the Million Dollar Movie or late at night.


Those films appeal to film lovers of all ages (maybe with the exception of silents and Leo who would be happy if TCM never ran a silent film again but I like to think he is in the minority on that) and those films are what make TCM so special.


I think part of the problem is the whole 31 Days of Oscar where films from all decades are programmed and this year especially seems heavily weighted towards to more recent films. Perhaps its time they give some thought to retiring the Oscar salute.


When the smoke clears, the direction TCM is taken will only be revealed when we can look back at the end of the year and analysis the programming and see if this month's programming was the exception or became the norm.


We don't know what gems the programmers have in store for us later this year. It might be centered around hard to see films, precodes, silents, film noir, musicals or it could be the greatest films of the 1990s. I don't want to see TCM abandon its core audience to chase the demographic that destroyed AMC. But then, I don't see them sliding charging headlong down that slippery slope the way others do.


I agree 100% with you that writing a letter addressing your concerns is much more effective than debating what should be shown here. A hand written letter will carry more weight than all the debating we do on the issue.


It should be an interesting year and I am looking forward to it.

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Ummm........Melanie, if you filter out the obscenity, there will BE no South Park movie! Is Team America the same as Bigger, Longer, Uncut from 1999...does that make it a 'classic'? :)


In my opinion, I thought it was hysterical. My husband thought it was horrible.


Then again, my sense of humor is sometimes twisted (hmmm, I just caught your burning stick figure--where DID you get that?, so maybe yours is too!), so you can't go by me.

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"...than the suck up sorry I'm not listening to the answer to my questions Larry King."


I hope you don't mind if I add the radio Larry King--"what's the question...WHAT'S THE QUESTION...". Why did anybody call his radio show?


Also, I would like to mention, "if you see a Larry King 'write bite' on an ad for a movie--avoid that film like the plague".


On the other hand, the few times I have seen his (Larry King) TV show, some of his guests were okay.



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EXACTLY what I thought, jarhfive, when I saw the blurb in the paper today by him for The New Pink Panther...is it a 'classic' yet? After all, it's about 35 minutes old, isn't it? :)


a. I don't believe he actually said what they quoted (it was a positive comment),

b. I don't believe he actually SAW the movie, and

c. IF he was able to stomach the trailer for the movie, he would NOT see it.


Yes...WHAT'S the question?......he does the same thing on his TV show. It was Roseanne Barr/Arnold (I think) who one time called him on his inability/unwillingness to listen to answers...but no matter, he didn't hear her, he wasn't listening!


P.S. Well, what do I know? --




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